Jump to content

Asus Caught Being Malicious - Zephyrus G15 has fan vents blocked by black paper. Reason Unknown

5x5
 Share
Posted
3 minutes ago, spartaman64 said:

what? that not due to the weight of the cooler its because the amd stock cooler thermalpaste is like glue i had trouble with it also and had to twist the cooler a bit to get it off which was a bit scary. but in fact this proves the opposite that the stock cooler is more likely to damage the cpu than a 3rd party cooler LUL. theres no way a cooler would bend the pins on a cpu no matter how heavy it is because its attached to the motherboard not the cpu. if you get a cooler that weighs a ton its going to break the motherboard

Search this forum for people who have thermal problems after their PC was shipped, moved or dropped. This tends to point to either the weight of the cooler or the "tall" coolers being pulled from their mounting hardware. 

 

Anyway the point was that the stock coolers are usually good-enough for something you're not going to fiddle with again.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
1 minute ago, Kisai said:

Search this forum for people who have thermal problems after their PC was shipped, moved or dropped. This tends to point to either the weight of the cooler or the "tall" coolers being pulled from their mounting hardware. 

 

Anyway the point was that the stock coolers are usually good-enough for something you're not going to fiddle with again.  

ofc you should never ship a pc with a big cooler and being dropped is self explanatory. im not saying never use stock coolers im saying that sometimes having a third party cooler is beneficial and sometimes people can and should make modifications to their hardware rather than just going with that the manufacturer provides and im not sure why i have to defend this point on a largely custom computer forum LUL

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
9 hours ago, spartaman64 said:

the point is do you believe that nobody should use an aftermarket cooler because they will destroy their systems or something

 

 

Who uses aftermarket coolers on laptops? I'm not sure how that applies to buying a laptop or understanding that compromises are an intrinsic part of their design.  The modification being posed in that video has side effects which may or may not reduce it's serviceable life).  

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
7 hours ago, spartaman64 said:

what? that not due to the weight of the cooler its because the amd stock cooler thermalpaste is like glue i had trouble with it also and had to twist the cooler a bit to get it off which was a bit scary. but in fact this proves the opposite that the stock cooler is more likely to damage the cpu than a 3rd party cooler LUL. theres no way a cooler would bend the pins on a cpu no matter how heavy it is because its attached to the motherboard not the cpu. if you get a cooler that weighs a ton its going to break the motherboard

That problem is just user/installation error. It's not a problem on LGA because the latch holds down the CPU. Those of us old enough to have been doing CPU installs since before LGA existed know how to work with PGA safely, this knowledge will spread again now that PGA is in use again.

 

You twist the cooler as much as you can then as it's moving/twisting you apply diagonal lift to the cooler, never direct straight up and down, and you will never pull the CPU out of the socket. The only way the CPU can be pulled out is by not twisting it enough to break both the adhesive seal but also the suction seal (really the absence of air if we are being technical about it). I've never pulled a CPU out of a PGA socket with the cooler attached.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
17 hours ago, Kisai said:

Honestly, this is a problem that stems from the demand for thin-and-light ultrabook designs, which all universally suck. Ever since they removed the optical drive, laptops have had insufficient cooling capacity to run the way users mostly use them, and it's like that venn diagram of "cheap, fast, good ; pick two

HP probook line is a bit better in this respect but they still need more cooling. my 3500U runs a little hot but not bad. I'd have to do some thermal load tests in a non tiny room for actuate numbers.

Good luck, Have fun, Build PC, and have a last gen console for use once a year. I should answer most of the time between 9 to 3 PST

NightHawk 3.0: R7 5700x @, B550A vision D, H105, 2x32gb Oloy 3600, Sapphire RX 6700XT  Nitro+, Corsair RM750X, 500 gb 850 evo, 2tb rocket and 5tb Toshiba x300, 2x 6TB WD Black W10 all in a 750D airflow.
GF PC: (nighthawk 2.0): R7 2700x, B450m vision D, 4x8gb Geli 2933, Strix GTX970, CX650M RGB, Obsidian 350D

Skunkworks: R5 3500U, 16gb, 500gb Adata XPG 6000 lite, Vega 8. HP probook G455R G6 Ubuntu 20. LTS

Condor (MC server): 6600K, z170m plus, 16gb corsair vengeance LPX, samsung 750 evo, EVGA BR 450.

Spirt  (NAS) ASUS Z9PR-D12, 2x E5 2620V2, 8x4gb, 24 3tb HDD. F80 800gb cache, trueNAS, 2x12disk raid Z3 stripped

PSU Tier List      Motherboard Tier List     SSD Tier List     How to get PC parts cheap    HP probook 445R G6 review

 

"Stupidity is like trying to find a limit of a constant. You are never truly smart in something, just less stupid."

