AMD VEGA official details

[Trixanity]

58 minutes ago, PCGuy_5960 said:

The Nvidia drivers are more feature-rich (Ansel, Shadowplay). Bugs, I never had an issue with Nvidia's drivers. Long terms support, I wouldn't keep a card for more than 3 years, so I don't really care.

AMD has ReLive which is essentially the same as Shadowplay. So that's one feature. Personally I don't care about either. I really doubt these gimmicks sell that many cards. Performance is ultimately what you buy a card for.

 

Anecdotally I've had more issues with Nvidia drivers than AMD drivers. However a quick check around the web tells a different story; both have issues here and there.

 

Edit: forgot to mention you now have to register to use GeForce Experience. Never have I seen something so stupid.

[Jito463]

17 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

Edit: forgot to mention you now have to register to use GeForce Experience. Never have I seen something so stupid.

The moment they started that nonsense, I began uninstalling GFE from the computers I was working on, when we reinstalled Windows.  Requiring an account just to get driver updates?  What an idiotic idea.

[Vode]

1 hour ago, PCGuy_5960 said:

The Nvidia drivers are more feature-rich (Ansel, Shadowplay). Bugs, I never had an issue with Nvidia's drivers. Long terms support, I wouldn't keep a card for more than 3 years, so I don't really care.

AMD has Chill which Nvidia has no equivalent of. Nvidia has Ansel which AMD doesn't have.

 

Both have a Sync technology, both have Multimonitor, both have a recording utility in the driver. AMD has very nice manual control with Wattman, Nvidia has GPU Boost 3.0 (both reflect their company ideology, open vs locked down)

 

There is feature parity pretty much.

 

I think the long term drive support is just a bi product because AMD "ran out of money" ~2011-2012 and needed their one archetecture to last longer. 

[DildorTheDecent]

37 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

Edit: forgot to mention you now have to register to use GeForce Experience. Never have I seen something so stupid.

Well the first issue is recognising the existence of GFE in the first place. 

[DragonTamer1]

3 hours ago, Jito463 said:

The moment they started that nonsense, I began uninstalling GFE from the computers I was working on, when we reinstalled Windows.  Requiring an account just to get driver updates?  What an idiotic idea.

I quickly found that if I renamed a file in the Geforce experience install folder to literally anything other than what it was, it would stop trying to update to 3.0 and you could still have all your features. It would periodically try to fix the file but you just renamed it. Not sure if it still works as I only own one remaining Nvidia card and I don't use GFE with it.

 

Edit: you could also still download drivers from their site directly.

[HelplmChoking]

Vega doesn't really have to compete with the 1080Ti. If it can do 1080 speed at 1070 prices (like what they've done with Ryzen) then it'll work.

[Taf the Ghost]

42 minutes ago, Rangaman42 said:

Vega doesn't really have to compete with the 1080Ti. If it can do 1080 speed at 1070 prices (like what they've done with Ryzen) then it'll work.

VEGA is a brand new architecture for AMD.  It's at least an evolution update of GCN.  So how it scales we just don't know yet.  It's going to be comparative in performance, we'll see how they price it.

 

As for the drivers, Nvidia used to have rock-solid drivers and ATI had the buggy ones.  That changed in the early 2000s.  ATI/AMD's problem has been their Control Panel programs, which always seem a little buggy.  Nvidia's driver quality is the one that took a nose-dive going into the late 2000s.  Both sides have shored up a lot of their problems, but let's not act like they haven't both had significant problems every now and then.

 

As for the side issue that's come up: 1080/Ti drivers on Ryzen have issues.  Like 1080 & 1070 having the exact same performance in some games.  Something is either broken within the Nvidia driver or the 1080's Device ID + Ryzen is simply read completely wrong by some engines when both are present.   AMD's greatest gift with Ryzen is pointing out that some Games/Game Engines were always horribly broken, but they found ways to patch it up to play well on Intel's design. Now we know this, haha.

[YoloSwag]

22 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

No he meant what he said, HBM2.0 - the second revision of HBM ("High bandwidth Memory"). The next generation version of what the Fury and Fury X had.

What the... I read it as HDMI, not HBM wow.

[Blake]

10 hours ago, PCGuy_5960 said:

No they haven't. AMD's launch drivers suck, so it is easy for them to improve performance with driver updates. 

prove it.

12 hours ago, Humbug said:

AMD seems to have has now surpassed Nvidia in driver quality.

prove it.

