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Man sues Apple for terminating Apple ID with $24K worth of content

Summary

Apple has terminated an Apple ID whose user had nearly $24k worth of content attached to it which he can no longer access. He is suing Apple now saying that the TOS allowing Apple to do that is unlawful.

 

Quotes

Quote

 Apple has been hit with a lawsuit alleging that its media services terms and conditions, which permit the company to terminate an Apple ID, are "unlawful" and "unconscionable."

The complaint, filed on Tuesday in the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of California, goes after an Apple services clause that states a user with a terminated Apple ID cannot access media content that they've purchased.

Through its terms and conditions, Apple retains the right to terminate an Apple ID. More than that, the lawsuit claims that Apple can terminate an account based on mere suspicion.

"Apple's unlawful and unconscionable clause as a prohibited de facto liquidated damages provision which is triggered when Apple suspects its customers have breached its Terms and Conditions," the lawsuit reads.

 

My thoughts

I think that this is certainly a topic that needs to be discussed and be decided by a court. Though I think that this needs to go far beyond just Apple. The fact that companies can at any point in time remove your access to bought (sorry, *licensed*) content at any time with no way for the average user to fight this is just ridiculous. More so in an eco-system like iOS or Android where it might render your physical devices almost unusable. I agree that companies shouldn't be forced to do business with you, but things you already bought should remain accessible to you. And there needs to be a way for users to reliably and easily be able to challenge bans and account deletions plus a company needs to give you specific reasons as to why your were banned. (Otherwise there is no way for you to disprove a claim)

 

Sources

 https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/04/20/man-sues-apple-for-terminating-apple-id-with-24k-worth-of-content

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This is a clear example of why a lot of people still prefer physical media, buy consoles with disc-drives or CDs instead of paying for streaming. Stuff like this.
Sure what Apple did was (currently) within their rights... But it sure does leave a sour taste in your mouth, doesn't it?
 

Music I liked disappeared from Spotify. I know Apple themselves removed movies people bought from their account in the past. There's a reason I stopped paying subscriptions and moved to hosting my own Plex server.

 

I think there needs to a refactoring of ownership laws concerning digital content. Currently basically all of it is a "license to use", not an actual ownership. And while some licenses might be non-revocable, access to the content certainly is, and keeps being dependent on the service that provides them. And current Copyright laws and DRM can certainly get part of the blame.


I think Apple is actually currently being sued about their wording about "purchasing" movies on iTunes, when it was actually an "extended renter's agreement".

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I know everyone loves to shit on Apple constantly, but I'd absolutely like to know why his account was terminated. Coz I don't see how Apple would just randomly terminate someone's account for no reason what so ever. And really, that is the most important part. Coz you really need to screw something really badly that they terminate not only your account but also all content associated with it.

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4 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

I know everyone loves to shit on Apple constantly, but I'd absolutely like to know why his account was terminated. Coz I don't see how Apple would just randomly terminate someone's account for no reason what so ever. And really, that is the most important part. Coz you really need to screw something really badly that they terminate not only your account but also all content associated with it.

Bruh, I don't shit on apple, apples are for eating ending up in our stomach, not to be shat on.

 

Ok ok, kidding aside. Yep, $24K is really damn a lot and you gotta fuck something really really bad to have it terminated indeed.

 

Can't it because of the leaked blueprints by randsomware?

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9 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

I know everyone loves to shit on Apple constantly, but I'd absolutely like to know why his account was terminated. Coz I don't see how Apple would just randomly terminate someone's account for no reason what so ever. And really, that is the most important part. Coz you really need to screw something really badly that they terminate not only your account but also all content associated with it.

If your account is terminated you lose access to everything tied to it... it's not an additional measure taken against this person specifically. And regardless, what, can Ikea just come to your house and take your bed away if you did something they didn't like?

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5 minutes ago, Sauron said:

And regardless, what, can Ikea just come to your house and take your bed away if you did something they didn't like?

Yes. Water sheep will summon his minions and they'll take it away /s

 

I'm really curious what this guy did, if anything.

If he's done nothing wrong, Apple's in trouble.

If he did do something that warranted an Apple ID termination, tough luck for him. Doing bad stuff = bad things happen.

 

How many times has Apple terminated an Apple ID, I wonder?

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44 minutes ago, XWAUForceflow said:

 

My thoughts

I think that this is certainly a topic that needs to be discussed and be decided by a court.

