Seasonic confirms Nvidia 12-pin connector

[Mateyyy]

22 minutes ago, Ankerson said:

Say it's pulling 500W from the wall in gaming

Yeah, because all gaming systems out there pull 500W of power while gaming lol

14 minutes ago, Ankerson said:

But to get a 550W PSU than then have to buy another 2 years later,

Huh?

[Ankerson]

1 minute ago, Mateyyy said:

Yeah, because all gaming systems out there pull 500W of power while gaming lol

Huh?

 

It's called take into count what you have...

 

Some do pull 500W and more gaming from the wall.... That's not accounting for power spikes either...

[LukeSavenije]

44 minutes ago, Kisai said:

snip

 

35 minutes ago, Kisai said:

snip

spoiler: they don't. they use undisclosed numbers that have no logic whatsoever, factor in cap degration (which is bs for multiple reasons), while if you look at Tomshardware here for example shown by @Mateyyy, they currently use Cybenetics' Powenetics system, a high-precision measurement system based off 10 current sensors made together with tinkerforge. this is an actually discolosed and realisticly tested scenario and is way ahead of the literal number generator that something like Outervision and alike have shown to be.

 

two, this connector CAN'T supply 400w this way, so that's the second part of the BS here. Molex Micro Fit or PCIe power has a rating of 75w for 6 pin, 150w for 8 pin. this means with a 2x8 pin converter, you can supply up to 300w through this, together with up to 75w through the pcie slot. this means the maximum power consumption will be 375w peak. taking this number and grabbing a xeon 3175x on an industrial chiller, you indeed come around 1000w under a combined stress load like furmark+prime95 (a position you won't reach in realistic use in the first place). but realistically seen here, most people will combine the next gen with one of the following CPUs as a baseline here

• 10600k: ~170w
• 9900k/10700k: ~250w 
• 3900x: ~140w
• 3950x: ~150w

add a realistic load of 300w for the GPU here, the worst case CPU in the 9900k/10700k with 250w on a 5ghz overclock, with the ram, storage and a small margin of error with another 50w added to the calculation, whill bring you a total of... 600w under extreme loads assuming you have a very high end system, realistically you would be totally fine with a 750w under the most extreme conditions

 

saying people need to grab more wattage will just bring them earlier on the efficiency curve, which doesn't exactly result in good efficiency either. and then I'm not even talking yet that the graph you're showing seems to be according to 80+, which is literally 3-4 loads measured, while most reviewers go per 10% with loads. 

 

and people that invest into a PSU for a system like this will instead of choosing a worse 1000w go for a good 650-750w depending on how the GPU numbers come out to be, and be happy with it

 

now, prove me that wrong, go ahead

[Ankerson]

4 minutes ago, LukeSavenije said:

 

spoiler: they don't. they use undisclosed numbers that have no logic whatsoever, factor in cap degration (which is bs for multiple reasons), while if you look at Tomshardware here for example shown by @Mateyyy, they currently use Cybenetics' Powenetics system, a high-precision measurement system based off 10 current sensors made together with tinkerforge. this is an actually discolosed and realisticly tested scenario and is way ahead of the literal number generator that something like Outervision and alike have shown to be.

 

two, this connector CAN'T supply 400w this way, so that's the second part of the BS here. Molex Micro Fit or PCIe power has a rating of 75w for 6 pin, 150w for 8 pin. this means with a 2x8 pin converter, you can supply up to 300w through this, together with up to 75w through the pcie slot. this means the maximum power consumption will be 375w peak. taking this number and grabbing a xeon 3175x on an industrial chiller, you indeed come around 1000w under a combined stress load like furmark+prime95 (a position you won't reach in realistic use in the first place). but realistically seen here, most people will combine the next gen with one of the following CPUs as a baseline here

• 10600k: ~170w
• 9900k/10700k: ~250w 
• 3900x: ~140w
• 3950x: ~150w

add a realistic load of 300w for the GPU here, the worst case CPU in the 9900k/10700k with 250w on a 5ghz overclock, with the ram, storage and a small margin of error with another 50w added to the calculation, whill bring you a total of... 600w under extreme loads assuming you have a very high end system, realistically you would be totally fine with a 750w under the most extreme conditions

 

saying people need to grab more wattage will just bring them earlier on the efficiency curve, which doesn't exactly result in good efficiency either. and then I'm not even talking yet that the graph you're showing seems to be according to 80+, which is literally 3-4 loads measured, while most reviewers go per 10% with loads. 

