Climate change real or hoax?

[TempestCatto]

I believe in it, just not to the degree people like the EPA want you to think. I believe we as humans do make an effect on it, but I don't think we're making things that much worse. After all we are a droplet ina massive ocean when you think about it. Personally, I believe by the time it becomes a very serious issue (in terms of what earth will be doing/how it will behave) the sun will be ready to swallow the planet anyway. Still though, I do like to do what I can to help.

[Tog Driver]

5 minutes ago, PacketMan said:

Do you think the meat industry is eco friendly in any way?

I guess not, but what's the alternative? not eating meat?

[TempestCatto]

14 minutes ago, PacketMan said:

Do you think the meat industry is eco friendly in any way? The amount of resources needed to run farms is too big compared to vegetables, fruits, etc and we can only benefit from meat in small amounts

The only comment I'll make here is this: You need tractors to till and plow the land to grow those foods. You need tractors to spray fertilizers, pesticides, fungicides, and sometimes even water. You need them to harvest the fruits and vegetables. You need trucks to take them to a preparing facility, and trucks to take them to stores. Is that still eco friendly to you? It's not just about how much fuel and emissions a tractor or truck uses and has, it's about the turnover. How much food is produced for every significant amount of emission pollution? We can't expect to feed countries and nations with just our own backyards and some basic tools. People did it back then, but that was because the population density was way lower than it is now. I wouldn't know for sure, but to me it seems like both meats and ground grown food take about the same amount of resources to get into stores. Besides that, it's been proven that our bodies need meat, because of the proteins. Sure, perhaps there are now pills or other supplements to take. But that doesn't include calories and even carbs, which people who have active jobs (like me) need in order to have the energy needed to exert the forces they do.

[wasab]

13 minutes ago, Tog Driver said:

I guess not, but what's the alternative? not eating meat?

How about eating humans. It's good population control as well as conserving natural resources. 

[Tog Driver]

1 minute ago, wasab said:

How about eating humans. It's good population control as well as conserving natural resources. 

How about not. . .    Who get's to decide who to eat?

[Tog Driver]

3 minutes ago, PacketMan said:

Yeah you can, but when your lunch is beef and your dinner is pork, day after day, you need to look for alternatives, I'm not the "WE NEED TO STOP EATING MEAT RIGHT NOW!!!!" guy but I know there will come a day when it will no longer be an alternative

My point here is: there's a middle ground between eating meat in every meal and not eating meal in any meal

I don't know about if you can actually be healthy while not eating meat (doubt it), but the thing is, I really like meat. . .

[TempestCatto]

16 minutes ago, PacketMan said:

We don't need meat protein, there are hundreds of non-meat proteins and the huge amount of protein we take to our bodies and the little exercise we do is a problem

About the trucks, the meat industry needs trucks too, how about the food produced to feed the animals? The whole process of making that food or working the land for the cows are whatever animal to eat from it, the whole process of killing the animals and preparing the meat, and the distribution of meat, etc; there are studies that shows that the meat industry (the ethical one) consumes way more resources and with more humans each year we need to look for healthier and more sustainable alternatives

Find me a reputable place that says this, I may then believe you when you say that about proteins (my dad is a bodybuilder and has researched for years the best foods to consume, for what he does. For people like that, they do need the meats).

 

As I said before, you need to look at turnover. How much food is put in stores vs how much pollution does it take to get there? As far as I'm concerned, there's more food produced than there is pollution from all those processes. Otherwise, the many farms in my family, and the many farms neighboring me would have all been shutdown by now. Typically (as far as I know) you don't really do much to the land while the animals are alive, you just herd them from one field to another and then back again. And unless you feed your animals foods to make them bigger and all that, you don't always feed them. Typically they eat grass. Even still, a lot of the farms that grow animals grow other things as well, including the food/feed for them. So it's really kinda like killing two birds with one stone.

[Shreyas1]

I believe in it but I also don't believe in over the top regulations that some politicians are pushing

 

 

[lewdicrous]

Yes, it's real.

[Lord Mirdalan]

15 hours ago, spwath said:

I believe it's true because like.. facts

Yeah... Basically what I was going to say.

 

 

 

[TempestCatto]

21 minutes ago, PacketMan said:

Yeah of course you can be healthy, there have been thousand myths about how bad is to not eat meat and the importance of meat in the diet, but that's actually bullshit, you can get carbohydrates, proteins, sugars, fiber, whatever you want from thousand non-meat foods

I used to love the taste of meat, but now I enjoy more other flavours and don't really like how full I feel after eating meat

But this is something personal, I understand the need to eat meat and it's hard to change diets, for me it started as a hobby to learn the different food around the world

That's why whey is so badly sold /s

There are lots of vegan bodybuilders, I don't get the myth of "To create muscle you need to eat meat!", a friend of mine is on the way to become a bodybuilder and is vegan too, no problems found so far

https://paleoleap.com/meat-protein/

 

That's one example right there. Some of those things you may be able to get in pill/supplement form. But not all. You can get all the stuff you list from plants, but there's more to be had in meats alone (it's also typically easier for the body to process it from a balanced diet of meats and plants, not just one or the other). You can't just eat meats only though, you need to balance it (I don't because I'm a fat lard. But people who do balance it are way better off health wise).

