[2019+] Apple abused market dominance again*n

[RejZoR]

2 hours ago, Kisai said:

Probably because Russian software has a bad record. How many Russian programs do you own? Probably zero.

 

I don't know about the specifics, but AV software has always needed more access to the OS than the OS vendors are willing to give it, and you can go look at microsoft's own precedents for this. Plus Microsoft's own free AV product is a lot less crappy than pretty much ALL third party AV products which have turned themselves in to bloated spyware/adware.

 

https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/10/16121726/microsoft-kaspersky-anti-trust-complaint-dropped

 

Kaspersky for sure and what's most common on almost everyone's system here is MSI Afterburner. It's foundation is RivaTuner and it's developed by Alexey Nicolaychuk. He's Russian Oh and WinRAR is also Russian, made by Eugene Roshal

 

Problem with Windows Defender is that it's not really fast despite lack of "bloat". It's scan engine is atrociously slow and it has no proactive features I could ever witness in its entire existence. Kaspersky on the other hand has loads and their track record is probably the most exceptional one in existence.

[lewdicrous]

11 minutes ago, Vitamanic said:

There’s no monopoly, just a bunch of people not understanding the concept of what one is.

You can’t monopolize your own product/platform. It’s... their platform, their product. They’re allowed to clamp it down all they want. Nobody is entitled to do what they want with it.

Removing competition after you bring out your own product.. a little on the nose there, don't you think?

13 minutes ago, Vitamanic said:

Arguing that the App Store violates monopoly laws implies that a company like Nintendo is doing the same thing with the Switch. Should Nintendo be litigated against to open up their platform to whoever wants access to publish whatever? No? Then the same applies to Apple.

I'm all for an open market between consoles, where you can buy Nintendo games in a non-Nintendo console and the likes for other consoles, but that's not what this topic is about.

[PineyCreek]

6 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Kaspersky for sure and what's most common on almost everyone's system here is MSI Afterburner. It's foundation is RivaTuner and it's developed by Alexey Nicolaychuk. He's Russian Oh and WinRAR is also Russian, made by Eugene Roshal

 

Problem with Windows Defender is that it's not really fast despite lack of "bloat". It's scan engine is atrociously slow and it has no proactive features I could ever witness in its entire existence. Kaspersky on the other hand has loads and their track record is probably the most exceptional one in existence.

Tetris anyone?

[Ashleyyyy]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

MS couldn't revive their windows phone in a market they once held the lead in,  a company that at the time was only a couple of % behind apple in market value.   If that doesn't demonstrate market power then nothing does.

that's because Windows phone was a bad platform that developers weren't interested in. 

[Trik'Stari]

4 hours ago, suicidalfranco said:

what's next? Apple makes a game, all games removed cause you only need that one game

You jest, but I can see it happening. I can already hear the arguments from Apple's fanboys defending that move.

[suicidalfranco]

10 minutes ago, Trik'Stari said:

You jest, but I can see it happening. I can already hear the arguments from Apple's fanboys defending that move.

why would you want to play candy crush when Apple has made a more premium one with Apple Brick? If you want to play candy crush just go and play it in that virus filled android phone

 

Pub what? no no no, here's Apple Royale, with premium graphics and no guns, only walkie talkies.

[Trik'Stari]

17 minutes ago, suicidalfranco said:

why would you want to play candy crush when Apple has made a more premium one with Apple Brick? If you want to play candy crush just go and play it in that virus filled android phone

 

Pub what? no no no, here's Apple Royale, with premium graphics and no guns, only walkie talkies.

Don't forget apple crossing.

https://youtu.be/mefP8GIODO4

[Doobeedoo]

Say it ain't so. 

[spartaman64]

7 hours ago, Vitamanic said:

 

 

 

The pitchforking is getting a little silly now guys.

 

Apple took down a bunch of parental control apps after they got complaints that a bunch of said apps were using MDM. They were harvesting kid’s data, location history, email accounts, camera access, etc. Not only is it against the law for these apps to do that to minors in many areas, it’s obviously not desirable.

 

Apple put their foot down and told them if they want to have the apps back up, they needed to stop spying on children. Most of them complied as they should have, I guess Kaspersky wasn’t one of them.

 

But yeah, keep blindly piling on the bandwagon.

no shit the apps need to collect data for the app to work. how are they going block websites etc if they cant see what websites the kid is accessing. also many parental control apps have an option for the parent to check the kids location so ofc they need location data. 