 

and people that invest into a PSU for a system like this will instead of choosing a worse 1000w go for a good 650-750w depending on how the GPU numbers come out to be, and be happy with it

 

now, prove me that wrong, go ahead

 

 

Yes, exactly...

 

My issue is with those that would recommend a 600W PSU.... and we see that a lot, and I mean a lot, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much.....

 

The 750W would be the smart option.

 

 

[Kisai]

19 minutes ago, Ankerson said:

 

And with the LONG warranties these days of 10 or more years that has to be taken into consideration too.

 

Better to buy a littlie larger than not.... Say 650W with the 30%, but get a 750W or 850W so you won't have to buy another PSU in 5 or 6 years or in 10 years... Not overboard at all still..... Still reasonable...

 

But to get a 550W PSU than then have to buy another 2 years later, then another on top of that maybe in another 2 or 3 years is just stupid... That's what some are actually pushing here..... That's absolutely idiotic when you think about it.

 

I am not saying go out and get a 1200W PSU...

I'm still using the 750w Seasonic PSU from 2007 or so. It's served me fine from a P35 system to present and is one of only two remaining parts from that build. If it fits in the chassis, then it's reasonable to use. Quite honestly I don't see why anyone would want to use any PSU less than 850w unless they're building a system without a GPU.

 

[Haro]

10 hours ago, Kisai said:

Quite honestly I don't see why anyone would want to use any PSU less than 850w unless they're building a system without a GPU.

 @LukeSavenije and @Mateyyy clearly showed you that you simply don't, wattage is not quality and it never was, and saying that you need "headroom" when choosing a psu is kind of meaningless, a psu is suppose to supply it's advertised wattage. and can you prove to me why i need an 850w unit with a system that has a dgpu? 

so do i need an 850w unit (regardless of quality) to run a 3100 and a 1650 super?  this makes literally no sense.

 

 

10 hours ago, Kisai said:

I'm still using the 750w Seasonic PSU from 2007 or so.

that doesn't mean you should lol..

[Ankerson]

19 minutes ago, Kisai said:

I'm still using the 750w Seasonic PSU from 2007 or so. It's served me fine from a P35 system to present and is one of only two remaining parts from that build. If it fits in the chassis, then it's reasonable to use. Quite honestly I don't see why anyone would want to use any PSU less than 850w unless they're building a system without a GPU.

 

 

I would think about replacing it due to age.... It is 13 years old, just because it runs doesn't mean it's operating within specs and not slowly killing your machine.

 

Just saying....

 

That said....

 

If a machine is only pulling 200W then 850W isn't needed or even close to that...

 

A 550W PSU would be more reasonable given long warranties and future upgrades etc.....

 

That's all I was getting at here in the end, think about what they have and then think about down the road, future upgrades, new builds etc.

 

If people are only thinking about right now then they are making a mistake and one that will cost them money in the long run. And money they wouldn't have had to spend if they thought ahead etc. If they buy the bare min they need right now with little or no headroom they will need to buy another PSU when they upgrade. And if they keep doing it they could end up buying 3 or more PSUs instead of one in say a 10 year period.

[Kisai]

19 minutes ago, TofuHaroto said:

 @LukeSavenije and @Mateyyy clearly showed you that you simply don't, wattage is not quality and it never was, and saying that you need "headroom" when choosing a psu is kind of meaningless, a psu is suppose to supply it's advertised wattage. and can you prove to me why i need an 850w unit with a system that has a dgpu? 

so do i need an 850w unit (regardless of quality) to run a 3100 and a 1650 super?  this makes literally no sense.

 

 

that doesn't mean you should lol..

This feels like one of those arguments where you're not listening and just berating the poster because they don't agree with you.

 

Point 1:

Regardless of the marketing, a PSU is a PSU and there is not a significant difference between brands, let alone models from the same brand, at least not enough to care. You know why I have that Seasonic? Because the Enermax Liberty 620w PSU "rated the best" I bought for that build the year before, died and took half the parts with it. Which means the only thing to care about is the wattage. Basically I bought the 750w Seasonic PSU because the guy at the NCIX store suggested it. I didn't question it. 