 

 

 

[PineyCreek]

12 hours ago, Humbug said:

is that your only metric for assessing driver quality? How much performance improves.

You care not about long term stability, features, bugs, long term support etc?

 

My experience on ATI/AMD drivers has always been that the drivers are unstable for me with games.  However, I have not actively used them for a few years, so it's entirely possible they've turned over a new leaf.

[leadeater]

16 minutes ago, PineyCreek said:

My experience on ATI/AMD drivers has always been that the drivers are unstable for me with games.  However, I have not actively used them for a few years, so it's entirely possible they've turned over a new leaf.

I have been using AMD/ATI for a long time now, back in the 9600 & X800 days but also since the 4850. Ever since the 4850 the drivers have been fairly decent, not really had any issues. My 6970 was rock solid and my crossfire 290X's have been more than acceptable, sure there have been issues but those were game issues easily solved with profiles and almost all of those were the same story for SLI.

 

I've also used Nvidia GPUs: 6600GT, 8800GTS, multiple different Quadro/NV cards. Personally I've never really considered either to be better, not in the areas people try and complain about, stability wise etc. People try and imply that AMD drivers causes system breaking issues or catastrophic problems which isn't the case, there is a clear difference between drivers that at release don't deliver the full potential performance and an unstable system. I've lived through the era of unstable systems due to drivers and there is a HUGE difference.

[MoonSpot]

On 3/25/2017 at 9:50 AM, NumLock21 said:

Not to long ago, AMD has held a Tech Summit, in China. During their stay, they talked about VEGA. Here is a 17 minute video about it.

 

 

 

TL:DW?

99% of the content is a repeat. Can't remember if the new information below are repeat or not.

• AMD Vega is launching soon.
• HBM is 5x faster than GDDR5
• VEGA is designed to be scalable architecture
• Mobile VEGA
• Allows VEGA to be implemented into notebooks and other mobile devices. Letting users continue to experience VR and enjoy AAA games.
• AMD VEGA uses HBM2
• AMD RX VEGA will have 2 vram configurations. It will have 4GB HBM2 and 8GB HBM2

Quoting entire OP in an effort(in vain surely) to steer the ship back on course.

 

I've some concerns primarily surrounding the amount of HBM2 VRAM that can be on package.

Firstly there is a degree of a leap of faith required in order to take RTGs demos where they're able to do twice as much with half the VRAM due to HBM2s bandwidth and apply that belief to all games and engines for the next X number of years.

 

Secondly, I've zero faith that the PC gaming community as a whole will attach a greater value to HBM2 then gddr5(x).  I'm certain the Lions share are going to follow the bigger #'s better mantra right off the edge of a cliff it they have to.  Plus, its not like there is any recent and credible coverage of the 4GB Fury X where the HBM on it specifically being examined and scrutinized.

Then even if all the best comes to light and HBM2 is all that and a bag of chips, how's RTG going to convince people?  Even when people are shown proof it takes a long time for them to accept it, especially when they don't intimately understand it.  I mean look at how many YEARS its taken to finally get people to stop debating the worthiness of SSDs over HDDs.  Hell there's probably still people out there saying that people don't "need" to have one, though I've just stopped bothering to look at storage topics/questions b/c I got sick or reiterating the same thing ad nauseum.

 

Though to be honest, Vega is going to be more $ than I'm willing to pay to game, particularly in Canadian ₱esos.  My greatest interest is bigger, better, newer tech sure; But also expanding the adoption of freesync/adaptive sync into everything thats got a screen.  In a perfect world if wishes were horses there wouldn't be another television, monitor or mobile screen pushed out of the factory with out it being integrated.

 

Well, these are my thoughts according to my current level of understanding of the factors at play.

[Marine_Boy]

Well, I have to say that I like what I see about Ryzen lineup so far, both performance and cost wise. I hope that VEGA will deliver at least 1080 comparable performance. We just have to wait I guess  

[cj09beira]

4 hours ago, MoonSpot said:

Quoting entire OP in an effort(in vain surely) to steer the ship back on course.

 

I've some concerns primarily surrounding the amount of HBM2 VRAM that that can be on package.

Firstly there is a degree of a leap of faith required in order to take RTGs demos where they're able to do twice as much with half the VRAM due to HBM2s bandwidth and apply that belief to all games and engines for the next X number of years.

 

Secondly, I've zero faith that PC gaming community as a whole will attach a greater value to HBM2 then gddr5(x).  I'm certain the Lions share are going to follow the bigger #'s better mantra right off the edge of a cliff it they have to.  Plus, its not like there is any recent and credible coverage of the 4GB Fury X where the HBM on it specifically being examined and scrutinized.