 

so you are saying apple's magical rainbow unicorn parental controls works without needing any data LUL

[Tech_Dreamer]

it's probably because of the Russia ties & US government pressure. this is just an excuse reason. they did ban government entities from using KS apps on their personal devices. this is probably an expansion to that.

[Red :)]

I'm not even surprised anymore.

[yian88]

8 hours ago, Arika S said:

....

 

Hope they are raked over the coals. 

i dont know what that  means but it sounds painfull.... good.

[wanderingfool2]

7 hours ago, Vitamanic said:

There’s no monopoly, just a bunch of people not understanding the concept of what one is.

 

You can’t monopolize your own product/platform. It’s... their platform, their product. They’re allowed to clamp it down all they want. Nobody is entitled to do what they want with it.

"You can't monopolize your own product/platform"...and you are saying the other people don't understand the concept of what one is.

 

8 hours ago, Ashley xD said:

according to you. but it isn't a monopoly. you can just use android. 

For those claiming Apple doesn't hold a monopoly, see below the snippets from FTC's definition of monopolization

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-antitrust-laws/single-firm-conduct/monopolization-defined

Quote

As a first step, courts ask if the firm has "monopoly power" in any market.

Quote

Courts do not require a literal monopoly before applying rules for single firm conduct; that term is used as shorthand for a firm with significant and durable market power — that is, the long term ability to raise price or exclude competitors.

To be clear Ashley, claiming someone can use android is not a good argument as that only applies to the consumers.  Apple maintains over 50% in all Apps sold to the general consumer and by developing for only Android you are missing out a lot.  It's like if Windows began restricting all apps unless developers paid Microsoft, the consumer could choose to go to Linux or Mac but that doesn't matter to the developer.

 

The fact is, Apple has and still uses their market dominance to create unfair practices where developers have no other options.  In the past Apple literally fixed prices for ebooks, and they also tried abusing their market share to force the % cut while not offering alternatives.  So yes, it is monopolistic behavior  and no they aren't allowed doing everything they want with their platform when they have that amount of market share.

 

This entire thing brings me back to the time that Apple began purging camera apps that used the volume button as a hardware button, claiming it violated the remapping hardware buttons...but then magically came out with their own app that allowed it.  Honestly, the quicker an anti-trust case can occur regarding the app store the better.

 

For those who also want a bit of reading about just what kind of company Apple truly is

https://9to5mac.com/2020/07/30/internal-emails-show-how-an-amazon-ad-prompted-steve-jobs-and-phil-schiller-to-block-in-app-purchases-of-kindle-books-on-ios/

https://www.macworld.com/article/1166953/apple_claims_us_government_sides_with_monopoly_in_ebook_case.html

[mr moose]

11 hours ago, Ashley said:

that's because Windows phone was a bad platform that developers weren't interested in. 

It was not because windows was a "bad platform",   it was because apple and android have all the consumers.  Apple and android control the market, they have the market power.

 

Few developers are going to waste time for a 4% market. 

 

 

 

 

[Kisai]

10 hours ago, mr moose said:

It was not because windows was a "bad platform",   it was because apple and android have all the consumers.  Apple and android control the market, they have the market power.

 

Few developers are going to waste time for a 4% market. 

 

 

 

 

Too little too late really. Given Microsoft's track record of abandoning hardware almost immediately when it doesn't capture 50% of the market, you can see why people were unwilling to invest into it and Microsoft had to buy Nokia's phone business to get anyone to use it. Absolutely everyone with a PDA got burned when Microsoft changed how Windows Mobile 2003SE worked into Windows Mobile 5.0. So it went from a "touch screen" device to a "two button phone device". WHOOPS. So Windows Mobile 6.0 was the final iteration of this. 7/8.1 were kinda-sorta Windows CE, but really Microsoft (and Nokia's own Symbian OS) were legacy OS's that were not designed for multi-core, capacitive multi-touch screen devices.

 

The irony with Symbian is that it was actually designed for ARM, where as CE was not (It was designed for MIPS, but was ported to ARM and SH.)

 

At any rate, it was kind of a shame really, as the PDA devices then would be the same feature set as "phablets" today. A lot of the stupid tiny PDA's (eg Palm/Treo) can be emulated today, but there's almost nothing that would be worth trying to emulate one. I can think of maybe a few games that haven't been ported to iOS/Android from mobile phones, but pretty much everything either didn't get ported, or something else replaced it anyway.