Camera Gear: X-S10, 16-80 F4, 60D, 24-105 F4, 50mm F1.4, Helios44-m, 2 Cos-11D lavs

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...
Posted
  • Author
16 minutes ago, Escanor said:

Maybe cpu should throttle to maintain proper vrm temps instead of making cpu run hotter and throttle to save vrm temps as result etc, or perhaps bios should have instruction for cpu to throttle to maintain proper temps on vrm, eitherway they should probably fix the vrm cooling issue regardless.

Or Asus shouldn't be taking bribes to artificially fuck CPU temps (G15) or intentionally fucking the design (A15)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
  • Author
2 minutes ago, Escanor said:

 

Im not a fan of running cpu higher temps either there fix was not thought thru, probably was due limitations they should just cancel the product do a call back and fix it properly least in a way that temps are under control for cpu as well and vrm's, altho vrm are usually rated to work very long time even at 105c that probably not safe for a laptop to burn fingers on, wonder if that something that could be fixed at all.

The issue on the A15 is easy to fix. Extend the heat plate to cover the power delivery just like on other laptops.

 

The G15 has no issue whatsoever. The black plastic isn't needed and was added because intel were not pleased with how cool the G15 ran compared to the M15. The reason the G14 doesn't have such blocked vents is the contract Asus have in place with AMD whereby AMD played a big role in the laptops design and didn't allow any such nonsense on their end.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted

I had a Lenovo Y500 that had a similar mesh on the inside of the intakes. The laptop used to burn the hell out of my hand when I played BF3/BF4 on it. After About a year of my hand being burnt I cutout the mesh insert and dramatically reduced the temperature of that laptop.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...
Posted

I would guess it's the same reason as Asus TUF A15, it has blocked bottom intake too. Asus stated that it's for cooling other components, like G15, and also said that its because of VRM temperature. Would be nice have some video which measures VRM temperature with G15 with and without intake covers, possibly repasted too. #content

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
47 minutes ago, FeelsDeadMan said:

I would guess it's the same reason as Asus TUF A15, it has blocked bottom intake too. Asus stated that it's for cooling other components, like G15, and also said that its because of VRM temperature. Would be nice have some video which measures VRM temperature with G15 with and without intake covers, possibly repasted too. #content

There is,  basically the VRM goes up a few degrees and the CPU comes down a few.   The issue people are missing is that companies balance performance and longevity.  Regardless what forum plebs think they know about laptops and silicon, the reality is Asus want their device to last a certain length of time and only reach certain temps. So depending on the CPU and it's thermal characteristics they will retard it a bit to reduce the thermal wear on the VRM.

 

Car companies do this all the time,  that's why there is a whole market for tuners and after makret performance bits,  If the manufacturer could just add those bits without any longevity penalty they would.

 

 

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
On 7/7/2020 at 4:46 AM, leadeater said:

lol so true, it's why I refuse to buy laptops or when I do it's the most dirt cheap crap possible since if I'm going to waste my money I'll waste as little as possible.

Jut noticed “takes time” and “low quality” should be swapped in the pic.  May have already been mentioned.

Not a pro, not even very good.  I’m just old and have time currently.  Assuming I know a lot about computers can be a mistake.

 

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
53 minutes ago, mr moose said:

There is,  basically the VRM goes up a few degrees and the CPU comes down a few.   The issue people are missing is that companies balance performance and longevity.  Regardless what forum plebs think they know about laptops and silicon, the reality is Asus want their device to last a certain length of time and only reach certain temps. So depending on the CPU and it's thermal characteristics they will retard it a bit to reduce the thermal wear on the VRM.

 

Car companies do this all the time,  that's why there is a whole market for tuners and after makret performance bits,  If the manufacturer could just add those bits without any longevity penalty they would.

 

 

Yes, but they could lock the clock lower, you would get 15 inch with 14 inch zephyrus performance (you get less now with worse thermals), but much lower temps and/or quieter laptop. And you wouldn't have to change desing either. This is what it makes it weird. Why the heck would you slap paper there and make a bracket for it if you can do this easy solution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted

At the end of the day TUF is the “fast and cheap” line, and they do things fast and cheap. They had a case designed for Intel and they slapped together some quick ass fixes to try and make a different system fit inside it.  Not all makers did this. “Hardware unboxed” found a German company that actually did work to give equal time to and and intel CPUs in otherwise identical laptops and were able to actually take advantage of ryzen’s lower cpu temps to give extra power to the gpu.  Effect was more or less ryzen was flat out better for non gaming stuff and while the CPUs were a bit slower for gaming most of that could be made up because the lower cpu heat allowed more power for the gpu. 
They’re apparently selling so many ryzen laptops the can’t get chips though. 

Not a pro, not even very good.  I’m just old and have time currently.  Assuming I know a lot about computers can be a mistake.

 

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
19 minutes ago, FeelsDeadMan said:

Yes, but they could lock the clock lower, you would get 15 inch with 14 inch zephyrus performance (you get less now with worse thermals), but much lower temps and/or quieter laptop. And you wouldn't have to change desing either. This is what it makes it weird. Why the heck would you slap paper there and make a bracket for it if you can do this easy solution.

