ada lovelace NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 and 4060 Ti get first rumored performance claims, fast but also power hungry

[Montana One-Six]

15 hours ago, AnonymousGuy said:

I'm over here not giving a shit.  Y'all acting like your desktop runs on a laptop battery.... wah wah wah 50 extra watts wah wah.

 

Plus it's just leaks. I mean the 4080 leaks were/are all over the place with anything between 800W and 300W being reported. Who knows when they are going to release and what happens until then.

 

But I guess that's just the internet, where people get mad over literally nothing. I mean why get so invested in something that someone could have just made up. Just save yourself the time and wait for actual information or confirmation before any of that.

[Deadpool2onBlu-Ray]

On 8/27/2022 at 8:07 PM, BiG StroOnZ said:

Summary

The rumors come from @QbitLeaks, who is supposedly sharing RTX 40 “Lovelace” specs and performance claims over his Twitter. According to the leaker, the RTX 4060 non-Ti gets around 6000 points in 3DMark Time Extreme, and in the same test the RTX 4060 Ti reaches 8600 point score.

 

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

While this leak is being featured by more well-known sources like Videocardz and @harukaze5719, take these claims with a grain of salt as this particular leaker does not have the track record as some others, like @kopite7kimi. With that out of the way, it seems that the RTX 4060 is 47% faster than the RTX 3060. While the RTX 4060 Ti is also about 47% faster than the RTX 3060 Ti. The 4060 is about as fast as a 3070 and the 4060 Ti is about as fast as a 3080. This looks like a sizeable improvement, but man is the power draw getting out of hand. I also think these numbers are interesting because while compared to previous gen the increase in performance looks adequate. But in the not too distant past the x60 series were usually able to match the previous gens x80 series. While here the 4060 is only matching a 3070. Taking a deeper dive, though it seems with Turing to Ampere that holds true; the 3060 matched a 2070 and the 3060 Ti matched a 2080 Super, while being slightly faster than a 2080. These specs and performance numbers will most likely change (as we've seen with the 4070/4080/4090 engineering boards), since this card is not launching until Q1 2023 at the very least. So I look forward to seeing more developments on these particular cards.

 

Sources

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-4060-ti-rtx-4060-get-first-rumored-performance-claims

Meh. The 4080 looks to be the most impressive one this gen

[BiG StroOnZ]

6 hours ago, CHICKSLAYA said:

Meh. The 4080 looks to be the most impressive one this gen

 

4070 looks good too, according to some other rumors it can match a 3090 Ti. What we need confirmation is whether or not there's a 4070 Ti. This is because apparently there are two different specifications for the 4070. Now whether this means that NVIDIA has not finalized the specs for the 4070 or whether it means there is a Ti SKU is still not clear. I'm sure there will be a Ti SKU but how soon it will be launched is the real question.

 

Nevertheless, it's scoring between a 10,000-11,000 in Time Spy Extreme. Matching a 3090 to 3090 Ti basically. If priced appropriately it could make for a good offering. Another question is if the 11,000 point score is from the Ti variant and if the 10,000 point score is from the non-Ti (or as mentioned before they are simply 4070 specs that are not finalized): 

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/leaker-claims-two-geforce-rtx-4070-specifications-are-now-being-considered

[StDragon]

Transients are only going to get worse with these newer GPUs (from both Nvidia and AMD) as they demand more power.

Whatever PSU wattage they recommend, plan on doubling that so as to not trip OCP; and that's with a quality PSU.

[Ydfhlx]

This leak doesn't mean much alone, in my opinion. Pricing of specific models will matter a lot. So what if 4060 will be more powerful than 3060, when it probably also will be more expensive. Now obviously this is just speculation, but Nvidia has a record of increasing prices.

 

Names are just names. Nvidia might try to sell us what would otherwise be a 4060ti as a 4060 to claim substantial performance increase, while blaming inflation for the price increase.

[StDragon]

7 hours ago, Ydfhlx said:

Pricing of specific models will matter a lot. So what if 4060 will be more powerful than 3060, when it probably also will be more expensive. Now obviously this is just speculation, but Nvidia has a record of increasing prices.

The actual pricing could be way lower than MSRP upon initial launch if it's having to compete against a glut of used 30 series GPUs and lower than expected desktop sales (market saturation from the prior pandemic).

[TheSaltyBaron]

GTX 1080 still holding on loyally, Although it's getting awfully tempting to upgrade

[Gamer Schnitzel]

I already have a 3080 but I will be upgrading to a 4070 just so my electricity usage does not go up even more, though I am hoping that AMD has competitive cards this time around that use less electricity.

[Gamer Schnitzel]

3 hours ago, TheSaltyBaron said:

GTX 1080 still holding on loyally, Although it's getting awfully tempting to upgrade

If you have a 1080 right now I would wait until the 5000 series. I bet you don't even play demanding games on a daily basis and you're just craving an upgrade out of boredom. I have a feeling they will be putting a lot of effort into improving the efficiency in the 5000 line-up and then you'll be pretty annoyed if you bought a 40 series card.

