Windows 10 consumer editions to reach End of Life in 2025

[Parabola]

6 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Again Businesses  make up a big portion of Microsoft’s revenues. Also without legacy support kiss your games goodbye. Business definitely rely on legacy support. People still play old games. Plus I think a lot of current games rely on that as well. 
 

If you’re talking 16 bit support, that was more of a going to 64 bit that did that. 

 

Again, I agree, but it doesn't mean they can't change and move forward. See what Apple is doing, their performance is leagues ahead of Windows. Computing has evolved and Microsoft needs to do the same, games would benefit too. We lose a lot of performance because of Windows, we can't get stuck because people want to play games from 15 years ago. Business is different, that's why I think they should have home and business/pro versions or something like that. 

[mr moose]

24 minutes ago, Parabola said:

 

Again, I agree, but it doesn't mean they can't change and move forward. See what Apple is doing, their performance is leagues ahead of Windows. Computing has evolved and Microsoft needs to do the same, games would benefit too. We lose a lot of performance because of Windows, we can't get stuck because people want to play games from 15 years ago. Business is different, that's why I think they should have home and business/pro versions or something like that. 

I'd just say that in business you don't fix what isn't broken unless you want to risk breaking it.  By that I mean Windows and MS's general business strategy keeps them on the lions share of all computers.  It doesn't seem to matter how good apple is, was or is becoming, they can't seem to catch MS for market share and likely won't while MS maintains support for all the old implementations.    In fact it is such a big market that there are professional devices out there that give modern computers and operating systems legacy interfaces (RS232,  Parallel, etc)  so they can still run old software managed systems/machines.  

 

Here's a shit example, I have seen more professional tools than this but it gives you an idea why windows is so big/ugly in the coding department, it still supports old ISA hardware through USB.  

[StDragon]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

Here's a shit example, I have seen more professional tools than this but it gives you an idea why windows is so big/ugly in the coding department, it still supports old ISA hardware through USB.  

On that specific example, no doubt Windows 10 would be running in 32bit mode so the underlaying 16bit app can run that needs access to whatever ISA card is being addressed.

 

What's going to happen when MS drops 32bit support? To be fair, those legacy apps should have been dropped or functionality migrated to a modern system a long-ass-time-ago. That's not an IT fail, that's business owner failing to procure such a project.

[Donut417]

19 minutes ago, StDragon said:

What's going to happen when MS drops 32bit support? To be fair,

That won’t happen. That’s the point we are making. Microsoft kisses Enterprise users asses. Because they give Microsoft boat loads of cash every year in subscription fees. That’s what you are not understanding. Enterprise users pay pretty much pay forever. That’s how they make money with Windows. 

[Duo01]

On 6/10/2021 at 2:10 PM, Djole123 said:

Summary

Microsoft published informtation about Windows 10 consumer edition lifecycles, and the retirement date was set for October 2025, fueling rumors about the next release of Windows.

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

Short news - but very sweet. This could have big implications on the whole Windows as a Service policy. Microsoft did say that Windows 10 is set to be "the last version of Windows", but it seems like, either because of the pressure from OEMs, or the sheer confusion about what Windows 10 is (remember, there are now TWELVE different releases of Windows 10, from 1507 to 21H2), they had to change things in some way. It's very interesting to see how this plays out in the future.

 

Sources

https://betanews.com/2021/06/10/windows-10-retires-2025/

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/products/windows-10-home-and-pro

Well, the rumors are true. A Windows 11 build based on Windows 10x was leaked today and it features new UI and new taskbar with a revamp in the OOBE and rounded corners. This pretty much confirms Windows 10 will loose support in 2025.

[ARikozuM]

How about you keep the security updates, but f#ck off with your feature updates? Sounds like a good compromise. 

[mr moose]

8 hours ago, StDragon said:

On that specific example, no doubt Windows 10 would be running in 32bit mode so the underlaying 16bit app can run that needs access to whatever ISA card is being addressed.

 

What's going to happen when MS drops 32bit support? To be fair, those legacy apps should have been dropped or functionality migrated to a modern system a long-ass-time-ago. That's not an IT fail, that's business owner failing to procure such a project.

The whole point is MS makes more money from enterprise than consumers (and gamers are barely a choc button in the cake).  They are not going to drop 32bit support any time soon.  When the vast majority of manufacturing can upgrade infrastructure and get away from legacy protocols and interfaces, that's when MS will drop support.  Until then I would not hold my breath that they will streamline windows (let alone make a new version) that the vast majority of domestic users won't even notice.

