The card some of you are still waiting for - Higher performance Navi Rumours

[williamcll]

Rumours that AMD will soon to release graphic cards that performs better than the current 5700XT and Vega VII has been circulating for 3 months already. Some new information has appeared from driver hardware IDs pointing to Next generation RDNA GPUs as well as some low performance models. The upcoming GPUs carry the hardware ID 737F (for reference, the 5700 series is 731F and Vega is 687F), leaving room for other models.

For the known highest end Navi card, its characteristics are believed to be TSMC 7nm+, 505mm² Die and GDDR6 and may be twice as fast as Navi 10 (5700XT) as well as hardware ray tracing 

Quote

Navi 21 will be a large GPU with new rumors pointing to it packing somewhere between 15-16 billion transistors, which makes it bigger than Vega 20 (13.2 billion) and Navi 10 (10.3 billion). But the bigger news here is that AMD's new flagship Navi 20-based graphics card would feature 12-16GB of GDDR6 memory on a much wider memory bus. The new rumors have AMD possibly using a wider 384-bit or 512-bit memory interface, something that would enable much more memory bandwidth with GDDR6 memory. Previous rumors suggested AMD would tap higher-end HBM2E memory, packing between 16-32GB of framebuffer.

The new Navi 21 GPU will have hardware-based ray tracing, exactly the same as the Turing GPU from NVIDIA. We should see something in the first few months of 2020, but I would guess we'll see a mix of GDDR6 (on consumer cards) and HBM2/E on the server/datacenter solutions.

Also from reading the twitter source, Mid/Mid-Low cards such as the Pro version of the 5500 as well as mobile cards such as 5300M and 5500M may appear in the following months.

 

Source:https://www.ptt.cc/bbs/PC_Shopping/M.1573129117.A.216.html

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/69543/amds-high-end-navi-gpu-details-twice-fast-radeon-rx-5700-xt/index.html

Thoughts: Considering that AMD will be delivering a keynote at CES the week after, I suspect at least one GPU will be announced, or maybe we will get a Vega surprise again.

Also, why haven't I seen any big brand laptops with the 5700M? it's been out for two months.

[TempestCatto]

Will this finally be the card that turns Linus from an NVIDIA shill to an AMD shill?

[Bombastinator]

The date is interesting.  The whole cloud bit turns my stomach a bit.  That’s a whole lot of bandwidth.  The possible weakness of the hardware ray tracing is interesting.  If it’s no better than Navi’s it’s pretty worthless.  And it’s what Scarlett/ps5 is going to have (yes I know Scarlett has a new and official name now.  Scarlett is shorter)

[DildorTheDecent]

7nm CPU and 7nm GPU

 

Big excite.

[dizmo]

AMD hype is about as trustworthy as the dude that sold Jack the beans. 

 

I highly, highly doubt that we're going to see that kind of performance gain. It's also a bad sign to see rumors of the card having 16GB of VRAM. It's unnecessary and is going to inflate the costs of the card without giving most users any real advantage. It's almost like AMD doesn't want to succeed. 

 

As I've said before, I fully expect this card to get tons of hype, and then get pissed on by Nvidia yet again. 

[Bombastinator]

Chickens, eggs.  It’s pretty rare to under hype something though it does occasionally happen.  I’m more interested in what it’s saying it won’t do than what it will.

[GoldenLag]

Just to fill out reasons why it wont be twice the performance of Navi 10.

 

Tl;dw:

Its more likely its at best 71% faster. Or roughly 10% faster than the 2080ti

 

That is a best case scenario. The reasons behind this is the memmory configuration conceivable on a GDDR6 based GPU. And the TDP limits in place before you become the new toastermeme. 

 

(Edit: 384-bit memmorybus is the max sane size and HBM is too expencive due to AMD nolonger running a charity)

[Letgomyleghoe]

1 hour ago, DildorTheDecent said:

7nm CPU and 7nm GPU

 

Big excite.

havent heard anyone use "big excite" or anything along the lines of that in a while thought i was the only one 

[Bombastinator]

2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Just to fill out reasons why it wont be twice the performance of Navi 10.

 

Tl;dw:

Its more likely its at best 71% faster. Or roughly 10% faster than the 2080ti

 

That is a best case scenario. The reasons behind this is the memmory configuration conceivable on a GDDR6 based GPU. And the TDP limits in place before you become the new toastermeme. 

Interesting video.  Quite long.  I got to where he could believe it might be up to 71% faster max because to do more they’d have to use impossible memory.  And even 71% was unlikely.

[williamcll]

2 hours ago, DildorTheDecent said:

7nm CPU and 7nm GPU

 

Big excite.

But 7nm SSD and RAM when? 

[Bombastinator]

5 hours ago, TempestCatto said:

Will this finally be the card that turns Linus from an NVIDIA shill to an AMD shill?

Meh.  He’s not nearly as effusive about AMD as some.  Shill might be strong.  I dunno.  I said somewhere earlier that I wasn’t an Intel fanboy. Maybe I do lean that way a bit.  To make an inaccurate comparison, Intel is kinda V8 and AMD is kinda turbo 4.  Same horsepower, better fuel economy for the 4, but I kinda like v8s

[Brooksie359]

6 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Just to fill out reasons why it wont be twice the performance of Navi 10.

 

Tl;dw:

Its more likely its at best 71% faster. Or roughly 10% faster than the 2080ti

 

That is a best case scenario. The reasons behind this is the memmory configuration conceivable on a GDDR6 based GPU. And the TDP limits in place before you become the new toastermeme. 