 

Microsoft makes three pieces of hardware that people consider good, or at least good-enough:

Xbox (and game controllers)

Surface Pro

Computer Mice and Keyboards

 

Pretty much everything else, forget it. I wonder if they will bring back their Microsoft Sidewinder Joysticks now that they're bringing Flight Simulator back.

[Mark Kaine]

On 8/18/2020 at 8:50 AM, ACEHACK said:

man as someone that just purchased 2 iphones for my two little siss, this hurts me so deep on every level; especially since i was searching for the kaspersky app on ios and why its not updated. apple burn in hell. 

I don't understand,  you bought a locked down device,  and are now complaining that it's locked down? 

 

I do understand that it's the hip thing to do right now,  though I really don't understand this mindset,  you *knew* what kind of device you were buying and didn't find out "oops I can't install what I want??“ afterwards,  there is *no* way you did. 

[mr moose]

8 hours ago, Mark Kaine said:

I don't understand,  you bought a locked down device,  and are now complaining that it's locked down? 

 

I do understand that it's the hip thing to do right now,  though I really don't understand this mindset,  you *knew* what kind of device you were buying and didn't find out "oops I can't install what I want??“ afterwards,  there is *no* way you did. 

How is any iphone buyer supposed to know what apple is going to remove from teh store or shut down support for before they do?

 

Are we to assume that apple will do it to all and any app at any time?   If that's the case then there is no argument that people are willingly signing up for that service.

 

 

[TetraSky]

More apple trying to screw over devs and apps:
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/21/21396316/apple-wordpress-in-app-purchase-tax-update-store

We'll never seen a Floatplane app on iOS.

 

(too lazy to make a thread for it)

[Helpful Tech Witch]

8 hours ago, Mark Kaine said:

I don't understand,  you bought a locked down device,  and are now complaining that it's locked down? 

 

I do understand that it's the hip thing to do right now,  though I really don't understand this mindset,  you *knew* what kind of device you were buying and didn't find out "oops I can't install what I want??“ afterwards,  there is *no* way you did. 

No. He bought a device that worked. Then he got features removed, and is complaining about the removal. 
 

The problem, which @mr moose, I, and many others have gone over sever times, across several threads, is that Apple is a dick. They add a extra 30% charge for IAPs (which is the main point with many threads), which forces you to use safari, or a different device, to buy something that you should have no problem buying.

 

Apple also forces smaller companies to not add a subscription option through the iOS app, a example being floatplane. Luke discusses in a WAN show, that Floatplane cannot lose 30% reavanue.

[Kisai]

1 hour ago, TetraSky said:

More apple trying to screw over devs and apps:
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/21/21396316/apple-wordpress-in-app-purchase-tax-update-store

We'll never seen a Floatplane app on iOS.

 

(too lazy to make a thread for it)

That one is somewhat of an over-reach, but it's the same problem of trying to circumvent paying Apple anything while getting all the sales by just not having sales on the app. If they put sales on the app, it's unlikely they would get any new sales on it just by virtue of "an app" is still the crappiest way to program/code anything.

 

[mr moose]

1 hour ago, TetraSky said:

More apple trying to screw over devs and apps:
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/21/21396316/apple-wordpress-in-app-purchase-tax-update-store

We'll never seen a Floatplane app on iOS.

 

(too lazy to make a thread for it)

 

For those who want a TL:DR, I found one sentence in the whole article that sums it all up:

 

Quote

In other words, Apple won: the richest company in the world just successfully forced an app developer to monetize an app so it could make more money.

 

If it isn't bad enough that governments aren't regulating this behavior, we all have to contend with people who defend it.   

 

What's next, will apple want a cut of my phone bill, maybe a few cents from every txt I send.

[Monkey Dust]

10 hours ago, mr moose said:

What's next, will apple want a cut of my phone bill, maybe a few cents from every txt I send.

Stop giving them ideas.

 

If consumers start noticing they can get certain apps on Android but not iOS, and choosing their phone accordingly, that might prompt a change of heart. Though the 'has to be an iPhone' mentality is pretty firmly entrenched in many people so maybe it won't have much effect.  

[colonel_mortis]

I've just removed 12 posts from the last couple of pages of this topic (and apologise for taking so long to do so). As a reminder, although I suspect those involved are already aware but choose to ignore it: discussing the topic at hand is encouraged, but arguing about the semantics of a remark that someone made that has negligible relationship to the topic at hand, then descending into personal attacks, is not OK.

 

You don't have to correct everyone who is wrong on the Internet.