[Salt Needed] Reddit leak shows next gen Xbox specs - to include Ray Tracing

[DragonTamer1]

There was a leak on the most reliable of all websites, reddit, about Microsoft's upcoming consoles specs and rough performance. The 'news' was quickly deleted from reddit but not before screen shots were taken of the post and later verified by someone who is connected to the projects (though this same person apparently claimed to know about the PS5 so take that as you will). The contact claimed that the hardware specs were 'partially true' but didn't comment further. They did say that ray tracing will be a thing on the consoles, which if true is huge for the technology and could possibly hint that Navi (which is what is rumored to be in the console) could also support ray tracing itself to some extent.

 

Quote

In the past few days, a rumor regarding the next Xbox console and Microsoft’s plans for the next console generation started circulating online. Earlier today, a verified ResetEra forums member called hmqq talked about the rumor, confirming that some of the things revealed in the earlier rumor are true. Among them are Ray Tracing and storage, as well as some of the revealed specs.

I don't know what 'verified' means on that forum so this could all be malarkey. The specs seem fairly reasonable though and not far off of what has been speculated in the past.

Quote

About the reddit leak.

The hardware is partially true
Storage is true
Raytracing is true
Lockhart is not Streaming box
Xbox SoC codename is Anubis, check AMD’s plan
MS AI is not a part of the hardware, in other words, never heard of TPU or ASIC like it
How to implement Raytracing? See GDC 2019
Why they make a decision like Lockhart? See GDC 2019
Why there still no DevKit? After GDC 2019

Supposedly there is going to be a more cut down version that is meant as a streaming box, but that was more questionable as some of its specs were way overkill for a streaming box.

Quote

The rumored specs for the next Xbox console, codenamed Anubis, are:

CPU: Custom 8 cores / 16 Threads Zen 2 CPU

GPU: Custom NAVI @12+ teraflops

Memory: 16GB GDDR6

Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD @ 1+GB/s

DirectX Raytracing + MS AI

CPU isn't surprising and was suggested before that it would be Zen based, I don't know if anyone expected it to be Zen2 as I haven't been following that closely.

GPU isn't much of a surprise either as far as I can tell.

16GB of memory is respectable, but how much of that is going to be used for GPU and how much for CPU. I'm assuming that they are sharing.

That's very fast storage for a console but might be too small for a lot of larger games. May be able to add external storage as well.

 

I know that most of the people on this forum are PCMR members and don't care about consoles, but if the ray tracing turns out to be true that would be huge in more ways than one. For starters, it would show that AMD is capable of ray tracing to some capacity and that it may be coming with Navi (assuming that is the GPU used here). In addition, as mentioned in the below video, it would also give an incentive for developers to leverage it since they would know that based on how many consoles sold, at least that many users would be able to use it.

 

As with all rumors, this should be taken with a bit of salt.

 

https://wccftech.com/next-xbox-raytracing/

 

Credit where due, I originally heard about this info here and he goes into more detail looking at the rumor.

 

 

[lacion]

microsoft has been doing a lot of work into raytracing in real-time. it would be interesting here though is to see what resources will be lost to do raytracing.

 

nvidia thew a lot of tensor cores at the RTX cards to make that possible, it been rumored that navi will have something alike, but i feel like amd is late at this game and a first gen AI chip from AMD into a console may be a bit risky.

[Beskamir]

It seems unlikely that it'll have decent ray tracing just due to the kind of tech Nvidia had to develop to make it work. Sure you can do ray tracing with compute shaders but it's not gonna be anywhere near what Nvidia has been able to pull off with custom ray tracing and AI cores.

[TheDankKoosh]

The rumored specs for the next Xbox console, codenamed Anubis, are:

CPU: Custom 8 cores / 16 Threads Zen 2 CPU

GPU: Custom NAVI @12+ teraflops

Memory: 16GB GDDR6

Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD @ 1+GB/s

DirectX Raytracing + MS AI

 

This would cost 1k at least with these kind of specs, I don't even see modern consoles switching off of hdds for another 5-10 years so an nvme ssd that is much more expensive than a sata ssd is already about half the cost of this machine. A 12 teraflop navi also seems completely out of the question since this needs to be a cheap chip and 12 teraflops would put it right by vega 64. The most likely out of this entire lineup is the 8c 16t zen 2 chip, and I even doubt that due to cost factors yet again.

