Everyone Was Right About Tesla

[jagdtigger]

23 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

I think the point is that Tesla played a big role in helping EVs be adopted by more than just a small niche alongside making their own products seem "hip" and "cool". 

Its still a pretty small niche with its price tag(not just tesla), and with no real benefit that wont change anytime soon... (if you add up everything it isnt cheaper than an IC that you can repair at home...)

[D13H4RD]

2 minutes ago, jagdtigger said:

Its still a pretty small niche with its price tag(not just tesla), and with no real benefit that wont change anytime soon... (if you add up everything it isnt cheaper than an IC that you can repair at home...)

It's at least a bit more common than before. 

 

It's going to be rather slow until those 30 minute charge times go down to 2-3

[jagdtigger]

2 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

It's going to be rather slow until those 30 minute charge times go down to 2-3

Well unless they find something better than lithium that aint gonna happen. Its an inherent problem of current batteries that they dont like quick-charge. It isnt helping either that currently there is no trustworty study on the cells used in EV's that could show how it ages on different charge and discharge currents... I would bet my bottom dollar on it that they doing it deliberately to hide how oversized the battery needs to be to give the illusion to the customer that the battery has a long lifespan.

[Castdeath97]

3 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

I mean, it's a Peugeot. 

 

Modern Peugeots are pretty crap 

Their newest stuff gives some hope. 508 and 5008 look like a step in the right direction.

[Blademaster91]

3 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

 

I think GM really missed the chance to sell a high performance truck ute in North America, then again they didn't advertise that the SS existed as a V8 4 door and killed it off.

[VanayadGaming]

12 hours ago, Canada EH said:

Telsa vehicles are not worth buying at all.

K Mate. You must have driven one and used one for a few weeks at least to give that impression. What I see here is MSN trying to spread more FUD, where there shouldn't be any. 

[Mihle]

1 hour ago, D13H4RD said:

It's at least a bit more common than before. 

 

It's going to be rather slow until those 30 minute charge times go down to 2-3

Why do you need that short charging, do you often take trips that is longer than one battery full worth of electricity?

Because I'd not, you just charge at home overnight.

[Mihle]

1 hour ago, jagdtigger said:

Its still a pretty small niche with its price tag(not just tesla), and with no real benefit that wont change anytime soon... (if you add up everything it isnt cheaper than an IC that you can repair at home...)

Depends.

On paper electric cars should have stuff break less often.

In some countries like here electricity is quite a bit cheaper than petrol. And the more hydro and wind is built for example, that's going to be more the case in others too.

Also, if more governments do as here and have no tax/vat on electric cars..... (And compensate with more on petrol/diesel)

[Mihle]

9 minutes ago, VanayadGaming said:

K Mate. You must have driven one and used one for a few weeks at least to give that impression. What I see here is MSN trying to spread more FUD, where there shouldn't be any. 

Well,  it's not worth buying if you don't have enough money to buy it.... But If you do and you don't drive as much as the top 1% then the pictures changes....

[Jtalk4456]

13 hours ago, Canada EH said:

Everyone Was Right About Tesla

except the large group of people who predicted they would fail, and the large group who said they'd never turn a profit.

Using a catch-all phrase like this is really silly, especially when Tesla is still up and running. If they had died, the exaggerated title would have been far more forgivable, but Tesla still lives. All this article says is that he had problems creating an efficient automobile production line from scratch while going against multinational corporations that have been around more than a hundred years. What this article tells me is that instead of dying off or asking for handouts, he stuck through it and made it work and came out stronger on the other side. So to me the "everyone" being referenced here are all the people who said he would survive, that he would figure it out, that he would be the one to change the industry, and he has done just that.