 

Because failing to cover the air intake resulted in less air traveling over the VRM.  It doesn't matter if you software lock the CPU clock, the idea is to limit VRM over heating.    Also software locks on Clocks can be worked around resulting in their product not performing the way they intend.    Many companies have tried software locks, like Nvidia on mobile GPU, but the reality is it creates more problems than its worth.  The CPU will thermal throttle before it does any damage to itself, the VRM will not. 

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
21 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

Because failing to cover the air intake resulted in less air traveling over the VRM.  It doesn't matter if you software lock the CPU clock, the idea is to limit VRM over heating.    Also software locks on Clocks can be worked around resulting in their product not performing the way they intend.    Many companies have tried software locks, like Nvidia on mobile GPU, but the reality is it creates more problems than its worth.  The CPU will thermal throttle before it does any damage to itself, the VRM will not. 

So the solution to that would be to make a system for cooling the VRM. Which they didn’t do because fast and cheap. Paper was fast and cheap.  That it was also stupid and more or less shit design was probably not something the engineers liked but budget is budget.  There was a limit to what they could do to get an AMD chip working in an intel case without making more than tiny changes. If there was maliciousness it had more to do with managerial cheapness than actual engineering.  As a laptop it’s crap for AMD. I would say that’s not AMD’s fault or even asus engineering at fault.  It was some asshat manager trying to save a buck and coming out with a crap product because they wouldn't allocate the resources to do it right. 


So more or less just a shit laptop, which people knew.  The danger I think is people are using the performance numbers to say that AMD chips behave differently than they do.   My personal take away is that TUF is crap, and survives because it can get new designs into cheap systems, and the cost is low quality. 
 

Occam’s razor says that attributing something to maliciousness that can be explained by incompetence is generally a mistake.  TUF leadership was incompetent. I don’t think the engineers really were.  This points not so much to engineers working to make AMD look bad, it points to someone in an asus boardroom with a thumb up their butt. 

Not a pro, not even very good.  I’m just old and have time currently.  Assuming I know a lot about computers can be a mistake.

 

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted

Well, just fuck it, why risk it right? I will just buy G14 and disapointly leave G15 to Asus, if they added an actual 1 heatpipe for the VRM's, they could raise the price and G15 would have been gold. :/ Bombastinator, I know this type of management. You can tell they will make more in the end, even improve manufacturing for less faulty parts, but no, they have to save 10-15% and lose 50% of the profits in the end.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted

Yeah, just was looking at naked G14 and it has actual heat pipe on VRM's

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted

I could swear this I've seen this stuff on Lenovo laptops using Intel components.

Ketchup is better than mustard.

GUI is better than Command Line Interface.

Dubs are better than subs

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
51 minutes ago, Trik'Stari said:

I could swear this I've seen this stuff on Lenovo laptops using Intel components.

You would have seen it from all manufacturers, if they try to design every laptop they make from scratch, the price in the end wouldn't be competitive. 

 

they can't just shove heatpipes in or change the airflow. if the chassis or mainboard is not designed specifically for it.

 

 

 

 

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
2 minutes ago, mr moose said:

You would have seen it from all manufacturers, if they try to design every laptop they make from scratch, the price in the end wouldn't be competitive. 

 

they can't just shove heatpipes in or change the airflow. if the chassis or mainboard is not designed specifically for it.

 

 

 

 

Depends on the chassis.  I’ll take your point as often enough though.

 

an example of an exception:

 

Not a pro, not even very good.  I’m just old and have time currently.  Assuming I know a lot about computers can be a mistake.

 

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
On 5/1/2020 at 11:17 PM, straight_stewie said:

Are they blocked, though?

Is the paper air permeable?

 

More generally:
 

Does having the paper reduce dust intake?

Does the paper reduce noise that is otherwise extremely loud?

Is this a manufacturing mistake only in some units? (i.e. Paper installed to transport partially completed machine from one place to the next, and forgot to remove it)
Could this have been a workflow mistake by factory workers?

Could Asus be nerfing their own product line(s) without Intel's involvement?

Could these units have been intercepted and modified without Asus knowledge?

 

There are many things that could explain this. Let's give Asus a chance to explain themselves before jumping to conclusions and trying to cancel Intel/Asus.

Clearly you are working for Intel and Asus to cover up the story. How much do they pay you? 😜

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted
9 hours ago, Senzelian said:

Clearly you are working for Intel and Asus to cover up the story. How much do they pay you? 😜

No, it's called being reasonable...

ENCRYPTION IS NOT A CRIME

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 8 months later...
Posted

I removed Plastic Paper covering the Air vents and temperature of CPU & GPU went down from 82c to 70c for Assassin Creed & from 82c to 60c for AgeOfEmpire, Idle temp went down from 54c to 42-44c. Think ASUS is sabotaging AMD machines & wants Intel machines to shine. SHAME ON YOU ASUS

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share
Go to topic listing Tech News

×