New GA106-302 RTX 3060 Revision coming with Hardware Based Mining Limiter coming in May, Possibly coming to the rest of RTX 30 series

[leadeater]

5 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

so... back to halving of hash rate for every GPU: nothing will change, except the mining difficulty will adjust itself to maintain a fixed time to be solved.

Cool, so I wasn't going insane. So overall seems pointless to me since older cards will at some point phase out and I can't see difficultly dropping much as I suspect any effort that doesn't make the card not profitable will just ultimately cause more of them to be purchased. If I want to make say $1000 per month and I need 2 to do that now and then a limiter comes in and I drop to $500 then I'll just buy 2 more. That's honestly what I would do if I were mining. At some point I would reach satisfaction and not buy any more cards, a limiter would only make me buy more.

 

Maybe that's not how everyone would act but that's how I would.

[Moonzy]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Cool, so I wasn't going insane. So overall seems pointless to me since older cards will at some point phase out and I can't see difficultly dropping much as I suspect any effort that doesn't make the card not profitable will just ultimately cause more of them to be purchased. If I want to make say $1000 per month and I need 2 to do that now and then a limiter comes in and I drop to $500 then I'll just buy 2 more. That's honestly what I would do if I were mining. At some point I would reach satisfaction and not buy any more cards, a limiter would only make me buy more.

 

Maybe that's not how everyone would act but that's how I would.

there's also power draw to consider, and physical space

hash density is the next thing to consider after efficiency

[tishous]

23 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

In no world does mining use up less energy than gaming. Sure gaming might use more energy when playing AAA games at full blast but let's be honest here not everyone is playing AAA games and even if they do they aren't running the pc 24/7 like miners. At least with gaming its providing entertainment. With mining its simply doing calculations for transactions for a currency that really shouldn't exist. Its not even a currency tbh as its way to volatile and it doesn't even do what it set out to do. Cryptocurrency is simply a failure and should have never been invented. 

I'll give you an example. When mining on my RTX 3060, I use about 170W total system power draw. When I play even a pretty non demanding game like GTA V or something, that power draw goes up to around 300W. So for every hour I spend gaming on a pretty easy to run game, it uses nearly the same amount of power as 2 hours mining. With larger scale miners, they use low power intel chips, so when mining with an RTX 3060 on one of those systems, it could be closer to 140W. For even larger scale, I'm talking enterprise-scale mining, it definitely becomes a burden on the environment, but the majority of people who mine don't have such large scale operations. 

 

I don't think you give cryptocurrency enough credit. Where in the definition of currency does it say that volatility is a factor in deciding whether or not it can be considered a currency? There are multiple different cryptocurrencies, some of whose main purpose is to be more stable. 

[kiska3]

I am going to chime in from a consumer protection perspective. And I think limiting mining performance is going to be bad if you're being told that you can't do something on a product. Also this sets a precedent and NV can decide to not allow scientific applications to run of Geforce cards as an example. University research ain't that well funded, look at how well seti@home was run

 

Also I am not sure how well this will jive with the ACCC given almost none of the retailers will tell you that mining perf has been nerfed.

https://www.accc.gov.au/business/treating-customers-fairly/consumers-rights-obligations

Specifically:

Quote

Businesses that sell goods guarantee that those goods:

have been accurately described

match any sample or demonstration model

come with undisturbed possession, so no one has the right to take the goods away from or to prevent the consumer from using them

 

[Guest]

25 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Just remember there is no such thing as a mining GPU. Nvidia makes GPU dies, from then on it's just product labeling. It'd be like Asics running shoes and walking shoes being literally the same shoe but with different accent colouring. That's not how it's done for shoes but that is how it is done for GPUs. RTX 3060 sort of the first to not be like that but unless the GA106-300 based products stay in production then it's not and it's still the same, just slapping a label on literally the same thing.

 

They for example make GA104 dies, then after validation and binning they get written with microcode and etched with either GA104-200-A1 (RTX 3060 Ti) or GA104-300-A1 (RTX 3070). They don't make GA104-200-A1 and GA104-300-A1 dies separately.

Thank you, I mean like those mining boxes or whatever. 

 

34 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

yea but you dont expect nike to bust your kneecaps with a bat...?

 

likewise, i am fully aware that my GPU fans will die sooner, but not active intervention from nvidia

 

You buy one of these 3060s and complain about mining, you bust your own kneecaps. 