Having said that, I'm not by any means a Tesla fanboy. There are many issues he needs to address. Many business practices and unnecessary costs/risks that he shouldn't be taking on. The reason I'm on his side here is I believe if anyone is going to overcome these issues, he'll be the one. Personally I have no intentions to own a Tesla, but I believe both the successes AND failures he makes with this company are being far more scrutinized by the public and by other corporations. Early on, he flat out released plans for his cars to other manufacturers.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/briansolomon/2014/06/12/tesla-goes-open-source-elon-musk-releases-patents-to-good-faith-use/#173094333c63

The choices he makes, good and bad will go on to help other manufacturers make better electric cars or in some cases, even make one in the first place...

I personally believe as electric cars take over the market, Tesla will not continue to focus on cheaper consumer grade cars. They might hold onto semis if they get a few nice contracts, but as the market is flooded with electric vehicles that can hold a candle to a tesla, tesla will focus back on the sports cars and continuing to put pressure on the technology and the AI.

[asus killer]

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

no it doesn't, telling me to google a defunct crooked business from 18 years ago doesn't mean jack shit. Explain yourself.

crooked and defunct? they were audit by one of the top audit companies in the world and the audits where public, i'm at a lost.

 

[Jtalk4456]

24 minutes ago, asus killer said:

crooked and defunct? they were audit by one of the top audit companies in the world and the audits where public, i'm at a lost.

 

 

not even sure what you two are really arguing over, but to clarify @mr moose's point of crooked and defunct that you seem to be at a "lost" for,

Quote

At the end of 2001, it was revealed that Enron's reported financial condition was sustained by institutionalized, systematic, and creatively planned accounting fraud, known since as the Enron scandal. Enron has since become a well-known example of willful corporate fraud and corruption.

So yeah...

 

Edit: The Auditing company was charged with obstruction of justice and was not allowed to do accounting for publicly traded companies anymore

[D13H4RD]

1 hour ago, Mihle said:

Why do you need that short charging, do you often take trips that is longer than one battery full worth of electricity?

Because I'd not, you just charge at home overnight.

Actually, yes.

 

I drive a lot and would find that extremely convenient especially for those 500+ mile back-and-forth trips on the same day whilst also accounting for traffic. A 30 minute top-up just isn’t fast enough for that sort of purpose lest you pull into a gas station and recharge there while having a planned break.

 

EV charging stations in towns and such can help but I think a real breakthrough is when EVs have that quick top-off ability that ICE powered cars have.

[Mihle]

29 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

Actually, yes.

 

I drive a lot and would find that extremely convenient especially for those 500+ mile back-and-forth trips on the same day whilst also accounting for traffic. A 30 minute top-up just isn’t fast enough for that sort of purpose lest you pull into a gas station and recharge there while having a planned break.

 

EV charging stations in towns and such can help but I think a real breakthrough is when EVs have that quick top-off ability that ICE powered cars have.

You aren't as the normal person then, especially compared to Europeans.

 

That fast charging just won't happen unless some big improvement to batteries happen. And even then, it would require ticker cables and stuff.

[Syntaxvgm]

14 hours ago, SlimyPython said:

Did you ever want the Unrepairability like apple

 

two of my cars require you to take off a tire to change the battery. A third has no transmission dipsctick, just a cover on the stick hole that says "dealer use only". All 3 are American made, and are not even new.

 

[D13H4RD]

30 minutes ago, Mihle said:

That fast charging just won't happen unless some big improvement to batteries happen. And even then, it would require ticker cables and stuff.

That's what I'm waiting for. I know I'll be waiting a long time for it, but it's one of those things that'll definitely help, even if it's for a very small subset of people.

23 minutes ago, Syntaxvgm said:

two of my cars require you to take off a tire to change the battery. A third has no transmission dipsctick, just a cover on the stick hole that says "dealer use only". All 3 are American made, and are not even new.

 

I've seen much worse. I've seen a car where you need to remove a lot of the trunk's interior to access the 12V battery.

[Commodus]

2 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

That's what I'm waiting for. I know I'll be waiting a long time for it, but it's one of those things that'll definitely help, even if it's for a very small subset of people.

