Is martial law coming to the US?

[oskar23]

I think we all can agree that those people are not protesting. They are destroying everything on their way for no reason. ATMs are stolen, cars from dealers, packages from delivery vehicles, stores vandalized, places being burned down, business owners beaten for protecting their property and list goes on. It has nothing to do with protesting. Will military be needed to stop that?

[PlayStation 2]

In recent memory, it hasn’t really been enacted, even in more violent situations as this, but a lot of the violence seems to be coming from people who are bussed into a specific area to specifically destroy an area. 
We could see our government trying to make a conceited effort to heavily crack down on that, but I don’t think there’s gonna be nationwide martial law.

[Tristerin]

The "Posse Comitatus Act" restricts the use of military on US soil to enforce US laws.  Disaster support and its like are different than enforcing law.

[Arika]

America is at a tipping point, and any attempt to enact martial law would be the equivalent of flipping the table that the boiling pot is tearing on the edge of. outright chaos to divide an already splitting country.

[Monkey Dust]

4 minutes ago, Arika S said:

America is at a tipping point, and any attempt to enact martial law would be the equivalent of flipping the table that the boiling pot is tearing on the edge of. outright chaos to divide an already splitting country.

Exactly. The cause of these riots is police brutality, more brutality isn't going to fix the problem. 

[TetraSky]

Countries come and go and it might be time for the US as we know it to "go".
It clearly doesn't work for everyone. The people are sick and tired of being killed/shot by those who swore to protect, just because they are one race over another. The government does nothing to actually de-escalate the tension. It just keep making things worse by sending the God damn national guard.
They want justice. It took days before that cop was finally charged and it was with Third degree, but they wanted first degree. The other cops involved, AFAIK, even though they also contributed to his death, got nothing thus far.... Then you have the trouble makers who don't want to do things peacefully by destroying everything and blame it on those who just wanted to peacefully protest the injustice. 
 

Overall, watching this from Canada is just painful. But hey, you guys did that to yourselves by only ever voting for one extreme or the other, Left or Right, no in-between. Resulting in a good bit of the population who doesn't identify with whoever wins, to feel left out. We also see it somewhat in Canada with the Conservative and the Liberals. But we don't shy away from voting in third parties. 

[Beerzerker]

46 minutes ago, Monkey Dust said:

Exactly. The cause of these riots is police brutality, more brutality isn't going to fix the problem. 

That was the reason why it began and only that, now the reason(s) are mostly just to raise hell wherever they can.

I agree - More violence will not solve it.

 

They are using the incident with the guy that was murdered as the reason why and originally it was, that's true but now it's not as related as they make it out to be if at all in some of the places these riots are happening at.

It's being orchestrated by a few behind the scenes and those are the ones that needs to be found and taken care of along with the ones doing all the damage.
Such organization to do things like bussing and so on indicates a malevolent presence with some individuals with deep pockets and an agenda. It's already been said in different incidents at different locations you see the same individuals participating in such riots.

 

That takes someone funding and basically giving orders/instructions as to what they want done and it all amounts to organized domestic terrorism.

Those would be subjects of interest to really find out who's behind it..... But many of us have a clue who it probrably is already and it fits the known narrative about them.

[Gix7Fifty]

Martial law does not have to be enacted through out the US as it was during the Civil War. It can be just a city like what happened in 1934 in Minneapolis or a very specific area like what happened in the docks of San Francisco that same year. So OP it is possible, hopefully its avoided but one thing for sure is that the people who hate and are jealous of America would love to see it happen.

[Tan3l6]

I remember in Estonia 2008 was uprising because a war memorial was going to be transferred from city center to a more appropriate place - war cemetary.

Then the russian "patriots" started vandalizing our capital in Estonia - Tallinn ... that was scary, but this event in America seems to be in very much bigger scale.

I hope the "protesters" get what they have deserved.

 

 

Not saying that the incident in US which caused the riots was at all justified - a man was killed for idiotic reason, accident or not.

[handymanshandle]

Nah the people that seem to be doing this aren’t really related to the police brutality thing they seem to be, some of them, anarchist like antifa. 
also the other cops will probably be charged it just takes time, the first one was the fastest a charge has been filed like that. There is some peaceful protesting still ongoing but a bit of it is the rioting.