[Donut417]

9 hours ago, StDragon said:

On that specific example, no doubt Windows 10 would be running in 32bit mode so the underlaying 16bit app can run that needs access to whatever ISA card is being addressed.

 

What's going to happen when MS drops 32bit support? To be fair, those legacy apps should have been dropped or functionality migrated to a modern system a long-ass-time-ago. That's not an IT fail, that's business owner failing to procure such a project.

Up till a few years ago US Nuclear Missile Silos used Floppy disks. Why? Because the technology was proven. The US Navy used Windows XP pasted the EOL date. We the tax payers paid Microsoft boatloads of money so the Navy continued to get updates. Why? Because warships are in service for decades. Their systems are probably not easily upgraded. 

 

@mr moose came up with a "Shit" example. But an Example I have is the ticket booking system the airlines use. From what I was told the original system was made back in like the 70's. If you start peeling back the layers of the current system, you're going to find the original system under all that. A business is not going to kill off software if it still works. If they can keep it working they will continue to use it forever. 

 

The only reason Apple gets away with what they did, killing off 32bit support. Well frankly Apple up till maybe a year or so ago didn't give a shit about their computer business. The mobile business is making boatloads of cash. Also Apple doesn't have as many Enterprise users as Microsoft. Thats because Microsoft marketed itself for businesses for like the entire life of the company. Microsoft will continue to cater to businesses. 

 

Eventually most stuff will move to the cloud and what Microsoft does wont matter as much. But until that happens in a few decades or more. Microsoft will have to continue doing things they way they have been. 

[mr moose]

38 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Up till a few years ago US Nuclear Missile Silos used Floppy disks. Why? Because the technology was proven. The US Navy used Windows XP pasted the EOL date. We the tax payers paid Microsoft boatloads of money so the Navy continued to get updates. Why? Because warships are in service for decades. Their systems are probably not easily upgraded. 

 

@mr moose came up with a "Shit" example. But an Example I have is the ticket booking system the airlines use. From what I was told the original system was made back in like the 70's. If you start peeling back the layers of the current system, you're going to find the original system under all that. A business is not going to kill off software if it still works. If they can keep it working they will continue to use it forever. 

 

The only reason Apple gets away with what they did, killing off 32bit support. Well frankly Apple up till maybe a year or so ago didn't give a shit about their computer business. The mobile business is making boatloads of cash. Also Apple doesn't have as many Enterprise users as Microsoft. Thats because Microsoft marketed itself for businesses for like the entire life of the company. Microsoft will continue to cater to businesses. 

 

Eventually most stuff will move to the cloud and what Microsoft does wont matter as much. But until that happens in a few decades or more. Microsoft will have to continue doing things they way they have been. 

Not to mention the backbone of the financial world is rooted in mainframes that run a dead programing language,  the dangers of upgrading such systems for the banking sector or the military is so high (not just financial cost but, security and fail safes) that they simply cannot do it.  And there are millions of large manufacturing plants that sit in the myriad of grey areas in between.   

 

 

EDIT: and yes it was a shit example, just in a hurry and wanted to show my musings aren't all in my head.

 

[Fnige]

Could you do something like "Hey I see you are trying to open up an application that is not supported on your device, do you want to download the correct files to add support?"

 

Though then I dont really have knowledge on how it supports old apps, so id probably need to be told how its supported one day

[Donut417]

8 minutes ago, SlimyPython said:

Could you do something like "Hey I see you are trying to open up an application that is not supported on your device, do you want to download the correct files to add support?"

Its not about downloading extra files. Its about the support being built in to the OS. Some software is not easily updated like that either. Some times companies create their own software and use it. Some times the people who created that software no longer work for the company, or in the case of many states during the whole COVID thing, The systems are written in an old programing language that is well, DEAD. Meaning they cant finding people who know how to use that language. This was an issue with many of our states unemployment systems because for many states the system was written in a language no longer used. They were trying to find people who knew how to program with these language, but those are few and far between because many of them are retired. 

 

But things like 32 bit support for example is built in to the OS. Apple killed 32bit support with Catalina, when you try to install 32bit software it just tells you the software is no compatible. Basically your shit out of luck for running it. 

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

Now the question is, are they going to be doing a free upgrade like they did with Windows 10? 

 

_{Inb4 know-it-alls chime in saying it's not free because you are the product} 

[Donut417]

27 minutes ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Now the question is, are they going to be doing a free upgrade like they did with Windows 10? 

 

_{Inb4 know-it-alls chime in saying it's not free because you are the product} 

Seems like they are trying to pull an Apple. So I would venture a guess and say it will probably be free. 