 

34 minutes ago, Moonzy said:

 

these are general purpose products, it's silly to think GPU are only for games

because even games utilise GPU differently

I don’t think GPUs are just for games, and to be clear I’m not against mining either - do what you want if the stuff you buy. But if the stuff you buy is clearly not intended for that use - e.g an ATI Rage won’t play Call of Duty, then you shouldn’t have bought it. 
 

Let’s be fair though, this is clearly marketing, in a time of GPU shortage. These are going straight to scalpers. 

[Brooksie359]

1 hour ago, tishous said:

I'll give you an example. When mining on my RTX 3060, I use about 170W total system power draw. When I play even a pretty non demanding game like GTA V or something, that power draw goes up to around 300W. So for every hour I spend gaming on a pretty easy to run game, it uses nearly the same amount of power as 2 hours mining. With larger scale miners, they use low power intel chips, so when mining with an RTX 3060 on one of those systems, it could be closer to 140W. For even larger scale, I'm talking enterprise-scale mining, it definitely becomes a burden on the environment, but the majority of people who mine don't have such large scale operations. 

 

I don't think you give cryptocurrency enough credit. Where in the definition of currency does it say that volatility is a factor in deciding whether or not it can be considered a currency? There are multiple different cryptocurrencies, some of whose main purpose is to be more stable. 

Are you joking? How can something be used as a currency if its value is fluctuating constantly? Sure it may not be in the formal definition but that doesn't mean it isn't necessary to function as a currency. Because its value is volatile no logical business person would accept it as a form of payment meaning it won't satisfy the actual definition of currency. Aka being able to buy thing with it. Right now it is no more than a glorified stock with no company backing. And on the note of power consumption again its not even close even if it is 2x which I highly doubt is the case anyways. Most people have a job or school or any other obligations meaning they don't have the ability to play games all that often so you probably get maybe 4 to 6 hour of game time per day while mining is 24/7. Also again not everyone plays AAA games and use their gpu at 100% load. I mean I play league of legends alot and that sure as hell doesn't consume alot of power. Not to mention that miners usually run multiple gpus so they likely have about as much power draw as a gamer with a single gpu if not more simply from the extra gpus. 

[IkeaGnome]

1 minute ago, Brooksie359 said:

Because its value is volatile no logical business person would accept it as a form of payment

Tesla, Home Depot, Starbucks, Microsoft, and Newegg are all not logical businesses?

[tishous]

2 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

Are you joking? How can something be used as a currency if its value is fluctuating constantly? Sure it may not be in the formal definition but that doesn't mean it isn't necessary to function as a currency. Because its value is volatile no logical business person would accept it as a form of payment meaning it won't satisfy the actual definition of currency. Aka being able to buy thing with it. Right now it is no more than a glorified stock with no company backing.

Every currency's value fluctuates. The USD, Euro, GBP and every other currency ever in history has constantly changed in value. You can buy things with crypto, Tesla is just one company that accepts Bitcoin from the top of my head. You just pay however much it's worth in relation to USD or whatever your country's currency is instead. The fact Bitcoin costs $56,000 one day and $57,000 the next doesn't change the fact you can use it to buy things, just one day you pay more Bitcoin and the other you pay less.

 

Again, there are many different cryptocurrencies, some of which literally have a value equal to the US dollar, so saying "crypto is volatile" isn't exactly true.

[Kisai]

3 hours ago, leadeater said:

GA106-303, GA106-304, GA106-305 etc etc lol

 

Also like a said in the RTX 3060 limiter announcement topic the issue is purely distribution and procurement related, mining limiting is such a tangential and doomed to failure solution. It simply will not work no matter how much anyone wishes that it will.

 

If Nvidia truly wanted to prioritize GPU dies and sales of graphics cards to gamers they could, they really could. Since they are not doing that it tells you everything you need to know about how much they actually care about gamers specifically over sales of GPUs in general. The same solution could/would also fix the scalping issue too.

nVidia could quite literately release incremental updates so that each "stepping" of the same card has additional hardware locked countermeasures. Like if I was "nvidia the gamer-friendly, miner hating" I'd take a lot more steps (that would have collateral damage):

1) Card connected at 1x: Nerf CUDA (Direct Compute, Vulkan, OpenCL, etc), lock-in nVidia ML libraries only (eg Tensorflow)

