Most Game developers are sexist? Apparently yes.....

[AlexGoesHigh]

Every time shit like this pops up, i like to pull this out.

 

 

*Runs to the woods*

 

 

[19_blackie_73]

16 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

This is what we call anecdotal evidence. And to me, it's worst than citing biased media.

what's wrong with that? I don't want to say that all women are good and cute and all of that things.

I just wanted to state that in my opinion, women would not blend in that good in a dystopic war shooter thingy like men do. Just my personal opinion based on what women i met, not what media taught me about women and feminists and so on.

[CTR640]

What are you mumbling about sexists?? My mr Johnson loves females!

[Sephiroth]

Op idk if you're trolling or serious, but in the off chance you are in fact serious, this might be worth a read to you: http://imgur.com/gallery/gzTILP2

 

Though personally I wouldn't mind if more games simply gave the option to "Create your own character" such as with Fallout or Skyrim etc... because then if you can have whatever type of lead you want.

[Misanthrope]

16 minutes ago, 19_blackie_73 said:

what's wrong with that?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anecdotal_evidence

 

Quote

Misuse of anecdotal evidence is an informal fallacy and is sometimes referred to as the "person who" fallacy ("I know a person who..."; "I know of a case where..." etc. Compare with hasty generalization). Anecdotal evidence is not necessarily representative of a "typical" experience; in fact, human cognitive biases such as confirmation bias mean that exceptional or confirmatory anecdotes are much more likely to be remembered. Accurate determination of whether an anecdote is "typical" requiresstatistical evidence.^[3][4]

 

[Daegun]

Well, I can certainly say that I'd never play twister with her. I'd lose so fast it isn't funny.

 

That and I'd probably be accused of rape. So, yeah....

[techdookie13]

It's simple capitalism. Let's see... who plays video games the most, men or women? I just looked it up and according to Huffintgon Post (very liberal, almost feminazi) more women do. But, I believe there are more men who play video games seriously (more than an hour a day) then women. Especially PC games.

[Derangel]

21 minutes ago, valdyrgramr said:

Also, why don't the people complaining just make or pay to have a game made the way they want it?

Because that would take actual effort and actually being creative and thinking of solutions instead of bitching constantly. They want to the world to mold to them and they don't want to to do any of the work. Everything needs to be handed to them on a gold platter because "they're special".

[MrRavens]

6 minutes ago, Derangel said:

Because that would take actual effort and actually being creative and thinking of solutions instead of bitching constantly. They want to the world to mold to them and they don't want to to do any of the work. Everything needs to be handed to them on a gold platter because "they're special".

That's the thing that bothers me, people will yell, scream and complain, and not actual make moves to change. Complainers bother me so much. Do something about it. Instead of yelling at someone for writing a story the way they wanted, make your own. That's all I'm gonna say, cause I literally just wrote a rant like 3 times now and erased it all and narrowed it down to this lol. *walks away*

[ace_cheaply]

2 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

This is what we call anecdotal evidence. And to me, it's worst than citing biased media.

 

1 hour ago, Misanthrope said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anecdotal_evidence

 

 

When the original claim is that his understanding is "because the media has taught you that women are always polite," and he counters with the fact that it is not from media teaching him, but his own interactions with women over a lifetime, you then can't claim his exerience was anecdotal evidence that doesn't count.  In this case, it is perfectly acceptable to explain how he came about his own views, and it directly refutes the claim made by the other poster. You can't say that his interactions with women haven't shaped his opinion of them, it's ridiculous. 

[Atmos]

Staggering majority of gamers are men.

Staggering majority of games are targeted to men.

 

I see no problems here, only people clutching at straws to defend their god of the cracks ideology, ignoring the REAL injustice and inequality around the world.

[Monte_Carlo]

2 minutes ago, Atmos said:

Staggering majority of gamers are men.

Staggering majority of games are targeted to men.

 

I see no problems here, only people clutching at straws to defend their god of the cracks ideology, ignoring the REAL injustice and inequality around the world.

 

Expect that the majority isn't staggering from what I've heard (or found).  Also saying there is real injustice elsewhere doesn't void out injustice here at home... otherwise you can shut down literally any argument by saying, "Yeah, but North Korea."  I personally wouldn't mind having more variety in video games for playable characters.  Probably one of the bigger things that sold me on Overwatch... besides solid game play that scratches that arcade-y itch. 

[Misanthrope]

11 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

 

When the original claim is that his understanding is "because the media has taught you that women are always polite," and he counters with the fact that it is not from media teaching him, but his own interactions with women over a lifetime, you then can't claim his exerience was anecdotal evidence that doesn't count.  In this case, it is perfectly acceptable to explain how he came about his own views, and it directly refutes the claim made by the other poster. You can't say that his interactions with women haven't shaped his opinion of them, it's ridiculous. 

His own experience is the definition of anecdotal evidence: plenty of rude women everywhere. To make such a claim, you need to do better than "In my experience" for me. I am glad that it's all the same to you, to me you do not directly refute something by talking about your life experiences.

[19_blackie_73]

1 hour ago, Misanthrope said:

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anecdotal_evidence

 

 

so you basically wanna say that every experience that i had can't be taken to argue why I think IN MY OPINION sth is true or not?

[ace_cheaply]

9 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

His own experience is the definition of anecdotal evidence: plenty of rude women everywhere. To make such a claim, you need to do better than "In my experience" for me. I am glad that it's all the same to you, to me you do not directly refute something by talking about your life experiences.

