Why does Linus Pirate Windows??

[Guest zeuschops]

No idea if the comment has already been made, but Microsoft allows up to 10 hardware swaps or "pc transfers" (according to what happened to one of my computers). But if you have at least 2 items maintained across builds, Windows 10 will restore happily while older versions of Windows (that aren't OEM licenses) won't transfer those licenses across builds. Windows 10 has been hit & miss about the "test bench" builds style (swapping hardware more often than not).

 

The "Skip" button during Windows installation is actually designed for licenses attached to a Microsoft Account with Windows 10, but it was there for 8.1 as well and nobody could link their license to their account anyways.

 

I understand the concern from previous, and certainly encourage the method you're using for test benches until Microsoft more publicly addresses the license issues for consumers of non-OEM Windows builds.

[kirashi]

Buckle up, dis gunna be good!

On 9/2/2018 at 12:13 PM, NumLock21 said:

Some people actually think Linus uses pirated Windows? That not pirated, Microsoft does let you try it out for normally 30days before you have to buy a license and activate it. The reason why it's not activated is because they're constantly reviewing new stuffs and keep on reactivating would be a hassle, when the windows, isn't going to be a permanent install.

On 9/2/2018 at 12:52 PM, Velcade said:

For a test bench it makes sense.  I don't see an issue.  Now if everyone's workstation was inactivated that's a different story however that doesn't seem to be the case.

Correct - by design there is a 30 day grace period built into Windows version prior to 8 so you can use the OS unlicensed without breaching the EULA. You can actually extend this license 3 times using the ReArm function built into slmgr to achieve a total of 120 days of unlicensed usage, but only for development or testing purposes, as noted in the following link. Production environments (consumers, businesses, etc.) can't legally rearm beyond the initial 30 day grace period because they don't qualify for testing or development purposes, unless you're actually developing or testing your code on Windows.

 

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/previous-versions/tn-archive/dd981009(v=technet.10)

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English.htm

 

On 9/2/2018 at 12:31 PM, SlayerScout said:

How about Microsoft KMS, would this not work better in linus's case?

On 9/2/2018 at 2:07 PM, n0creativity said:

Is there a reason LTT doesn't have a VL (volume licensing) agreement and use either MAK keys or KMS? 

The link above contains some information regarding KMS & MAK activation which may answer your questions. Businesses do have to meet certain requirements, such as number of licenses needed to the edition of Windows they're running, in order to use KMS or MAK activation. Because of this, sometimes businesses are better off just purchasing upgrade copies of Windows Pro and installing them over the OEM Home copies that come with new computers.

 

On 9/2/2018 at 12:48 PM, jfarre20 said:

I run a Linux based KMS emulator (TinyKMSv6) at work. Microsoft is okay with this as long as we have the licenses to back it up. We've had audits, and they never seem to have a problem with it. I've never had activation issues since spinning that VM up and setting the DNS entries. 

This is totally fine and doesn't violate the EULA, since you're not modifying any part of Windows Activation Technologies. Activating through a 3rd party KMS emulator via custom DNS and / or an emulated loopback connection locally on each machine is OK as long as you have the legal paperwork to provide proof of licensing.

 

When Microsoft audits a business, often times they'll just take inventory of the number of machines / users and simply ask for paperwork that proves the business owns enough licenses to cover this. How the machines are actually activated becomes a moot point, since that's IT's responsibility, and MS isn't going to manually audit each machine. In some cases, Microsoft isn't even allowed to audit the machines due to HIPPA compliance and/or Canada's Privacy Laws.

 

That being said, I'll admit that I activate all my Windows 10 Pro installations using a KMS emulator like you mentioned above. I have a legally purchased retail key for Windows 8 Pro, and a retail copy of Windows 7 Pro, both of which were upgraded during the free upgrade period. These are attached to my Microsoft account as well as digital licenses too. I choose to KMS activate because it's much faster than the inconvenience of typing in (or even copy pasting) a 25 character product key, much like how downloading movies and TV shows is more convenient than using your (usually) poorly designed set top box to PVR the same content that you already subscribe to..

 

One thing I do not and will never agree to is licensing per machine - all of my software licenses are licensed to me, the end user, regardless of what the license says. Obviously this doesn't mean I can install 30 copies of Windows on 30 machines and run them all at once, but it does mean that even if I only had 1 Windows 10 Pro license I'd be ethically able to use it on both my laptop and desktop, so long as I didn't run them both at the same time. My credit card purchased the software, and my credit card is licensed by the issuing bank for use in my name, not in the name of the computer I intend to install the software on.