I have to wonder what egregious thing this person did to have their account terminated, and my guess is probably that they were either:

a) a software developer who was breaking their ToS (eg see Epic)

or

b) pirating content from the app store or itunes music/movie store and it has come back to haunt them

 

That said, as someone who has like $50,000 (60 x 800) worth of games in digital downloads, I would be very upset if the companies I downloaded the games decided to just pack up and leave (my main concern with Epic Game Store, and the same reason why I wouldn't buy anything from Ubisoft or EA's stores unless it was on Steam.) Steam is unlikely to go anywhere. Microsoft though? Microsoft has closed stores they've operated, including the PHYSICAL stores they opened not that long ago. Same with Google. I would never spend a dime on microsoft or google's stores because they show no commitment to it. Nintendo I even have reservations of buying from because what if the drive or flash memory dies, what if the console is no longer available? They haven't exactly been keeping their stores and services online. That just leaves Apple, Sony and Steam as the only reliable stores for downloading, and Apple comes with the caveat that even if something is delisted, it doesn't get deleted from your device, buf if you get a new device, you aren't transferring that old app to it. Sony doesn't let you buy PS3 or Vita games after June this year.

 

Really Steam is all there is, if you want to download stuff released in the last decade. GOG isn't even a reliable option after CP2077 (CD Projekt S.A.) can potentially tank the company. I no doubt see GOG or a copy of it establishing itself if CD Projekt screws things up too horribly, (eg itch.io), but that might raise the hackles of any company wanting to release DRM-free software on a platform that is vertically integrated with a game publisher again.

 

Realistically, we should be requiring companies that "own" the media, to send us backups at zero cost if we request them, if they will not permit us to make our own backups. So that might just be the carrot needed to disincentive machine-tied DRM methods.

 

 

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Companies being allowed to shut down your accounts containing hundred/thousand of dollars worth of "digital goods" in them... Is the thing I fear most in this digital world. But I hate collecting physical media so much... 
I do wonder what this content was, though.

 

4 minutes ago, Kisai said:

Realistically, we should be requiring companies that "own" the media, to send us backups at zero cost if we request them, if they will not permit us to make our own backups. So that might just be the carrot needed to disincentive machine-tied DRM methods.

I would certainly love to have this option!
At least with Steam and the like, you can download your games and back them up locally. If steam ever goes away, most games are easily crackable to skip the DRM.
But with things like Apple, Google and what not... Especially on mobile... Can you even download movies and music ? I remember with Google Play Music, I could download my songs that I bought (up to a limited number of times). But after they switched to Youtube Music, I seems to have lost that option with my library of songs and no longer feel like buying more.

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Why did they delete his Apple ID?

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1 hour ago, RejZoR said:

I know everyone loves to shit on Apple constantly, but I'd absolutely like to know why his account was terminated. Coz I don't see how Apple would just randomly terminate someone's account for no reason what so ever. And really, that is the most important part. Coz you really need to screw something really badly that they terminate not only your account but also all content associated with it.

Yep, it sounds wrong to be able to do this "on mere suspicion" as is claimed, but I'd like to believe even Apple wouldn't do something that drastic just because someone has a hunch. I'd also like to see the other side of this story.

11 minutes ago, Kisai said:

Realistically, we should be requiring companies that "own" the media, to send us backups at zero cost if we request them, if they will not permit us to make our own backups. So that might just be the carrot needed to disincentive machine-tied DRM methods.

I remember Spore only being allowed to be installed on 3 machines/OSes. That was a drag. Steam has become too big to fail. With the amount of money and people tied up in it there's no way they would be allowed to go under without giving us a way to maintain access to our games. Or at least I hope and like to think that.

 

1 hour ago, elfensky said:

I think there needs to a refactoring of ownership laws concerning digital content. Currently basically all of it is a "license to use", not an actual ownership. And while some licenses might be non-revocable, access to the content certainly is, and keeps being dependent on the service that provides them. And current Copyright laws and DRM can certainly get part of the blame.

I believe, but I could be wrong, that DVDs or Blu Rays are also nothing more than a license to view the content on that disc. The key difference is that if your local DVD shop disappears, you still have access to your license, so I think the problem here is: if the vendor loses their license to distribute said movie, does that immediately void your license to watch as well? (I don't think it shoud) In other words, what kind of license are you obtaing through these storefronts and are you purchasing said license or renting them.

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9 minutes ago, RoseLuck462 said:

Why did they delete his Apple ID?

1 hour ago, FakeKGB said:

I'm really curious what this guy did, if anything

31 minutes ago, Kisai said:

I have to wonder what egregious thing this person did to have their account terminated

 

honestly, does it matter?

 

it's one thing to stop someone from using your services, but another thing entirely to retroactively lock you out of ALL purchases you had made previously.

 

This is why i hate DRM and the growing trend of always online services.

 

 

32 minutes ago, Kisai said:

b) pirating content from the app store or itunes music/movie store and it has come back to haunt them

I find it very hard to believe someone would be stupid enough to pirate content or acquire it fraudulently and then when he gets banned, to take Apple to court where evidence would be able to be easily given to completely invalidate his case and also then be charged himself.

