m1 Apple M1 = the rest of us are living in the stone age!?

[gal-m]

I've really been impressed with the Apple M1 chip, though it seemed too good to be true at first, but after researching it extensively it looks like the claims actually do hold up.

 

My question is, what's next? Can Apple Silicon wipe everything else out? I've recently been thinking about building a new high end gaming system, but now it just seems like Apple might speed past anything in the years to come (in reference to single thread performance at least). The whole thing is making me extremely discouraged to invest in any type of Windows machine at the moment... - Yes I DO know that Windows and Macs, don't compare directly depending on a persons specific workload, but I think you get what I'm trying to say.. it's just making x86 CPUs feel a bit old ...

 

EDIT: I am NOT saying I want to play games on a Mac. I am just simply stating that the potential of Apple's new chips to wipe every other Intel or AMD off the face of the planet might move manufacturers like Intel or AMD to start looking at developing an ARM based chip as well and the potential that would have in a Windows machine..

 

Anyways, what do you guys think?

Edited November 26, 2020 by gal-m

[wall03]

Just now, gal-m said:

I've really been impressed with the Apple M1 chip, though it seemed too good to be true at first, but after researching it extensively it looks like the claims actually do hold up.

 

My question is, what's next? Can Apple Silicon wipe everything else out? I've recently been thinking about building a new high end gaming system, but now it just seems like Apple might speed past anything in the years to come (in reference to single thread performance at least). The whole thing is making me extremely discouraged to invest in any type of Windows machine at the moment... - Yes I DO know that Windows and Macs, don't compare directly depending on a persons specific workload, but I think you get what I'm trying to say.. it's just making x86 CPUs feel a bit old ...

 

Anyways, what do you guys think?

other computers still outperform it.
Other chip makers just have to innovate even more now that Apple is innovating faster then ever.

AMD started innovating and really shook the desktop industry, but Apple is running ahead of AMD.

Competition = good.

it doesn't mean your things will suddenly not work.

[Ankh Tech]

3 minutes ago, gal-m said:

I've really been impressed with the Apple M1 chip, though it seemed too good to be true at first, but after researching it extensively it looks like the claims actually do hold up.

 

My question is, what's next? Can Apple Silicon wipe everything else out? I've recently been thinking about building a new high end gaming system, but now it just seems like Apple might speed past anything in the years to come (in reference to single thread performance at least). The whole thing is making me extremely discouraged to invest in any type of Windows machine at the moment... - Yes I DO know that Windows and Macs, don't compare directly depending on a persons specific workload, but I think you get what I'm trying to say.. it's just making x86 CPUs feel a bit old ...

 

Anyways, what do you guys think?

no matter what, arm will not, never, replace x86. Arm is optimised for low end efficient systems. High end will never be achieved by arm. Whatever the case. x86 however. Does both. Get a new windows system. If arm gets more advanced than now. x86 would've probably reached the to good to be true stage

[aDoomGuy]

Yeah x86 is old. It must be 15-20 years since I had x86 chip last. Now I run x64. and it's good.

 

Apart from that, the more companies that can make good CPU and whatnot the better. Competition benefits us, the users and monopoly benefits the corporation.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

7 minutes ago, gal-m said:

I've recently been thinking about building a new high end gaming system, but now it just seems like Apple might speed past anything in the years to come (in reference to single thread performance at least).

Well, since it's a gaming PC you were planning to build, how do the new Macs perform compared to the PC you were planning to get in the games you want to play?

[gal-m]

2 minutes ago, wall03 said:

Competition = good.

it doesn't mean your things will suddenly not work.

I agree with you 100%. Competition is FANTASTIC, but this came out of nowhere. I was NOT expecting such a docile chip to have such incredible performance. It makes me wonder what's going to happen if they ever decide to introduce a "really high powered" one.. It kind of seems like it could just chew everything else up to be honest. And as a consumer I don't want to be buying a new computer if we're about to witness a huge leap in performance... 

[Fasauceome]

1 minute ago, Ankh Tech said:

High end will never be achieved by arm.

I mean, this is why you can't future proof. There's just no way of knowing whether or not arm can push onto the upper performance levels. And given that it's the current goal of basically all arm development, id say it's far from impossible

[gal-m]

2 minutes ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

Well, since it's a gaming PC you were planning to build, how do de new Macs perform compared to the PC you were planning to get in the games you want to play?

You misunderstood me. I am talking about the ARM architecture and what it can do specifically. And the potential it would have if possibly introduced for Windows. 

[boggy77]

1 minute ago, gal-m said:

I agree with you 100%. Competition is FANTASTIC, but this came out of nowhere. I was NOT expecting such a docile chip to have such incredible performance. It makes me wonder what's going to happen if they ever decide to introduce a "really high powered" one.. It kind of seems like it could just chew everything else up to be honest. And as a consumer I don't want to be buying a new computer if we're about to witness a huge leap in performance... 

i don't think apple chips will start popping up very soon in gaming-grade desktops. macos is not optimised for that and running windows and games on a M1 chip is also not optimised. so don't worry, build your dream gaming machine. as others said, competition is good and it's likely that the battle in the next years will be ryzen vs apple, rather than ryzen vs intel.

[Ankh Tech]

Just now, Fasauceome said:

I mean, this is why you can't future proof. There's just no way of knowing whether or not arm can push onto the upper performance levels. And given that it's the current goal of basically all arm development, id say it's far from impossible

Well arm is currently focusing on the low power efficient end. You are correct. I hate the term "future proof". But the speed it advances is just slower than x86. I'd expect arm to pull ahead if they can run native apps on everything. So I don't like arm, some might like them.

