Asus believes Coffee Lake should work on Z270

[AshleyAshes]

ITT: Nerds realize that corporations aren't their friends.

[Prox1ma]

15 hours ago, cj09beira said:

that is what 10%-15% behind the latest intel in ipc (not counting games) and considering ryzen is on its first gen it wont be hard for amd to catch up

I hope so, but I am skeptical, fingers crossed....

[CookieMaster]

23 hours ago, Fictionvl said:

didnt work because there's no bios update for it.

I read this wrong, I get it now. It's saying with a simple bios update they could make it work with z270. Damn Intel 

[FRlTZ]

2 hours ago, CookieMaster said:

I read this wrong, I get it now. It's saying with a simple bios update they could make it work with z270. Damn Intel 

BIOS update and a power adjustment, nothing major, and nothing too impossible to do.

Intel is just following their stupid philosophy that no motherboard should be compatible with more then 2 gens of CPU.

 

 

Am I the only one whom misses the socket 7 / Super 7 from back in the days??

At least AMD has the balls to do something, and future proofing what they design.

 

[mr moose]

14 minutes ago, FRlTZ said:

BIOS update and a power adjustment, nothing major, and nothing too impossible to do.

Intel is just following their stupid philosophy that no motherboard should be compatible with more then 2 gens of CPU.

 

 

Am I the only one whom misses the socket 7 / Super 7 from back in the days??

At least AMD has the balls to do something, and future proofing what they design.

 

If I remember right, the AMD geode lx was still using socket 7 in 2015.

 

 

[TidaLWaveZ]

16 hours ago, dexT said:

That was for uncore cache frequency. Regular 2011-3 would top out around 3.8. With the OC socket I can run 4.9GHz uncore.

Which means what, a non noticeable performance increase at best?

[pas008]

4 hours ago, FRlTZ said:

BIOS update and a power adjustment, nothing major, and nothing too impossible to do.

Intel is just following their stupid philosophy that no motherboard should be compatible with more then 2 gens of CPU.

 

 

Am I the only one whom misses the socket 7 / Super 7 from back in the days??

At least AMD has the balls to do something, and future proofing what they design.

 

What is future proofing?

 

Is it the philosophy of supposely predicting the future and limiting yourself to backwards compatibility?

 

Ok there is no such thing you are welcome

[leadeater]

Spoiler

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

Seems apt for this 

[MageTank]

7 minutes ago, leadeater said:

  Reveal hidden contents

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

Seems apt for this 

Could be worse. I could recall my original prophecy on this  

[pas008]

17 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Could be worse. I could recall my original prophecy on this  

Can you link?

I find your  posts amusing

[cj09beira]

1 hour ago, pas008 said:

What is future proofing?

 

Is it the philosophy of supposely predicting the future and limiting yourself to backwards compatibility?

 

Ok there is no such thing you are welcome

Of course you are never 100% future proof and 100% using all new features, but that does not mean that you cant build for the future,  in ryzen's case because ryzen is a soc so there is lots of flexibility.

I really don't understand why people would be against saving money in the long run and be able to keep their boards for while longer.

We know that it doesn't prevent the CPU from supporting things like DDR 5 as it has happened in the past,

What would someone be missing from newer boards? Usb 3.2 like you are going to find a product with it anytime soon and even if you do usb 3.1 is fast enough. 

Saying futuproofing doesn't exist is like saying that investing doesn't exist just because some times it doesn't pay off. 

 

[pas008]

52 minutes ago, cj09beira said:

Of course you are never 100% future proof and 100% using all new features, but that does not mean that you cant build for the future,  in ryzen's case because ryzen is a soc so there is lots of flexibility.

I really don't understand why people would be against saving money in the long run and be able to keep their boards for while longer.

We know that it doesn't prevent the CPU from supporting things like DDR 5 as it has happened in the past,

What would someone be missing from newer boards? Usb 3.2 like you are going to find a product with it anytime soon and even if you do usb 3.1 is fast enough. 

Saying futuproofing doesn't exist is like saying that investing doesn't exist just because some times it doesn't pay off. 