 

(Edit: 384-bit memmorybus is the max sane size and HBM is too expencive due to AMD nolonger running a charity)

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they went HBM again and just charged alot of money for the card like nvidia does for the 2080ti. That being said I still expect that they will try and stay away from HBM with all the trouble it has caused them in the past. 

[Bombastinator]

1 minute ago, Brooksie359 said:

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they went HBM again and just charged alot of money for the card like nvidia does for the 2080ti. That being said I still expect that they will try and stay away from HBM with all the trouble it has caused them in the past. 

Nvidia made an announcement about ampere (which could be BS of course) that they had found a way to make a sort of hybrid HBM which while slower cost less and had fewer problems.  If it’s the case AMD might be forced to use HBM.

 

As per usual, it’s all vaporware ATM.  We shall see what we shall see.

[Tamesh16]

9 hours ago, TempestCatto said:

Will this finally be the card that turns Linus from an NVIDIA shill to an AMD shill?

[Rune]

RT in the cloud.

No thanks.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, DildorTheDecent said:

7nm CPU and 7nm GPU

 

Big excite.

if only other small things were appreciated 

[BiG StroOnZ]

More sources for you OP:

 

AMD's Massive Navi 21 GPU Rumored To Be Twice As Fast As Radeon RX 5700 XT -

 

Quote

 

The message board rumors suggest that the Navi 21 will use GDDR6 memory rather than the previously rumored HBM2E. If true, that could be a cost-saving measure, as HBM is notoriously expensive. With a decent size memory bus, though, that doesn’t preclude an eventual Navi 21 card from having massive memory bandwidth with 12GB or 16GB of GDDR6 that’s 16Gbps or even 18Gbps.

 

Also, this iteration of Navi allegedly delivers a performance uplift twice that of the Navi 10. At the very high end of speculative expectations, that could mean a card that’s twice as fast as a 5700 XT. Alternatively, it could mean something more like twice the speed of the 5600 XT.

 

1) https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/amd-navi-21-twice-fast-5700-xt/

 

2) https://hothardware.com/news/amd-radeon-rx-navi-21-gddr6-rdna-2

 

3) https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/amd-navi-21.g923

[RejZoR]

I personally think they'll be able to hit those marks. Radeon RX 5700 XT pretty much came around out of nowhere and caught everyone by surprise after rather meh RX Vega. Everyone was expecting nothing and yet AMD delivered a card that is very much competitive and the RDNA architecture seems very promising. Cards perform and are power efficient for it not to even be something worth talking about (unlike Vega where power was a huge deal for everyone). And all they released was RX 5700 XT! Given their past naming schemes, there is still room for RX 5800 XT and RX 5900 XT.

 

What I'm really hoping is by the time I'll have to replace my GTX 1080Ti, Intel and AMD will be a great competition to NVIDIA so I'll have 3 versions of similarly performing cards to choose from.

[Bombastinator]

1 minute ago, RejZoR said:

I personally think they'll be able to hit those marks. Radeon RX 5700 XT pretty much came around out of nowhere and caught everyone by surprise after rather meh RX Vega. Everyone was expecting nothing and yet AMD delivered a card that is very much competitive and the RDNA architecture seems very promising. Cards perform and are power efficient for it not to even be something worth talking about (unlike Vega where power was a huge deal for everyone). And all they released was RX 5700 XT! Given their past naming schemes, there is still room for RX 5800 XT and RX 5900 XT.

 

What I'm really hoping is by the time I'll have to replace my GTX 1080Ti, Intel and AMD will be a great competition to NVIDIA so I'll have 3 versions of similarly performing cards to choose from.

The news from intel has not been good lately.  Apparently their “new” stuff involves leveraging their tiger lake iGPU stuff which is decidedly low end.  Currently claims are that they can combine them in multiples which could in theory do it but it’s something folks have tried before with very little success.  I personally would love to see pcie 4.0 being leveraged into “ fill your slots with low power cards for lots of performance” dial-gpu-power-level thing.  Want more power add more cards sounds awesome. “Sounds” being the key word.

[leadeater]

10 hours ago, dizmo said:

I highly, highly doubt that we're going to see that kind of performance gain. It's also a bad sign to see rumors of the card having 16GB of VRAM. It's unnecessary and is going to inflate the costs of the card without giving most users any real advantage. It's almost like AMD doesn't want to succeed. 

If the reported 384-bit or 512-bit is true it may just be a side effect from that and the minimum GDDR6 die you can actually buy. The VRAM size might be unnecessary but the bandwidth may not. Has been a long time since AMD have done a memory bus as wide as 512-bit though.

[leadeater]

10 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Or roughly 10% faster than the 2080ti

I'll eat my shoe if that happens, if released this year.

[JuztBe]

53 minutes ago, leadeater said:

I'll eat my shoe if that happens, if released this year.

One does not speak lightly about eating shoes. Please specify.

You will eat your shoe if AMD releases any 10% more powerful card than 2080TI in 2020? Or you meant Navi 21 in specific?

 

[leadeater]

41 minutes ago, JuztBe said:

One does not speak lightly about eating shoes. Please specify.

You will eat your shoe if AMD releases any 10% more powerful card than 2080TI in 2020? Or you meant Navi 21 in specific?

All in poker hand, any GPU 

[Juular]

9 minutes ago, leadeater said:

All in poker hand, any GPU 

Do you have any sauce that goes well with shoes ?

[leadeater]

7 minutes ago, Juular said:

Do you have any sauce that goes well with shoes ?

Like all internet claims, gut sauce 

 

Usually I'd wait longer but track record is not on AMD rumor side here, at all lol.

 

It's not like not beating the 2080 Ti is that bad either, I'd take a 2080 at 70% the cost of one but it's right now more important to get the top crown win, I just don't think it'll happen in 2020.