October 18th Apple Event - Unleashed - Apple Silicon, MacBook Pro upgrades, HomePod mini, AirPods 3rd Generation

[defic]

3 minutes ago, Forbidden Wafer said:

Just noticed the new macs have notches. Come on... WTF is that Apple?

Notch over thick top bezels anyday. You don't want nosecam that some manufacturers sell right?

They should've included faceid, but maybe they will introduce it in a later version.

[Forbidden Wafer]

1 minute ago, gjsman said:

With the notch, you now get the full 16:10 aspect ratio without the Mac menu bar intruding. More room for your content - can totally accept.

It looks absolutely terrible.

[gjsman]

Just now, Forbidden Wafer said:

It looks absolutely terrible.

Considering the level of performance this thing is going to have, it could look like a potato and it'd still be worth purchasing. Plus that's subjective.

[LeeroyJenki]

16 minutes ago, AluminiumTech said:

Could you give a link to where it says that?

 

Also do we know the power target of that Razer laptop's 3080? If it's less than 130W then the comparison is somewhat unfair.

 

Edit: The Razer's Max Graphics power is 105W. That's so sad.... That's not even a fair comparison and not representative of 3080 laptop GPUs.

Here is a link to the other laptop they compared it to in their presentation (MSI GE76 Raider 11UH-53) which has an RTX 3080 with 155W.

 

They said M1 Max has similar performance but with 100W less, which if true is actually astonishing.

 

Is there an RTX Max-Q with higher wattage?

 

Sources:

MSI GE76 Raider 11UH-53

[gjsman]

1 minute ago, LeeroyJenki said:

They said M1 Max has similar performance but with 100W less, which if true is actually astonishing.

 

By the time they redo the Mac Pro with Apple Silicon next year, the GPUs in that thing will be... 

[TetraSky]

Oh man, that $19 polishing cloth though

https://9to5mac.com/2021/10/18/apple-introduces-new-polishing-cloth-for-all-devices-sold-separately-for-19/

 

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MM6F3AM/A/polishing-cloth

 

Tried searching this topic and got zero results. Why is no one talking about this excellent piece of innovation.

[Spindel]

7 minutes ago, gjsman said:

By the time they redo the Mac Pro with Apple Silicon next year, the GPUs in that thing will be... 

rumors speak of 128 GPU cores. With straight scaling from the M1 that means more than 40 TF

[LeeroyJenki]

1 minute ago, TetraSky said:

Oh man, that $19 polishing cloth though

https://9to5mac.com/2021/10/18/apple-introduces-new-polishing-cloth-for-all-devices-sold-separately-for-19/

 

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MM6F3AM/A/polishing-cloth

Hahah... how did you even manage to find it? under what category where you browsing? 

[hishnash]

53 minutes ago, leadeater said:

I think Apple is the only 16GB LPDDR5 customer aka they have exclusive access to them. They aren't publicly listed anywhere far as I know.

For now, i expect in 2 to 3 years (when your likely to want to do an upgrade) these will no longer be exclusive. 

 

 

31 minutes ago, TheSage79 said:

Apple had me literally drooling over their new laptops right up until they announced the prices... YIKES! I will stick with my regular M1 MacBook Pro. 

Prices are what should be expected they did not really go up that much given the massive increase in perf. Things like that memory will likely cost a LOT as apple will need to be paying the $$ to ensure supply with the current pressure on production.

[hishnash]

5 minutes ago, Spindel said:

rumors speak of 128 GPU cores. With straight scaling from the M1 that means more than 40 TF

Yep! but when we get the 128 GPU that might well be not based on the M1's GPU cores but on the next generation so maybe add another 10% to 15%. 

 

 

16 minutes ago, LeeroyJenki said:

They said M1 Max has similar performance but with 100W less, which if true is actually astonishing.

 

Not really that surprising if you look at the perf/w of the M1 this is to be expected. Apple have been pushing perfomance per watt as the key metric for a long time and in fact as they go higher and higher up the perfomance scale this becomes more and more important. What limits the 3090 in its perfomance is handling that power, both thermaly and just within the die, if you can do that at 1/2 the power draw then you can also go larger and create an even more powerful chip.  This will likely cost a lot in transistors but given apple is targeting pro users (if they make such a GPU) you would not expect prices to be less than $5k anyway as that is what NV and AMD have for their professional cards.

[Roswell]

34 minutes ago, TheSage79 said:

Apple had me literally drooling over their new laptops right up until they announced the prices... YIKES! I will stick with my regular M1 MacBook Pro. 

They’re the same price they’ve always been.

[hishnash]

31 minutes ago, Forbidden Wafer said:

It looks absolutely terrible.

Only if you extend your content into the notch area something that will not happen. Sysmte menu bar will fill that area, and most users will keep the menu bar black so that given this is a min LED display the notch will not be visible. 
 

 

[BondiBlue]

6 minutes ago, Roswell said:

They’re the same price they’ve always been.

The base model 16" did go up in price by $100, and the previous mid range 13" started at $1799, which is $200 less than the 14". 

[GDRRiley]

1 hour ago, LeeroyJenki said:

Which one do you think is worth your money?

 

Sources:

Razer Laptop model compared by Apple

a windows machine that isn't a razer, never would call any of razer machines a good buy

[gjsman]

12 minutes ago, BondiBlue said:

The base model 16" did go up in price by $100, and the previous mid range 13" started at $1799, which is $200 less than the 14". 

