[UPDATED 2] - Nvidia GPP shows its first victim

[Jurrunio]

3 minutes ago, WMGroomAK said:

Again, not sure if this is due to GPP or that the Vega cards are just not locatable at the moment.

I think it's more on the latter. Vega reference cards are still hard to come by, and partners are postponing Vega custom card plans because AMD just isnt giving them enough GPUs to work on.

[Sauron]

This is obviously bad but - honestly the boxes look exactly the same except for the brand. I'm not sure this is what nvidia meant...  

[samcool55]

Just now, Sauron said:

This is obviously bad but - honestly the boxes look exactly the same except for the brand. I'm not sure this is what nvidia meant...  

This is probably just the beginning tho.

If you look for MSI RX 580's on newegg all the gaming versions are gone which is probably a more accurate example of what's going to happen soon.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=msi+rx+580&ignorear=0&N=-1&isNodeId=1

[Jurrunio]

20 minutes ago, samcool55 said:

MSI is doing to too tho. RX 580 gaming X? Gone, not for sale anymore

https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=msi+RX+580&ignorear=0&N=-1&isNodeId=1

Only generic looking ones are still available.

 

RX 570 from MSI is available but they do still have stock, i expect that it will disappear as well once they are sold out.

worth looking into, though I'm no MSI graphics card guy (those I tried out never worked right).

 

Should I add that, even Taiwan no longer has RX 580 Gaming X available from local major retailer, CoolPC.

[Froody129]

This sounds very anti-competitive... 

[ItsMitch]

Is this even legal? Seems very dodgy.

[kladzen]

1 minute ago, SC2Mitch said:

Is this even legal? Seems very dodgy.

this has already been talked about.. that they are highly big chance that they are certain "agreements" in the GPP program that violate the law.. 

 

Did you see the wan show??

[ItsMitch]

Just now, kladzen said:

this has already been talked about.. that they are highly big chance that they are certain "agreements" in the GPP program that violate the law.. 

 

Did you see the wan show??

No, I don't watch tech talk shows and it was too late if I was.

[samcool55]

1 minute ago, SC2Mitch said:

Is this even legal? Seems very dodgy.

It's worth the watch and explains imo very well what GPP is all about.

 

[TopHatProductions115]

Idea :: What happens if the AIB partners simply notified the consumers, and did a branding 'split' of sorts?

      

        ASUS takes the ROG line, and splits it. nVIDIA - ROG CUDA. AMD - ROG STRIX.
        And MSI could do something like nVIDIA - GAMING X. AMD - GAMING Y.
        
That would give them both wiggle room, and let AMD have a set of dedicated gaming branding as well - putting AMD on the same playing field as nVIDIA. This wouldn't tick off any lawyers - would it?

[Drak3]

5 minutes ago, TopHatProductions115 said:

Idea :: What happens if the AIB partners simply notified the consumers, and did a branding 'split' of sorts?

      

        ASUS takes the ROG line, and splits it. nVIDIA - ROG CUDA. AMD - ROG STRIX.
        And MSI could do something like nVIDIA - GAMING X. AMD - GAMING Y.
        
That would give them both wiggle room, and let AMD have a set of dedicated gaming branding as well - putting AMD on the same playing field as nVIDIA. This wouldn't tick off any lawyers - would it?

GPP mandates that ALL gaming oriented lines be exclusively Nvidia, I believe.

[hobobobo]

Should prolly post it here too

Kyle might have been right

https://www.computerbase.de/2018-03/gigabyte-gaming-box-rx-580/#update1

Quote

ComputerBase hat bei Gigabyte nachgefragt, warum das Modell mit Radeon RX 580 als einziges der Serie nicht unter Gigabytes Marke für Spieler „Aorus“ läuft. Der Hersteller erklärt, der Fokus liege in diesem Fall nicht auf Spielern. Mit der Produktseite ist das allerdings nicht in Einklang zu bringen, deren erste Überschriften „Turn Your Ultrabook to Gaming Platform“ und „Upgrade the Game Experience“ lauten.

