Toyota to start chargings its car owners a subscription fee for remote vehicle start

[Master Disaster]

The war of ownership is progressing forward with the auto industries biggest and one of its most respected manufacturers throwing their hat into the ring.

 

Anybody who bought a Toyota from 2018 onward equipped with a keyfob that has the ability to start the vehicle from outside will now be required to pay Toyota a monthly fee ($8pm or $80pa) for the privilege of using something they already paid for when they bought the car. An important note here is that this is a direct RF signal being sent from the fob to the car, at no point is it having to go trough any Toyota servers to tell the car to start. This will only affect remote starts, pressing the button from inside the vehicle will still work.

Quote

Yes, it appears the pay-to-play ethos that's spreading around the industry has reached the world's largest automaker. A Toyota spokesperson confirmed to The Drive that if a 2018 or later Toyota is equipped with Toyota's Remote Connect functions, the vehicle must be enrolled in a valid subscription in order for the key fob to start the car remotely. To be clear, what we're talking about is the proximity-based RF remote start system, where you press a button on the fob to start the car while outside of it within a certain distance—say, from your front door to warm up your vehicle in the driveway on a cold morning before you get in. Your fob uses radio waves to communicate with the car, and no connection back to Toyota's servers is needed. But the function will not work without a larger Remote Connect subscription.

 

It's become more common in recent years for automakers to charge for apps that allow drivers to monitor, lock, or start their cars with their smartphones. As far as we can tell, though, Toyota's the first company to charge for full use of your physical key fob—either $8 a month or $80 a year at the Remote Connect plan's current price.

 

Usage of the service is tied to which audio package you paid for when you bought the car, buyers who pay for Audio Plus get 3 years of free remote start, buyers of Premium Audio get 10 years.

Quote

When buying a new Toyota, buyers have the option to trial Toyota's Connected Services. These can include features like emergency assistance, hotspot connectivity, and app-based services like remote vehicle unlocking and starting. The length of Toyota's trial depends on the vehicle in question, as well the audio package included in the vehicle. For example, vehicles equipped with Audio Plus get a trial of up to three years whereas Premium Audio may have a trial for up to 10 years. Beyond that, drivers will need to pay for a subscription to continue using the key fob's remote start.

 

It also might not be obvious when buying a new Toyota that the remote start function is tied to a subscription. For example, the dealer video below shows a brief overview from a salesperson who states that the key should work on certain Toyotas "as long as [they have] Audio Plus"—no mention of the trial period or required subscription once that ends.

Source - https://www.thedrive.com/news/43329/toyota-made-its-key-fob-remote-start-into-a-subscription-service

 

Buy everything, own nothing, be happy, the mantra of the modern corporate society we live in. The absolute best thing about this is it literally costs them money to check subscription status of vehicles where as just letting the fob start the car for everyone would cost them nothing.

 

I can see this going class action.

[Oshino Shinobu]

Charging monthly premiums for features that literally cost nothing for the manufacturer to keep active is ridiculous. Not sure how Toyota's remote start works, but if remote start required the FOB or smartphone to send a request to a Toyota hosted server, which then relays to the car to start it, then I could understand the fees. Still ridiculous for something you've spent tens of thousands on, but at least they'd have an excuse of server uptime. Things that very obviously don't require this, like BMW's stupid heated seats subscription, are revolting. 

 

I really hate how everything is moving towards monthly subscription models. I've avoided them pretty well so far, but it means I'm using old versions of software because I just want a perpetual license.

[RejZoR]

And this is how you start losing customers. Only shitty thing is few car makers will do this and lose customers and then we'll come to a point when it'll become a norm and everyone will be doing this shit and you won't be able to avoid it.

 

I still believe it's a shitty and lame business. Imagine buying Roomba robot and they charge you extra for "remote" start. It's taken for granted to have that kind of functionality. It's ridiculous. For cars, even more so because you're never 30 kilometers away and needing it to start which might actually be the case for a robot cleaner that you absolutely run when you're not anywhere near home. You need it to start from your house so you don't have to dress yourself in the winter to defrost the fucking car.

 

And from the original post it's literally for a god damn key fob. What cost does Toyota have with fob sending signal to a car 10 meters away? Toyota, get fucked. I hope their sales drop in massive number because of this. So they won't try it ever again and be a warning for the rest.

[Master Disaster]

5 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

And this is how you start losing customers. Only shitty thing is few car makers will do this and lose customers and then we'll come to a point when it'll become a norm and everyone will be doing this shit and you won't be able to avoid it.