 

wow

nothing is guaranteed, and if you recall people still had to buy newer boards for newer cpus on am3/am3+ because of tdp limitations 

like I said millions of times how are you going forward with your progress if you are constantly looking back for compatibility,

amd took this approach many times and look what it did in the past

I'm hoping with ryzen it doesnt hold back their gains but we will see

 

there is no such thing as futureproofing, NO ONE KNOWS what the future holds, hd dvd? I can list many things that are standard now that no one seen coming

 

also lets make the point that people are most likely to upgrade gpu or memory before even a cpu is considered, so why cant I just slap in new volta chip into my already card? why cant I just slap in any old ram in and have it work flawlessly with my current ram

[MageTank]

5 hours ago, pas008 said:

Can you link?

I find your  posts amusing

I'll have to look it up really quickly. Basically, it was me saying that the chipset itself supports CFL, but the change in the pin configuration improved power delivery efficiency (and is potentially the blame for the superior memory OCing, given the support of 4500 on CFL over 4266 on KBL), and that Z270 boards themselves wouldn't "support" it. I said that back in July of this year, long before this info came out, lol. 

 

It really shouldn't surprise anyone though, as the initial leaks showed that CFL was tested on retail Z270 boards. Not even custom Intel boards. 

 

I also made a prediction that ASRock would totally circumvent this if they can, like they always do. I am still waiting for that one to come true.

[TheLaserCucumber]

On 10/19/2017 at 7:54 AM, BubblyCharizard said:

no one really claimed it, but intel wanted to make sure that the motherboards were properly built for coffee lake

I‘m going to say that all Z170 and Z270 boards are capable of delivering the bit more power the extra 2 Cores need.

[NvidiaIntelAMDLoveTriangle]

13 hours ago, TheLaserCucumber said:

I‘m going to say that all Z170 and Z270 boards are capable of delivering the bit more power the extra 2 Cores need.

Oh 100%.

This whole excuse that Intel gave is complete bullshit.

[MyName13]

13 hours ago, TheLaserCucumber said:

I‘m going to say that all Z170 and Z270 boards are capable of delivering the bit more power the extra 2 Cores need.

Z chipsets aren't the only chipsets, what about H and B motherboards?Even if they could support coffee lake how would you use them without a bios flash?

[vorticalbox]

On ‎19‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 8:49 AM, mr moose said:

 

Not likely, they can't keep up with the CL demand.   At best/worst they have a few more 7700K's they can shift with their ubber gaming bundle extraordinaire.

 

I am constantly amazed by how many people get wet panties over AMD's incremental improvements over 3-4 years even though they never actually upgrade that often.  Damn you Intel I paid $330 for my i5 3550, now I can;t even buy a new CPU for the mobo.  

wouldn't you agree that having smaller increases without the need to spend lots of money on a new motherboard is better than bigger increases and a much higher cost to get a motherboard? 

[Mr_Bartek]

After watching the WAN show and reading into the article I reckon I have a theory which holds itself together fairly well. Intel usually has two generations of compatible CPUs before killing off compatibility, so for example 6700K and 7700K or 2600K and 3770K. Linus specifically mentioned in the WAN show that you can pair up at 7700K with a Z170 and still get all the features of the newer CPU whilst paying less for a motherboard.So I reckon whilst Z270 might still be compatible with Coffee Lake CPUs, it would not have been compatible with the next generation of CPUs which comes after (9k CPUs). This would mess up Intel's strategy of having two years of compatibility between chipsets. This would also explain the power delivery issues which may come in the future if Intel decides to make more power hungry chips. They have done it before with LGA2011 and LGA2011-v3.

[mr moose]

9 hours ago, vorticalbox said:

wouldn't you agree that having smaller increases without the need to spend lots of money on a new motherboard is better than bigger increases and a much higher cost to get a motherboard? 

 

No, it all works out the same in the end.   Whilst I could say  history has shown us that Intel's models is better, that would be precluding the fact AMD simply had a bad run with performance/design.  Assuming Ryzen keeps going the way it appears to be, then over the next few years it won't matter which brand you buy,  there won't be much difference to the end user (maybe a few dollars here and a few frames there). 

[vorticalbox]

23 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

No, it all works out the same in the end.   Whilst I could say  history has shown us that Intel's models is better, that would be precluding the fact AMD simply had a bad run with performance/design.  Assuming Ryzen keeps going the way it appears to be, then over the next few years it won't matter which brand you buy,  there won't be much difference to the end user (maybe a few dollars here and a few frames there). 

seeing as am4 is support then few releases of cpu while intel just released a new motherboard for their new line I would say and will wind up cheaper in the end. 

