Xiaomi's double folded phone is a fraud?

[BananaInSandals]

Source: 

Royole's Chairman's Weibo (In Chinese)

Taiwan Yahoo! news (In Chinese) (With Xiaomi's response)

Forum post from ePrice (in Chinese)

 

TL;DR Royole, the company that produced the world's first foldable phone last year, accused Xiaomi's double folded phone to be nothing but bought conceptual phones from other companies that cannot be mass produced. 

 

(Apologies for unable to directly copy and paste the Chinese Weibo post from Royole's Vice President. It's a photo on Royole's Chairman's Weibo. The Chinese in the following was copied from the ePrice post. The Weibo picture was translated to Traditional Chinese and typed out.)

 

From Royole's Vice President: 

Quote

CES剛結束不久，各路朋友紛紛發來一個號稱全球首款雙折疊屏手機的視頻。本來還挺好奇什麼牛逼的公司在柔派後又做了一個新的折疊手機讓我們在國際上揚眉吐氣。

CES just ended and people are sending me videos of a so-call world's first double folded phone. I was wondering which genius company made a new foldable phone after Royole and let us shine in the world.

 

屏幕核心技術專利產線啥都沒有的手機組裝公司，買個別人的尚未量產的概念柔性屏幕和概念機就說自己"攻克了柔性折疊屏技術”，作為上市公司，難道只是重而無基，信譽何在，不怕被告？

A mobile assembly company without even a production line for screen core technology patent, buying other's yet to be mass produced conceptual flaxible screen and phone, and claimed to have "conquered the technique of flaxible screen". As a listed company, do you not have your basic? Where is your integraty? Do you not fear being taken to court?

 

國際媒體會對此作何評價？這就是為什麼像這樣的中國公司在國內炒概念風生水起在國際上卻從來得不到尊重和認可。因為他們不僅只會抄襲模仿而沒有真正的創新，甚至還公然造假。

What will the international media evaluate this? This is why Chinese companies like this can so so well in China by flipping conceptual ideas but will not be respected nor regconised internationally. Because they not only simply know how to copy and plagiarise without real innovention, they even do fraud publically.

1

 

From Royole's Chairman:

Quote

When they go low, we go hard. 
"人不犯我，我不犯人，人若犯我，虽远必诛!"

(Unless people insult me, I don't insult others. If people offend me, even if they are very far, they will be dealt with!)

 

(Bloody hell, that line of Chinese idiom is hard to translate... Apologies if any of the translation is not accurate.)

 

From Royole's Chairman's post's second picture:

Quote

小米這個摺疊屏手機
其實就是LG的樣機而已，很多廠商都拿到了，也就小米刷了個ROM出來裝逼

This Xiaomi foldable screen phone

It's actually just a LG sample phone only. A lot in the industry got it as well. Only Xiaomi flashed a different ROM and came out to pretend

 

Xiaomi's response:

Quote

小米雙折疊手機是小米自主研發的創新產品。這款手機的柔性折疊式屏幕設計是小米和供應鏈合作夥伴聯合開發的成果。雖然折疊式柔性屏幕是折疊手機的關鍵組件，但屏幕以外還涉及機身結構、堆疊、零件定制、交互設計、系統調配等多個不同關鍵創新範疇。以上各項皆是小米在雙折疊手機研發的自主創新成果。

Xiaomi's double folded phone is a brand new product invented by Xiaomi alone. This phone's flaxible foldable screen's design is joinly produced by Xiaomi and partners. Although the foldable flaxible screen is the key component for the foldable phone, there are many other area, such as body structure, stacking, part customization, interaction design and system deployment, to be innovative. The above mentioned are all Xiaomi's own innovative result in the double foldable phone.

 

雖然小米並非首家涉獵折疊手機，但小米的確是行業首家能夠做出雙折疊手機的品牌。雙折疊、單折疊和全打開都會讓柔性屏幕處於不同的形態，承受不同的壓力。如何在全機及轉軸設計上盡可能保護屏幕，是整個手機設計的難度之一。小米雙折疊手機是從十多種設計中反覆進行實驗驗證，才有了目前理想的解決方法。

Although Xiaomi is not the first to produce foldable phone, Xiaomi is indeed the first in the industry to have produced a double foldable phone. Double folded, single folded and all open make the screen to be at different form and have different pressure on the screen. The major diffifult on producing the phone is how to protect the screen as much as possible in the design of the phone and the axis.

 

每一款劃時代的創新產品都是上游供應鏈廠商和終端廠商共同努力的心血。只有協同傾力研發，才能為用戶提供真正優秀的產品和體驗，推動業內創新競爭共同進步。

Every brand new products are the combined effort of the upstream supply chain vendors and terminal vendors. Only through developing togather can we provide users with the best product and experience as well as promoting competition within the industry for progressing togather. 