 

I still believe it's a shitty and lame business. Imagine buying Roomba robot and they charge you extra for "remote" start. It's taken for granted to have that kind of functionality. It's ridiculous. For cars, even more so because you're never 30 kilometers away and needing it to start which might actually be the case for a robot cleaner that you absolutely run when you're not anywhere near home. You need it to start from your house so you don't have to dress yourself in the winter to defrost the fucking car.

 

And from the original post it's literally for a god damn key fob. What cost does Toyota have with fob sending signal to a car 10 meters away? Toyota, get fucked. I hope their sales drop in massive number because of this. So they won't try it ever again and be a warning for the rest.

Did you ever see that advert the auto industry put out against Right to repair where they claimed allowing third parties access to your car could lead to women getting raped since third party repairers can theoretically clone the key and wait for a woman in a car park on a dark night?

 

What happens when said woman is being followed through said car park by a nefarious individual and would like her car open and running before she gets there so she can jump in and drive away?

[mr moose]

Hopefully the ACCC will be watching this sort of thing closely.  They already have a win up their sleeve with steam being a service.   I would like it if they made it law so if there was an ongoing fee then the initial outlay should be zero.  Like WOW, AOC etc.  Know what you are getting and be able to cancel at anytime.

[Lightwreather]

So let me get this straight: You pay money to start the car?

 

 

 

Huh... Next we might see them asking for a subscription fee to turn the car to the left and another to turn right, one more to reverse and a couple more to engage the brakes. But ofc Moving forward is included for free with the purchase.

/s

[Spindel]

Why would I want to start the car at a distance?

 

A lot of people in this thread getting their knickers in a twist but no one seem to reflect over the point of the function. 

[Nayr438]

Just now, Spindel said:

Why would I want to start the car at a distance?

 

A lot of people in this thread getting their knickers in a twist but no one seem to reflect over the point of the function. 

I do it to warm up the vehicle in the morning when its below freezing. I can start my car from within the house and let it run for about 15 minutes, when I go to leave the car is warmed up and the windows are defrosted. Same if it's hot outside, i can make sure the vehicle is nice and cozy before I ever open the car door.

[Master Disaster]

9 minutes ago, Spindel said:

Why would I want to start the car at a distance?

 

A lot of people in this thread getting their knickers in a twist but no one seem to reflect over the point of the function. 

You =/= Everyone

[Spindel]

9 minutes ago, Nayr438 said:

I do it to warm up the vehicle in the morning when its below freezing. I can start my car from within the house and let it run for about 15 minutes, when I go to leave the car is warmed up and the windows are defrosted. Same if it's hot outside, i can make sure the vehicle is nice and cozy before I ever open the car door.

If you live in a house and have an outlet get a block heater instead. Much better for both the engine and the environment. 

[Ankh Tech]

THank god my parents were conservative when they bought their RAV 4 1 year ago. It's basically a no options choice (we were on a budget)

[aDoomGuy]

Soon:

 

Auto manufacturers start charging it's car owners for a subscription fee for starting the car's engine.

 

Meeh...

[Vishera]

Is there an option to buy the car instead of just renting it?

I don't want to rent a car for life...

Well,just like with john deer people will hack it to work as it's suppose to.

But people should just boycott Toyota for it.

[aDoomGuy]

1 minute ago, Vishera said:

Is there an option to buy the car instead of just renting it?

I don't want to rent a car for life...

Well,just like with john deer people will hack it to work as it's suppose to.

But people should just boycott Toyota for it.

This is the new standard my man... What people should do is boycott newer automobiles altogether...

[RejZoR]

47 minutes ago, Spindel said:

Why would I want to start the car at a distance?

 

A lot of people in this thread getting their knickers in a twist but no one seem to reflect over the point of the function. 

Rest of the world has winters you know. Instead of having to dress up just so you can go through frigging cold to start the car and then shower and dress up while car is doing its thing, you would start it from inside your home. Yes, it's not a necessary feature, it's 100% convenience, but if this was some sort of super special remote system that relays through Toyota servers, I'd kinda sort of understand, though most companies would just give this as feature that would attract buyers to your brand. It seems Toyota just takes buyers for granted if they feel charging for actually local "remote" start functionality with a freaking key fob as a normal thing to do and not expect huge backlash from it. It's NO different than "remote" unlocking of a car using key fob. Imagine being charged per unlock. With a key fob. That's the level of absurdity here. They want to charge users local communication between key fob and car. It's insane. It shouldn't matter why you need to start a car remotely within proximity, it's why the f**k they want to charge us for it with subscription.

[Vishera]

10 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Imagine being charged per unlock. With a key fob.