[mr moose]

38 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

seeing as am4 is support then few releases of cpu while intel just released a new motherboard for their new line I would say and will wind up cheaper in the end. 

 

Long platform compatability does not always equal $/performance gains.    Even on AMD's best platform run (6 years), to go from the lowest CPU to the best gave you marginal performance improvements at the cost of ram restrictions and SMT restrictions.   Assuming Ryzen goes the way we expect over the next 3 years that AM4 is supported, the best CPU you can expect to put on a current motherboard will be marginally better (maybe 30% at best?*) than what we have today,  minus any feature improvements that won't work on today's motherboards**.   When the current best AM4 CPU is  $500-600 that's a substantial upgrade cost considering there are no guarantee's you will get everything out of it.  And that is not too mention that the platform life expectancy is still 1 year short of the 4-5 year average upgrade cycle.   Which means even if you buy right at the start of the platform, for 99% of enthusiasts they are still going  to be upgrading when AM4 is obsolete.

 

TL:DR it doesn't matter if you upgrade a little bit more often or a lot less often, you spend about the same in the end.  The sweet spot for upgrading is GPU every 3-4 years (2 years for hardcore enthusiasts with money) and CPU every 4-6 years (3 years for hardcore enthusiasts with money). 

 

 

*each generation of CPU from both companies has averaged out to a bout 10% improvement from what I can tell. 

** unless you have a crystal ball and know what the future holds, we can only use history as a guide that it will happen.

[dexT]

On 10/20/2017 at 5:23 AM, TidaLWaveZ said:

Which means what, a non noticeable performance increase at best?

If you only play video games and watch youtube then at worst you'll see no to little gain. If you do work, that's a different story.

[Dabombinable]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

 

Long platform compatability does not always equal $/performance gains.    Even on AMD's best platform run (6 years), to go from the lowest CPU to the best gave you marginal performance improvements at the cost of ram restrictions and SMT restrictions.   Assuming Ryzen goes the way we expect over the next 3 years that AM4 is supported, the best CPU you can expect to put on a current motherboard will be marginally better (maybe 30% at best?*) than what we have today,  minus any feature improvements that won't work on today's motherboards**.   When the current best AM4 CPU is  $500-600 that's a substantial upgrade cost considering there are no guarantee's you will get everything out of it.  And that is not too mention that the platform life expectancy is still 1 year short of the 4-5 year average upgrade cycle.   Which means even if you buy right at the start of the platform, for 99% of enthusiasts they are still going  to be upgrading when AM4 is obsolete.

 

TL:DR it doesn't matter if you upgrade a little bit more often or a lot less often, you spend about the same in the end.  The sweet spot for upgrading is GPU every 3-4 years (2 years for hardcore enthusiasts with money) and CPU every 4-6 years (3 years for hardcore enthusiasts with money). 

 

 

*each generation of CPU from both companies has averaged out to a bout 10% improvement from what I can tell. 

** unless you have a crystal ball and know what the future holds, we can only use history as a guide that it will happen.

Upgrade cycles have always been all over the place for me. From: K6-2 500>Celeron 450A>Pentium III 667>Celeron D 2.4GHz>Pentium III 667>Pentium 4 HT 3.2GHz>Core Duo T2600>Core 2 Duo T7600>i5 4440>i7 4790K

[mr moose]

Just now, Dabombinable said:

Upgrade cycles have always been all over the place for me. From: K6-2 500>Celeron 450A>Pentium III 667>Celeron D 2.4GHz>Pentium III 667>Pentium 4 HT 3.2GHz>Core Duo T2600>Core 2 Duo T7600>i5 4440>i7 4790K

I based my numbers on forum polls and news articles.  My personal upgrade cycle is about 7-8 years, but I also personally know one person who upgrades closer to 3 years.

[GDRRiley]

On 10/19/2017 at 8:07 AM, TidaLWaveZ said:

That's my whole beef with the thread title, it's all hypothetical, nothing has been confirmed.

we know that intel had these CPUS working on z270 in testing before it was disabled with microcode.