[lacion]

5 minutes ago, ElfFriend said:

It seems unlikely that it'll have decent ray tracing just due to the kind of tech Nvidia had to develop to make it work. Sure you can do ray tracing with compute shaders but it's not gonna be anywhere near what Nvidia has been able to pull off with custom ray tracing and AI cores.

im not so sure about that, if AMD is working closely with Microsoft they may have something there, as DXR is MS baby.

 

Just now, TheDankKoosh said:

The rumored specs for the next Xbox console, codenamed Anubis, are:

CPU: Custom 8 cores / 16 Threads Zen 2 CPU

GPU: Custom NAVI @12+ teraflops

Memory: 16GB GDDR6

Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD @ 1+GB/s

DirectX Raytracing + MS AI

 

This would cost 1k at least with these kind of specs, I don't even see modern consoles switching off of hdds for another 5-10 years so an nvme ssd that is much more expensive than a sata ssd is already about half the cost of this machine. A 12 teraflop navi also seems completely out of the question since this needs to be a cheap chip and 12 teraflops would put it right by vega 64. The most likely out of this entire lineup is the 8c 16t zen 2 chip, and I even doubt that due to cost factors yet again.

9

if history is to be noted, both MS and Sony have always take losses on hardware to keep their consoles selling

 

 

[GoldenLag]

8 minutes ago, TheDankKoosh said:

CPU: Custom 8 cores / 16 Threads Zen 2 CPU

unless AMD has stupidly high yields. this is unlikely to happen. they are at best super low clocking parts. 

 

also, "custom". its unlikely they are using anything but standard desktop chips to keep yields and salvaging rates high. there is really nothing custom but maybe the IO die to have GDDR6 controllers instead of DDR4, unless the desktop IO die allready has both. 

 

 

[suicidalfranco]

Linus already made an Xbox capable of RTX

[Salv8 (sam)]

but in all seriousness

57 minutes ago, DragonTamer1 said:

Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD @ 1+GB/s

thats bullshit from a console peasant, an Intel 660p costs $260 AUD (LINK), thats about HALF the Xbox One X in cost

i created a PCpartpicker list of the parts and their nearest aprox. 's

(keep in mind i will use the specs that this "source" says it will have)

(also this is in AUD because fuck the US dollar, everything is more expensive in Australia)

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD - Ryzen 7 1700 3 GHz 8-Core Processor	$265.38 @ Amazon Australia
Memory	Corsair - 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR3-1600 Memory	$65.55 @ Amazon Australia
Storage	Intel - 660p Series 1 TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive	$245.00 @ Skycomp Technology
Video Card	Gigabyte - GeForce RTX 2060 6 GB MINI ITX OC Video Card	$579.00 @ PCCaseGear
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total	$1154.93
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-01-25 19:28 AEDT+1100

again, this is only a idea of what the source says that "it will have", the entire thing costs half of my desktop and TWICE as much as the Xbox One X.

but this is for a desktop, lets be generous and say that it will have 50% off (it's probbly less but hey, lets give it a fucking chance because why not) since only the chips and required components are only needed and the rest in integrated into the console itself like how it's been done since consoles started using PC hardware as their basis, and an extra $200 added for manufacturing costs and other crap

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD - Ryzen 7 1700 3 GHz 8-Core Processor	$132.69
Memory	Corsair - 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR3-1600 Memory	$32.77
Storage	Intel - 660p Series 1 TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive	$122.50
Video Card	Gigabyte - GeForce RTX 2060 6 GB MINI ITX OC Video Card	$289.50
Other	"The magic spice"	$200.00
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total	$777.46
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-01-25 19:35 AEDT+1100

about under $800, or the price of mid range PC with a bit more budget given to it.. keep in mind that it may not be like that...

even then, real time raytracing isn't having much luck on the PC side, a console having it may actually hurt the consoles sales due how poorly it's preformed on the PC side and has yet to prove that it's the next step...

it's going to be 1-2 years before RTRT (real time ray tracing, i'm not writing that out again fuck that) will be a good idea on the PC side, add another 2 years and RTRT will most likely be on consoles...

this is just another console peasant spouting bullshit about how the next console will be better than the PC and that shit, it's been going on since the 360 and will never stop until we stop noticing them and start ignoring them... it's fucking tiring and a waste of time, energy, resources, space and the limited life span we humans have...

is this post salt?

yes....