Then even if all the best comes to light and HBM2 is all that and a bag of chips, how's RTG going to convince people?  Even when people are shown proof it takes along time for them to accept it, especially when they don't intimately understand it.  I mean look at how many YEARS its taken to finally get people to stop debating the worthiness of SSDs over HDDs.  Hell there's probably still people out there saying that people "need" to have one, and I've just stopped bothering to look at storage topics/questions.

 

Though to be honest, Vega is going to be more $ than I'm willing to pay to game, particularly in Canada ₱esos.  My greatest interest is bigger, better, newer tech sure; But also expanding the adoption of freesync/adaptive sync into everything thats got a screen.  In a perfect world if wishes were horses there wouldn't be another television, monitor or mobile screen pushed out of the factory with out it being integrated.

 

Well, these are my thoughts according to my current level of understanding of the factors at play.

Amd knows it and i think thats why they have double fp16 performance. This card is going to be a beast in Ai we are talking about over 25Tflops of compute power. Amd has had better compute perf than nvida for the price for a long time what they needed was software to back it up which is something they have been are releasing from time to time in this last year. 

[Grinners]

6 hours ago, MoonSpot said:

 

Secondly, I've zero faith that PC gaming community as a whole will attach a greater value to HBM2 then gddr5(x).  I'm certain the Lions share are going to follow the bigger #'s better mantra right off the edge of a cliff it they have to.  Plus, its not like there is any recent and credible coverage of the 4GB Fury X where the HBM on it specifically being examined and scrutinized.

Then even if all the best comes to light and HBM2 is all that and a bag of chips, how's RTG going to convince people?  Even when people are shown proof it takes along time for them to accept it, especially when they don't intimately understand it.  I mean look at how many YEARS its taken to finally get people to stop debating the worthiness of SSDs over HDDs.  Hell there's probably still people out there saying that people "need" to have one, and I've just stopped bothering to look at storage topics/questions.

 

 

I think you underestimate the effect of performance on sales. 

 

If HBM2 outperforms gddr5x in overall fps (on an outright and a per cost basis) then the sales will instantly follow.

 

Numbers talk. 

[Vode]

As someone who has used both Nvidia and AMD GPUs over the last couple years: (6800GT, 8600GT, HD6670, R7 250 (Cape Verde), GTX 750 Ti, GTX 960, RX480, GTX 1070, R9 Fury and now on GTX 1080) 

 

Anecdotally drivers are not particularily unstable for either side. At worst it was less then expected performance for a game at launch. Some things that stick out are some small problems with Nvidia driver uninstalls (resolved by DDU) and AMD Wattman crashing in the first few weeks after launch. Those are some minor issues really.

 

Games crashing only had to do with overclocking and particularily some very optimistic undervolting on my part. Hehe ^^

[TidaLWaveZ]

On 4/23/2017 at 4:43 AM, Prysin said:

silly you, you need the right kind of fuel.

 

fucking A1 JET FUEL

 

#hold my beer

 

 

Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel beams.

[PCGuy_5960]

10 hours ago, Blake said:

prove it.

RX 480 vs 1060 at launch vs now

[Spenser1337]

Any genuine news

[Humbug]

6 hours ago, Marine_Boy said:

I hope that VEGA will deliver at least 1080 comparable performance.

1080 performance is a given...

The question mark is about scaling upto 1080ti and Titan XP performance levels.

 

if they stop at 1080 or slightly higher performance it can still be a good product and sell well. But it will be very underwhelming after all this time.

[Humbug]

delete- double post

[Prysin]

58 minutes ago, TidaLWaveZ said:

Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel beams.

It was an inside job 

[Prysin]

25 minutes ago, Humbug said:

1080 performance is a given...

The question mark is about scaling upto 1080ti and Titan XP performance levels.

 

if they stop at 1080 or slightly higher performance it can still be a good product and sell well. But it will be very underwhelming after all this time.

Vega (pro) will be slightly faster than the 1070. Vega (xt) will be around the 1080, at the very best 10% faster 

[Notional]

10 minutes ago, Prysin said:

Vega (pro) will be slightly faster than the 1070. Vega (xt) will be around the 1080, at the very best 10% faster 

WRONG! Fake news!

[Humbug]

1 hour ago, Prysin said:

Vega (pro) will be slightly faster than the 1070. Vega (xt) will be around the 1080, at the very best 10% faster 

source?