Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

[Lightwreather]

3 minutes ago, Doobeedoo said:

I mean Edge is literally better though.

It is (subjectively ofc), but that doesn't really excuse this behaviour tho

[IPD]

As underhanded as google is in virtually every way, I'm not going to bat an eye at this.  If the tables were turned, and MS was trying to destroy Netscape Navigator or Word Perfect, then yeah...I might be peeved.  But this is google we're talking about.  The same company that records the SSID's from every wifi it comes across while its cars are recording google-earth views.  The same company that has highly biased search results that can be skewed by anything from blood money to crowd bombing.  The same company that wants to record/obtain piles of data about you that would make Bezos and Zuckerberg both green with envy.  And the list goes on and on (eg. Pixel phones are volunteering yourself to lack privacy).

 

MS is no saint, but it is clearly the lesser of 2 evils in this case.

[linkboy]

My primary browser is Vivaldi and I doubt I'll change that anytime soon. 

 

I do have Edge as a backup on both my Windows and Linux installs (as well as my S21 Ultra), but I don't really use it. 

 

I'd want to use Firefox, but I hate the Android version. 

[Vishera]

Edge is malware...

Acts like adware and spyware - Edge is malicious.

[IPD]

P.S.

Last "new' browser I installed was Pale Moon.  Chrome only exists for those rare instances when I want to query info (vpn style) to see if anything changes. 

[IPD]

1 minute ago, Vishera said:

Edge is malware...

Acts like adware and spyware - Edge is malicious.

Perhaps.  But do you really trust ad-ons for privacy....on a browser built by a company whose very livelihood depends on compromising every bit of privacy you have?

[Kilrah]

6 minutes ago, IPD said:

 The same company that wants to record/obtain piles of data about you that would make Bezos and Zuckerberg both green with envy. 

MS is no saint, but it is clearly the lesser of 2 evils in this case.

The only reason they're pushing it so hard is so they can join the others and get a slice of the pie...

[Vishera]

Just now, IPD said:

Perhaps.  But do you really trust ad-ons for privacy....on a browser built by a company whose very livelihood depends on compromising every bit of privacy you have?

It depends on the company,depends on the browser and depends on the add-on itself.

Are you referring to a specific company?

[Alder Lake]

5 hours ago, J-from-Nucleon said:

when I'm on windows or need a quick Chromium Browser

That's kind of an edge case

[TetraSky]

Haven't they been doing this for a long time already?

Also, just tried it. It didn't show for me.

[Cyberspirit]

3 hours ago, steelo said:

I use Brave and have noticed with Windows 11, I cannot pin it to the taskbar. This may sound like a minor complaint, but it's pretty annoying. I'm sure there is a workaround if I were smarter and put in time to research it...LOL

I have it pinned there and I don't think I had to jump through hoops, or at least I don't remember. Try maybe pinning an icon of it there.

[uncreativespace]

It's a matter of taste at this point now that Edge is Chromium based. Do you need Trident compatibility and buy into 365? Use Edge. Do you hate Microsoft? Use Chrome.
Hate both companies' business practices and like flexibility? Use Firefox.
All three are pretty good options these days.

[Arika]

So no "their platform their rules" with this one?

Oh right, microsoft is not an approved company. 

[Jtalk4456]

9 hours ago, J-from-Nucleon said:

•    “Microsoft Edge runs on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust of Microsoft.”
•     “That browser is so 2008! Do you know what’s new? Microsoft Edge.”
•     “‘I hate saving money,’ said no one ever. Microsoft Edge is the best browser for online shopping.”

 

So the first and last, I don't really see a problem with as far as wording. the overall behavior is beyond my legal knowledge or what counts as antitrust and all that.

The first and last are not DIScouraging chrome, but rather ENcouraging Edge. To me this is just advertisement, and while a dick move, I couldn't care less and just ignore it anyways. Now the middle one is actually insulting a competitor, I'd guess they're gonna have trouble with that one if it goes to court.

[Gork]

5 hours ago, Mel0nMan said:

Wow, wouldn't it be a shame if they were to be hit with an antitrust lawsuit for trying to create a monopoly over web browsers? Such a shame huh?

if anything that'd be google to get hit with one. they got goatse'd in the 90s only because of IAAYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE  er explorer, partially because of  people hating up them getting Java(the oldschool VM) to not suck, and some crap related to being backed into the OS.  Now you could use the same argument about chrome being a practically baked into android.  But edge just doesn't have the same presence explorer did. Frankly neither Chrome or Edge are exactly a wholes takehome beachbabe, or a prize worth noting now. Chrome eat ram and disk space.  edge is  just their.

[LAwLz]

10 hours ago, Stahlmann said:

In any case, new Edge is better than Chrome anyway 

[Citation Needed] 

 

10 hours ago, Stahlmann said:

Also worth to mention that there are a lot of privacy features in Edge so there's less data harvesting than with Chrome.