So yeah - I'd say that, considering they've now got way more powerful CPU, way more powerful graphics, better cooling, more quiet operation, miniLED, 120hz, and more ports, a $100-$200 price increase compared to last gen isn't that bad. Especially considering we are in a chip shortage and there was a certain pandemic with lots of inflation. 

[saltycaramel]

The new 14.2” has more pixels than the old big 15.4” retina. 

Let that sink in.

No need to use scaled modes on these new displays.

I think for the first time in years they will default to native resolution (with 2x retina assets).

Crisper than ever.

[Vishera]

On 10/12/2021 at 6:20 PM, BondiBlue said:

The 14" MacBook Pro starts at $1999, and the 16" starts at $2499. The 13" M1 MBP is now the base model

The pricing is ridiculous,

I guess that people will buy them anyway because it's a status symbol.

So people will happily get milked out of their money.

 

The specs don't justify the price...

[StDragon]

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MM6F3AM/A/polishing-cloth
 

Hot damn they're milking it!

[Kisai]

3 hours ago, saltycaramel said:

Are we happy with the 200GB/s and 400GB/s LPDDR5 bandwidth to the unified memory?

No. A Geforce 1080 is 352, 2060 is 336, 3060 is 360. A Geforce 1060 is 192.

 

So the M1 Max (400GB/s) slots slightly higher than entry-level Geforce 3060/2060 parts and GTX 1080. The M1 Pro is slightly above a 1060.

 

So for perspective the 1060 barely does 1080p60 with all games, the 1080/2060/3060 falls slightly under 2160p60 with all games. So Apple's parts are slightly above both of these, so that means the M1 Pro is aimed at a 1080p60 user experience and the M1 Max is aimed at a 1080p240p or a 2160p60 experience.

 

THAT SAID. Laptop parts will thermal throttle, especially Apple's so getting these experiences consistently is likely never going to be a thing in a laptop. If the same chip goes into a Mac Mini/iMac, then yes.

 

Ultimately however ... Apple is the only one offering an affordable laptop right now. I went to Staples earlier today, and there wasn't a single laptop with more than a GTX 1650 in it. Meanwhile, the M1 Macbook's are sitting there at $200 less than the Intel+GTX 1650 models.

 

[BobVonBob]

Going to preface this with: I was never going to buy the Macbook Pro, and I will never buy the Macbook Pro, but I've still got opinions.

 

Unless those bezels are ultra thin, the notch is just bad. Windows manufacturers have had top mounted webcams in bezels that look similarly thin for years. Granted they all take video that looks like you've smeared grease on them compared to Macbook cameras, but given Apple's engineering and manufacturing might I can't see any reason for it to be there other than that Apple now considers a notch to be part of their brand.

[Vishera]

1 minute ago, StDragon said:

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MM6F3AM/A/polishing-cloth
 

Hot damn they're milking it!

When are they going to monopolize it?

[hishnash]

1 minute ago, Kisai said:

So the M1 Max (400GB/s) slots slightly higher than entry-level Geforce 3060/2060 parts and GTX 1080. The M1 Pro is slightly above a 1060

It is worth noting however like AMD have on die cache the M1 GPU has multiple layers of much much faster on die cache:

* To start with it has `tile memory, or thread group memory` this is not cache as develops explicitly allocate data in this memory
* Then the chip as System level cache as well (not sure how big this was 16MB on the M1 but we don't have numbers for the M1 Pro/Max yet).

For things like 3d rendering the tile memory does enabled the GPU to use a lot less bandwidth (in particular for those high res 6k+ displays) due to the depth buffer blending happing on die so rather than writing out the fragment output for every object to memory then reading it in to figure out what is in front TBDR pipelines do this on the fly using the local tile memory (this has its drawbacks and does making writing a display pipeline more complex but saves a LOT of memory bandwidth if you have many many draw call objects on screen). 

 

[hishnash]

4 minutes ago, BobVonBob said:

Unless those bezels are ultra thin, the notch is just bad. Windows manufacturers have had top mounted webcams in bezels that look similarly thin for years. Granted they all take video that looks like you've smeared grease on them compared to Macbook cameras, but given Apple's engineering and manufacturing might I can't see any reason for it to be there other than that Apple now considers a notch to be part of their brand.

Doing this on a windows (that does not have a top menu bar) would be a big issue yes.  (lets hope OEMs do not do what we all know they are about to do and copy apple). 

But when running macOS the system puts a menu bar at the top of the screen. So the notch will not cover your apps it just covers the centre of the menu bar.  

[Roswell]

35 minutes ago, BondiBlue said:

The base model 16" did go up in price by $100, and the previous mid range 13" started at $1799, which is $200 less than the 14". 

Yeah but the 2015 model before the 16 started at $2699 if memory serves. They’ve always been around the same price point for years and years. 

[hishnash]

12 minutes ago, Vishera said:

The pricing is ridiculous,

I guess that people will buy them anyway because it's a status symbol.

So people will happily get milked out of their money.

 

The specs don't justify the price...

Well for the performance they do, your going to be paying much much more for any laptop (if you can find one) that is faster and you will have much worse battery life and will sound like a jet engine and on battery will perform very badly so you will be tethered to the wall at all times. 

Given the perfomance, screen, battery life i really don't see what's wrong with these prices, other high end pro machines that are not even close to the perfomance cost much more (see ProArt laptop range).