ada lovelace NVIDIA Project Beyond GTC Keynote with CEO Jensen Huang: RTX 4090 + RTX 4080 Revealed

[melete]

14 minutes ago, HenrySalayne said:

Ehh, that's exactly what inflation does. Things get far more expensive.

For those keeping score here:

 

RTX 3080 launch date: September 17th, 2020

RTX 3080 launch price (2020 dollars): $699 USD

RTX 3080 launch price (August 2022 dollars): $802.51 USD

 

RTX 4080 16GB launch date: November 2022

RTX 4080 16GB launch price (November 2022 dollars): $1199 USD

 

Using the 16 GB model because that's the true 4080 GPU. 12 GB is some Nvidia nonsense, it's likely a different GPU.

[StephanTW]

well glad they got AV1 encoding, shame they are soo expensive, i will just wait and see what AMD is gonna offer for their line up

[DildorTheDecent]

[starsmine]

2 minutes ago, melete said:

For those keeping score here:

 

RTX 3080 launch date: September 17th, 2020

RTX 3080 launch price (2020 dollars): $699 USD

RTX 3080 launch price (August 2022 dollars): $802.51 USD

 

RTX 4080 16GB launch date: November 2022

RTX 4080 16GB launch price (November 2022 dollars): $1199 USD

 

Using the 16 GB model because that's the true 4080 GPU. 12 GB is some Nvidia nonsense, it's likely a different GPU.

As pointed out earlier, the die is 2x the cost, with more power consumption and everything that goes along with that.
Ram also costs more then it did in 2020, gddr6x still has not gone down to pre covid pricing

[WereCat]

3 minutes ago, HenrySalayne said:

I'm with you, but the 3080 is a completely different price category. The only real decision is around the 1100€ mark between the 3090 with 24 GB of RAM and the 3080 with 12GB of RAM and probably a minor performance improvement. I would not expect the 4080 12GB* to be more than 10% faster than a 3090 in most workloads.

 

*We need a different name for the 12GB model of the 4080. How about 4080 CE (= clown edition or cheap edition)?

It all comes down to how big difference vs 30 series there actually is.

I am 100% sure the NVIDIA performance graphs show the 40series with DLSS 3.0 vs 30series with DLSS 2.0.

 

Considering that DLSS 3.0 can create a whole new frames instead of just making frames look better like with 2.0, this will make the 40series look a LOT better on the graph. The thing is... does this require again a specific game support? Does it at least work in old DLSS games?

NVIDIA did this exact same trick when they shown DLSS for the 1st time so I wouldn't be surprised.

[SteveGrabowski0]

31 minutes ago, Ravendarat said:

You cant just make stuff up to make your point true. You as an individual dont decide what the price is. The overall market combined with the company supplying the product does. And we saw that that card was $2000. Im not saying you arent right to be upset by the new price of these launch cards, but to say the 3090ti was a $1000 card is just factually untrue

It is a $1000 card now though. Well, $1030.

[starsmine]

2 minutes ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

It is a $1000 card now though. Well, $1030.

yes, and they are being sold at a loss at that price. They are trying to liquidate as much as they can before all the Chinese mining cards hit our shores and they have to take an even bigger loss. At least in terms of the AIBs
 

[SteveGrabowski0]

4 minutes ago, starsmine said:

yes, and they are being sold at a loss at that price. They are trying to liquidate as much as they can before all the Chinese mining cards hit our shores and they have to take an even bigger loss. At least in terms of the AIBs
 

All the Texas mining cards. Mining moved out of China already.

[Exty]

4 minutes ago, starsmine said:

yes, and they are being sold at a loss at that price. They are trying to liquidate as much as they can before all the Chinese mining cards hit our shores and they have to take an even bigger loss. At least in terms of the AIBs
 

where are you pulling this information that it costs a 1000$ to make a card?  its prolly closer to 300-500 range, same place as you (trust me bro)

[ewitte]

42 minutes ago, Ravendarat said:

You cant just make stuff up to make your point true. You as an individual dont decide what the price is. The overall market combined with the company supplying the product does. And we saw that that card was $2000. Im not saying you arent right to be upset by the new price of these launch cards, but to say the 3090ti was a $1000 card is just factually untrue

It didn't though the price dropped like a rock just months later because nobody was paying $2k for it.