 

Regardless I wont upgrade till 2025. Because a few years for the bugs to be worked out sound like a good idea to me. 

[BondiBlue]

10 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Regardless I wont upgrade till 2025. Because a few years for the bugs to be worked out sound like a good idea to me. 

I'll be putting it on a secondary machine, but definitely not my main machine. I still have some painful memories about Windows 10 build 10240. I loved the new UI at the time, but damn, it was unreliable. On my laptop the Wi-Fi settings would fail to load half the time, and when they did load I wouldn't be able to turn the wireless adapter on and off. And up until a few years ago scaling was still handled very poorly, especially when connecting through RDP. 

[12345678]

if they let you pirate windows doesn't really matter

if they force you pay hundreds for windows, then I'll deal with linux

 

[NotFakeName]

Sad thing is that when I will buy w10, I will only have 3years worth of updates

[Dash Lambda]

On 6/10/2021 at 2:13 PM, FakeKGB said:

My guess is that Windows 10 "21H2" will not be Windows 10 at all, but a "new OS" that's still Windows 10 but something else instead.

And herein lies the confusion.

I swear, I cannot find a way to read this that makes sense.

[WhitetailAni]

Just now, Dash Lambda said:

And herein lies the confusion.

I swear, I cannot find a way to read this that makes sense.

Attempted explanation. I do see the contradictory part - not sure how I didn't notice that I said "Windows 10 is not Windows 10 but is Windows 10". There's also some missing words. Wow, this post is bad.

Last year, MS announced the 21H2 update for W10, which was going to change a lot. It's what we now know as Windows 11, I think. The "new OS" part is Windows 11.

I think what I was trying to say is that Windows 11 is Windows 10 with some minor tweaks, such as scheduler changes for big.LITTLE.

I haven't been able to use it personally - downloading the leaked/dev ISO right now - but I will give my thoughts.

Sorry if this is still confusing.

[Dash Lambda]

46 minutes ago, FakeKGB said:

Attempted explanation. I do see the contradictory part - not sure how I didn't notice that I said "Windows 10 is not Windows 10 but is Windows 10". There's also some missing words. Wow, this post is bad.

Last year, MS announced the 21H2 update for W10, which was going to change a lot. It's what we now know as Windows 11, I think. The "new OS" part is Windows 11.

I think what I was trying to say is that Windows 11 is Windows 10 with some minor tweaks, such as scheduler changes for big.LITTLE.

I haven't been able to use it personally - downloading the leaked/dev ISO right now - but I will give my thoughts.

Sorry if this is still confusing.

Makes more sense put that way I think. Basically just another Windows 10 update.

It'd be weird to see it called Windows 11 though.

[Helpful Tech Witch]

12 hours ago, 12345678 said:

if they let you pirate windows doesn't really matter

if they force you pay hundreds for windows, then I'll deal with linux

 

It's never been hundreds....

It's been hundred, but even then, a windows 7 key would work, or a 5$ key off of eBay.

[12345678]

13 minutes ago, HelpfulTechWizard said:

It's never been hundreds....

It's been hundred, but even then, a windows 7 key would work, or a 5$ key off of eBay.

most of those keys are either stolen or not destinated to privates/consumers or illegal in most states

 

actually most of the ebay's keys are just stolen, the keys are the same, they are multiactivation, though sometimes they do provide different keys, to allow randomizations and be considered more trustworthy by some random customer

 

but even so, it needs time to get a good flood of keys in the gray markets, the flood of keys it's needed because, more keys there are around less it costs

[Helpful Tech Witch]

1 minute ago, 12345678 said:

most of those keys are either stolen or not destinated to privates/consumers

 

but even so, it needs time to get a good flood of keys in the gray markets, the flood of keys it's needed because, more keys there are around less it costs

Win11 currently with win7, 8, 8.1, or 10 keys, or just poking around the regestry untill youve found the activation things.

 

I'd say there's plenty of keys right now.

[SpikeSpiegel]

I just found a video where a guy ran Windows 11 on a Core 2 Duo from 2007.  And I thought you need at least TPM 2.0 to run Windows 11

 

[Tieox]

@LinusTechBet you can't get Windows 11 to run on an Intel Atom. 

[Kisai]

5 hours ago, CalintzJerevinan said:

I just found a video where a guy ran Windows 11 on a Core 2 Duo from 2007.  And I thought you need at least TPM 2.0 to run Windows 11

 

You only need the TPM for secure boot. Microsoft Office will also use the TPM, but otherwise it pretty much doesn't do much. I don't think it's even used for BitLocker.