 

 

 

Personal thought:

I won't be surprised if Xiaomi actually bought someone else's conceptual product/prototype and call it their own. After all, Xiaomi started by copying iPhone. And to this date, a lot of their product are still "similar" to others. Also, the wording of Xiaomi's response is particularly weird. If they indeed make it themselves, they could simply say "we made it the end". But instead, they went on to say stuff that makes them sound uncertain that whether they make the whole thing or just the non-screen part.

 

Screenshot of the Weibo post from Royole in case it got deleted:

[TetraSky]

I mean, it's china. Have they ever made anything original?
(I'm kidding of course, but come on... This sort of news where Company A totally just ripped off Company B's product and claimed it their own isn't news in that country)

[RejZoR]

Who even gives a shit about stupid folding phones anyway? Just give me a phone that performs well and doesn't cost 900€ for a base model and I'm happy.

 

Xiaomi did make first slider phone brick (Mi Mix 3) and it's pretty damn good.

[Kroon]

27 minutes ago, TetraSky said:

I mean, it's china. Have they ever made anything original?
(I'm kidding of course, but come on... This sort of news where Company A totally just ripped off Company B's product and claimed it their own isn't news in that country)

 

Most innovations coming from China now days, Just listen to Linus:

 

[suits]

That's a bummer, I really liked the design of that phone, hopefully samsung comes out with something like it that can be mass produced

[dizmo]

I don't get why anyone would want a phone that folds, and keeps the screen on the outside. Just seems stupid. More chances to damage it, harder to manage accidental presses, who needs the screen on when they're not looking at it?

[DrMacintosh]

Foldable phones will never amount to anything 

[Jito463]

One Chinese company accusing another Chinese company of fraudulent behavior.  This should be good.

 

[Sauron]

4 hours ago, BananaInSandals said:

But instead, they went on to say stuff that makes them sound uncertain that whether they make the whole thing or just the non-screen part.

I think they're saying that the foldable screen is nothing new and they may be buying it from someone else, but the idea and engineering behind a double foldable phone is their own. Which would make sense, even though their previous statements may have been misleading.

1 hour ago, DrMacintosh said:

Foldable phones will never amount to anything 

I thought the same about non-expandable phones and the notch, and yet here we are...

[DrMacintosh]

1 minute ago, Sauron said:

I thought the same about non-expandable phones and the notch, and yet here we are...

Those things happened because they were solutions to a problem. 

 

Foldable smartphones are a solution looking for a problem. If people want a bigger screen, they buy an iPad. Nobody wants a phone that is physically required to be made out of cheap plastic just so they occasionally might be able to make a small tablet out of it. There is no market. 

[Fasauceome]

2 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

 

 Foldable smartphones are a solution looking for a problem

More screen + pocket size, and different modes of use. Yeah the current configurations are clunky but the feature is a clear advantage in what it does nonetheless.

[79wjd]

3 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Those things happened because they were solutions to a problem. 

 

Foldable smartphones are a solution looking for a problem. If people want a bigger screen, they buy an iPad. Nobody wants a phone that is physically required to be made out of cheap plastic just so they occasionally might be able to make a small tablet out of it. There is no market. 

Strongly disagree. I'd love if I could make my phone bigger sometimes.

[DrMacintosh]

1 minute ago, fasauceome said:

Yeah the current configurations are clunky but the feature is a clear advantage in what it does nonetheless.

I just don't see it that way. And I don't believe OEMs (well I guess only Apple since they are the only real tablet competitor) would rather sell 1 device than sell two different ones. 

 

I believe that a dedicated form factor can do the tasks it was intended to better than a hybrid device. People are not going to ditch their Xs Max or Galaxy Note for a cheap (I'm talking about quality of components, not price) phone just because you can bend it a little......

 

Maybe a select few people on this incredibly skewed forum might (keep in mind the people in this forum are very disconnected from the masses) be into the idea of foldable phones. But mark my words, put foldable phones in a BestBuy next to regular phones....people are gonna look at the cool and shiny new thing...but once they see it and hold it they'll put the thing down, and walk over to what they are familiar with and what they already know to be good. 

[DrMacintosh]

7 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

Strongly disagree. I'd love if I could make my phone bigger sometimes.

Ok, so are you willing to pay the higher price for a worse screen, a plastic build (including the screen), poor performance, extreme fragility, and wonky ergonomics for making your phone bigger sometimes? 

[79wjd]

1 minute ago, DrMacintosh said:

I just don't see it that way. And I don't believe OEMs (well I guess only Apple since they are the only real tablet competitor) would rather sell 1 device than sell two different ones. 

By that logic they wouldn't want to sell a phablet sized phone either then. If they only sold 3" phones, then far more people would buy tablets. 

 

Unfortunately for corporations, market demands often dictate situtations that they would otherwise prefer to avoid.

1 minute ago, DrMacintosh said:

I believe that a dedicated form factor can do the tasks it was intended to better than a hybrid device. People are not going to ditch their Xs Max or Galaxy Note for a cheap (I'm talking about quality of components, not price) phone just because you can bend it a little......