 

On 9/2/2018 at 1:02 PM, Enderman said:

There is no time limit. You can use it unactivated forever.

Legally, you cannot use it this way forever as a consumer or business. See above for details on the grace period.

 

On 9/2/2018 at 1:00 PM, DrMacintosh said:

You don’t have to spend $100 to get Windows 10, you could spend $22 on Kinguin. And since the hardware will never change with a Mac, there is no risk. 

On 9/2/2018 at 1:00 PM, valdyrgramr said:

In order to use Mac OS you have to buy a Mac, and if you don't then it's a Hackintosh which is illegal [as per Apple's EULA].  It's also illegal to use those OEM keys because you're breaching a contract [Microsoft's EULA] in order to use them. 

On 9/2/2018 at 12:15 PM, DrMacintosh said:

You don't even have to do that. You get limited in some features after that period, but tbh it is still usable. MS would rather Windows 10 be free so they could get that sweet sweet telemetry from everyone. 

As noted above, one cannot legally use Windows unlicensed beyond the 30 day grace period (120 days if rearming for testing or development purposes) as this violates the EULA. This doesn't mean it won't work - it's just no more legal than running OSX on non-Apple hardware.

 

On 9/2/2018 at 1:13 PM, valdyrgramr said:

 Nintendo, on the other hand, would because Nintendo.

Wee woo wee woo. This is the sound of the police. We are here to do the arresting of you because you said the N word without a release of the press from the Nintendos of the Americas. Please, come with us, and don't make the Mario jumping noise or coin ding sounds, otherwise we have to arrests you multiple times.

[Enderman]

29 minutes ago, kirashi said:

As noted above, one cannot legally use Windows unlicensed beyond the 30 day grace period (120 days if rearming for testing or development purposes) as this violates the EULA. This doesn't mean it won't work - it's just no more legal than running OSX on non-Apple hardware.

Why are you posting documents from 2010?

Windows 10 was released long after that.

 

There is no limit to how long you can use it unactivated.

Other than the watermark and not having access to personalization there is no restriction to use.

[kirashi]

10 minutes ago, Enderman said:

There is no limit to how long you can use it unactivated.

Other than the watermark and not having access to personalization there is no restriction to use.

Technically, one can use it indefinitely, sure, but it's not legal as it violates the EULA. Please see section 5 as quoted below.

Quote

5.      Authorized Software and Activation. You are authorized to use this software only if you are properly licensed and the software has been properly activated with a genuine product key or by other authorized method. When you connect to the Internet while using the software, the software will automatically contact Microsoft or its affiliate to conduct activation to associate it with a certain device. You can also activate the software manually by Internet or telephone. In either case, transmission of certain information will occur, and Internet, telephone and SMS service charges may apply. During activation (or reactivation that may be triggered by changes to your device’s components), the software may determine that the installed instance of the software is counterfeit, improperly licensed or includes unauthorized changes. If activation fails, the software will attempt to repair itself by replacing any tampered Microsoft software with genuine Microsoft software. You may also receive reminders to obtain a proper license for the software. Successful activation does not confirm that the software is genuine or properly licensed. You may not bypass or circumvent activation. To help determine if your software is genuine and whether you are properly licensed, see (aka.ms/genuine). Certain updates, support, and other services might only be offered to users of genuine Microsoft software.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English.htm

[Enderman]

5 minutes ago, kirashi said:

Technically, one can use it indefinitely, sure, but it's not legal as it violates the EULA. Please see section 5 as quoted below.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English.htm

1) Where in that wot does it say there is a 30 day limit

 

2) There is absolutely nothing that changes in windows 10 if you keep using it unactivated.

Nothing tells you that you need to activate it, no restrictions are applied, no additional features are blocked.

https://superuser.com/questions/1024274/how-long-can-i-use-windows-10-without-activation

[kirashi]

11 minutes ago, Enderman said:

1) Where in that wot does it say there is a 30 day limit

 

2) There is absolutely nothing that changes in windows 10 if you keep using it unactivated.