[handymanshandle]

1 hour ago, Tristerin said:

The "Posse Comitatus Act" restricts the use of military on US soil to enforce US laws.  Disaster support and its like are different than enforcing law.

It makes so it can only be used at the request of the governor. The way it read to me doesn’t imply that if a governor requested military assistance for say an insurgency they couldn’t enforce martial law. 

[Curious Pineapple]

Be frigging funny if it happened, doubt all them handguns will help maintain the "freedom" when there's armed forces with bigger guns and no issues shooting to kill.

[Beerzerker]

It's not about the handguns, it's about the hearts of the people involved and behind it.

 

BTW a bit of history - It's fact that although the Japanese during WWII had considered an invasion of the west coast, one big reason they didn't attempt it was due to the fact they would not only be fighting against US forces there but basically everyone and that would have been a disaster if they had. If everyone has something to fight back with, you'd be in a bad situation with that and it's the same one the US feared to be in about an invasion of the Japanese main islands themselves.

 

Back to the present - I can see folks defending themselves but no one with any real common sense taking on the military unless they have a death wish.

[Windows9]

I don't see why they are destroying random things. If they wanted to destroy something wouldn't they just do it to the offending police station.

[Zodiark1593]

2 hours ago, oskar23 said:

I think we all can agree that those people are not protesting. They are destroying everything on their way for no reason. ATMs are stolen, cars from dealers, packages from delivery vehicles, stores vandalized, places being burned down, business owners beaten for protecting their property and list goes on. It has nothing to do with protesting. Will military be needed to stop that?

Enacting martial law at this point is like to have unpredictable results, for better or worse. The sudden threat of massive military force may deter rioting, or it may just escalate things much further. However, if riots threaten the homes and lives of innocents and children, I can’t say I’d be opposed if nothing else will stop them doing so. So long as violence is largely directed toward businesses and participants however, letting the riots burn themselves out would probably pose less risk overall, with resources directed to treating the injured and rebuilding. 
 

That isn’t to say that there isn’t more authoritarian and ruthlessly pragmatic  measures that could’ve/can be taken if government so chooses. The riots are widespread due to the speed of which information can travel. The propagation of information on social media (truthfulness is irrelevant) puts wildfires to shame. An extreme measure such as shutting off the nation’s internet and heavily restricting media (closer to the point of Floyd’s death would be more effective) would’ve likely slowed the spread of protesting and rioting across the nation, and bought time for authorities to muster resources to retain control, though now we obviously run into pretty blatant ethical and human rights concerns. Also, it would’ve difficult to predict this particular incident would end up sparking unrest in a multitude of cities. 

[Guest]

INB4 Black Panther Riots from like 1960s were exactly what happened today.

[Beerzerker]

4 minutes ago, Windows9 said:

I don't see why they are destroying random things. If they wanted to destroy something wouldn't they just do it to the offending police station.

I agree - Not only destroying stores but stores they'd have to shop at to get stuff themselves if they are the ones doing it.

It's been said many doing it aren't from those areas and that's related to bussing them in so they don't care, they'll just destroy and then go home with no repercussions over it to them unless apprehended.

It's the real residents of those areas that will suffer and pay the price in the end.

 

Also, this is an incident that in truth only pertains to where it happened - I understand what did happen wasn't right but to then have it popping up everywhere else with the accompaning crap doesn't make any sense since then it's their stores and so on that gets destroyed making life harder on them too after it's over.....

But with all the rest in play with bussing and so on I'm not so suprised TBH.

I mean I agree, wrong is wrong but two wrongs makes no right either.

 

There is a need to address it but there is a right and a wrong way to do it, this obviously being the wrong way.

For the part of those behind it, just another attempt to start and carry on a race war with the aim of destroying society as it is here, such being attempted by others in the past with that end in mind.

This is the evil that lurks within the hearts of those that's in and behind it all in play.
BTW If you're in one of these affected areas, stay safe.

[Commodus]

I see a whole lot of people wagging their fingers at violent protests and looting without acknowledging that it's a much murkier situation than some media outlets (especially right-wing outlets) want to portray.