He is claiming that his own opinion is based on his personal experience.  He is not claiming that all women are nicer than all men, or trying to convince others with his opinion. You're the one making the claim that his own experience isn't allowed to influence his opinion, and that it must be media making him think that.  I'm glad you think that people aren't capable of forming their own opinions but, to me, you are allowed to have thoughts based on life experience. 

[Atmos]

2 minutes ago, Monte_Carlo said:

 

Expect that the majority isn't staggering from what I've heard (or found).  Also saying there is real injustice elsewhere doesn't void out injustice here at home... otherwise you can shut down literally any argument by saying, "Yeah, but North Korea."  I personally wouldn't mind having more variety in video games for playable characters.  Probably one of the bigger things that sold me on Overwatch... besides solid game play that scratches that arcade-y itch. 

Right so again. Ideologies claiming that they want equality, actively ignore massive cultural and political injustices and oppression, so they can focus on why more games don't have female leads.

 

The gender of the protagonist doesn't even matter. The more people like this cry about these things, the more they draw attention to a nonproblem, in an attempt to make it a problem. If you're so sheltered that the gender of a fictional character upsets you, then do something about it.

 

Stop typing away on that keyboard, and DO something about it. Get a degree in something not worthless (Gender studies) like software programing, and MAKE A DAMN GAME. Stop demanding other's to fix your problems. Stop demanding other's pony up to you. Do something about it yourself. Want games with more women leads? Get a degree in game development, and make games with women leads.

 

This is as far as I go in this conversation. I'm not going to contribute anymore to any sort of flame war over flawed ideologies.

[KamilKrait15]

Most of us are forgetting that one of the best games to ever be released has a female as the main character........ Tomb Raider... I honestly wish people would stop bitching at something so pathetic.

[Omon_Ra]

2 hours ago, AlexGoesHigh said:

Every time shit like this pops up, i like to pull this out.

-snip-

*Runs to the woods*

 

That brings up an interesting point that relates to a lot of 'under-represented' groups in other forms of media; the one that springs to my mind is the 'white Oscars' and the general 'whiteness' of Hollywood. If you replace most of the leading white, male characters with either a woman or person of minority, their entire 'motivation' will be attributed to the fight against the discrimination towards their minority group. Whether or not that is the director's intention or not, that connection WILL be made; after all, most of film analysis is deeply rooted in post-modern philosophies. For some reason the mere fact a minority is chosen as a role immediately casts them as fighting for that minority group, and not as an individual reacting to the situations presented to them.

 

Look at 'Finding Nemo,' if Nemo was framed as an 'African-American' or female fish; 'You think you can do these things, but you just can't!' would take on an entirely different meaning than the assumption that Nemo is a 'white, male' fish. This whole issue is akin to minorities demanding equality; yet special treatment for being a minority. That isn't equality. Just like someone can't help being born as Asian, African, female, etc, someone can't help being born white and male.

 

*Removing the pic from your post makes it seem almost inappropriate*..

[Belgarathian]

I find this post mostly hilarious - It's their IP, they can do what they want. If they had to conform to society's expectations on every occasion, there would be no creative development and virtually every game would be the same dribble. 

 

We get angry when Blizzard changes Tracer's pose because it ruins creative artistry, but then get angry when they don't put in female protagonists... 

[cesrai]

37 minutes ago, 19_blackie_73 said:

so you basically wanna say that every experience that i had can't be taken to argue why I think IN MY OPINION sth is true or not?

I'm lost. Is Misan... saying that you can't base your opinion on your experiences or is he saying that your experiences don't make your opinions ?   

[Misanthrope]

42 minutes ago, 19_blackie_73 said:

so you basically wanna say that every experience that i had can't be taken to argue why I think IN MY OPINION sth is true or not?

Most of the time yes I am saying that. If you can offer your perspective on your experience that's also based on factual, verifiable evidence and statistics sure. But as the basis of your argument? It would have to be a really stupid argument like "Absolutely all men living on this planet are sexist" in which case the person made the initial argument so badly that anecdotes would suffice. 

[Misanthrope]

6 minutes ago, cesrai said:

I'm lost. Is Misan... saying that you can't base your opinion on your experiences or is he saying that your experiences don't make your opinions ?   

I am saying that you cannot make an argument and claims based soley on your own experiences for the aforementioned reasons above: it's not only statistically meaningless to offer such as a refutation it is also subject to things like observational bias that you might include on your observations completely unintentionally.

[minibois]

1 hour ago, valdyrgramr said:

Also, why don't the people complaining just make or pay to have a game made the way they want it?

Because that would mean they actually have to do some work

[Misanthrope]

2 minutes ago, Minibois said:

Because that would mean they actually have to do some work

In my opinion it goes a bit beyond that: Notice at people who make this argument. It is mainly done by reporters, by University professors in Sociology, Women Studies and other bullshit fields of expertise and last but not least by people that directly make money out of women remaining as victims like Anita and the hundreds of thousands she already made by crowd funding.

 

SJWs, that is career SJWs that actually influence opinion like the aforementioned cases, have little interest in the truth, in facts and evidence. That's why they focus so goddamn much about feelings, micro-aggressions, etc. That's also why their responses are usually immediately dismissive accusations and ad-hominem. Because they literally have careers that are build upon this house of cards and obviously they're gonna be rabid about protecting their little fiefdoms at the expense of your average Tumblr reading, naive college student that eats this stuff up.

[Rune]

If you don't like the game, don't buy it. I'd rather have a voiced protagonist and most companies won't bother voicing both options. (Thanks for that, BioWare)