[Avocado Diaboli]

I love how so many people are arguing over what the "true 4080" is supposed to be, as if a name carries any meaning whatsoever. Seriously guys, look at the actual performance and determine if what you're asked to spend on it reflects what you're willing to part ways with. Nobody cares if you used to only buy to of the line xx80 Ti hardware. If what's sold under that moniker is now twice as expensive and you aren't willing to pay that for the privilege of claiming you've got a xx80 Ti model in your PC, then don't buy it. I upgraded from a 980 Ti to a 3080 two years ago and had the 3080 Ti been available at the time, I wouldn't have bought it at the price Nvidia demanded for it. And that lacking "Ti" on my GPU doesn't impact my self-esteem in the slightest. Don't fall into the marketing trap, you just look like gullible fools.

[bramturismo]

1 hour ago, Dracarris said:

Europe wishful-MSRP pricing (including ~20% VAT, but still):

4080 12G 4070: 1099€

                 4080: 1469€

 

NVidia, go fuck yourself. Sincerely.

Bloody hell...

 

It's not the latest and the greatest I got myself 2 months ago...but I am happy I managed to get an RX 6800 at 600 euros...

[Mister Woof]

$900 for a mislabeled RTX 4070

[ewitte]

7 minutes ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

I love how so many people are arguing over what the "true 4080" is supposed to be, as if a name carries any meaning whatsoever. Seriously guys, look at the actual performance and determine if what you're asked to spend on it reflects what you're willing to part ways with. Nobody cares if you used to only buy to of the line xx80 Ti hardware. If what's sold under that moniker is now twice as expensive and you aren't willing to pay that for the privilege of claiming you've got a xx80 Ti model in your PC, then don't buy it. I upgraded from a 980 Ti to a 3080 two years ago and had the 3080 Ti been available at the time, I wouldn't have bought it at the price Nvidia demanded for it. And that lacking "Ti" on my GPU doesn't impact my self-esteem in the slightest. Don't fall into the marketing trap, you just look like gullible fools.

The problem isn't the name its the die.  They are completely different chips.  The "4080 12GB" die isn't even in the same league as the 4080 16GB.  Having the same name for that much of a performance difference is a lie at best.  Its deceptive marketing that preys on people that don't know any better.

[Mister Woof]

6 minutes ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

I love how so many people are arguing over what the "true 4080" is supposed to be, as if a name carries any meaning whatsoever. Seriously guys, look at the actual performance and determine if what you're asked to spend on it reflects what you're willing to part ways with. Nobody cares if you used to only buy to of the line xx80 Ti hardware. If what's sold under that moniker is now twice as expensive and you aren't willing to pay that for the privilege of claiming you've got a xx80 Ti model in your PC, then don't buy it. I upgraded from a 980 Ti to a 3080 two years ago and had the 3080 Ti been available at the time, I wouldn't have bought it at the price Nvidia demanded for it. And that lacking "Ti" on my GPU doesn't impact my self-esteem in the slightest. Don't fall into the marketing trap, you just look like gullible fools.

The issue is less the names, and more the fact that mid and entry-level cards will be de-prioritized, low volume, and likely be at or above MSRP for their entire existence.

See: RTX 3050/3060.

 

They just do not want to sell cards below these new arbitrary price points and they find ways to ensure that it goes the way they want.

[Dracarris]

6 minutes ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

I love how so many people are arguing over what the "true 4080" is supposed to be, as if a name carries any meaning whatsoever.

I generally agree. But the 4080 variants are labeled as if only memory capacity differs while in reality it‘s a completely different GPU and even tier.

 

Also, the 80 at launch always was the non-crazy enthusiast/high-end tier with the largest GPU die but some units disabled to increase yield. And that‘s most certainly not true for the 4080 12G.

[BiG StroOnZ]

JayzTwoCents Coverage:

 

 

Gamers Nexus Coverage:

 

 

Greg Salazar Coverage:

 

 

[Mister Woof]

1 minute ago, Dracarris said:

I generally agree. But the 4080 variants are labeled as if only memory capacity differs while in reality it‘s a completely different GPU and even tier.

