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Đỗ Đức Huy

Intel to offer Haswell CPU in 2020

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38 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Intel's 80186 and 80386 were available well into the mid 2000s because they were used in embedded systems. I think the 386 lasted longer.

 

But I think the sticking point is this: Intel will only make them if you want them.

Lets be clear though, the 80386s Intel were producing in 2007 were not the same as the first batch in 1985. They were 100% instruction compatible but much faster, IIRC the fastest variant was clocked at 33Mhz.

 

Still technically you're correct and as we all know, technically is the best kind of correct :D

 

EDIT - Its actually kind of crazy, if you think about it, that Intel spent money on time & resources to improve a design based on a 20 year old process. I guess it shows how many of them Intel must have still been selling.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
3 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

I also have Haswell. With 6 cores, 12 threads and clock of 4.5GHz. Old, but still very much relevant :D

I have an Ivy, 8 cores, oc to 4.5... damn that thing will give a R7 2700 a good run for its money but the Xeon suck up electricity like no one cares.


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38 minutes ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

Try that with a 4790K, I dare you.

i booted at 5ghz at 1.665v, granted i only ran it for 20 seconds so i didn't do too much damage as i was only running cooled water but... i dared.


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Intel in a nutshell

2tfbca.png

 

Can't wait for the new 14nm++++++++++++


I tend to reply with memes because I lack social skills and don't know how to express myself correctly.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
2 minutes ago, yaboistar said:

i booted at 5ghz at 1.665v, granted i only ran it for 20 seconds so i didn't do too much damage as i was only running cooled water but... i dared.

Don’t give me hope like that. That will lead to sub- ambient with a bare die setup....


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9 minutes ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

this ending of end of life status thing seemed like Intel is restarting production of 22nM cpu, which means the fabs were making something else before switching back to cpu again. It doesn’t look well when you are supposed to be on the bleeding edge of technology yet you have to drag a low end parts introduced 6 years ago out of retirement during a 2 years long product shortage. 

It doesn't matter because the qualifier to this is Intel will make you a Haswell if you ask for one.  It's not like Intel is manufacturing Haswells, putting them on store shelves, and hope they sell.

 

It's why I said in the first place Intel was still making 80186s and 80386s well into the mid 2000s. They weren't selling them on store shelves, they were selling them to people who were making embedded systems. They had to actually ask Intel (or a supplier) for them.

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10 minutes ago, Master Disaster said:

EDIT - Its actually kind of crazy, if you think about it, that Intel spent money on time & resources to improve a design based on a 20 year old process. I guess it shows how many of them Intel must have still been selling.

While we in the enthusiast space look for improvements every generation, there are other use cases where you just want something you know works, and don't change it. This leans more towards embedded systems that silently work in the background of our daily life.

 

This reminds me of an interview, I think it was with one of the designers of the Mars rovers. Compared to the best technology at the time, the cameras they used on it were relatively old, but they stuck with them as they were a known quantity. They knew how it worked, and that it worked in space. Going to a new "better" camera sensor would take more work, introduce uncertainty, and also they had the ultimate bottleneck. Bandwidth. They didn't have a way to transfer more data than they were already capturing with that camera.


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2 minutes ago, porina said:

While we in the enthusiast space look for improvements every generation, there are other use cases where you just want something you know works, and don't change it. This leans more towards embedded systems that silently work in the background of our daily life.

I feel like this is a problem. A lot of people have this mindset that PCs are the only computers around, even though practically every electronic device we use today is for all intents and purposes, a computer.

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I'm having trouble finding a reason to upgrade simply because my Ivy Bridge won't die.


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Can't wait to turn my current 4790k rig into dedicated server for random games while investing hard into Zen 3 in 2020.

Thank you AMD, you made PC Building exciting again, due to all the releases I keep telling myself to wait for another year. 

 

As to Intel, you reap it for sitting on your ass for so long, monopolies in conjunction with complacency is a bitch. 

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13 minutes ago, porina said:

While we in the enthusiast space look for improvements every generation, there are other use cases where you just want something you know works, and don't change it. This leans more towards embedded systems that silently work in the background of our daily life.

 

This reminds me of an interview, I think it was with one of the designers of the Mars rovers. Compared to the best technology at the time, the cameras they used on it were relatively old, but they stuck with them as they were a known quantity. They knew how it worked, and that it worked in space. Going to a new "better" camera sensor would take more work, introduce uncertainty, and also they had the ultimate bottleneck. Bandwidth. They didn't have a way to transfer more data than they were already capturing with that camera.

I understand the need for a stable platform, what I don't get is a company spending money on updating a 20 year old design. The only reason Intel would do that would be if the product was still profitable or if someone else was funding the work.

 

It would be like them re-releasing Core 2 but on a new socket with DDR 4 and PCIe 3 support.


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7 minutes ago, Master Disaster said:

The only reason Intel would do that would be if the product was still profitable or if someone else was funding the work.

This is the only reason. If someone is asking for it and is paying whatever price Intel is offering it at, then Intel will make the product.

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1 hour ago, yaboistar said:

>typing this on a 4790k

 

haswell was great, i missed it

I'm still on a 3470... I have a board ready for getting a 4790... but pricing, and performance, means I'll just scrap that board and go straight to Ryzen (I want a sub 200w, like 100w system like LTT built in that video).

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Unironically I just bought a 4570T to upgrade the G3220 in my storage server.  Might as well when Haswell is dirt cheap on ebay, and I can get 2 more threads and a higher boost clock with lower TDP.

 

Haswell appears to be getting upgraded in bulk (libraries, computer farms, offices, etc) so now is a good time to get it.