 

For example, Target stores in Minneapolis were subject to looting because they denied milk to protesters who'd been teargassed, in addition to hiring discrimination issues and police funding.  Clearly not every store was actively hurting the community, and I'm not advocating for looting, but it's important to understand that some looting comes as a response -- it's not necessarily a mindless rage.

 

There have also been multiple instances of police overstepping their bounds since protests started, including targeted harassment of journalists, shooting rubber bullets at people filming from their porch and an NYPD SUV plowing through a crowd, among other incidents.  The police are providing textbook examples of why the protests started: some officers feel they have the right to attack or silence anyone that dares challenge their authority.

 

Would I prefer peaceful protests?  Absolutely.  But as cliche as it is to bring up MLK, he was entirely right when he said that riots are the language of the unheard.  Martial law won't fix this; it'll only give those unheard people more justification for speaking out.

[Beerzerker]

Looting can become mindless, that's the problem regardless of how it started.

 

I understand the cops will do things during this that may well egg it on but the protesters are certainly not innocent here either - Cause and effect if you will with a bad outcome regardless.

The cops if pushed will respond (It's their job) and that's how it is and the ones doing the damage already know that as fact, using it to further the violence done. It's also been seen some of these "Protesters" want to fight period and the cops do have a right to defend themselves.

I also noted it was way more than just milk that got pilfered like it was at all the other riots and looting we've ever seen before.
Those guys got gassed because they were rioting and that was a voluntary act they themselves decided to do fully aware it could happen and that was the consequence of it.

The act done by the cop that killed the guy was the same with a consequence too and he's now paying for it - And yes, he knew that in advance too, he just did it and there ya go.
I'd hate to be in his shoes once he's finally in with the prison population proper.

[Aereldor]

These 'people' (I am disparaging looters as subhuman, not any races or demographics) do not care about George Floyd... If they get locked up or shot? Fuck 'em.

 

 

 

[Commodus]

10 minutes ago, Beerzerker said:

Looting can become mindless, that's the problem regardless of how it started.

 

I understand the cops will do things during this that may well egg it on but the protesters are certainly not innocent here either - Cause and effect if you will with a bad outcome regardless.

The cops if pushed will respond (It's their job) and that's how it is and the ones doing the damage already know that as fact, using it to further the violence done. It's also been seen some of these "Protesters" want to fight period and the cops do have a right to defend themselves.

I also noted it was way more than just milk that got pilfered like it was at all the other riots and looting we've ever seen before.
Those guys got gassed because they were rioting and that was a voluntary act they themselves decided to do fully aware it could happen and that was the consequence of it.

The act done by the cop that killed the guy was the same with a consequence too and he's now paying for it - And yes, he knew that in advance too, he just did it and there ya go.
I'd hate to be in his shoes once he's finally in with the prison population proper.

It's not completely clean on either side, but the whole point is to keep those "tsk, tsk" people in check, the ones who think all the violence and looting comes from people who are just looking for an excuse to lash out, and that the police are just responding in kind.  The police brutality I mentioned during the protests is just the tip of the iceberg.

 

And yes, more than milk was taken... but like I said, it's the culmination of numerous factors.  Being denied basic food is just the breaking point.  Imagine if a store seemingly had a grudge against your entire culture for years; would you react to being denied milk, which you need to avoid the agony of teargas, by just shoplifting the milk or writing a sternly-worded complaint to the manager?  Hell no.

 

I'm not sure where the end is, but right now it's a vicious cycle where the police play at least as large a role in perpetuating violence as some of the protesters.  The US (and other countries for that matter) needs serious rethinks of its approaches to policing and discrimination cases, and the sooner those happen the better.

[ARikozuM]

You want to arrest the looters? Do it then! 

 

You leave the actual bulk of the protestors alone. If Fox, CNN, et al. want to continue supporting the institutions, they will reap what they've sowed. They disparaged every peaceful protest up to this point and now you disparage violence. You're either for the peaceful protests and acting to fix it, or you don't care at all. 

 

Edit: The peaceful protestors and media outlets are getting shot and gassed more than the looters are. 

 

Also inb4 lock.