2) Card connected to no monitor, or monitor with no EDID (eg dongles): Nerf CUDA if nvlink not connected to another nVidia GPU

3) Card undervolted/underclocked: Nerf CUDA entirely

4) Multiple Geforce cards in the same system: Only initialize cards that can run electrically at 16x (eg Xeon system, no budget chipsets)

5) Correlate monitor resolution with capability: Cleave VRAM configuration based on active resolution set. eg 480p60, cap to 1GB, 720p60, 2GB, 1080p60 4GB, 4Kp60, 8GB. This would have rather massive consequences for ML however. eg to "enforce gaming use", there are better ways (like ensuring there is always a framebuffer, textures, shaders, etc) but that requires the card knowing about API features that should be handled by the display driver. Like Vulkan and DX12 which have less driver cruft in the way basically expose memory management and thread control, but also allow for compute through them.

6) Abandon CUDA on gaming cards. Vulkan or DX12 only. Somehow I doubt they would do this.

 

Of the various options, I think ultimately it hurts the brand and resale value of cards that have been crippled, regardless of the intention. Like as I said the last time about vbios incremental updates, they could make it so only specific vbios versions work with specific drivers, and update a part of the firmware to prevent "driver and firmware downgrade" before pulling the trigger on the actual counter-measure. Then whenever the mining craze falls off a cliff, all those previously used cards need to find a new purpose or they become landfill, so at that point unlock the countermeasures that would affect ML/Folding on a gaming pc, while keeping the ones that would be typical of a mining rig (eg link rate correlation with multiple gpu's in the same system)

 

Unfortunately unless nvidia takes a massive hatchet job to cryptocoin usefulness, we will keep seeing these opportunistic parasites buying up all available supply. PS5's are still unobtanium, as well as 5xxx series Ryzen CPU's (zero available, can't even preorder) and all GPU's(zero available, can't even preorder) produced after 2015. Oddly enough, the Xbox Series S, is available, the series X isn't.

 

Like, the thing I would almost prefer here is for nvidia to just make all the cards unaffordable even to miners at MSRP. Issue mail-in-rebates to those who register the card with geforce experience on windows, use that to trace down who is selling directly to scalpers and miners, and just outright terminate all business with them.

[Anti Miner]

Good. Miners suck. They can quit wasting our worlds energy on stupidity when this happens. Its their fault the shortages are worse than ever before.

 

14 hours ago, Kisai said:

nVidia could quite literately release incremental updates so that each "stepping" of the same card has additional hardware locked countermeasures. Like if I was "nvidia the gamer-friendly, miner hating" I'd take a lot more steps (that would have collateral damage):

1) Card connected at 1x: Nerf CUDA (Direct Compute, Vulkan, OpenCL, etc), lock-in nVidia ML libraries only (eg Tensorflow)

2) Card connected to no monitor, or monitor with no EDID (eg dongles): Nerf CUDA if nvlink not connected to another nVidia GPU

3) Card undervolted/underclocked: Nerf CUDA entirely

4) Multiple Geforce cards in the same system: Only initialize cards that can run electrically at 16x (eg Xeon system, no budget chipsets)

5) Correlate monitor resolution with capability: Cleave VRAM configuration based on active resolution set. eg 480p60, cap to 1GB, 720p60, 2GB, 1080p60 4GB, 4Kp60, 8GB. This would have rather massive consequences for ML however. eg to "enforce gaming use", there are better ways (like ensuring there is always a framebuffer, textures, shaders, etc) but that requires the card knowing about API features that should be handled by the display driver. Like Vulkan and DX12 which have less driver cruft in the way basically expose memory management and thread control, but also allow for compute through them.

6) Abandon CUDA on gaming cards. Vulkan or DX12 only. Somehow I doubt they would do this.

 

Of the various options, I think ultimately it hurts the brand and resale value of cards that have been crippled, regardless of the intention. Like as I said the last time about vbios incremental updates, they could make it so only specific vbios versions work with specific drivers, and update a part of the firmware to prevent "driver and firmware downgrade" before pulling the trigger on the actual counter-measure. Then whenever the mining craze falls off a cliff, all those previously used cards need to find a new purpose or they become landfill, so at that point unlock the countermeasures that would affect ML/Folding on a gaming pc, while keeping the ones that would be typical of a mining rig (eg link rate correlation with multiple gpu's in the same system)

 

Unfortunately unless nvidia takes a massive hatchet job to cryptocoin usefulness, we will keep seeing these opportunistic parasites buying up all available supply. PS5's are still unobtanium, as well as 5xxx series Ryzen CPU's (zero available, can't even preorder) and all GPU's(zero available, can't even preorder) produced after 2015. Oddly enough, the Xbox Series S, is available, the series X isn't.