 

Point 2: If you're a typical desktop user who upgrades parts piecemeal, you will never know what you might upgrade in the future, and given the penchant for CPU's and GPU's to go UPwards, buying something smaller only means you end up having to buy another PSU later. Buy the biggest thing you can fit at the time of the build and hope that will be good enough for everything.

 

Point 3: With the exception of ATX12vo, there has been zero innovation in PSU's that justify replacing one of one wattage with another of the same wattage.

 

Of all the dead and dying PSU's I've encountered with other peoples systems, the ways they die is completely unpredictable, and in at least my case, it wrecked everything, even being on a UPS. One PSU even died after replacing the fan. PSU's for external devices I have even worse luck with. Suffice it to say I'd rather buy more than I need based on the PSU vendor's marketing than try to minmax a PSU to spite them. The PSU is definitely not the part you want to be a cheapskate on.

[Ankerson]

20 minutes ago, Kisai said:

This feels like one of those arguments where you're not listening and just berating the poster because they don't agree with you.

 

Point 1:

Regardless of the marketing, a PSU is a PSU and there is not a significant difference between brands, let alone models from the same brand, at least not enough to care. You know why I have that Seasonic? Because the Enermax Liberty 620w PSU "rated the best" I bought for that build the year before, died and took half the parts with it. Which means the only thing to care about is the wattage. Basically I bought the 750w Seasonic PSU because the guy at the NCIX store suggested it. I didn't question it. 

 

Point 2: If you're a typical desktop user who upgrades parts piecemeal, you will never know what you might upgrade in the future, and given the penchant for CPU's and GPU's to go UPwards, buying something smaller only means you end up having to buy another PSU later. Buy the biggest thing you can fit at the time of the build and hope that will be good enough for everything.

 

Point 3: With the exception of ATX12vo, there has been zero innovation in PSU's that justify replacing one of one wattage with another of the same wattage.

 

Of all the dead and dying PSU's I've encountered with other peoples systems, the ways they die is completely unpredictable, and in at least my case, it wrecked everything, even being on a UPS. One PSU even died after replacing the fan. PSU's for external devices I have even worse luck with. Suffice it to say I'd rather buy more than I need based on the PSU vendor's marketing than try to minmax a PSU to spite them. The PSU is definitely not the part you want to be a cheapskate on.

 

 

There is and can be a very large difference in the quality of PSUs, even those from the same makers.

 

I also had a few Liberties and yes they sucked..... Took out a few GPUs and Motherboards...

 

So I also went with Seasonic after that.

 

Having been in the PC industry myself over the decades I saw a lot of bad thing happen.

 

It's normally best to get one the Companies better quality units, especially now as there is even more of difference as time goes on or so it seems.

 

I do have a Corsair HX 850W Platinum coming currently...

 

Will be using my current Seasonic Prime Ti 750 in another system to replace the older Seasonic X 650W and using the HX 850 in my current one. Got Corsairs Pro Cable kit to go with it also, better options than the ones that come with it.

 

 

 

 

[Kisai]

7 minutes ago, Ankerson said:

 

 

There is and can be a very large difference in the quality of PSUs, even those from the same makers.

I'm not disputing that. Just saying, that if I need a new PSU "now" I'm not going to shop around. When I upgraded to the Geforce GTX 1080 I had to replace the chassis, and I bought the first thing NCIX had, there (shortly before they went bankrupt.)  I'm probably going to have to replace the chassis again if I wanted the 3090 for some reason, or GPU's all start being taller than longer.

 

 

Quote

I also had a few Liberties and yes they sucked..... Took out a few GPUs and Motherboards...

A few? How many did you have to learn that lesson?

Quote

So I also went with Seasonic after that.

 

Having been in the PC industry myself over the decades I saw a lot of bad thing happen.

 

It's normally best to get one the Companies better quality units, especially now as there is even more of difference as time goes on or so it seems.

 

I do have a Corsair HX 850W coming currently...

 

Will be using my current Seasonic Prime in another system and using the HX 850 in my current one.