Ehm... The opposite is true. Edge collects MORE data on you than Chrome by default. Edge is worse than Chrome in terms of privacy, and that's saying something. 

https://www.scss.tcd.ie/Doug.Leith/pubs/browser_privacy.pdf

 

I am very surprised that so many people think Edge is better than Chrome for privacy when the opposite is true. I guess Microsoft did push that PR message pretty hard, and it's easy to assume that nobody can be worse than Google when it comes to privacy. Well, Microsoft managed to beat Google at data collection, somehow. 

 

 

Personally I left Edge a while ago. I got fed up with all the bloat Microsoft were adding. I though edge was good when the had just switched to Chromium, but now with the addition of full screen ads when you update the browser, the constant nagging to set Bing as your search engine, and now apparently it comes bundled with some "buy now pay later" service from a third part called Zip. 

 

Microsoft do not view Edge as a browser. They are not interesting in making it a good browser. They see it as a tool to push their other services such as Bing and MSN and it's awful as a result. 

[GoodBytes]

Ok 2 things, and my real concern:

1. Google forced its web browser for years on people by injecting itself on popular downloads (via paid agreements with the developers) in unrelated program installers. No one cared. Microsoft shows a pop-up, end of the world. Kinda silly.
    
2. For those complaining about "hard to set default", If you join the Insider program you have the option that Microsoft didn't have time to slip it through the October release:
   
   
   
   
   And when you hit "Set default" is sets all supported file extension to the web browser set as default (in this case, Firefox)

 

I am more concern about Microsoft adding (at least in the US, I am not seeing this.. maybe it will come in a bit of time), ZIP payment service to it.

Probably there is a turn off option like its Coupon service (which is basically Honey, a company owned by Microsoft), but still. I have read that MS is not making any money when the service is used, so I am curious how much ZIP is paying Microsoft to have them do this... 

[hishnash]

3 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

I have read that MS is not making any money when the service is used, so I am curious how much ZIP is paying Microsoft to have them do this... 

Facebook don't make any money either... while MS might not be getting paid $ every time you use it they will likely be getting data every time you use it! Now that is powerful stuff how are they going to use that data? we do not know.

[D13H4RD]

"...with the trust of Microsoft" 

 

Who writes this stuff?!?! 

[StDragon]

59 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

"...with the trust of Microsoft" 

 

Who writes this stuff?!?! 

Someone in marketing getting paid well over six figures.

[jagdtigger]

5 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

Google forced its web browser for years on people by injecting itself on popular downloads (via paid agreements with the developers) in unrelated program installers. No one cared. Microsoft shows a pop-up, end of the world. Kinda silly.

Apple vs orange, you could easily opt out/uninstall. On the other hand you cannot do either with edge, hell on w11 you cant even fully switch away from it...

[Stahlmann]

9 hours ago, LAwLz said:

[Citation Needed] 

 

Ehm... The opposite is true. Edge collects MORE data on you than Chrome by default. Edge is worse than Chrome in terms of privacy, and that's saying something. 

https://www.scss.tcd.ie/Doug.Leith/pubs/browser_privacy.pdf

 

I am very surprised that so many people think Edge is better than Chrome for privacy when the opposite is true. I guess Microsoft did push that PR message pretty hard, and it's easy to assume that nobody can be worse than Google when it comes to privacy. Well, Microsoft managed to beat Google at data collection, somehow. 

Out-of-the-box maybe Chrome is better in terms of data collection, idk. But Edge has a lot of settings regarding what data 3rd parties can collect, auto-deleting browser data when closing, tracker blocking, etc. Last time i used Chrome it either didn't have any of these settings or they were buried in some submenu and not in the settings tab. Reviews on launch basically concluded it's on par with Chrome in terms of speed, it can use chrome extentions and even emulate internet explorer (which is surprisingly important to a lot of business software), so i'd say it's also better in terms of compatibility. Memory useage is also lower. Netflix can run in 4K (720p max on chrome). It supports HDR.

 

THIS article talks a lot about in what way it stands out for privacy features. (You'll have to translate, it's in German)

 

So for me Edge offers a better feature package and is in no way inferior to Chrome. And that's why i'm happy to recommend to try it out before downloading Chrome or Firefox just out of the "included browser is crap" habit.

 

9 hours ago, LAwLz said:

Personally I left Edge a while ago. I got fed up with all the bloat Microsoft were adding. I though edge was good when the had just switched to Chromium, but now with the addition of full screen ads when you update the browser, the constant nagging to set Bing as your search engine, and now apparently it comes bundled with some "buy now pay later" service from a third part called Zip. 

I never got any prompts to change my search engine to bing. I'm not saying it's not a thing, it just never happened to me so far so i cannot confirm or deny it.

What bloat do you mean?