 

Like, the thing I would almost prefer here is for nvidia to just make all the cards unaffordable even to miners at MSRP. Issue mail-in-rebates to those who register the card with geforce experience on windows, use that to trace down who is selling directly to scalpers and miners, and just outright terminate all business with them.

That's a great idea. I support a ban on miners

 

14 hours ago, tishous said:

Every currency's value fluctuates. The USD, Euro, GBP and every other currency ever in history has constantly changed in value. You can buy things with crypto, Tesla is just one company that accepts Bitcoin from the top of my head. You just pay however much it's worth in relation to USD or whatever your country's currency is instead. The fact Bitcoin costs $56,000 one day and $57,000 the next doesn't change the fact you can use it to buy things, just one day you pay more Bitcoin and the other you pay less.

 

Again, there are many different cryptocurrencies, some of which literally have a value equal to the US dollar, so saying "crypto is volatile" isn't exactly true.

Crypto is stupid. I can't wait until it is heavily taxed. It's caused nothing but trouble for us gamers

 

15 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Thank you, I mean like those mining boxes or whatever. 

 

You buy one of these 3060s and complain about mining, you bust your own kneecaps. 

 

I don’t think GPUs are just for games, and to be clear I’m not against mining either - do what you want if the stuff you buy. But if the stuff you buy is clearly not intended for that use - e.g an ATI Rage won’t play Call of Duty, then you shouldn’t have bought it. 
 

Let’s be fair though, this is clearly marketing, in a time of GPU shortage. These are going straight to scalpers. 

Ban the miners and ban the scalpers. If it were me running sites like ebay, I would charge an 80% commission on anything being sold above msrp that is still being produced by manufacturers.

[IkeaGnome]

3 minutes ago, Anti Miner said:

Crypto is stupid. I can't wait until it is heavily taxed. It's caused nothing but trouble for us gamers

Might want to do a bit of research. It is taxed.

[leadeater]

31 minutes ago, Kisai said:

Abandon CUDA on gaming cards. Vulkan or DX12 only. Somehow I doubt they would do this.

Could never do this, tons of games and other applications use CUDA. May as well just exit the GPU market.

[leadeater]

37 minutes ago, Kisai said:

1) Card connected at 1x: Nerf CUDA (Direct Compute, Vulkan, OpenCL, etc), lock-in nVidia ML libraries only (eg Tensorflow)

2) Card connected to no monitor, or monitor with no EDID (eg dongles): Nerf CUDA if nvlink not connected to another nVidia GPU

Also now that code 43 isn't a thing you could just bypass these and anything else by way of GPU passthrough to VM and report to the VM OS that the GPU is x16 connected and a dummy HDMI plug per GPU.

 

Simple fact is like I keep saying the issues is distribution and procurement, not what the cards can and cannot do.

 

39 minutes ago, Kisai said:

PS5's are still unobtanium

Maybe this is a giant clue that maybe the shortages are not primarily miners if unrelated, impossible to mine on, products are also supply MIA. Seems to be a hell of a lot of blame gaming going on with no actual evidence.

[Zodiark1593]

56 minutes ago, Kisai said:

nVidia could quite literately release incremental updates so that each "stepping" of the same card has additional hardware locked countermeasures. Like if I was "nvidia the gamer-friendly, miner hating" I'd take a lot more steps (that would have collateral damage):

1) Card connected at 1x: Nerf CUDA (Direct Compute, Vulkan, OpenCL, etc), lock-in nVidia ML libraries only (eg Tensorflow)

2) Card connected to no monitor, or monitor with no EDID (eg dongles): Nerf CUDA if nvlink not connected to another nVidia GPU

3) Card undervolted/underclocked: Nerf CUDA entirely

4) Multiple Geforce cards in the same system: Only initialize cards that can run electrically at 16x (eg Xeon system, no budget chipsets)

5) Correlate monitor resolution with capability: Cleave VRAM configuration based on active resolution set. eg 480p60, cap to 1GB, 720p60, 2GB, 1080p60 4GB, 4Kp60, 8GB. This would have rather massive consequences for ML however. eg to "enforce gaming use", there are better ways (like ensuring there is always a framebuffer, textures, shaders, etc) but that requires the card knowing about API features that should be handled by the display driver. Like Vulkan and DX12 which have less driver cruft in the way basically expose memory management and thread control, but also allow for compute through them.

