Germany Okay With Huawei Infrastucture

[Guest]

Germany okay with Huawei building infrastructure

Source: https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2018/12/germany-okay-with-huawei-building-infrastructure.html?fbclid=IwAR3wvsrtb1ajv2t01M2YVgZ7JOBVAD1Yw0bnyf9wiibq0tVz1E_UgfVeh0E

 

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Unlike the Five Eyes countries, Germany's technology watchdog says it cannot find any evidence Huawei is a security risk.

New Zealand's spy agency the Government Communications Security Bureau (GCSB) in November effectively banned Spark from teaming up with the Chinese firm to build its 5G network.

Similar concerns have been raised by agencies in the US, Canada and Australia. The UK is the only country in the Five Eyes spy alliance that's letting Huawei build infrastructure at present.

 

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But Germany is also bucking the trend.

"For such serious decisions like a ban, you need proof," Arne Schoenbohm, the head of Germany's Federal Office for Information Security (BSI), told Spiegel.

He said they couldn't find any evidence, even after examining products and its lab in the German city of Bonn.

All three of Germany's major telcos use Huawei equipment, according to Spiegel.

 

Finally some common sense. No proof, no ban. I know Japan said they found evidence of extra components in Huawei products, but seeing as they were really ambiguous it could have actually just been another antenna - I don't believe they would have had access to the Huawei designs in the first place, so how could they compare? The US is about as trustworthy as a dog who steals your food from the table, so IMO any claims the US makes is worthless. Germany on the other hand is a lot more serious, and finally some credence to the matter. 

[Brooksie359]

Yeah German must be right because they are a serious country? That's a pretty dumb way to think about things. There are quite a few countries that ban Huawei so I there is probably more to it than that. 

[Guest]

Just now, Brooksie359 said:

Yeah German must be right because they are a serious country? That's a pretty dumb way to think about things. There are quite a few countries that ban Huawei so I there is probably more to it than that. 

It helps If I hear it from the intelligence agency and not Anderson Cooper

[SupaKomputa]

And its coming from japan, the country who used to make these kinda things.

Huawei made loads of innovations in the past 10 years, cheaper, no wonder every telco used their products.

I guess its just another "oh you have a weapon of mass destructions, attack!!"

[Drak3]

5 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

German must be right because they are a serious country?

They're serious about fucking their citizens over, but that's about it.

[mr moose]

Must be another secret deal or conspiracy to explain this. 

[Brooksie359]

4 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

It helps If I hear it from the intelligence agency and not Anderson Cooper

Oh you're right. All those countries that banned them were doing so because Anderson Cooper said they were spying on us. Oh wait they probably were doing so based on an intelligence agency like any normal country. 

[XR6]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/12/15/mps-call-parliament-investigate-dangers-huawei-poses-uks-national/ (I don't know how to format it sorry)

Anyway the UK has security fears too so we're not all agreeing that Huawei is safe to use.

I don't completely trust Germany on this one as they're a lone wolf on thinking "Huawei's fine". It's 5 countries against 1. I'd rather take the opinion of multiple countries instead of 1 country unless the 1 country has enough evidence to suggest Huawei is innocent. Sure, the 5 eyes might not have enough evidence but if 5 countries agree then I'm going to trust them. I'm not saying you should trust them, I'm just saying I do.

 

[mynameisjuan]

Good.

 

Other than 1 incident Huawei has not gotten a break with not a single person bringing up evidence that traffic is indeed going back to china. 

[dalekphalm]

I'm on the fence about this - on one side, the number of countries whose intelligence agencies claim Huawei are up to no good are so numerous that you can't simply dismiss it out of hand.

 

On the other hand, I haven't seen any hard evidence myself.

 

With all of that in mind? There are going to be cases where government cannot share sensitive intelligence info with the public. We might not like it, and under perfect utopian conditions, 100% transparency would always be present. But that's naive and not the reality we live in.

[Hunter259]

13 minutes ago, SupaKomputa said:

And its coming from japan, the country who used to make these kinda things.

Huawei made loads of innovations in the past 10 years, cheaper, no wonder every telco used their products.

I guess its just another "oh you have a weapon of mass destructions, attack!!"

Hmmm. I wonder why. If you are willing to use labor the way the Chinese do it's not really such a stretch that you would use unethical methods to spy.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

I'm on the fence about this - on one side, the number of countries whose intelligence agencies claim Huawei are up to no good are so numerous that you can't simply dismiss it out of hand.