While vegan bodybuilders are a thing, they don't have an easy time doing it, nor do they typically have as much muscle mass as those who eat meat (balanced that is). To create muscle you need balance, not solely meat. My dad eats chicken breast, vegetables, and three hard boiled eggs every day (and has his protein and creatine supplements after he lifts). That's balance, he has a lot of muscle mass to the point where his doctor has told him he's over weight. His doctor only looked at his weight on the scale, not his BMI or amount of muscle.

 

At this point, we're gonna have a mod shut us down as we're way off from the OP which is climate change and your stance on it.

[SpaceGhostC2C]

It's obviously a hoax concocted by the googluminati to fool you into vaccinating your kids so they don't realize Earth is a 5000-year-old flat surface created in 6 days.

[Tog Driver]

2 minutes ago, SpaceGhostC2C said:

It's obviously a hoax concocted by the googluminati to fool you into vaccinating your kids so they don't realize Earth is a 5000-year-old flat surface created in 6 days.

I sense sarcasm. . .

[Guest]

Climate change is definitely quite real, and some people - especially some politicians, are particularly naive to climate change. We, as humans, need to get our act together quite quickly on this matter. 

37 minutes ago, Tog Driver said:

I don't know about if you can actually be healthy while not eating meat (doubt it), but the thing is, I really like meat. . .

If you take the appropriate vitamins and mineral you can be healthy, I don't think anyone would recommend it though. People who natter on about the meat industry and pollution are a little misinformed. It is the mass factory farming that gives the most pollution, while small farms can have little impact - and often better quality meat. It is far better to buy meat at your local farmers market than at a supermarket. 

[tikker]

Yeah I believe it's real, as there's plenty of scientific evidence. Even myself I notice it when I look at the winters here, for example. When I was a child I remember having lots of snow and ice, whereas the last couple of years we've had much less. The problem is not so much the global climate cycle of warming and cooling itself, but the effect we humans have on it, for which there is significant evidence that we are indeed pushing it past its normal boundaries.

[711jrp]

I believe it's real, I also believe it's the natural order of things, i also believe people use it to make money and I also believe people use it to gain political power.

 

[Andreas Lilja]

Real? Yeah.

Worth doing anything? No. 

 

Even if people in the West lived like cavemen, Asia would practically reverse everything. 

[wasab]

1 hour ago, Tog Driver said:

How about not. . .    Who get's to decide who to eat?

But if there is a famine, how are you going to survive without rationing and dictate who to eat what? Meat is extremely low yield per unit of input energy per unit of output calories. 

[SenKa]

Factually real. How much of it is human-caused and how much of it is natural climate changes as observed through our earths history?

 

Who knows. I would imagine most is the latter.

[Arika]

absolutely real....

[XR6]

It's 100% real. Unfortunately it is being used as a quick ticket to get power and fame (for trying to be eco friendly) by politicians and businessmen alike. 

9 hours ago, PacketMan said:

My point here is: there's a middle ground between eating meat in every meal and not eating meal in any meal

This is exactly right.

I'm not going to go all PETA on you guys and say "STOP EATING MEAT YOU'RE KILLING INNOCENT ANIMALS AND YOU'RE HURTING THE ENVIRONMENT" but I will say that it's entirely possible to cut down on your meat consumption without cutting it out entirely.

Doing so will actually help the environment more than you think.

 

The bottom line is it's time to start caring about the earth more.

Look at the news, you'll find snowfall in Las Vegas, the same place that hits 42°C in the summer.

You'll also find that it has snowed in Hawaii, a place notable for its tropical climate.

Not only that, take a look at what happened in the midwest a few weeks ago with the polar vortex.

It's clear to see that this shouldn't be happening and that something needs to be done before the earth goes to s**t.

[zassou]

yeah why not, come to my place, experience what winter is when the yester day is sunny at 30 degree and today is raining all day at 7 degree.

 

but i think people are entitled for their opinions and afford some basic level of respect, even they are unpopular ones. we are long way away from the times when churches still burning people.

 

after all, a disney character can lead a country, so why not?

[TheBelgianBuilder]

23 hours ago, Rohith_Kumar_Sp said:

climate change is real

 

edit : wtf happened to my comment? i had more stuff in here, did someone edit it without my knowledge? 

Sure thing mate, I'm willing to change a lot to fix the climate. But why does it ALWAYS have to cost money. Buying an electric car is way more expensive than buying a diesel or petrol. Laying down solar panels is mad expensive and only pays itself back in like 15 years, if your solar panels even last that long. Not to mention solar panels aren't really environment friendly either. Thing is, people surely want to change and live greener. But for some reason the gov thinks living greener should cost more.

 

Also : In Belgium the taxes on petrol and diesel are massive. It's a majority of the income of our gov. What if we decide to go full electric. Those taxes are gone, where do you think they will come and get them? That's the thing, everything has to be more expensive and saving the climate should cost money. Why? I don't understand why I have to pay more to live greener, while that is what supposedly everyone in the world wants in order to save the climate. 

 

Something isn't quite right here, and that's why I'm fishy about all this. Not to mention the people who move for climate (all of our younger generation) mostly go on vacation by using a plane or a car. Which is in my opinion just a plain joke.

[kilgore_T]

i always thought the debate wasnt whether climate change is real but whether or not its man made climate change

 the climate is always changing naturally but is it dramatically affected by human behavior? thats the debate

is it natural or is it AGW?

[alatron978]

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