[Fnige]

im sorry, but the worlds amount of salt (120,000,000 tonnes) isn't enough

 

is there anything that acts like salt, but isnt salt? anyone?

[williamcll]

jh

2 hours ago, TheDankKoosh said:

The rumored specs for the next Xbox console, codenamed Anubis, are:

CPU: Custom 8 cores / 16 Threads Zen 2 CPU

GPU: Custom NAVI @12+ teraflops

Memory: 16GB GDDR6

Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD @ 1+GB/s

DirectX Raytracing + MS AI

 

This would cost 1k at least with these kind of specs, I don't even see modern consoles switching off of hdds for another 5-10 years so an nvme ssd that is much more expensive than a sata ssd is already about half the cost of this machine. A 12 teraflop navi also seems completely out of the question since this needs to be a cheap chip and 12 teraflops would put it right by vega 64. The most likely out of this entire lineup is the 8c 16t zen 2 chip, and I even doubt that due to cost factors yet again.

Don't console makers (other than Nintendo probably) sell consoles on a loss?

[TempestCatto]

18 minutes ago, Tedny said:

Is NVMe SSD save enough to replace HDD in 5 year run of writing and rewriting data? 

As long as it's a good one, yes.

[kuddlesworth9419]

Doubt.

[Dabombinable]

Still don't care about modern consoles. Getting my chipped OG Xbox out and using it after screwing around with the PS4 slim has made me realise how out of touch Microsoft and Sony are. Their consoles are barely more  convenient  than a pre-built now.

[lacion]

the PS3 cost at launch was $599 / 699 euros maybe Microsoft will be pulling a sony on this one.

[GoldenLag]

1 hour ago, williamcll said:

jh

Don't console makers (other than Nintendo probably) sell consoles on a loss?

they make money on the service and not the console themselves. shure the earning on the hardware is nice, but not neccesary. 

[Noctus]

1 hour ago, lacion said:

the PS3 cost at launch was $599 / 699 euros maybe Microsoft will be pulling a sony on this one.

PS3 was sold at a loss. Do you honestly think MS will build something costing twice as much (if you compare pcpartpicker) and sell at even MORE of a loss ?? That just seems suicide.

[The Benjamins]

44 minutes ago, Noctus said:

PS3 was sold at a loss. Do you honestly think MS will build something costing twice as much (if you compare pcpartpicker) and sell at even MORE of a loss ?? That just seems suicide.

My estimated BOM cost of those specs is around $500, keeping in mind this is a 2020 product. and for MS to sell it at $400-$500 sounds reasonable to me

 

Update: After looking at source

The streaming box, looks like a xbox one x side step (better CPU, same GPU perf) at $250 which sounds like a reasonable price point.

 

The Big one has 3x faster GPU then a xbox one x at $500 which also does not sound like a huge stretch.

 

Both said to launch in holiday (Q4) 2020, and at that time frame RAM, SSD and other part prices should be lower.

 

To me nothing sounds crazy unachievable at a $500 price point.

[D13H4RD]

Press X to doubt 

[lacion]

45 minutes ago, Noctus said:

PS3 was sold at a loss. Do you honestly think MS will build something costing twice as much (if you compare pcpartpicker) and sell at even MORE of a loss ?? That just seems suicide.

 

do you really think microsoft is getting hardware at MSRP? i am pretty sure anyone comes to a vendor with a multimillion unit order the prices will go down a lot more than 50%

[thorhammerz]

4 hours ago, Tedny said:

Is NVMe SSD save enough to replace HDD in 5 year run of writing and rewriting data? 