 

9 hours ago, LAwLz said:

Microsoft do not view Edge as a browser. They are not interesting in making it a good browser. They see it as a tool to push their other services such as Bing and MSN and it's awful as a result. 

For not being interested in making a good browser they do a suprisingly good job at offering the best browser for me personally.

Again, i never got promted to switch my standard search engine.

I don't even know what MSN is tbh. (Which if anything, means that it's not pushed into my face)

 

Maybe it's worth to mention that i also use a 3rd party adblocker, so maybe some stuff you're talking about is falling under what is getting blocked.

[maartendc]

21 hours ago, J-from-Nucleon said:

Summary

New prompts in Edge steer people away from Chrome

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

So, Microsoft is now doing what Google sort of does. Okay. This will likely help boost Edge adoption ...... for the few people who don't click the "X" and download Chrome anyway. Now, I do use Edge (when I'm on windows or need a quick Chromium Browser for certain edge cases that Firefox can't be used for) but this might actually have the exact opposite of the intended Effect, drive away people form Edge. Welp, Microsoft's gonna do what they're gonna do, best hope that they won't ruin Edge or it's reputation (which is probably gonna be a big feat seeing as it's rep is sort of in tatters now).

Lawsuit incoming in 3....

                                 2....

                                 1....

Sources

TheVerge

Neowin

I guess Mirosoft didnt learn from the past.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Corp.

[LAwLz]

2 hours ago, James Evens said:

Like purposely breaking Microsoft Edge optimisation on YouTube (before they switched to chromium)?

Are you perhaps talking about how Youtube performed worse in non-Chrome browsers because of a redesign in 2018? If so then:

1) Google didn't break it intentionally from what we know.

2) The issue has been fixed.

3) It wasn't Microsoft Edge optimizations that broke. It was Firefox and Edge not supporting some features that made it slower.

 

If you want more details about it then check out the posts I made in this thread back when it happened. The TL;DR is basically that Google didn't really do anything malicious and things are far more complicated than "Google makes Youtube slow in other browsers because they are evil".

Making a web browser is hard because of all the standards you have to follow (hence why Microsoft stopped developing their own browser engine), and on top of that Youtube is a far more complex site than most people assume. Just because it performs better or worse in some browser does not mean it is intentional or even the fault of some specific group.

 

 

 

 

41 minutes ago, Stahlmann said:

But Edge has a lot of settings regarding what data 3rd parties can collect, auto-deleting browser data when closing, tracker blocking, etc.

Chrome has those settings too but that's besides the point.

When it comes to how much data Google collects on you through Chrome, and how much data Microsoft collects on you through Edge, Microsoft collects far more. Microsoft may give you slightly more tools to prevent third parties (like websites) from tracking you, but they don't give you a whole lot of tools to prevent Microsoft from tracking you.

 

 

 

41 minutes ago, Stahlmann said:

I never got any prompts to change my search engine to bing. I'm not saying it's not a thing, it just never happened to me so far so i cannot confirm or deny it.

What bloat do you mean?

Consider yourself lucky. I have gotten this popup (which blocks all other interactions with my browser until I close it) 4 times on my desktop in the last half a year or so (maybe it appears once a month), and an equal amount of times on my laptop.

 

Other bloat is stuff like the built in math solver, coupon finder, the "search with bing" button that appears whenever you select text, the Zip "but now, play later" service, and so on. Those things should be extensions but instead they are built in to the browser, and what's even worse is that settings for them doesn't seem to sync so whenever I install Edge I have to manually go through and disable all of them, and they are spread out in the menus as well so I have to basically go through the entire settings page to disable it and make it work the way I want it to.

 

 

Microsoft likes to A/B test as well as region lock certain things so your difference might be very different from mine, but for me it has gone from "wow, this is my new favourite browser" to "it feels like a second job keeping Edge in check because it constantly tries to push me to use things I don't want to use" over the course of the last 6 months.

When I updated Edge a week ago I was shown a full screen ad for some service called philo. I don't want to see a full screen ad for something when I update my browser. 

 

[Dabombinable]

18 hours ago, RejZoR said:

The more Microsoft this, the more I hate Edge. From stupid nag when changing browser to blocking protocols and file types to this dumb shit. Microsoft, instead of your product speaking for itself, you're using such dumb tactics that will just make everyone hate Edge. I had neutral opinion about it and even kinda liked Edge on iOS. Now I hate it so much I yet again only use it to download Firefox and then not touch it ever again. And I make sure I don't touch it AT ALL. Stop being assholes, my god.

Changing default app preferences from the UWP apps to Windows Media player (I have been using codec packs since my first XP PC), and it was excruciating having to go through and change every single preference by extension. MS really wants to piss people off with how hard they are forcing their newer shit on people.

Microsoft's attempt at having a shot at Chrome is funny as well - considering Edge's Chromium base.