6) Abandon CUDA on gaming cards. Vulkan or DX12 only. Somehow I doubt they would do this.

 

Of the various options, I think ultimately it hurts the brand and resale value of cards that have been crippled, regardless of the intention. Like as I said the last time about vbios incremental updates, they could make it so only specific vbios versions work with specific drivers, and update a part of the firmware to prevent "driver and firmware downgrade" before pulling the trigger on the actual counter-measure. Then whenever the mining craze falls off a cliff, all those previously used cards need to find a new purpose or they become landfill, so at that point unlock the countermeasures that would affect ML/Folding on a gaming pc, while keeping the ones that would be typical of a mining rig (eg link rate correlation with multiple gpu's in the same system)

 

Unfortunately unless nvidia takes a massive hatchet job to cryptocoin usefulness, we will keep seeing these opportunistic parasites buying up all available supply. PS5's are still unobtanium, as well as 5xxx series Ryzen CPU's (zero available, can't even preorder) and all GPU's(zero available, can't even preorder) produced after 2015. Oddly enough, the Xbox Series S, is available, the series X isn't.

 

Like, the thing I would almost prefer here is for nvidia to just make all the cards unaffordable even to miners at MSRP. Issue mail-in-rebates to those who register the card with geforce experience on windows, use that to trace down who is selling directly to scalpers and miners, and just outright terminate all business with them.

I feel like Nvidia (and PC gamers as a whole for right now) would probably be better served conceding graphical superiority to consoles, and focus on getting smaller chip cards out there. The big dies primarily going to datacenters and workstations, the small dies to gamers, at least for awhile. 
 

Going this route, Nvidia could achieve higher margins per wafer, mining performance is reduced simply out of virtue of a less powerful GPU, and if board partners can keep up, flood out scalpers. 
 

The biggest strength of PC gaming is not graphical superiority, but the flexibility of the platform (via modding, emulation, vast library, home brew, streaming, productivity, etc). A card needn’t curb-stomp console GPUs to leverage the advantages PC has to offer, so long as Nvidia can get something competent in the hands of gamers. 
 

Putting the high end on the back burner for a bit will probably allow continued accessibility of PC gaming, even if the silicon shortage lasts multiple years. As it stands right now, even older low end cards are hardly a compelling or financially competitive option. 

[Bombastinator]

28 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Also now that code 43 isn't a thing you could just bypass these and anything else by way of GPU passthrough to VM and report to the VM OS that the GPU is x16 connected and a dummy HDMI plug per GPU.

 

Simple fact is like I keep saying the issues is distribution and procurement, not what the cards can and cannot do.

 

Maybe this is a giant clue that maybe the shortages are not primarily miners if unrelated, impossible to mine on, products are also supply MIA. Seems to be a hell of a lot of blame gaming going on with no actual evidence.

Just watched a video on lumber supply’s in the US which seem to have undergone a similar price hike.  Apparently lumber prices will shortly go down because lumber mills are developing massive amounts of inventory.  Apparently it will be a while before this happens to GPUs. Miners didn’t help but they’re likely not the whole problem.  Much like with lumber there was a perfect storm of colliding factors. 

[Guest]

59 minutes ago, Anti Miner said:

Ban the miners and ban the scalpers. If it were me running sites like ebay, I would charge an 80% commission on anything being sold above msrp that is still being produced by manufacturers.

Commissions and taxes are passed to consumers. If you have lack of supply, that will bump prices up as all cards will be above rrp 

[Brooksie359]

1 hour ago, IkeaGnome said:

Tesla, Home Depot, Starbucks, Microsoft, and Newegg are all not logical businesses?

Yeah tbh. The only reason they would accept it is if they immediately transfered it to a different currency after the transaction which is basically negates its use as a currency. 

[Helpful Tech Witch]

1 hour ago, Anti Miner said:

Ban the miners and ban the scalpers. If it were me running sites like ebay, I would charge an 80% commission on anything being sold above msrp that is still being produced by manufacturers.