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1 hour ago, givingtnt said:

Haswell is best architecture.

Sure, I'll upgrade from my 4790k next summer, but I:m not getting rid of it lol

 

As much as I find it hiiilaaarious that my cpu goes for the shape price it did NEW at launch (more or less lol)

 

These will be def cheaper and still very good.

 

So like, why not 

I'd like a 4790K myself, but prices are too silly and not cost effective.


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3 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

I'd like a 4790K myself, but prices are too silly and not cost effective.

If you do the math you'll find that it's priced appropriately, it's how the market works.  "how much for a 4 core 8 thread 4+Ghz motherboard + cpu from a newer generation or AMD".  And it'll be more than buying a 4790k by itself.


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4 minutes ago, AnonymousGuy said:

If you do the math you'll find that it's priced appropriately, it's how the market works.  "how much for a 4 core 8 thread 4+Ghz motherboard + cpu from a newer generation or AMD".  And it'll be more than buying a 4790k by itself.

Don't forget the RAM, as Haswell users are on DDR3.


The pursuit of knowledge for the sake of knowledge.

Forever in search of my reason to exist.

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1 minute ago, Zodiark1593 said:

Don't forget the RAM, as Haswell users are on DDR3.

*Laughs in Haswell-E*


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Break off your chains

And look what I've found in the dirt.

 

Pale battered body

Seems she was struggling

Something is wrong with this world.

 

Fierce Bloody Angel

The blood is on your hands

Why did you come to this world?

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

The blood is on your hands.

 

The blood is on your hands!

 

Pyo.

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1 hour ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

Don’t give me hope like that. That will lead to sub- ambient with a bare die setup....

Image result for do it gif

i was doing mine just on LM, you might get further than me

one way to find out 😉


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1 hour ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

 They weren't selling them on store shelves, they were selling them to people who were making embedded systems. They had to actually ask Intel (or a supplier) for them.

And let's be honest,  they will not make them just for anyone, it will be for companies who's orders are substantial.  We can't really think of these things in terms of the enthusiast market, however it does stand as a good example of how far different the commercial market is from the DIY/domestic market and how important legacy support can be.  Two factors a lot of people don't think about.


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3 hours ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Then I don't understand how your reasoning makes sense.

 

I'm pretty certain Intel is just offering system builders and other people who use Haswell for some reason or another a last chance to order batches for replacements or whatnot, then they'll just shelve it up and you can no longer buy Haswell. If anything, that'll mean their 22nm fabs can shift to something else. And it looks like two of their main fabs still produce 22nm parts (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_semiconductor_fabrication_plants)

This.

 

I was actually looking at the website earlier when I was responding to the hyperthreading post, and noted that nearly all the U and HQ (laptop parts) were still not discontinued under Haswell. So someone is still buying them. They're the last parts that use DDR3, so they're probably going into embedded devices. There are still 3rd and 2nd generation U and QM parts not discontinued either.

 

The i7-4770S and i7-4790S are desktop parts and still available. So is the i7-3550S which is 22nm. S parts are apparently "small form factor" that are 65w parts instead of 95w parts with a lower base clock speed but same turbo speed as the non-S model.

 

Maybe someone out there is selling desktops with 4770S's ?

Bestbuy, Staples, Walmart and Amazon are selling refurbished Dell and HP PC's with them. There's also a company in Germany selling servers with them. But none of them are showing in stock, so that may just be "as we get them"

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2 minutes ago, Kisai said:

Maybe someone out there is selling desktops with 4770S's ?

Bestbuy, Stables, Walmart and Amazon are selling refurbished Dell and HP PC's with them. There's also a company in Germany selling servers with them. But none of them are showing in stock, so that may just be "as we get them"

Or someone who wants to sell systems in "lesser developed" or whatever countries. Like how there's the China-only GTX 1060 5GB

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This is pretty embarrassing but we should remember that even after Ryzen existed AMD was continuing to offer some budget options based on previous architectures so it's not unheard of.

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11 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

This is pretty embarrassing but we should remember that even after Ryzen existed AMD was continuing to offer some budget options based on previous architectures so it's not unheard of.

The difference that I'm seeing is AMD continued to make and offer them to the general public market. Here Intel is saying "if you want the Pentium G3420, tell us now so we can make them. Otherwise that's it."

 

This is just for this thread in general because I decided to actually read the source material. The product in question is indeed the Haswell based Pentium G3420, but the product code is CM8064601482522. Looking this up brings me to http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Pentium_Dual-Core/Intel-Pentium%20G3420.html which says that CM8064601482522 is an OEM/tray part, meaning it's meant for system builders.

 

If an OEM wants to continue building/servicing computers with this part, Intel is giving them a warning to make their orders.

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53 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

The difference that I'm seeing is AMD continued to make and offer them to the general public market. Here Intel is saying "if you want the Pentium G3420, tell us now so we can make them. Otherwise that's it."

 

This is just for this thread in general because I decided to actually read the source material. The product in question is indeed the Haswell based Pentium G3420, but the product code is CM8064601482522. Looking this up brings me to http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Pentium_Dual-Core/Intel-Pentium%20G3420.html which says that CM8064601482522 is an OEM/tray part, meaning it's meant for system builders.

 

If an OEM wants to continue building/servicing computers with this part, Intel is giving them a warning to make their orders.

Is this more due OEMs actually needing the 22nm part, or are they asking for 22nm since they literally can't get 14nm parts? Of course if Intel offers to build 22nm parts in the market segment of pentiums, any OEM will accept that if they literally can't get any of Intel's 14nm pentiums.

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