Nothing tells you that you need to activate it, no restrictions are applied, no additional features are blocked.

https://superuser.com/questions/1024274/how-long-can-i-use-windows-10-without-activation

Actually, regarding point 1 you're correct - the 30 day grace period has been completely removed from Windows 8 and higher. Instead, these versions of Windows require licensing upon installation to comply with the license terms. One can still use Windows 10 without activation or licensing, albeit with certain customization & account sync features disabled and a watermark in the corner. Although one can remove the watermark by way of special tools.  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Product_Activation

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-windows_install/activating-windows-10/5ef7becd-fc78-4ea1-884e-1e6df1f4f8d2

 

However, as I mentioned above already (and won't repeat again), using Windows 10 (versions 8 and up, actually, as I just learned) without a valid license violates the EULA you agreed to in order to use the software. Whether Microsoft does anything is an entirely separate story, but it doesn't change the legality of the software EULA, assuming the EULA holds up if challenged in a court of law, but this too is a separate issue that will vary greatly depending on your local laws.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English.htm

[Enderman]

3 minutes ago, kirashi said:

Actually, regarding point 1 you're correct - the 30 day grace period has been completely removed from Windows 8 and higher. Instead, these versions of Windows require licensing upon installation to comply with the license terms. One can still use Windows 10 without activation or licensing, albeit with certain customization & account sync features disabled and a watermark in the corner. Although one can remove the watermark by way of special tools.  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Product_Activation

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-windows_install/activating-windows-10/5ef7becd-fc78-4ea1-884e-1e6df1f4f8d2

 

However, as I mentioned above already (and won't repeat again), using Windows 10 (versions 8 and up, actually, as I just learned) without a valid license violates the EULA you agreed to in order to use the software. Whether Microsoft does anything is an entirely separate story, but it doesn't change the legality of the software EULA, assuming the EULA holds up if challenged in a court of law, but this too is a separate issue that will vary greatly depending on your local laws.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English.htm

Yes I know there are easy ways to remove those restrictions.

My point is that nothing forces you to stop using windows while unactivated, not after 30 days, not ever.

 

Technically it is against their rules, but so is driving 1km/h over the speed limit.

If Microsoft actually cared they wouldn't allow it.

Nobody is going to get a lawsuit for using windows 10 unactivated.

Worst case scenario they might add more restrictions in the future that force you to activate, but so far there is no indication of this.

[MGE Dawn]

4 hours ago, imreloadin said:

Why does Linus "pirate" Windows? Because people don't know how it works or even how "pirating" works for that matter...

You can look at it this way, Microsoft ALLOWS people to use Windows 10 without activating it. Microsoft just locks out features like not allowing people to "personalize" it.

If Microsoft didn't want people using Windows without activating it then they would NOT allow it. They would require you to enter in a product key when installing it.

What Microsoft is really wanting to do is count people in their amount of people who use Windows. Activated or not you're still using Windows.

Not just those, they also slap a really annoying watermark on your screen that you can only get rid of by activating Windows

[imreloadin]

42 minutes ago, MGE Dawn said:

Not just those, they also slap a really annoying watermark on your screen that you can only get rid of by activating Windows

Yeah, so what?

[MGE Dawn]

3 minutes ago, imreloadin said:

Yeah, so what?

So nothing. Just pointing out something you seemed to have forgotten about whilst agreeing with you

[Streetguru]

Shouldn't buy windows 10 because they offer little control over the OS, fill it with spyware and ads, and still haven't made it as good as windows 7.

[imreloadin]

1 minute ago, MGE Dawn said:

So nothing. Just pointing out something you seemed to have forgotten about whilst agreeing with you

Ah, gotcha. The watermark doesn't mean anything to me so that's why I didn't list it.

If you're using Windows on your gaming rig, just buy the damn license lol.

[MGE Dawn]

1 minute ago, imreloadin said:

Ah, gotcha. The watermark doesn't mean anything to me so that's why I didn't list it.

If you're using Windows on your gaming rig, just buy the damn license lol.

I plan to... it's just that I'm short enough on cash until my employer decides to start scheduling me for my usual number of hours again that I can really only pay my rent and keep the utilities turned on. Same reason why I haven't picked up my monitors, TBH...

[imreloadin]

3 minutes ago, MGE Dawn said:

I plan to... it's just that I'm short enough on cash until my employer decides to start scheduling me for my usual number of hours again that I can really only pay my rent and keep the utilities turned on. Same reason why I haven't picked up my monitors, TBH...

It's all good, as I stated if Microsoft was that torn about people using Windows 10 without a license they would have locked it down like Windows 7 and everything before that by requiring you to buy the license eventually.

[Streetguru]

7 minutes ago, imreloadin said:

It's all good, as I stated if Microsoft was that torn about people using Windows 10 without a license they would have locked it down like Windows 7 and everything before that by requiring you to buy the license eventually.

People would just pirate it anyways

[ahuckphin]

Compared to Windows 10, running Windows 8.1 without being activated was worse. In addition to the watermark, on every login you're prompt to activate. 

 

Actually I feel like over the years running Windows unactivated have become easier and easier. 