Quote

ComputerBase asked Gigabyte why the model with Radeon RX 580 is the only in the series which does not come with the "Aorus" gaming branding. The manufacturer states that the product is not gamer focused. This however is inconsistent with the product page, whose headings are "Turn Your Ultrabook to Gaming Platform" and "Upgrade the Game Experience".

 

[NumLock21]

Didn't pay attention to other packaging, but on the Asus packaging. The box with the snow leopard on it used to come with cards that has a white shroud and it cools with basic axial fans. The ROG strix version comes in this nicer looking ROG Strix box and uses better axial fans. This new non CPP packaging for AMD cards, it seems they have combined the Strix card like design into a non Strix packaging.

The other thing I see is some of the cards have the ROG logo on the fan hub and others don't.

 

Without ROG logo

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16814126199

 

With ROG logo

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA6V669T2580

 

Asus Dual series card with white shroud

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16814126122

 

[ItsMitch]

2 minutes ago, hobobobo said:

The manufacturer states that the product is not gamer focused.

Huh...... Riiiiiiiiight.

[Taf the Ghost]

1 hour ago, SC2Mitch said:

Is this even legal? Seems very dodgy.

 

1 hour ago, kladzen said:

this has already been talked about.. that they are highly big chance that they are certain "agreements" in the GPP program that violate the law.. 

 

Did you see the wan show??

Legal, no. But what Intel did to AMD, on two separate occasions, wasn't either, but they haven't had to pay out for the second one and it's been over a decade. That's the "play" here: Nvidia can abuse their position and the companies they just stole marketing labels from can't really attack them in court. Nvidia can kill them in the GPU space in the time being, long before Nvidia would ever have to pay damages.

 

The only real action here that can be taken is someone to collect up information and have Americans file complaints with the FTC and Europeans file with the EU Commission.  Either one can force companies to surrender the contract for inspection.

[ARikozuM]

I don't really see this as a problem unless AIBs have to start choosing sides on who to go with. 

 

Scenario: AIBs try sticking with Nvidia for gaming and AMD for general compute; Both sides start to take their respective niches.

A) Nvidia starts to lose customers that may have purchased Titans or Ti's as AMD is now marketed (and hopefully validated) for compute performance. 

B) AMD products get their own "gaming" branding which can be a good thing for variety. 

C) AMD starts losing enough market share that the graphics division has to close and work towards developing relations with Intel for their integrated graphics. 

 

I hope A is truer than the others, but I think this falls square "on the edge of the line" (if I can make a tennis reference; it's so close to being out that it should be called out) where only consumers can make the choice as far as legality goes. 

[AresKrieger]

Honestly the cards looking the same not only made them a bit confusing to identify but also resulted in copy paste coolers which didn't work as well on the cards they were ported to. So I'm actually fine with it, could have been setup in a less questionable way like different designs rather than brands but eh its what I expected rather than doomsday some claimed.

[ATFink]

4 hours ago, Being Delirious said:

I think in gonna sell my and card in June because of this. I don't wanna support Nvidia anymore. Im going AMD now.

If you already own an nVidia card switching right now won't make a difference. Statistical market share won't really change since it'll just be someone else using the GeForce card when steam reads hardware in their surveys (unless you destroy the card or sell to someone that will only mine with it). Good luck finding a new GPU that isn't outrageously priced so if you go down the used route you'll likely have a slower GPU that also won't buffer AMD statistical market share in steam hardware surveys either (the new card will have just switched machines). Just upgrade to a non-nVidia card in the future when you feel its time to upgrade if you're really going to boycott nVidia.

[samcool55]

11 minutes ago, AresKrieger said:

Honestly the cards looking the same not only made them a bit confusing to identify but also resulted in copy paste coolers which didn't work as well on the cards they were ported to. So I'm actually fine with it, could have been setup in a less questionable way like different designs rather than brands but eh its what I expected rather than doomsday some claimed.

That's neither nvidia's nor amd's worry tbh.

