Project CARS devs address AMD performance issues, AMD drivers to blame entirely, PhysX runs on CPU only, no GPU involvement whatsoever.

[BestBOTEU]

again a case where the game developers got payed by nvidia and screwed the game for amd users, then blame the drivers which leads to nvidia fanboys spreading the false word, which leads to more people buying nvidia, classic nvidia. 

also gotta add the project cars looks "arcadey" as hell, gonna to stick to dirt rally.

[grayperview]

What i noticed when running this game was that the gpu load was extremely low on both my cards (30-40%) despite the game running far below 60fps....So thing ain't right somewhere with this game that is for sure.

[Ashaira]

i was referring to @Ashaira who claims he changed to AMD since he had so much trouble with shadow play not working 

 

do you have a nvidia card and have you tried it in your home? PC's are like vehicles, you know your PC and the problems it has, but when you are on your friends house and something didn't work, its just not the same as diagnosing your own computer. 

you say you configured it once in your friends house, if it's all the exposure you have on shadow play , sorry i can not take your claims of shadow play problems. but i aknolwedge it has problems and it is beta. so we shouldn't really be having this conversation 

 

ok then.

 

i did not switch due to shadowplay alone. it was just one of the problems i had.

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

i did not switch due to shadowplay alone. it was just one of the problems i had.

what other ?

[Humbug]

last time i checked noone on the forum cared about benchmarks that werent max ultra...but there can be first

the video illustrated a point which is relevant to this discussion for AMD GPUs on Project Cars

The windows 10 driver (which for now is only available via windows update to users of the tech preview) had consistently higher GPU usage numbers and as a result noticeably better performance in Project Cars vs the official windows 8.1 catalyst 15.4 beta. In general higher GPU usage is a sign that the graphics card is operating closer to it's potential with other bottlenecks in the system such as CPU/driver  overhead not getting in the way. Either it's the driver or it's some other aspect of windows 10 which allowed the 280x to flourish.

[Ashaira]

what other ?

look up the godam post. your the one who looked at the post and the only thing you saw was the shadowplay problem.

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

look up the godam post. your the one who looked at the post and the only thing you saw was the shadowplay problem.

i did, that was your main issue.

[Ashaira]

i did, that was your main issue.

how was that the main issue? you think i had a bigger problem with shadowplay over random 1-2 second freezes?

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

how was that the main issue? you think i had a bigger problem with shadowplay over random 1-2 second freezes?

well, that's what you said.

[Chris_R.]

Green Team Sponsored, so let’s blame the red team..... Just wait for it to go on sale for $19.99 in Steam’s Summer Sale

[ShadowCaptain]

 3. WHEN THE INTRO OF THE GAME HAS NVIDIA GAMEWORKS YOU WERE PAID

 

that isnt necessarily true

 

(might be in some cases)

[AlwaysFSX]

that isnt necessarily true

 

(might be in some cases)

Last I recall the gameworks intro is if the game even uses it, not for being paid. So all these schmucks spewing bullshit have the right to sit down and shut the hell up.

[ShadowCaptain]

Last I recall the gameworks intro is if the game even uses it, not for being paid. So all these schmucks spewing bullshit have the right to sit down and shut the hell up.

 

Yeah it really annoys me, in fact it pretty much sums up this forum

[AlwaysFSX]

Yeah it really annoys me, in fact it pretty much sums up this forum

It's a bunch of idiots that know jack all about the subject spreading nonsense that they don't even know about. I bet Michelin paid the developers to gimp AMD too, huh? God these ignorant narrow minded people are the bane of humanity's existence.

[ShadowCaptain]

It's a bunch of idiots that know jack all about the subject spreading nonsense that they don't even know about. I bet Michelin paid the developers to gimp AMD too, huh? God these ignorant narrow minded people are the bane of humanity's existence.

 

Welcome to humans

[AlwaysFSX]

Welcome to humans

One of the worst life forms to grace this planets. Self entitled delusional beings that think they know it all. Evidence in this thread.

[ShadowCaptain]

One of the worst life forms to grace this planets. Self entitled delusional beings that think they know it all. Evidence in this thread.

 

agreed

 

 

Intels GPUs are just getting started, they've done wonders with Iris Pro so far

 

 

Very true, and honestly the intel on board gpus sure they are not powerful but they are extremely reliable and never seem to have issues, Iris pro is really really good, 

 

Maybe intel can ramp up GPU performance to high end standards, would be awesome! (especially for laptops/ultrabooks)

[zappian]

One of the worst life forms to grace this planets. Self entitled delusional beings that think they know it all. Evidence in this thread.

 

I agree some members of this thread do have that problem .

[AlwaysFSX]

I agree some members of this thread do have that problem .

The problem I have is everyone wants to point fingers at everything but what could be the likely problem. AMD does need to develop their drivers to work with the game properly. Months ago in an Alpha build it might have worked great. But things change over time and drivers need to be updated or they won't work right. If the problem is AMD then everyone needs to be quiet and not blame the devs, Nvidia, whoever. AMD not putting out proper drivers is a very likely problem and the developers are right. But nooobooooooody here knows whether or not this is actually what happened. And they also don't know if the game was "sabotaged by Nvidia."