 

On the other hand, I haven't seen any hard evidence myself.

 

With all of that in mind? There are going to be cases where government cannot share sensitive intelligence info with the public. We might not like it, and under perfect utopian conditions, 100% transparency would always be present. But that's naive and not the reality we live in.

 

Putting aside the fact that they may not be able to make public the evidence or reasoning they have currently,  when it comes to national security they tend to play by the better safe than sorry rule.  

 

If people are happy to wait 30 years the Australian documentation will become public and we can get a better Idea then.

 

 

[dalekphalm]

2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Putting aside the fact that they may not be able to make public the evidence or reasoning they have currently,  when it comes to national security they tend to play by the better safe than sorry rule.

Agreed - and personally, I'd rather my country take the precaution if there's even a little evidence of their wrongdoings. There are enough alternatives that we don't need their tech.

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If people are happy to wait 30 years the Australian documentation will become public and we can get a better Idea then.

Bookmark this page! We'll check back in 29 years, 364 days.

[hobobobo]

7 minutes ago, Hunter259 said:

unethical methods to spy.

lol

 

 

on a more serious note, outsource communication - reap the benefits. Cisco was under the same allegations from china, russia and india, so, who cares. Huawei can gourge themselves

[XR6]

9 minutes ago, Hunter259 said:

unethical methods to spy.

Any way of spying is unethical. 

[19_blackie_73]

10 minutes ago, Hunter259 said:

unethical methods to spy. 

OK let's ban any US manufactured equipment in Europe because they spyed on us too.

 

The US is not better than China in terms on spying on other countries.

[Hunter259]

Just now, 19_blackie_73 said:

OK let's ban any US manufactured equipment in Europe because they spyed on us too.

 

The US is not better than China in terms on spying on other countries.

Go right ahead. If someone finds that a government is interfering with a companies product to spy do it.

[GoldenLag]

every major Nordic Telecom is saying the same thing.

 

seems like US flexed some muscles as Norway has again brought up a topic they once disregarded. every Major telecom is meeting up in January to discuss it with its goverment and i expect the government to follow the telecoms advice of ignoring it as it has no substancial proof to stop expansion of 5G. 

 

Nordic Telecom Company Telenor has allready picked a supplier for its 5G expansion (Huawei) and Telecom company Telia is waiting with its decision to see what conclusion the government decides upon. 

 

Both Telecom companies are owned by Nordic goverments and operate to supply telecommunication. they Operate as a duopoly even though a third company has started expanding its network. smaller companies can operate as contractors and create their own mobile plan and prices. Telecom companies rent their network out to these companies for a goverment regulated price as to keep competition up and prices down. 

[DrMacintosh]

The actions of Germany throughout history have been questionable at best 

[dalekphalm]

5 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

The actions of Germany throughout history have been questionable at best 

That's an incredibly vague and not very useful statement. Throughout what history? Germany has recorded history going back over a thousand years.

[DrMacintosh]

6 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Throughout what history?

All of it

[dalekphalm]

Just now, DrMacintosh said:

All of it

Uhm... Okay - you're gonna need to be a little bit more specific to justify that statement. Lots of countries (including the US) have had a very dark history at times.

[Rakanoth]

17 hours ago, Brooksie359 said:

 because they are a serious country

ROFLMAO.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Brooksie359 said:

Oh you're right. All those countries that banned them were doing so because Anderson Cooper said they were spying on us. Oh wait they probably were doing so based on an intelligence agency like any normal country. 

My post wasn't quite literal, but the US tends to stretch facts to fit their agenda much more than Germany does. They are currently under the trade war, so banning sales of Huawei, a large manufacturer would be in their best interests at the moment. The truth of the matter is there is no form of hard evidence against Huawei, so it would be problematic to take any formal action within the EU. The US does things more ambiguously and we don't know the real truth behind this - and obviously they aren't co-operating well with their information with overseas intelligence. 

[Brooksie359]

3 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

My post wasn't quite literal, but the US tends to stretch facts to fit their agenda much more than Germany does. They are currently under the trade war, so banning sales of Huawei, a large manufacturer would be in their best interests at the moment. The truth of the matter is there is no form of hard evidence against Huawei, so it would be problematic to take any formal action within the EU. The US does things more ambiguously and we don't know the real truth behind this - and obviously they aren't co-operating well with their information with overseas intelligence. 

the US isnt the only country that is banning them so its hard to make the case that this is simply the result of a trade war between the US and china.