 

 

[Kadah]

OEM Microsoft licenses do not have transfer rights, the license is locked to the PC and MS defines that as the mobo for Windows 10. This is why OEM licneses are cheaper, they have this restriction. (If you upgrade from an OEM license of 7 or 8 to 10, that 10 license will also not have transfer rights.)

 

Retail Windows licenses have transfer rights, though if you reactivate too many times by MS's determination and hyper complex rules, they will stop you and require you to buy another license.

 

Microsoft licencing is overly complex for business use, this may be intentional. Linus's use is an edge case. My guess is that what he needs a per user volume license, BUT the reactivations on that get even more complex. The only correct answer here is "talk to a MS licensing partner then blame them if you ever end up out of compliance during an audit after licensing how you were instructed." At a previous job, they got audited by MS and were found out of compliance by around a dozen devices/users on their volume license and were fined over $2 million. I don't know if MS still does those audits now, but making sure things remained in compliance after that was a massive headache.

 

One gotcha about MS volume licensing is that its more expensive than buying individual licenses, and its more complicated than individual licenses. Unless you have 1000's of workstations, it will not be worth the hassle, so just buy your machines from your OEM with Windows pre-licensed.

 

OSX is licensed not to the user but to the device. If you want to virtualize OSX, its allowed by the OSX terms but you have to do it on Apple hardware, which is a huge pain in the ass for software development and testing as Apple killed the xServe forever ago, Mac Pro haven't been viable for years, the Mac Mini might be dead, and new Macbook Pros are a terrible choice for actual computational workloads like a build farm.

[_Al_]

I actually signed up just for this thread. I have ran in to the exact same issue, bought a family pack (3 licenses) of windows 7 when it first came out. The issue that I have is that I have changed hardware 2-3 times every year in my own rig, then there's my fiance's rig that also has been rebuilt a few times and last but not least, my fiance's brothers rig that I have now rebuilt 4 times. There's only 3 active rigs that has [had] this license... One sunny day I ran in to the activation issue, tried to use the automated phone thing that didn't work and the rep that then replied was a total d**k about it. Turns out that each key can be activated 26 times at most, but the issue with the family pack is that only one key is included.

The way I see it and the real question - I'm not going to buy a new license since I already bought them, however it can't be activated anymore...so what's the next step in getting this actually solved without buying a new license or pirating?

[NelizMastr]

When in doubt:

 

[F Bomb29]

I've ran Windows 10 Unlicensed practically since it came out, when I built my Skylake system back in 2015 I ran Windows unlicensed no problem, and now 3 years later and a bunch of upgrades I'm still running it unlicensed.

[Sfekke]

17 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

Sure, but generally Macs have much lower cost to own numbers. In the lifespan of the machine, assuming there isn’t a catastrophic failure, a Mac tends to be a more solid investment. 

 

You don’t have to spend $100 to get Windows 10, you could spend $22 on Kinguin. And since the hardware will never change with a Mac, there is no risk. 

 

If you buy a Mac you intend to run macOS significantly more than you plan to run Windows. If that Windows Software you needed was mission critical, you should have bought a PC instead. So your argument doesn’t actually have a foundation. 

Mac's are more expensive, but no Windows laptop (ASUS/HP/MSI) lasted me as long as my Mid 2013 MacBook Air 11" base.

That thing still works, granted I passed it down to my grandmother in favor of the Early 2015 MacBook Air, 13" base.

macOS is a big leap for some, but I didn't find it much of an issue; still switching between the Windows & macOS daily to this day.

I've tweaked both to my liking, and only Windows so far keeps trying to undo that.

Yes Explorer I'm looking at you pinning worthless crap like Onedrive & 3D Objects only removable through a simple registry fix .. still why?

[JoostinOnline]

16 hours ago, Agenda21Confirmed said:

 

That's nonsense.

[biotoxin]

taking the opportunity to mention that if you did some prep work during the original free windows 10 licensing time if you made the right kind of usb installer you can get any version of windows for free with it's own unique license for each install and you could install on as many machines as needed indefinitely so long as you had your original usb

 

I don't even get a key prompt and just select pro every time, have yet to have a problem

[m8377]

The transfer license tool is pretty straightforward. It asks if you recently changed hardware, if you click yes, it lists all devices tied to your ms account. Sometimes it won't accept the transfer then you just call ms, give them your old key and they generate a new one. Won't work for keys coded for HP/dell/some OEM but usually works. 

[keskparane]

On 03/09/2018 at 5:04 AM, Princess Cadence said:

God damn this is the worse clickbait ever, running it unlicensed IS NOT PIRATING.

Surely the worst clickbait is one that doesn't attract your attention?