Unless there was some well engineered solution. The same could (and was) said about smartphones as a whole over a decade ago -- who would ever want to bother with such an expensive and limited device when you can just use a computer.

1 minute ago, DrMacintosh said:

Maybe a select few people on this incredibly skewed forum might (keep in mind the people in this forum are very disconnected from the masses) be into the idea of foldable phones. But mark my words, put foldable phones in a BestBuy next to regular phones....people are gonna look at the cool and shiny new thing...but once they see it and hold it they'll put the thing down, and walk over to what they are familiar with and what they already know to be good. 

Foldable phones might not take off -- and certainly won't if there isn't a good implementation. But it is incredibly short sighted to say that it can't ever happen, because if a good solution comes about, then it will almost definitely catch on.

[DrMacintosh]

2 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

Unless there was some well engineered solution

Unless we can pull out some magic elements and compounds with Star Trek level properties.....there ain't gonna be one. None that are mass marketable and that people are going to be willing to buy at least. 

 

 

[79wjd]

9 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Unless we can pull out some magic elements and compounds with Star Trek level properties.....there ain't gonna be one. None that are mass marketable and that people are going to be willing to buy at least. 

 

 

Go back two decades and people had the same opinion about cell phones in general. Go back a decade+ and people had the same opinion about smartphones. Just because a solution hasn't been created doesn't mean that one won't. Just because you can't conceptualize something doesn't make that something impossible. 

 

Case and point: https://qr.ae/TUvRkH

[DrMacintosh]

Just now, 79wjd said:

Just because you can't conceptualize something doesn't make that something impossible. 

Oh I can concepualize foldable smartphones just fine. I’m telling you, nobody wants them. 

 

They are fundamentally disposed to being bad phones. 

[Sauron]

22 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Those things happened because they were solutions to a problem.

I'd disagree with you on that, I don't see why the notch solves a "problem" that is any more relevant than wanting a larger screen device to fit in your pocket. In fact I'd argue the foldable phone is a more effective approach at doing that than the notch. As for expandability, the only problem its lack "solves" is potentially easier waterproofing, which Apple hasn't taken advantage of for years and has been shown to be more than possible either way on plenty of other phones.

25 minutes ago, DrMacintosh said:

Foldable smartphones are a solution looking for a problem. If people want a bigger screen, they buy an iPad. Nobody wants a phone that is physically required to be made out of cheap plastic just so they occasionally might be able to make a small tablet out of it. There is no market. 

"Cheap plastic" is no worse than thin aluminium, there's no reason it shouldn't be just fine if done properly. I don't see a use for this myself and I don't think many people will, but as I said I've been wrong before and about things I consider significantly sillier.

 

Besides, isn't the current ipad pro foldable too? Kappa

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

I just want people to know Xiaomi serves ads even on it's file manager, before you jump onto xiaomi phones because it's cheap, know the costs before hand. you can try to disable it but it's not foolproof unless you root it. // Victim of Redmi Note 4/4a myself. Edit : also bendable phones are stupid. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Taf the Ghost]

This is funny. Deeply ironic given that most of the "Innovation in China" comes from corporate espionage by the government, but it's still funny. It's also possible Royole really did do all of the initial design work (especially as we've only seen just a few patents about the topic at all), so they'd be correct to be very annoying. But it's still funny.

 

The Motorola patent (i think it was a patent) which was functionally a return to a flip-phone form factor will sell. I know plenty of people that'd quite appreciate having a small carrying form factor to their phone. 

[yolosnail]

1 hour ago, Sauron said:

"Cheap plastic" is no worse than thin aluminium, there's no reason it shouldn't be just fine if done properly.

I don't know about you, but I'd happily take a plastic phone over one made of metal and glass. Sure, metal and glass looks better, but all it does is make the phone more fragile,

If I could get a phone with a plastic body and screen, that I could then put a glass screen protector over it would be perfect, because the glass would protect the screen from scratches and the plastic wouldn't crack if the phone was dropped

[hobobobo]

Nah, foldable phones wont be mainstream reality for at least 5 more years. When organic polymers get cheaper, sure, but currently it would cost 1k+ just for the proper materials that could survive repetative bending without any lasting deformations, folds etc. When the time comes - foldable phones gonna dominate business oriented markets, the gains in productivity are amazing

[ARikozuM]

8 hours ago, TetraSky said:

I mean, it's china. Have they ever made anything original?

A border wall. 

 

4 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

Foldable phones will never amount to anything 

BRING BACK THE RAZR!

Spoiler

with iOS!

Spoiler

[gladly steps into the wrong neighborhood]

 

 

[Curufinwe_wins]

3 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

Oh I can concepualize foldable smartphones just fine. I’m telling you, nobody wants them. 

 

They are fundamentally disposed to being bad phones. 

While I dont think they are all that likely to take off... the technology has enough applications outside of smartphones that the sales volume from novelty alone is enough to justify their existence.