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He probably had 24K magic in there. lol

Being serious, like said before even I prefer physical content. I don't like to put valuable content on some kind of cloud or buy a lot of digital content that I could lose. For example, it's why many people refuse to go fully digital on gaming consoles. Do something bad, get your account banned and all your content could be unreachable. And in gaming terms it's much easier to get banned than on Apple.

For Apple he really must have crossed the line with something like pirated, stolen or hacked content. Or he just had inappropriate content on there.

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What does he want Apple to do?  Be forced to maintain a relationship with him under any circumstance so he never loses access to digital services?  Refund him for stuff he bought years ago, so whenever you want to "cash out" your account just get it banned?  Get all his porn mailed to him on a flash drive?

 

The fact he even got banned says something cause he's the first I've heard of.

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Page me when there is info posted why his account was terminated. Until then it's just a bullshit witch hunt. It's funny how people scream "we need more info" and "don't jump to conclusions, but when Apple is involved, everyone jumps to conclusions without ANY info. I just find it oddly bizarre.

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You pay for a lifetime rental.. be it your lifetime, or the lifetime of your account I would think.. whichever ends first..

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inb4 "their platform, their rule" excuse

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9 minutes ago, suicidalfranco said:

inb4 "their platform, their rule" excuse

I mean people are pretty much giving that excuse with "but it's apple the person must be stupid to get banned".

28 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Page me when there is info posted why his account was terminated. Until then it's just a bullshit witch hunt. It's funny how people scream "we need more info" and "don't jump to conclusions, but when Apple is involved, everyone jumps to conclusions without ANY info. I just find it oddly bizarre.

No, you're the one insisting it's because it's Apple, I don't care what company it is they should give a reason before just before completely terminating an account.

What's funny is everyone is defending them because it's Apple as if they care about you than any other company, that doesn't happen with any other company that does anti-consumer sh*t like this.

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3 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

I mean people are pretty much giving that excuse with "but it's apple the person must be stupid to get banned".

No, you're the one insisting it's because it's Apple, I don't care what company it is they should give a reason before just before completely terminating an account.

What's funny is everyone is defending them because it's Apple as if they care about you than any other company, that doesn't happen with any other company that does anti-consumer sh*t like this.

No, I'm just saying STOP JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS. Coz without info why they terminated it, that's literally what you all are doing.

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51 minutes ago, AnonymousGuy said:

What does he want Apple to do?  Be forced to maintain a relationship with him under any circumstance so he never loses access to digital services?  Refund him for stuff he bought years ago, so whenever you want to "cash out" your account just get it banned?  Get all his porn mailed to him on a flash drive?

 

The fact he even got banned says something cause he's the first I've heard of.

Probably he wants to not get locked out everything he bought, even if he couldn't buy new things.

Using the IKEA example, that's like if you get banned from IKEA for doing something stupid, but they also come to your house and get everything you have ever bought back. It's stupid and shouldn't be a thing.

 

30 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Page me when there is info posted why his account was terminated. Until then it's just a bullshit witch hunt. It's funny how people scream "we need more info" and "don't jump to conclusions, but when Apple is involved, everyone jumps to conclusions without ANY info. I just find it oddly bizarre.

It doesn't matter why the account got terminated.

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11 minutes ago, KaitouX said:

Probably he wants to not get locked out everything he bought, even if he couldn't buy new things.

Using the IKEA example, that's like if you get banned from IKEA for doing something stupid, but they also come to your house and get everything you have ever bought back. It's stupid and shouldn't be a thing.

 

It doesn't matter why the account got terminated.

All of a sudden "it doesn't matter". I guess we should just close down the courts, we don't need the "reasons" anymore to make verdicts. Lets go back in drowning people and see if they float or drown to see if they are witches...

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24 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

No, I'm just saying STOP JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS. Coz without info why they terminated it, that's literally what you all are doing.

I'm not jumping to any conclusions, again the person wasn't given any reason why they were banned, I don't care what company does that it's a sh*t thing to do when it can render a device nearly unusable.

I doubt anyone would be defending Google if they were randomly terminating an account worth $24k in content without any stated reason.

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3 hours ago, FakeKGB said:

Yes. Water sheep will summon his minions and they'll take it away /s

 

I'm really curious what this guy did, if anything.

If he's done nothing wrong, Apple's in trouble.

If he did do something that warranted an Apple ID termination, tough luck for him. Doing bad stuff = bad things happen.

 

How many times has Apple terminated an Apple ID, I wonder?

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5 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

I'm not jumping to any conclusions, again the person wasn't given any reason why they were banned, I don't care what company does that it's a sh*t thing to do when it can render a device nearly unusable.

I doubt anyone would be defending Google if they were randomly terminating an account worth $24k in content without any stated reason.

If this was happening every week or month, I'd even believe you. It's like the first case ever. Hold your horses at burning shit at stakes...

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