Sounds like micro transactions - Koei Tecmo style, every little thing is a DLC,what's next? EA style surprise mechanics?

https://store.steampowered.com/dlc/838380/DEAD_OR_ALIVE_6/

[Master Disaster]

Just now, Vishera said:

Sounds like micro transactions - what's next? EA style surprise mechanics?

You press the button and have a 50% chance of the alarm going off, a 30% chance of the tyres deflating, a 10% chance of the door unlocking or a 10% chance of the car calling the police on you.

[Nayr438]

1 hour ago, Spindel said:

If you live in a house and have an outlet get a block heater instead. Much better for both the engine and the environment. 

I don't care about the Engine Temperature. I care about the Temperature inside the Vehicle when I get inside of it. I have no interest in obtaining, setting up, and running a cord to a block heater, of which I can only use when I happen to be home.

[Beerzerker]

So.... What's next?
Pay just to have heat period - Or AC?

As said these features have already been paid for and are in use now, I knew when Tesla started this others would see it and try it themselves.

 

[Heliian]

34 minutes ago, Nayr438 said:

I don't care about the Engine Temperature. I care about the Temperature inside the Vehicle when I get inside of it. I have no interest in obtaining, setting up, and running a cord to a block heater, of which I can only use when I happen to be home.

Block heaters are useful when temps are below - 15degc.  It plugs into a regular outlet.  I have a timer that turns it on 2hrs before I leave for work.  It helps reduce engine wear and it heats the interior up faster when you start it. 

 

As for Toyota or anyone else who tries to pull this level of skullduggery, you're losing my business.  

[SolarNova]

Read: 'Toyota to start loosing customers'

[wanderingfool2]

4 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

Anybody who bought a Toyota from 2018 onward equipped with a keyfob that has the ability to start the vehicle from outside will now be required to pay Toyota a monthly fee ($8pm or $80pa) for the privilege of using something they already paid for when they bought the car. An important note here is that this is a direct RF signal being sent from the fob to the car, at no point is it having to go trough any Toyota servers to tell the car to start. This will only affect remote starts, pressing the button from inside the vehicle will still work.

The bit that bothers me is that it's a feature which you have to pay for to have it available...to have a fee attached as well doesn't really sit well with me.  (Along with them using it as a selling point at dealerships, but failing to mention it's a subscription)...i.e. making it retroactive.

 

What is worse though is the reason why it's 2018 and above...it's because 2017 and older used 3G, so when 3G gets shutdown the services that you subscribe to will go dead [and apparently they aren't doing any upgrades to allow for things like phone tethering to provide the data]...so people who bought their car in 2017 can have their services limited.

 

3 hours ago, Spindel said:

Why would I want to start the car at a distance?

 

A lot of people in this thread getting their knickers in a twist but no one seem to reflect over the point of the function. 

Lots of reasons, hot day so you get AC running before getting to the car.

 

Winter's day (needing to start the defrost cycle)...instead of going outside you can turn on your car while getting ready.  It's a feature that you don't really use as often, but when you do it can make the quality of life better.

1 hour ago, Beerzerker said:

As said these features have already been paid for and are in use now, I knew when Tesla started this others would see it and try it themselves.

Don't kid yourself, Tesla is hardly the one to kickstart this trend.  Toyota has had paid GPS maps for the longest time, OnStar has been a thing way before Tesla, and the list goes on of examples where car manufacturers have been pulling this kind of stunt.

[Spindel]

2 hours ago, RejZoR said:

Rest of the world has winters you know. Instead of having to dress up just so you can go through frigging cold to start the car and then shower and dress up while car is doing its thing, you would start it from inside your home. Yes, it's not a necessary feature, it's 100% convenience, but if this was some sort of super special remote system that relays through Toyota servers, I'd kinda sort of understand, though most companies would just give this as feature that would attract buyers to your brand. It seems Toyota just takes buyers for granted if they feel charging for actually local "remote" start functionality with a freaking key fob as a normal thing to do and not expect huge backlash from it. It's NO different than "remote" unlocking of a car using key fob. Imagine being charged per unlock. With a key fob. That's the level of absurdity here. They want to charge users local communication between key fob and car. It's insane. It shouldn't matter why you need to start a car remotely within proximity, it's why the f**k they want to charge us for it with subscription.

Stupid me I forgot I live in the warm climate of lat 59,3 N

[HarryNyquist]

Chalk another one off my list of cars to never buy.

Of all the companies to embrace the MTX model I literally never expected Toyota to be on that list.

[Fasterthannothing]

And stupid stuff like this is why I buy manual cars and with minimal options and then modify it myself. You can wire your own remote start no point in paying money just to pay more money every month to use it.