1. Ban the miners

oh my f*cking god the amount of gamers that are so f*cking entitled about people doing what they want with their property.
I'd rather not have everything follow the apple model of ownership, thanks.
 

2 the 80 tax

There’s literally no way to enforce this. 
someone would have to manually flag every entry, and if a item is mismarked, eBay would 110% get sued for that. It's a free market, and that's a good thing. If someone tries to sell something for 20273682826$ and it's something that costs 10$ let them.

[Brooksie359]

1 hour ago, tishous said:

Every currency's value fluctuates. The USD, Euro, GBP and every other currency ever in history has constantly changed in value. You can buy things with crypto, Tesla is just one company that accepts Bitcoin from the top of my head. You just pay however much it's worth in relation to USD or whatever your country's currency is instead. The fact Bitcoin costs $56,000 one day and $57,000 the next doesn't change the fact you can use it to buy things, just one day you pay more Bitcoin and the other you pay less.

 

Again, there are many different cryptocurrencies, some of which literally have a value equal to the US dollar, so saying "crypto is volatile" isn't exactly true.

There is a difference between values fluctuating in very small amounts vs the volatility of cryptocurrency. Sure you can use cryptocurrency as a means to convert into usd or other actual currencies but the same can be said about stocks. That doesn't make stocks or cryptocurrency actual currency. The definition of currency is based on it being generally accepted as payment or used for transactions but being able to use it for a few companies doesn't satisfy that requirement. And again its not like these companies keep the currency. No they instead immediately convert it to an actual currency. If cryptocurrency was a real currency then it would be accepted generally as payment and people would keep it after transactions instead of simply converting it to fiat currency to avoid the volatility issue. Another problem is when the few companies that do accepted cryptocurrency get the cryptocurrency its basically useless to them unless they exchange it for fiat currency as very few of their expenses can be paid for in cryptocurrency. At the end of the day cryptocurrency is not a currency simply because you can't use it generally. 

[tishous]

9 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

Sure you can use cryptocurrency as a means to convert into usd or other actual currencies but the same can be said about stocks

You can't buy a car using stocks.

9 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

And again its not like these companies keep the currency. No they instead immediately convert it to an actual currency

Says who? In that case why wouldn't they just ask people to convert it for them and save some fees? If I had to guess, I would say these companies have wallets for these crypto currencies and are just collecting. In 5-10 years, it could be worth 3, 4 times or more what it is worth now.

11 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

Another problem is when the few companies that do accepted cryptocurrency get the cryptocurrency its basically useless to them unless they exchange it for fiat currency as very few of their expenses can be paid for in cryptocurrency. At the end of the day cryptocurrency is not a currency simply because you can't use it generally. 

These are multi billion if not trillion dollar companies. I don't think they are struggling to pay their bills. Their other sales would easily cover that and still provide billions in profit. 

[SolarNova]

I've always been an advocate for being able to use ones PC any way they see fit.

However, there is a distinct difference between using something for its intended purpose, and not, especially when it comes at the expense of other people. When that happens, it is certainly necessary and usual for said 'thing / 'product' to be separated into 2 distinct items, one for the intended purpose and one for the other purpose.

 

An example in the UK, im sure the US has something similar, is Red Diesel.

Red Diesel is essentially the same as normal Diesel, its just Dyed Red, its only used in farm vehicles and some construction equipment. Red Diesel has a very low Tax Duty rate.

Initially farm vehicles used normal diesel that was simply cheaper due to less Duty cost, however this caused 'normal' people to buy said diesel under the guise of using it for farm equipment, and/or otherwise 'acquire' it and use it for their every day car and ofc for resale. This ofc caused a problem, so they solution was to Dye the Diesel red, anyone caught using it in a regular vehicle is subject to penalties.

 

So in this instance, the 'cheap' Diesel is the GPU, intended primarily for farmers to use so they can affordably ..farm. However, the average joe started to realize they could save some money and avoid Taxes by buying / acquiring said Diesel to use in their every day vehicle and worse still acquire it to resell, they are the Crypto Miners.

The solution, Dye the Diesel Red to differentiate between the almost Duty free Diesel and 'normal Diesel' making it very easy to find and fine those who use the 'cheap' Diesel outside its intended use. This is Nividia adding the limiters to the GPUs.

 

The average joe isnt going to be harmed here. Most people are not going to be crypto mining with a single GPU, its hardly worth it afterall. By the time you have enough GPU power for it to be worth it, ur well within being a 'miner' territory, and thus are causing an problem for other people.