 

Also, the 80 at launch always was the non-crazy enthusiast/high-end tier with the largest GPU die but some units disabled to increase yield. And that‘s most certainly not true for the 4080 12G.

And don't forget...last time they offered a "$499" entry point for the new product.

This time it's $899. I understand inflation and shortages...but that's an 80% price hike "just to play"

[HenrySalayne]

23 minutes ago, melete said:

For those keeping score here:

 

RTX 3080 launch date: September 17th, 2020

RTX 3080 launch price (2020 dollars): $699 USD

RTX 3080 launch price (August 2022 dollars): $802.51 USD

 

RTX 4080 16GB launch date: November 2022

RTX 4080 16GB launch price (November 2022 dollars): $1199 USD

 

Using the 16 GB model because that's the true 4080 GPU. 12 GB is some Nvidia nonsense, it's likely a different GPU.

What we know as "inflation" is just an average of the price increases across a wide variety of goods. So one good might be 30% more expensive year by year, while other goods are only 3% more expensive or even less expensive than before. So a one-dimensional view doesn't show the entire picture.

As others stated before, the 3080 was infamous for being borderline cheap (almost no margin), manufacturing has gotten more expensive and less predictable, the dice are more expensive (but most likely not as much as some people in this thread suggest) and inflation and market turbulences are adding a big error bar to the manufacturing costs.

Nvidia still has a healthy profit margin, but with mining being dead and the foreshadowing of a recession on the horizon, I'm pretty sure their quarterly numbers are not as good and they aren't just filling their pockets with insane amounts of money. The price increase is disappointing but expected.

[Thaldor]

24 minutes ago, WereCat said:

It all comes down to how big difference vs 30 series there actually is.

I am 100% sure the NVIDIA performance graphs show the 40series with DLSS 3.0 vs 30series with DLSS 2.0.

 

Considering that DLSS 3.0 can create a whole new frames instead of just making frames look better like with 2.0, this will make the 40series look a LOT better on the graph. The thing is... does this require again a specific game support? Does it at least work in old DLSS games?

NVIDIA did this exact same trick when they shown DLSS for the 1st time so I wouldn't be surprised.

Specific game support is needed as stated. Example CP2077 supports DLSS3.0 with new patch and Portal RTX is probably whole new game (Valve doubling down with the "we can't count to three"-joke).

 

Now that people are fighting over the "true 4080" I think we should make things clear:

There's now 3 RTX40-series cards:
- RTX 4080 Expensive Edition

- RTX 4080

- RTX 4080 Discount Edition

 

Upcoming cards will be:

- RTX 4080 Totally Overpriced

- RTX 4080 Inexpensive

- RTX 4080 Poor Man's Edition

- RTX 4080 GraphicDanceDanceRevolution 5X

- "RTX" "4080"

- Not-RTX 4080

[xg32]

6 minutes ago, Shimmy Gummi said:

And don't forget...last time they offered a "$499" entry point for the new product.

This time it's $899. I understand inflation and shortages...but that's an 80% price hike "just to play"

funny thing is there isnt even a shortage anymore, thats why i expected the 4090 to be higher and "4080"s to be lower, last time the MSRP of 500 and 700 were too low, this time they seem to be too high, who in their right mind is gonna buy the 12gb? (every1 i've talked to today wants the 4090 or a discounted 3090ti with current psu)

 

And let's face it, people will pay for the 4090 even if the MSRP is at 2k, unless they can make more than they sell, and they can lower prices later, really feel like jensen's lost his mojo.

[Mister Woof]

2 minutes ago, xg32 said:

funny thing is there isnt even a shortage anymore, thats why i expected the 4090 to be higher and "4080"s to be lower, last time the MSRP of 500 and 700 were too low, this time they seem to be too high. 

 

And let's face it, people will pay for the 4090 even if the MSRP is at 2k, unless they can make more than they sell, and they can lower prices later, really feel like jensen's lost his mojo.