[Master Delta Chief]

3 hours ago, oskar23 said:

I think we all can agree that those people are not protesting. They are destroying everything on their way for no reason. ATMs are stolen, cars from dealers, packages from delivery vehicles, stores vandalized, places being burned down, business owners beaten for protecting their property and list goes on. It has nothing to do with protesting. Will military be needed to stop that?

For the record, there are people legitimately protesting for proper reasons. And yes, you have those who vandalize and take advantage of the situation but in some cases it's necessary in order to send a message to the government. And let me end it on this: The message is far, far more IMPORTANT than the riots or any other kind of damage done to shops. 

[Zodiark1593]

49 minutes ago, Commodus said:

I see a whole lot of people wagging their fingers at violent protests and looting without acknowledging that it's a much murkier situation than some media outlets (especially right-wing outlets) want to portray.

 

For example, Target stores in Minneapolis were subject to looting because they denied milk to protesters who'd been teargassed, in addition to hiring discrimination issues and police funding.  Clearly not every store was actively hurting the community, and I'm not advocating for looting, but it's important to understand that some looting comes as a response -- it's not necessarily a mindless rage.

 

There have also been multiple instances of police overstepping their bounds since protests started, including targeted harassment of journalists, shooting rubber bullets at people filming from their porch and an NYPD SUV plowing through a crowd, among other incidents.  The police are providing textbook examples of why the protests started: some officers feel they have the right to attack or silence anyone that dares challenge their authority.

 

Would I prefer peaceful protests?  Absolutely.  But as cliche as it is to bring up MLK, he was entirely right when he said t hat riots are the language of the unheard.  Martial law won't fix this; it'll only give those unheard people more justification for speaking out.

There are officers in a number of cities that have joined the protests, Santa Cruz and Flint being a couple examples. I’d imagine that there are those among the police force that are horribly angered and distraught at not just the killing, but the other officers that stood by and allowed it to occur. 
 

My opinion below: (directed toward the officers standing by at the incident, not Derek) 

 

While there are probably some people in the police that are the more power hungry or impulsive type, I don’t think that’s necessarily what occurred here. Rather, I think succumbing to human faults was the primary spark here. Doing the right thing is sometimes not the easy thing to do. 
 

 Throwing the handcuffs on a nameless troublemaker is probably easy enough. Throwing the handcuffs on a close buddy that you’ve probably have had drinks with, maybe even mentored you, is another matter. Peer pressure is a thing that exists as well, and being the sole voice of dissent amongst several reluctant officers is again, not an easy thing to do. 
 

The prospect of stopping one of their own is probably something many officers believe won’t happen to them or anyone close. Few are likely prepared to do just that, and in this case, cost Floyd his life, and led to some pretty disastrous consequences. Had even one officer   taken a stand, and stopped Derek from killing Floyd, we’d probably still have COVID on front page news. 
 

While there are very few means to prove an officer is prepared to arrest one of their own if necessary, at the very minimum, those present at the incident and failed to act have definitively proven they do not have what it takes to hold a badge.
 

Opinion over: I’m hoping the above isn’t offensive or in any way, making making of what occurred. This is in no way an excuse for what occurred, either Derek, nor the officers that remained inactive when the killing occurred.  I aimed for as close to neutral as possible in presenting my opinion as to the mindset. 

[dalekphalm]

3 hours ago, Tristerin said:

The "Posse Comitatus Act" restricts the use of military on US soil to enforce US laws.  Disaster support and its like are different than enforcing law.

How does that work when US soldiers are deployed during other riots? Like, say, the 1992 LA riots?

 

Which, unsurprisingly, was also caused by police brutality and racial disparity. They deployed the marines, and Army infantry. 
 

Granted, I have no idea if either were involved in direct violence. 
 

I think the riots are terrible - but I have no qualms ultimately about the fact that they started. 
 

Sometimes you need to send a massive brutal message for the system to adjust and for those in power to listen.
 

Bringing the murderous racist cop to justice with the murder charge is a good start. But for a lot of these people, it’s not enough. It’s not enough because it should have never happened. And it will happen again, and they know it. 
 

And you got dumbasses like the Mayor saying “if he can say he can’t breathe, then he can breathe” - you know, ignoring that you can asphyxiate someone without cutting off 100% airflow.