When I decide to upgrade to a Intel 12th gen or a Ryzen 4xxx , I'm probably going to buy a new PSU, but I have no reason to buy one now.

 

[Ankerson]

13 minutes ago, Kisai said:

I'm not disputing that. Just saying, that if I need a new PSU "now" I'm not going to shop around. When I upgraded to the Geforce GTX 1080 I had to replace the chassis, and that was the thing NCIX had, there (shortly before they went bankrupt.)  I'm probably going to have to replace the chassis again if I wanted the 3090 for some reason, or GPU's all start being taller than longer.

 

 

A few? How many did you have to learn that lesson?

When I decide to upgrade to a Intel 12th gen or a Ryzen 4xxx , I'm probably going to buy a new PSU, but I have no reason to buy one now.

 

 

 

Built two systems at the same time, why I had 2 of them.... Yeah they sucked....

 

Just the age of your PSU alone is more than reason enough to replace it. PSU's don't get better with age, and yours is way out of it's warranty by a very long time now.

 

Likely would be a horror story if you had it actually tested... I am sure it's slowing killing your parts now..... I would bet money on it.....  Just because it powers on doesn't mean it's working correctly.

[CarlBar]

1 hour ago, LukeSavenije said:

 

spoiler: they don't. they use undisclosed numbers that have no logic whatsoever, factor in cap degration (which is bs for multiple reasons), while if you look at Tomshardware here for example shown by @Mateyyy, they currently use Cybenetics' Powenetics system, a high-precision measurement system based off 10 current sensors made together with tinkerforge. this is an actually discolosed and realisticly tested scenario and is way ahead of the literal number generator that something like Outervision and alike have shown to be.

 

two, this connector CAN'T supply 400w this way, so that's the second part of the BS here. Molex Micro Fit or PCIe power has a rating of 75w for 6 pin, 150w for 8 pin. this means with a 2x8 pin converter, you can supply up to 300w through this, together with up to 75w through the pcie slot. this means the maximum power consumption will be 375w peak. taking this number and grabbing a xeon 3175x on an industrial chiller, you indeed come around 1000w under a combined stress load like furmark+prime95 (a position you won't reach in realistic use in the first place). but realistically seen here, most people will combine the next gen with one of the following CPUs as a baseline here

• 10600k: ~170w
• 9900k/10700k: ~250w 
• 3900x: ~140w
• 3950x: ~150w

add a realistic load of 300w for the GPU here, the worst case CPU in the 9900k/10700k with 250w on a 5ghz overclock, with the ram, storage and a small margin of error with another 50w added to the calculation, whill bring you a total of... 600w under extreme loads assuming you have a very high end system, realistically you would be totally fine with a 750w under the most extreme conditions

 

saying people need to grab more wattage will just bring them earlier on the efficiency curve, which doesn't exactly result in good efficiency either. and then I'm not even talking yet that the graph you're showing seems to be according to 80+, which is literally 3-4 loads measured, while most reviewers go per 10% with loads. 

 

and people that invest into a PSU for a system like this will instead of choosing a worse 1000w go for a good 650-750w depending on how the GPU numbers come out to be, and be happy with it

 

now, prove me that wrong, go ahead

 

As was pointed out to me the 8 pins on the PSU end are typically supplying two 8 pins on the other end each under current setups, so this cable is able to deliver 3x8 pin equivalent.

[Kisai]

9 minutes ago, Ankerson said:

 

 

Built two systems at the same time, why I had 2 of them.... Yeah they sucked....

 

Just the age of your PSU alone is more than reason enough to replace it. PSU's don't get better with age, and yours is way out of it's warranty by a very long time now.

 

Likely would be a horror story if you had it actually tested...

I went and looked up the part number

 

M12D SS-750EM Active PFC F3

 

https://www.hardwaresecrets.com/seasonic-m12d-750-w-power-supply-review/3/

Quote

As we have mentioned in other articles and reviews, the first place we look when opening a power supply for a hint about its quality, is its filtering stage. The recommended components for this stage are two ferrite coils, two ceramic capacitors (Y capacitors, usually blue), one metalized polyester capacitor (X capacitor), and one MOV (Metal-Oxide Varistor). Very low-end power supplies use fewer components, usually removing the MOV and the first coil.