On a well-made drive on gaming (a.k.a. non-existent/negligible) loads? The NAND will probably reach it's rated usage sometime just before the 2nd inch of dust has killed everything else the 4th or 5th time over .

 

 

[The Benjamins]

6 hours ago, TheDankKoosh said:

The rumored specs for the next Xbox console, codenamed Anubis, are:

CPU: Custom 8 cores / 16 Threads Zen 2 CPU

GPU: Custom NAVI @12+ teraflops

Memory: 16GB GDDR6

Storage: 1TB NVMe SSD @ 1+GB/s

DirectX Raytracing + MS AI

 

This would cost 1k at least with these kind of specs, I don't even see modern consoles switching off of hdds for another 5-10 years so an nvme ssd that is much more expensive than a sata ssd is already about half the cost of this machine. A 12 teraflop navi also seems completely out of the question since this needs to be a cheap chip and 12 teraflops would put it right by vega 64. The most likely out of this entire lineup is the 8c 16t zen 2 chip, and I even doubt that due to cost factors yet again.

a 1TB NVME drive today that is faster then 1GBps can be bought for under $140, this product releases in 1.5 years, The cost of it for micro soft to implement should be under $80.

 

Per the Navi leaks the top Navi card will be around $300, with this being a AMD zen 2 + Navi custom Package deal with expected volumes I can see it being under $300 for the CPU + GPU package.

 

A BOM cost of $500 sounds perfectly reasonable, it will be using a 1 year old CPU and GPU.

[GoldenLag]

59 minutes ago, Noctus said:

PS3 was sold at a loss. Do you honestly think MS will build something costing twice as much (if you compare pcpartpicker) and sell at even MORE of a loss ?? That just seems suicide.

They arent paying retail for these components. And these are lower performing chips. 

 

Its also not current products. So price speculation is mostly out the window on a lot of this

[RejZoR]

If Xbox is going to have ray tracing, so will desktop GPU from AMD.

[Doobeedoo]

Well, it may seem far fetched though maybe not. It's still away before release. Being 7nm SoC so Zen2 CPU makes sense, 8c 16t is a huge uplift from old Jaguar core. 60fps should be a thing easily. Navi with 12+ tflops would also be a big jump. It's meant to be a better performance for a better price point type of GPU at least what it's rumored to be on desktop in time. 

16GB of shared memory if managed well may be solid though. It's a console so OS using less and all. 

1TB NVMe SSD I can really see by then with QLC and further price drops. 

For RT well who knows, but interesting though, even though we still don't know Navi details. But yeah expect it to be of a lower entry quality for sure. 

But yeah, for that price that would be awesome it looks like. 

[DragonTamer1]

Since the clock speeds of the CPU wasn't discussed, I suspect it would be a low clock Zen or Zen2. These would probably be the reject low bin parts that didn't make AMD's requirements for desktop CPU (craps out at higher clocks) so they sell these to Microsoft/Sony for less to at least make their money back. I would be floored if these CPUs broke 3 GHz.

 

The IO controller would need to be modified to work with GDDR6

 

The GPU is probably a lower end Navi. I don't see a top end Navi chip going in there unless there was something wrong with the silicon where it wasn't good for desktop use. As for ray tracing, if AMD has employed those guys that were demoing ray tracing in 2016 then it's possible AMD may have approached the issue differently than Nvidia. Using a small dedicated IC would help lower power when not in use, would reduce fab costs since they don't need to make as big of a chip overall and could feed ray traced graphics back into the GPU during rendering. Probably won't be more than the RTX 2060 in performance though.

 

The GDDR6 is probably going to be the most expensive, at least at first.

 

If MS is buying storage ICs and a controller then they could be putting their NVMe SSD right onto the board. This would save cost since they don't need someone to make a stick, they don't need to pay someone on an assembly line to install the SSD in the system and the development cost would be on MS themselves. MS probably gets a discount for bulk orders or even an exclusive contract with a certain provider to only buy their ICs.

 

I would put the system somewhere between $500 and $600 to build.