Might happen sooner than you think.  The next wave of advanced EVs (like the Porsche Taycan) can reach an 80 percent charge in under 20 minutes -- apparently you can add 62 miles of range in four minutes with the Taycan.  Of course, it'll probably be a while before a reasonably priced EV like the Nissan Leaf can do that, but it could be just a few years off.  And arguably, it's  those short bursts that will make the most sense.  You only occasionally need to charge to 80 percent or more when you're on the road (usually if you're on a long trip and aren't sure when you'll see another charger).  When you're commuting?  A few minutes' charge could be enough for everything you have to do that day, and you'll have a full charge when you get home.

[Syntaxvgm]

9 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

That's what I'm waiting for. I know I'll be waiting a long time for it, but it's one of those things that'll definitely help, even if it's for a very small subset of people.

I've seen much worse. I've seen a car where you need to remove a lot of the trunk's interior to access the 12V battery.

Point is car manufacturers pretty much have long strived to discourage people servicing their own cars, and the capability will only be greater with electric cars. It's really not a good anti-tesla argument when other car manufacturers have such a long history of this.

[mynameisjuan]

4 minutes ago, Syntaxvgm said:

Point is car manufacturers pretty much have long strived to discourage people servicing their own cars, and the capability will only be greater with electric cars. It's really not a good anti-tesla argument when other car manufacturers have such a long history of this.

There is more of an argument of consumers not servicing at least the electrical side of a tesla because most dont know what the hell they are doing. Even most mechanics have a basic understanding of electrical and boards in modern cars. 

 

One stupid move or short and you car lights or blows up in flames. But changing a damn tire should be so hard.

[Drak3]

7 hours ago, Cyanara said:

Tesla is notable for one important reason: They made the electric car sexy and increasingly mainstream.

Their designs are generic and their cars are still as niche as ever. The only reason they're noticeable is because they lack grills.

[Syntaxvgm]

9 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said:

There is more of an argument of consumers not servicing at least the electrical side of a tesla because most dont know what the hell they are doing. Even most mechanics have a basic understanding of electrical and boards in modern cars. 

 

One stupid move or short and you car lights or blows up in flames. But changing a damn tire should be so hard.

repair your brakes lines wrong and your car is a 2 ton missile.

[Brooksie359]

1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

Their designs are generic and their cars are still as niche as ever. The only reason they're noticeable is because they lack grills.

If you compare a tesla to an electric car from another company you can tell why people praise tesla for making good looking cars. The fact is that a tesla cat was basically the first electric car that you could buy that you didn't have to compromise with it looking ugly. I have seen a great many teslas and they definitely look pretty slick. You go to LA and you will see a ton of them or in more city areas. If all you do is commute to work then it is a great car that you can simply charge when you get home. The amount of times I actually have to drive a far distance is small and I could wait the 30 mins for a full charge and it wouldn't be a big deal. I could even rent a gas car if I really needed to. 

[Drak3]

8 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

If you compare a tesla to an electric car from another company you can tell why people praise tesla for making good looking cars. The fact is that a tesla cat was basically the first electric car that you could buy that you didn't have to compromise with it looking ugly

A Corolla sans the grill is a fucking ugly piece of shit.

 

And other electrics aren't and weren't ugly either. Definitely better looking than a Tesla.

[asus killer]

3 hours ago, Jtalk4456 said:

not even sure what you two are really arguing over, but to clarify @mr moose's point of crooked and defunct that you seem to be at a "lost" for,

So yeah...

 

Edit: The Auditing company was charged with obstruction of justice and was not allowed to do accounting for publicly traded companies anymore

just to clarify, my "lost" was sarcasm. About the rest is like i said i was just answering is doubt.

[Brooksie359]

8 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

A Corolla sans the grill is a fucking ugly piece of shit.

 

And other electrics aren't and weren't ugly either. Definitely better looking than a Tesla.

You may not agree with my opinion but does seem that alot of people do. The fact is that I know alot of people who wouldn't consider an electric car until they saw a tesla. Alot of them liked the looks enough to make the option appealing while prior electric cars they didn't because they didn't like the looks.