[Error 52]

I don't know how it looks in the rest of the world, but right now, in the UK, electricity bills are absolutely soaring in prices. It's become a genuine crisis. Hell, my brother, who has an obsession with having the most overpowered, big-dick gaming hardware out there, actually swapped his 3090 out for my old 1060 just because his 3090 was actually starting to having a tangible effect on his electricity bills.

 

If AMD can get their efficiency under control - and if the Ryzen 7000 announcement is anything to go by, they very well might - they might finally have a proper attack vector on Nvidia.

 

 

[TOMPPIX]

I swear to fucking god, just like rich ppl just keep getting richer so does the high end GPUs also. Those are apparently the only ones getting a big upgrade.

[porina]

11 hours ago, Error 52 said:

I don't know how it looks in the rest of the world, but right now, in the UK, electricity bills are absolutely soaring in prices. It's become a genuine crisis. Hell, my brother, who has an obsession with having the most overpowered, big-dick gaming hardware out there, actually swapped his 3090 out for my old 1060 just because his 3090 was actually starting to having a tangible effect on his electricity bills.

Suggestion: keep the 3090 in but use Afterburner or similar and lower the power limit as far as it'll go. Power efficiency generally improves at lower power limit. I don't know how low a 3090 can go but my 3070 can go to 41%. So that goes down from 220W to 90W. If the 3090 has the same limit that would be down from 350W to 144W, still a bit above a 1060 6GB's 120W but closer, and likely perform a lot better still. And you don't have to go all the way and can balance perf and power that way.

[Rauten]

25 minutes ago, porina said:

my 3070 can go to 41%. So that goes down from 220W to 90W.

Oohh! I'm curious, about how much performance does your 3070 keep with such "low" power draw?

[porina]

7 minutes ago, Rauten said:

Oohh! I'm curious, about how much performance does your 3070 keep with such "low" power draw?

Good question. I never actually tested it for gaming. I've only ever done that for compute uses a while ago, and don't know where my notes are. Debating running a few benchmarks later, but that'll go in another thread. I'll let you know if I do.

[yolosnail]

16 hours ago, Error 52 said:

I don't know how it looks in the rest of the world, but right now, in the UK, electricity bills are absolutely soaring in prices. It's become a genuine crisis. Hell, my brother, who has an obsession with having the most overpowered, big-dick gaming hardware out there, actually swapped his 3090 out for my old 1060 just because his 3090 was actually starting to having a tangible effect on his electricity bills.

 

If AMD can get their efficiency under control - and if the Ryzen 7000 announcement is anything to go by, they very well might - they might finally have a proper attack vector on Nvidia.

 

 

At the October rates, an 8 hour gaming session for a 3090 (minus other components) would be around £1.70!

 

For a full system, it's looking like it's going to be about £0.40 per hour of gaming, which might not sound a lot, but it sure does add up considering a few months back it would have only cost £0.09

[CTR640]

21 hours ago, Error 52 said:

I don't know how it looks in the rest of the world, but right now, in the UK, electricity bills are absolutely soaring in prices. It's become a genuine crisis. Hell, my brother, who has an obsession with having the most overpowered, big-dick gaming hardware out there, actually swapped his 3090 out for my old 1060 just because his 3090 was actually starting to having a tangible effect on his electricity bills.

 

If AMD can get their efficiency under control - and if the Ryzen 7000 announcement is anything to go by, they very well might - they might finally have a proper attack vector on Nvidia.

 

 

Here in the Netherlands, we used to pay €186 a month the last year from September and now this month....€457!!!!

I guess it's safe to say nVidia (and AMD) can simply fuck off and shove their GPU's deeply and madly up their asses by using excessive and invasive force?

[porina]

9 hours ago, Rauten said:

Oohh! I'm curious, about how much performance does your 3070 keep with such "low" power draw?

Ok, my 3070 is factory OC so it takes a bit more power than nominal. Internet went out for a bit so I ran one game before I lost interest. I forgot how much time benching can take! Bigger testing is not happening any time soon (think weeks, if not longer).

 

Watchgdogs Legion, 4k Very High, V-Sync off, no RT.

 

100% power limit, 239W peak, 54 fps average

69% power limit, 168W peak, 49 fps average

41% power limit, 101W peak, 38 fps average

 

So relative to the 100% condition:

At 69% power limit, it took 70% the power for 91% of the performance. 71W power saving.

At 41% power limit, it took 42% the power for 70% of the performance. 138W power saving.

 

Someone more motivated might also measure system power as a whole, since if there are fewer frames being drawn, there may be some reduction in CPU power needed also although many parts of system power usage may not scale at all.