 

On this power supply this stage is flawless. It has two extra ferrite coils, one extra X capacitor and two extra Y capacitors.

 

One thing that we noticed here was that the active PFC circuit had actually two circuits working in parallel (see the two coils in Figure 8), and this was the first power supply we’ve seen using such design. 

This, actually sounds over-engineered.

Quote

Not only this design proved to be superior, but Seasonic decided to use only high-end components inside this unit, which features only Japanese capacitors and solid caps on the DC-DC converter in charge of the + 5 V and +3.3 V outputs.

*shrug*

 

[Ankerson]

16 minutes ago, Kisai said:

I went and looked up the part number

 

M12D SS-750EM Active PFC F3

 

https://www.hardwaresecrets.com/seasonic-m12d-750-w-power-supply-review/3/

This, actually sounds over-engineered.

*shrug*

 

 

5 year warranty..... So it's 8 years out of warranty.

 

Should have been replaced after 7 years or so.....

 

I don't care how good they are when new, they degrade over time, they all do....

 

That PSU is nowhere near as in not even remotely close to what it was when new..... I would bet that PSU wouldn't do more than 600W on a good day now..... And that's being kind..... Not even getting into the ripple and other issues of it degrading over time.... And if the protections actually still work... It could blow today and take your whole machine out..... It is possible....

[Derangel]

12 minutes ago, Kisai said:

This feels like one of those arguments where you're not listening and just berating the poster because they don't agree with you.

 

Point 1:

Regardless of the marketing, a PSU is a PSU and there is not a significant difference between brands, let alone models from the same brand, at least not enough to care. You know why I have that Seasonic? Because the Enermax Liberty 620w PSU "rated the best" I bought for that build the year before, died and took half the parts with it. Which means the only thing to care about is the wattage. Basically I bought the 750w Seasonic PSU because the guy at the NCIX store suggested it. I didn't question it. 

 

Point 2: If you're a typical desktop user who upgrades parts piecemeal, you will never know what you might upgrade in the future, and given the penchant for CPU's and GPU's to go UPwards, buying something smaller only means you end up having to buy another PSU later. Buy the biggest thing you can fit at the time of the build and hope that will be good enough for everything.

 

Point 3: With the exception of ATX12vo, there has been zero innovation in PSU's that justify replacing one of one wattage with another of the same wattage.

 

Of all the dead and dying PSU's I've encountered with other peoples systems, the ways they die is completely unpredictable, and in at least my case, it wrecked everything, even being on a UPS. One PSU even died after replacing the fan. PSU's for external devices I have even worse luck with. Suffice it to say I'd rather buy more than I need based on the PSU vendor's marketing than try to minmax a PSU to spite them. The PSU is definitely not the part you want to be a cheapskate on.

 

Saying there is no significant difference between brands is utter nonsense. A PSU made by Deer and one made by Superflower will be wildly different in terms of quality, even if they claim to have the same specs. You seem to only be paying attention to the name slapped on the label and not the OEM nor the quality of the internal parts. Outside of the handful of OEMs that also sell direct to consumer (Seasonic, Superflower, and a couple others) every single PSU on the market is from an OEM and every single OEM-dependent brand using different OEMS depending on the price, power, and market segment they are targeting.

 

While you shouldn’t cheap out on a power supply, there is also no need to overspend. There is a wide gap between cheap crap and overkill. You should actually research a PSU before buying it. Look for info on who actually made it, look for comprehensive reviews, look at user failure reports, etc.

 

In general, there really hasn’t been a major increase in power requirements in the mainstream space over the past five years. There are some obvious exceptions, but even in those cases it’s really only been minimal increases that tend to be balanced out by other things getting more efficient or through the replacement of legacy power hungry devices. It isn’t until you reach into the high-end and pro-sumer markets where you see some notable jumps, but even that isn’t as extreme as it was in the past. Intel CPUs and AMD GPUs are a bit of an exception, but given the current state of the market both of those are fairly irrelevant in the high-end space right now. Zen has made huge gains in efficiency and power efficiency has been something Nvidia has touted since Kepler. With various governments around the world cracking down on electronics with high power usage, there has been an industry wide push for improving power usage.