 

This is a slippery slope however, so its well worth consumer keeping a close eye on things.

[Helpful Tech Witch]

16 minutes ago, SolarNova said:

The average joe isnt going to be harmed here. Most people are not going to be crypto mining with a single GPU, its hardly worth it aftercall. By the time you have enough GPU power for it to be worth it, ur well within being a 'miner' territory, and thus are causing an problem for other people.

Actually i think most people are mining off one gpu: their gaming one. Which it most definitely is. Im profiting on mining on my rx480 4gb. Mining eth. on a 3070 i might be making $5.50 daily, as apposed to $1.00 on my 480.

 

As long as you use a pool ofc. If you are solo mining it would take like more than the lifetime of the universe to mine a block or something.

[GalacticRuler]

What we need is not the manipulation of graphics cards. What we need is a prominence of dedicated mining hardware for the Etherium side of things. Back in the first mining boom, before altcoins were even a thing, graphics cards in mining operations were rendered useless once ASIC cards came out, which were specialized pieces of hardware which mined Bitcoin at exponentially higher rates compared to graphics cards. This is why you can still find many R9 2xx cards that were used in mining operations in the past.

 

The problem is when Etherium came out, an altcoin that was extremely ineffective to mine on ASIC cards. This wasn't a problem until the second mining boom hit, when new miners who couldn't compete against the ASIC warehouses mining Bitcoin turned to Etherium and the other altcoins that were ineffective on ASICs.

 

Considering that ASIC cards completely shut down the relevancy of graphics cards in the mining scene back then, it's quite plausible that dedicated mining hardware for Etherium would follow the same pattern, and would result in a tremendous flood of GPUs hitting the market as miners try to salvage as much money as they can on their hardware now worthless for mining.

[Brooksie359]

1 hour ago, tishous said:

You can't buy a car using stocks.

Says who? In that case why wouldn't they just ask people to convert it for them and save some fees? If I had to guess, I would say these companies have wallets for these crypto currencies and are just collecting. In 5-10 years, it could be worth 3, 4 times or more what it is worth now.

These are multi billion if not trillion dollar companies. I don't think they are struggling to pay their bills. Their other sales would easily cover that and still provide billions in profit. 

Are you crazy? None of those companies are going to keep the cryptocurrency long term. They will definitely transfer it into usable currency. You think that these companies don't need money to continue buying necessary raw materials and paying workers? What are they going to pay workers in bitcoin? I highly doubt that. You also realize that Tesla is not the most profitable company out there. Sure they are getting by but its not like they can afford to sit on cryptocurrency like that. And again that doesn't change the fact that cryptocurrency is not a currency because you can't use it for general use. Its not like I can pay for gas in cryptocurrency or buy groceries with cryptocurrency or do so many different things. You can use it at like 6 places. That doesn't make it a legit currency. If that was the case then vbucks for fortnite is about as much of a currency as cryptocurrency as you can use it to buy stuff. 

[IkeaGnome]

12 minutes ago, GalacticRuler said:

What we need is not the manipulation of graphics cards. What we need is a prominence of dedicated mining hardware for the Etherium side of things. Back in the first mining boom, before altcoins were even a thing, graphics cards in mining operations were rendered useless once ASIC cards came out, which were specialized pieces of hardware which mined Bitcoin at exponentially higher rates compared to graphics cards. This is why you can still find many R9 2xx cards that were used in mining operations in the past.

 

The problem is when Etherium came out, an altcoin that was extremely ineffective to mine on ASIC cards. This wasn't a problem until the second mining boom hit, when new miners who couldn't compete against the ASIC warehouses mining Bitcoin turned to Etherium and the other altcoins that were ineffective on ASICs.

 

Considering that ASIC cards completely shut down the relevancy of graphics cards in the mining scene back then, it's quite plausible that dedicated mining hardware for Etherium would follow the same pattern, and would result in a tremendous flood of GPUs hitting the market as miners try to salvage as much money as they can on their hardware now worthless for mining.

Bitminer is ahead of you. While there is no release date, the E9 should be coming out soonish. There's also other ASICs out for ETH. 

https://www.innosilicon.com/html/a10pro-miner/index.html

https://www.asicminervalue.com/miners/innosilicon/a11-pro-eth-2000mh