 

Also note the GPU reported powers are after PSU losses, so if you factor in PSU efficiency the reduction at the wall will be a bit greater.

 

Note I observed peak power reported. Average was perhaps 2% down from that.

[StDragon]

7 hours ago, porina said:

Ok, my 3070 is factory OC so it takes a bit more power than nominal. Internet went out for a bit so I ran one game before I lost interest. I forgot how much time benching can take! Bigger testing is not happening any time soon (think weeks, if not longer).

 

Watchgdogs Legion, 4k Very High, V-Sync off, no RT.

 

100% power limit, 239W peak, 54 fps average

69% power limit, 168W peak, 49 fps average

41% power limit, 101W peak, 38 fps average

 

So relative to the 100% condition:

At 69% power limit, it took 70% the power for 91% of the performance. 71W power saving.

At 41% power limit, it took 42% the power for 70% of the performance. 138W power saving.

I'm surprised the GPU didn't crash from being starved when a transient load is required. Apparently it's good enough to hold it together and drop performance instead.

Enabling V-Sync or limit FPS to 60 would help too.

FYI, OPEC announced reduction in energy output due to falling prices. Yet, falling energy costs is exactly what the world needs now. It will be real interesting to see how this effects the GPU market. Normally that's a calculus Crypto miners and cloud providers factor in. I wonder if the Steam stats will reflect a reduction in gaming hours spent over the next 12 months, and by nation.

[igormp]

22 minutes ago, StDragon said:

I'm surprised the GPU didn't crash from being starved when a transient load is required. Apparently it's good enough to hold it together and drop performance instead.

The GPU is limiting itself, so it those transient spikes won't happen. A crash would only occur if it tried to draw current and the source (the PSU in this case) couldn't deliver that, causing a drop in voltage and thus a brownout.

 

Anyhow, pugetsystems did a similar test with 3090s here: https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/hpc/Quad-RTX3090-GPU-Wattage-Limited-MaxQ-TensorFlow-Performance-1974/

 

 

I'd personally run a 3090 limited at 250W happily.

[Rauten]

11 hours ago, porina said:

<snip>

Thou art a lovely human being. Thank you very much!

[Zodiark1593]

On 9/5/2022 at 7:38 PM, StDragon said:

I'm surprised the GPU didn't crash from being starved when a transient load is reqI wonder if the Steam stats will reflect a reduction in gaming hours spent over the next 12 months, and by nation.

Maybe we could see a upswing in igpu-friendly, indie titles? It is nice to have your gaming fun entirely under 30 watts. 

[Gamer Schnitzel]

On 9/5/2022 at 9:39 AM, TOMPPIX said:

I swear to fucking god, just like rich ppl just keep getting richer so does the high end GPUs also. Those are apparently the only ones getting a big upgrade.

Where do you think their money comes from? Rich people are shareholders and shareholders get paid by all of those companies that are increasing their prices. The reason for price increases is never ever an "increase" in material cost which is what they always say. While it is correct sometimes the cost of a component goes up companies receive price cuts and better deals year after year but they don't pass those savings on to customers but instead to higher profit margins. Shareholders and rich people want to be richer ever year even though right now the top 10% richest people already own 90% of the money. This is only going to be more extreme. The only reason why prices are increased is because those companies need to continue making profit and promise shareholders high returns or they pull their investments out and go to an industry that is not impacted by current affairs. Soon enough the top 10% will own 99% of the money in the world and we will all be living in paper houses. I'm pretty sure we are going to see very violent civil wars during our life time because this cannot keep going this way and people already now are extremely unhappy with life.

[StDragon]

4 hours ago, Gamer Schnitzel said:

Shareholders and rich people want to be richer ever year even though right now the top 10% richest people already own 90% of the money. This is only going to be more extreme. The only reason why prices are increased is because those companies need to continue making profit and promise shareholders high returns or they pull their investments out and go to an industry that is not impacted by current affairs. Soon enough the top 10% will own 99% of the money in the world and we will all be living in paper houses. 

This is cyclical. The value of wealth is backed up by labor; econ 101 stuff. So what happens when you have a concentration is a misallocation of resources and thus the entire system either corrects in the marketplace, or collapses catastrophically. The crypto boom and bust cycles are a perfect example. Ditto for when wealth doesn't move from Wall Street to Main Street.

[StDragon]

3 minutes ago, Dean0919 said:

Okay, so when are we going to see those cards on market? (Approximately)

Difficult to say for sure. There's what Nvidia is planning, and then there's the reality of absolute chaos that is supply chain and logistical issues.

[Ydfhlx]

On 9/4/2022 at 12:23 AM, StDragon said:

The actual pricing could be way lower than MSRP upon initial launch if it's having to compete against a glut of used 30 series GPUs and lower than expected desktop sales (market saturation from the prior pandemic).

MSRP is just a made up number with next to no relation to actual pricing nowadays. 3080 10GB doesn't even have a MSRP at all...