 

Barring issues due to component degradation, someone could have bought a 700-750w PSU five years ago to power a high-end system and still use that same PSU today to power a system running an overclocked 1090k and overclocked 2080 ti, and the 10900K when overclocked uses more power than most/all of AMD’s HEDT lineup. Outside of the 3090 monstrosity, that same PSU could probably handle high-end consumer grade systems for another 2-3 hardware generations. Five years ago that PSU would likely have been considered ideal for a high end system. We’ll see where the rest of the consumer Ampere lineup lands, but right now it seems like the 3090 is an exception to the general industry trends instead of the rule.

 

If my 1000w PSU wasn’t starting to get flakey it could probably handle the high end hardware I throw it until the capacitors reached the end of their natural life cycle without breaking a sweat. There are certainly scenarios where you would really want and need a huge PSU, but they generally aren’t gaming systems running consumer-grade hardware. Even high-end variants of that hardware.

[Guest]

7 hours ago, VeganJoy said:

i sure am glad i got some used seasonics that didnt have cables, got em super cheap and ebay has big ass baggies of official seasonic cables for 30 bucks. 4x pcie, 2x eps, bunch of satas. for the 3x8pin i wonder if you can fill 2 sets of pins in with a single daisy chained pair without having issues, or if youlll need 3 dedicated 8 pins

Different Seasonic PSUs have different cables, I'm afraid.  Only the most current ones are standardized.

 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Kisai said:

I'm still using the 750w Seasonic PSU from 2007 or so. It's served me fine from a P35 system to present and is one of only two remaining parts from that build. If it fits in the chassis, then it's reasonable to use. 

 

Unfortunately, when a PSU does fail, it's typically quite spectacular and damages a lot of other components with it.

 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, LukeSavenije said:

two, this connector CAN'T supply 400w this way, so that's the second part of the BS here. Molex Micro Fit or PCIe power has a rating of 75w for 6 pin, 150w for 8 pin. this means with a 2x8 pin converter, you can supply up to 300w through this, together with up to 75w through the pcie slot. this means the maximum power consumption will be 375w peak. taking this number and grabbing a xeon 3175x on an industrial chiller, you indeed come around 1000w under a combined stress load like furmark+prime95 (a position you won't reach in realistic use in the first place). but realistically seen here, most people will combine the next gen with one of the following CPUs as a baseline here

The actual part number for these pins are 20-64600041 and it supports 16g wire and up to 9A per pin.  It's called MicroFit +. Note the "+".  It's not MicroFit.

 

That said, that doesn't mean anything about the actual power delivery of the connector.  They're only deciding to use a smaller connector with more power capability to avoid using up too much PCB space. Nothing more.

 

[Spotty]

4 hours ago, Kisai said:

550w was never enough. People just like being cheap. Really there has never been a reason to not just pick the biggest PSU available other than chassis-space/cooling efficiency being reduced by larger ones. Heck the "PSU calculator" just for the best upgrade currently available still requires a 1000w PSU. If I reduce that to the best Ryzen 9 system, and cut all the HDD's, USB's and all the PCIe cards but the GPU and M2 drive, that's still 750w.

PSU calculators are notoriously unreliable and are known to intentionally overestimate in order to inflate the figure. They make money through affiliate links to PSUs and want you to buy a more expensive, higher wattage unit as it makes them more money. Try asking it to calculate when there are no parts at all. It'll tell you 100W

 

4 hours ago, Kisai said:

Quite frankly people are being stupidly cheap if they're not buying the biggest available PSU if they intend to run the highest end parts.

Wrong. Also bad advice as people often have a budget when buying and if their choices are between a good 550W or a crappy 850W what do you think they're going to pick if told they need to buy the highest wattage available? People don't want to spend an extra $50 for something they're not going to use.

 

3 hours ago, Kisai said:

Quite honestly I don't see why anyone would want to use any PSU less than 850w unless they're building a system without a GPU.

... Because a system with a Ryzen 3600 + 1660Ti is only going to draw like 250W at most? Why would you buy an 850W PSU for that?

 

4 hours ago, Kisai said:

Excuse me? The most efficient point on PSU's is at the 50% point on the manufacturer's own marketing.

That only shows data from 10%, 20%, 50%, and 100% load data points. It gives an inaccurate representation of efficiency curve.

 

This has low load testing as well as measurements for 10% increments from 10-110%. I added a line to show where the 50% load mark is.