[wall03]

1 minute ago, gal-m said:

I agree with you 100%. Competition is FANTASTIC, but this came out of nowhere. I was NOT expecting such a docile chip to have such incredible performance. It makes me wonder what's going to happen if they ever decide to introduce a "really high powered" one.. It kind of seems like it could just chew everything else up to be honest. And as a consumer I don't want to be buying a new computer if we're about to witness a huge leap in performance... 

True. We were expecting something big, just not this big.

I have my speculation on the chips for the future, and here they are:

Spoiler

(green is for already released)

 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Ankh Tech said:

arm will not, never, replace x86.

So ARM will replace x86, got it.

[gal-m]

2 minutes ago, boggy77 said:

i don't think apple chips will start popping up very soon in gaming-grade desktops. macos is not optimised for that and running windows and games on a M1 chip is also not optimised. so don't worry, build your dream gaming machine. as others said, competition is good and it's likely that the battle in the next years will be ryzen vs apple, rather than ryzen vs intel.

No no, I know. I am talking about Apple making really great chips and CPUs like AMD and Intel just being stuck in the past Which would mean, they'd want to start looking at the ARM architecture as well. 

I own both a Mac and a Windows machine, so I know you don't play games on a Mac. I think you just misunderstood me.

[Spindel]

Yes, yes you are

 

Now bow to your Apple Silicon overlords 

 

[boggy77]

Just now, gal-m said:

No no, I know. I am talking about Apple making really great chips and CPUs like AMD and Intel just being stuck in the past Which would mean, they'd want to start looking at the ARM architecture as well. 

I own both a Mac and a Windows machine, so I know you don't play games on a Mac. I think you just misunderstood me.

i see. i don't necessarily think x86 is past and arm is future. just because x86 has been here for longer doesn't mean it's dead or obsolete and the clear example is the ryzen 5000 performance, which has better performance than intel for half the power consumption. and yes, i know that the m1 has similar performance to ryzen, for again half the pwoer consumptions, but that may be due to the 5nm vs 7nm difference. once zen 4 on 5nm launches, you might see it trade blows with apple with similar performance AND power consumption.

[gal-m]

4 minutes ago, Spindel said:

Now bow to your Apple Silicon overlords 

 

I bow to you sir. 
Congratz on the purchase! Hope you're enjoying it so far

[gal-m]

3 minutes ago, boggy77 said:

once zen 4 on 5nm launches

Looking forward to that as well  
Thanks for the reply @boggy77!

[Ankh Tech]

3 minutes ago, Den-Fi said:

So ARM will replace x86, got it.

it will not apple went to far. the gpu barley beats a 1050 ti

[boggy77]

Just now, Ankh Tech said:

it will not apple went to far. the gpu barley beats a 1050 ti

what other igpu beats a 1050ti?

[SupaKomputa]

Just now, gal-m said:

No no, I know. I am talking about Apple making really great chips and CPUs like AMD and Intel just being stuck in the past Which would mean, they'd want to start looking at the ARM architecture as well. 

I own both a Mac and a Windows machine, so I know you don't play games on a Mac. I think you just misunderstood me.

AMD has an ARM cpu, A1100 if im not mistaken, i don't know why it's not continued. Maybe low demand.

Apple has the 5nm tsmc, which pretty much on par with the best zen 3 in single core with only 3.2 ghz.

This is great, i know you can't direcly compare arm with x86, but it shows how a 5nm zen4 will have a massive performance jump. 

 

[SpaceGhostC2C]

1 minute ago, gal-m said:

You misunderstood me. I am talking about the ARM architecture and what it can do specifically. And the potential it would have if possibly introduced for Windows. 

It has already been introduced to Windows, there's Windows for ARM. It sucks. Maybe someone else tries and succeeds at making a truly high performance ARM chip and MS decides to improve its Windows support. Who knows.

 

But I thought the question was "is the rest of us living in the stone age"?, not "may we be living in the stone age, perhaps, at some future date?", because then yes, most likely at some point current hardware will be obsolete, ARM or otherwise. 

The fact that you wanted a gaming PC just makes the recent Apple release less relevant to you.

 

 

[Ankh Tech]

Just now, boggy77 said:

what other igpu beats a 1050ti?

well, they claimed it to be a revolutionary gpu, plus the fact that mac os and arm are  not optimal for gaming, I don't see gaming on arm anytime soon. For the price of the macbook pro, you can get a good gaming system that crushes the m1.

[Spindel]

5 minutes ago, gal-m said:

I bow to you sir. 
Congratz on the purchase! Hope you're enjoying it so far

Everything I need for work works for me. 

 

I've stated in several other threads that the over all system responsiveness can't be described, this thing is fast, quiet and cool in a normal workflow. 

 

(mainly use MS Office (word, excel, outlook, onenote), AutoCAD and browser to do my work all of the programs except Safari are currently running under rosetta so they aren't even native) 

[SupaKomputa]

1 minute ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

It has already been introduced to Windows, there's Windows for ARM. It sucks.

Yes, because there aren't any ARM optimized cpu for windows yet, they use the desktop version of snapdragon, which is sucks even in android.

[Blademaster91]

14 minutes ago, gal-m said:

No no, I know. I am talking about Apple making really great chips and CPUs like AMD and Intel just being stuck in the past Which would mean, they'd want to start looking at the ARM architecture as well. 

I own both a Mac and a Windows machine, so I know you don't play games on a Mac. I think you just misunderstood me.

Apple doesn't sell chips, they sell you a system, Apple is doing their own thing by ditching x86.

AMD is beating Intel which is great for competition and encourages Intel to innovate again, we've been stuck on Intel 14nm++++++++ and their 4c/4t cpu's for way too long there hasn't been much push to optimize software for anything more than a quad core until AMD Ryzen.

But Intel isn't doomed or outdated considering their 10th gen chips still compete while on 14nm. If you want a powerful Windows gaming system then you should build one.