If that's what the AIB decides to sell then that's their choice (at least it used to be) and sometimes they might even do it on purpose.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAB946S95463&cm_re=msi_1080ti-_-14-137-111-_-Product

This one for example, cooler is absolutely not capable of cooling the 1080ti, but when it launched it was one of the cheapest 1080ti's available, used a reference PCB and the cooler was easy to take off. So you might think "what's the point of that"? Well that makes it a great option to use in a liquid cooled build.

 

The reference waterblocks fit because it uses the same PCB, no issue with the original cooling because you can easily take it completely off with a few screws and it's cheap because the cooler is cheap and you would ditch it anyway.

 

However, is it marketed for that purpose? No, because that wouldn't make sense, but it's a niche part of a niche market that it fills really well.

 

Also, this is an example of a crappy cooler recycled on a high-end nvidia card that's not even gaming branded so GPP won't exactly stop that recycling cooler issue...

[Arika]

I've always seen NVIDIA as the gaming option and AMD as the workstation option.

 

So many people with no law background are calling it illegal. Guess we'll see. If NVIDIA going to get disbanded? LOL no, they might get a fine and told to dissolve the GPP at most.

[BroliviaWilde]

It must be that GPP means at least one gaming brand is exclusive for Nvidia products, not all gaming brands.  For example, Gigabyte has those external GPU enclosures: Aorus gtx 1080 gaming box and Aorus gtx 1070 gaming box, and now they have the RX 580 gaming box.  Notice the lack fo Auros for AMD?

So maybe this isn't as bad as first thought about, but what it appears to be is Nvidia grabbing the "premium" gaming brand from each vendor and leaving that vendor to come up with somethign else for AMD GPUs.

 

I got that tidbit from https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2018/03/20/new-clues-suggest-msi-and-gigabyte-are-aligned-with-geforce-partner-program/#33119cdd4c6a

[hobobobo]

18 minutes ago, Sierra Fox said:

I've always seen NVIDIA as the gaming option and AMD as the workstation option.

 

So many people with no law background are calling it illegal. Guess we'll see. If NVIDIA going to get disbanded? LOL no, they might get a fine and told to dissolve the GPP at most.

Ive always seen SAPPHIRE cards to be the only ones worth a damn, doesnt mean im right or everybody should see it as i do. And as somebody mentioned, there is retaliation clause in the contract, without it people would talk, and unless somebody digs enough info to get FTC our Eurocomission interested nothing will come out of it.

 

2 minutes ago, BroliviaWilde said:

It must be that GPP means at least one gaming brand is exclusive for Nvidia products, not all gaming brands

Gaming box is not a brand name, its product designation. Gigabyte already stated that its not a gamer oriented product, which actually relates to gaming branding, unlike product designations

[Humbug]

5 hours ago, factorialandha said:

Not that i agree with this whole thing, but to be completely honest, anyone who knows what they are buying, will do there research as to what card to buy, if you are buying a card purely based on its branding then you arent doing the research properly.

Whether we like it or not half the consumers are uneducated about this stuff. We are not the norm. So a typical consumer can see the 'gaming' card tag and assume the 1050ti is better than an rx 580 for gaming. So this is bad for the PC gaming community and bad for AMD.

[Mihle]

Fuck...

[IamGame]

1 hour ago, hobobobo said:

Ive always seen SAPPHIRE cards to be the only ones worth a damn, doesnt mean im right or everybody should see it as i do. And as somebody mentioned, there is retaliation clause in the contract, without it people would talk, and unless somebody digs enough info to get FTC our Eurocomission interested nothing will come out of it.

 

Gaming box is not a brand name, its product designation. Gigabyte already stated that its not a gamer oriented product, which actually relates to gaming branding, unlike product designations

Take a good long look at the product page, it is crystal clear that "gaming box" is more than a product designation.   What gigabyte has said is pure spin, they don't want to lose that gpp-bro-hood perks, but still use gaming in their branding of amd, because hey, gaming sells.

 

Another interesting point, Auros is the OC tool mentioned on that page.  Curious to see how gigabyte works around that one.