It's everywhere. They've normalized (and we've capitulated) incredibly high prices for things. Nobody bats an eye anymore at throwing down $1500 on a new iPhone every other year. They offset the price by letting people pay in installments.

 

I'm surprised nVidia hasn't done a payment plan deal with Best Buy yet.

The difference is that Apple and Google all release really good budget phones for "the people" that are actually affordable. 

Nvidia behaves like if Apple or Google announced the SE or A models but never produced them in volume.

[Avocado Diaboli]

6 minutes ago, ewitte said:

The problem isn't the name its the die.  They are completely different chips.  The "4080 12GB" die isn't even in the same league as the 4080 16GB.  Having the same name for that much of a performance difference is a lie at best.  Its deceptive marketing that preys on people that don't know any better.

You could say that about any arbitrary naming convention in the PC space. If it's labelled as a 4080 12 GB and performs as such, you're paying for what you're getting. They could call the entire 40 series "4080" with a different suffix and nothing would change. I have coworkers who still tout that they have an i7 processor in their 10 year old machine and that somehow means it's better than a current i5 in their mind. Names mean nothing. I mean, if the logic here is that "it's a different die so it should be called something else" then by all rights the 3080, 3080 Ti, 3090 and 3090 Ti should've had the same name.

 

8 minutes ago, Shimmy Gummi said:

The issue is less the names, and more the fact that mid and entry-level cards will be de-prioritized, low volume, and likely be at or above MSRP for their entire existence.

See: RTX 3050/3060.

 

They just do not want to sell cards below these new arbitrary price points and they find ways to ensure that it goes the way they want.

I understand that it sucks that PC gaming is getting more expensive for people, but if enough people are willing to pay for it, Nvidia have no incentive to offer cheaper hardware. It's been a seller's market for quite a few years and that means if you're not the highest bidder, then you're not the target customer.

[Mister Woof]

Just now, Avocado Diaboli said:

You could say that about any arbitrary naming convention in the PC space. If it's labelled as a 4080 12 GB and performs as such, you're paying for what you're getting. They could call the entire 40 series "4080" with a different suffix and nothing would change. I have coworkers who still tout that they have an i7 processor in their 10 year old machine and that somehow means it's better than a current i5 in their mind. Names mean nothing. I mean, if the logic here is that "it's a different die so it should be called something else" then by all rights the 3080, 3080 Ti, 3090 and 3090 Ti should've had the same name.

 

I understand that it sucks that PC gaming is getting more expensive for people, but if enough people are willing to pay for it, Nvidia have no incentive to offer cheaper hardware. It's been a seller's market for quite a few years and that means if you're not the highest bidder, then you're not the target customer.

It's actually a lot cheaper to get into the game than it has been in many years. Not even counting the GPU crisis. Storage, CPUs, RAM...it's all quite affordable now, despite inflation and supply problems.

 

But in recent years, Nvidia has positioned itself to be the Apple of graphics cards. They know they carry brand recognition and there is a premium attached to that brand. They don't WANT to be in the budget space. It probably harms their brand.

 

So fuck em...if they want to concede the budget market, AMD and Intel(?) can come in and pick it up. 

Regardless of performance metrics, there's no way I can justify spending more than a thousand dollars on a graphics card. And I can afford it, too. The sad part is the amount of people who can't afford it, but will buy it anyway.

 

 

[SolarNova]

In a surprise to absolutely no one .. the prices are once again an absolute scam. And ofc once again 'people' with no money sense or self control will still buy them further encouraging this scummy pricing practice.

They have pulled pritty much every trick they can think of to buff their margins this time around to.

 

They have moved away from using the same die for the top cards now segregating them using the lower end dies for x80 cards.

They have split the x80 name in 2 using Vram, enabling them to set 2 prices (both too high)

And ofc finally they have continued with the price/tier shift that was started with the 20 series.

 

Whats next i wonder ...using performance vs previous gen and increasing price accordingly each generation ? ..sounds absurd considering it wouldn't take long for cards to start costing many thousands ...but ...we are in absurdity already.

 

years past we would hope/count of AMD to swoop in and massively chunk away at Nvidia market share with competitive performing cards for much less ..but recent generations pricing destroys that hope.