Seasonic Prime Gold 850W

(Source: Cybenetics)

 

And an 80+ Titanium PSU (Corsair AX1600i)

(Source: Cybenetics)

 

PSUs do not have a peak in efficiency at 50% load.

[CarlBar]

40 minutes ago, jonnyGURU said:

Unfortunately, when a PSU does fail, it's typically quite spectacular and damages a lot of other components with it.

 

 

This, i used to not be super into getting a really high build quality PSU. Then i had one fail and brick the entire system plus some of the drives. I've paid attention since.

[Elisis]

15 minutes ago, Spotty said:

on the manufacturer's own marketing.

Ah yes, the absolute method of getting such information and being sure of its accuracy.

[Spotty]

Just now, Elisis said:

Ah yes, the absolute method of getting such information and being sure of its accuracy.

I think you meant to quote @Kisai post, not mine. (If you quote a quote within a reply it will show the wrong person)

[Elisis]

Just now, Spotty said:

I think you meant to quote @Kisai post, not mine. (If you q

Ah, my bad.

[Kisai]

Just now, Spotty said:

I think you meant to quote @Kisai post, not mine. (If you quote a quote within a reply it will show the wrong person)

 

1 minute ago, Elisis said:

Ah yes, the absolute method of getting such information and being sure of its accuracy.

Are you going to spend all day looking up a PSU when you need one "now" . No. You're not. And unless you already have a backup machine handy you're not going to order something online and wait a week for it. Work needs to be done. You can do this research when you build a new machine and plot out where to buy the parts from. Both that PSU and the current Chassis were "things I need immediately" and had NCIX offered me the crappiest things, I would have just taken it and left. With the PSU, this was a time before smartphones and not something to sit there in the store for a few hours to look up.

 

And unless you have proof that these PSU's explode on their 12th birthday, I really am not compelled to replace it before the Ryzen 4xxx parts are released. Considering that Seasonic's current PSU's have 12 year warranties over whatever the warranty on the current one is.

 

[Ankerson]

47 minutes ago, Spotty said:

PSU calculators are notoriously unreliable and are known to intentionally overestimate in order to inflate the figure. They make money through affiliate links to PSUs and want you to buy a more expensive, higher wattage unit as it makes them more money. Try asking it to calculate when there are no parts at all. It'll tell you 100W

 

Wrong. Also bad advice as people often have a budget when buying and if their choices are between a good 550W or a crappy 850W what do you think they're going to pick if told they need to buy the highest wattage available? People don't want to spend an extra $50 for something they're not going to use.

 

... Because a system with a Ryzen 3600 + 1660Ti is only going to draw like 250W at most? Why would you buy an 850W PSU for that?

 

That only shows data from 10%, 20%, 50%, and 100% load data points. It gives an inaccurate representation of efficiency curve.

 

This has low load testing as well as measurements for 10% increments from 10-110%. I added a line to show where the 50% load mark is.

Seasonic Prime Gold 850W

(Source: Cybenetics)

 

And an 80+ Titanium PSU (Corsair AX1600i)

(Source: Cybenetics)

 

PSUs do not have a peak in efficiency at 50% load.

 

 

From what I have seen over time when recommending builds to people and or looking at their builds on forums.....

 

They discount the PSU until the very end after they selected the CPU/MB/GPU.... And other things like the KB and Mouse.... All the bling....

 

They will spend $200 on a KB or a mouse for example and then complain that a good high quality PSU that is needed to power their system costs too much.... So they get a $60 PSU to power that $2,500 total machine they just configured...

 

That's what I see more than anything else.... 

 

And it doesn't help at all when they see people recommended really low wattage PSUs with little or no headroom so then they take that at face value and get the cheapest PSU at the lowest wattage...... That happens much more often than getting a higher wattage lower end unit from what I have seen... They cut both wattage and quality..... 

 

Yes, people do have budgets... 

 

But those who recommended need to start being smarter in what they post..... It's not only the OP who reads the threads....

 

 

Also not good when people get these crazy high wattage units when they don't need them, 1,000W and higher.... Waste of a good part and money really... They could take that $100 that they didn't need to spend and put towards something else in the build. Better CPU cooler or SSD or something.