[patrickjp93]

so basically devs are too lazy to fix their games properly and so driver vendors are supposed to fix it...this didnt used to be the case when people didnt have the internet as easily...

Most game devs are not even on my tier of programming ability, much less system engineers. You have to remember most of the world's video game programmers are college dropouts or otherwise not graduates of a rigorous computer science degree from even a top 50 institution on the subject. The fact AMD and Nvidia and Intel all have programmers working furiously around the clock fixing game issues via driver changes should boggle the mind and stand testament to the fact the games industry is in serious trouble moving forward. With DX12 the responsibility goes back to the developers to deliver.

[ACatWithThumbs]

Most game devs are not even on my tier of programming ability, much less system engineers. You have to remember most of the world's video game programmers are college dropouts or otherwise not graduates of a rigorous computer science degree from even a top 50 institution on the subject. The fact AMD and Nvidia and Intel all have programmers working furiously around the clock fixing game issues via driver changes should boggle the mind and stand testament to the fact the games industry is in serious trouble moving forward. With DX12 the responsibility goes back to the developers to deliver.

That problem wouldn't be there if they would pay the same as other tech companies.

Of course they don't get the really good coders when other tech companies outside of the game industry pay 10-30k more per year.

 

[Humbug]

The fact AMD and Nvidia and Intel all have programmers working furiously around the clock fixing game issues via driver changes should boggle the mind

exactly.

I can't think of any other field of computing where hardware vendors have to constantly update their device drivers for every major software application to perform properly.

From a layman's perspective it seems like If every layer functioned ideally and everybody was using industry standard APIs it should not be necessary...

[patrickjp93]

That problem wouldn't be there if they would pay the same as other tech companies.

Of course they don't get the really good coders when other tech companies outside of the game industry pay 10-30k more per year.

 

Do you want to pay more for your video games? If not, then the economy for game developers will remain the same. Studios only buy the good programmers for engine development. If the system works for the businesses, why change it? It's just more proof consumers aren't king in any developed economy.

 

Also, 10-30K more? Try multiple 100K more depending on the area of the industry. Maybe if teachers were paid more, we'd have better teachers. That said, do you want to pay more taxes to fund that, regardless of whether or not you can afford private education?

[Victorious Secret]

Most game devs are not even on my tier of programming ability, much less system engineers. You have to remember most of the world's video game programmers are college dropouts or otherwise not graduates of a rigorous computer science degree from even a top 50 institution on the subject. The fact AMD and Nvidia and Intel all have programmers working furiously around the clock fixing game issues via driver changes should boggle the mind and stand testament to the fact the games industry is in serious trouble moving forward. With DX12 the responsibility goes back to the developers to deliver.

 

Well, isn't this the sad truth. Professional programmers are professionals for a reason. They passed through some rigorous standards and wear that degree with pride, because they truly know better and know more. 

 

One of my relatives did the song and dance with computer sciences, thought of game development, realized just how big a joke it truly was and that a degree was maybe even a hindrance, since studios want to hire fucking morons for 50% the price of what they'd have to pay a properly qualified programmer. Its a monumental joke how much work drivers do to cover up the pitfalls of developers. 

 

Its even sadder when games like these have lead times that stretch into YEARS, yet still can't get it right. 

[DXMember]

The problem I have is everyone wants to point fingers at everything but what could be the likely problem. AMD does need to develop their drivers to work with the game properly. Months ago in an Alpha build it might have worked great. But things change over time and drivers need to be updated or they won't work right. If the problem is AMD then everyone needs to be quiet and not blame the devs, Nvidia, whoever. AMD not putting out proper drivers is a very likely problem and the developers are right. But nooobooooooody here knows whether or not this is actually what happened. And they also don't know if the game was "sabotaged by Nvidia."

You sure you understand how drivers work?

At least how they are supposed to work...

I mean all this GPU driver update nonsense is fault of the game developers and only game developers.

Seriously, GPU drivers are the only thing that you have to constantly keep updating, have you ever tried to update your ethernet or soundcard driver? - usually any sane person would tell you not to mess with them for the sake of messing with them if things are working.

Nowadays GPU drivers have become a new layer where poorly written code get's optimized.

nVidia LOVES to optimise in the driver, because that gives them more power to differenciate their GPU lineup *cough* GTX 960 performs on par with Titan and 780 *cough*

AMD on the other hand believes that it should be done the "right" way - optimisation should take place in the game code - and they actively promote it and all kinds of stuff to assist them. Unfortuantely most of the devs are so bad/uneducated/greedy/lazy or whatever are their motives - it just doesn't leave GPU vendors a choice but to keep doing shader substitutions and all kinds of goory stuff in the driver which deal with the poorly written code.

 

EXAMPLE #1:

void RetardedCode()

{

   int c=0;

   int f=0;

   while(c<1000)

   {

       c++;

       if(c==1000 && f<1000)

       {

              c=0; f++;

       }

   }

   cout<<c;

}

 

EXAMPLE #2:

void OptimisedCode()

{ cout<<1000; }

 

Both of these yield exactly the same end result - number '1000' gets printed on the screen, but I hope you would agree that the first example would take a bajillion times more memory and procesor time to execute.

 

Another set of examples - When was the last time a driver came out that addresses performance issues in an indy developed game?

Those devs usually try harder to code for hardware and solve the issues by them selves or just don't release it to the market.