wan show KickStarter Ossic Disapears

[Princess Luna]

How have nobody posted this yet:

South Park teaching you how to use Kickstarter

[Castdeath97]

Kickstarter doesn’t work for hardware does it? 

[The Benjamins]

1 hour ago, Misanthrope said:

Do you have any substantial evidence any work was done before, during or after the Kickstarter campaign?

 

If not, it absolutely fucking is a Ponzi scheme.

 

Of course people that encourage this kind of garbage like crowd funding dress it as 'It's an investment, it always carries risks!"

 

In reality, many of you end up giving money to this fucking guy:

 

 

Did you mean to quote me?

 

Kickstarter scheme do not fit the definition of a Ponzi scheme, I even gave the definition. and I will quote my self to answer the rest.

 

Quote

...but that by no means it does not mean their is no foul play, but from the OP I don't see any. But I did not read the article to I am not 100% sure.

Added the bold, because I didn't proof read.

 

And I feel like many people act like they expect kickstarter to be risk free.

[bcredeur97]

5 hours ago, Shreyas1 said:

Ponzi?

this would be more of the "Exit scam" type. which is when a product or service is offered/promised, backed by investors, but then the company mysteriously backs out with all of the investors money. Perhaps not even having a product in the first place.

Which theoretically kickstarter is a really easy way to get away with if you write your legal policies correctly.

 

@Misanthrope

[Bcat00]

Another kickstarter failed, oh well. 

Kinda what happens when all the company has to offer its customer is a promise.

[aezakmi]

The guy right now

 

 

[descendency]

I'll never support something on Kickstarter or like sites. I can see them as a great means for smaller developers to get into manufacturing but there is a side reality to this. 

 

No company wants to use crowd funding. Crowd funding campaigns have very low success rates and often require very limited goals. The reason why you crowd fund your company is because traditional funding means have turned you down. Why did they turn you down? Why should I give you money if someone with more experience in investing didn't think it was a good idea? 

 

Im not saying you shouldn't back a project. Some of them are amazing ideas. The problem is that there is something usually wrong with the idea. Even if the idea is great, the people running the show might be too new to the market to actually succeed. Or maybe there are other issues. 

 

Only 'invest' the money you are ok with losing. Because you might as well call it a charity donation.

[Rupe]

3 hours ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

The thing is, this is nothing like actually investing in company where you end up with a share in the company. Rather, Kickstarters portray themselves like a store where you purchase tiers and get a finished product and/or other goodies of non-value return. And since it's a store with virtually no consumer protections, that's where things turn ugly. 

Kickstarter does, but people understand what Kickstarter is and that is not a store front, and from that should accept the inherent risk with handing over money for a promise to essentially strangers most of them with no former track record of supplying a product.

[Tech_Dreamer]

This is straight up fraud isn't it?  

[Princess Luna]

2 minutes ago, Tech_Dreamer said:

This is straight up fraud isn't it?  

No really because you never bought any thing, you never signed any contract any thing so you're not entitled for any thing juridically speaking.

 

What you did do was a Patreon like thingy to fund the idea and in exchange you were promised something but there is absolutely nothing obligating any one to give you any thing, that's the beauty on it.

[Tech_Dreamer]

3 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

No really because you never bought any thing, you never signed any contract any thing so you're not entitled for any thing juridically speaking.

 

What you did do was a Patreon like thingy to fund the idea and in exchange you were promised something but there is absolutely nothing obligating any one to give you any thing, that's the beauty on it.

so basically it's like paying for an IMAX ticket to watch a Tyler perry movie. it's a complete loss either way . you pay something & you get nothing of value back.

[AnonymousGuy]

Dude goes to china and thinks that he can make a bazillion dollars putting a kickstarter campaign around some white label shit from Shenzen.  Then Mr. Chen realizes that he's dealing with someone with a bigger bankroll than he originally thought and jacks up all the pricing.  game over for your kickstarter campaign.    He was probably paying himself a fat $250k a year salary too.

[Princess Luna]

3 minutes ago, Tech_Dreamer said:

.

Yes that is why it is called Funding and not Purchasing :3

[Tech_Dreamer]

Just now, Princess Cadence said:

Yes that is why it is called Funding and not Purchasing :3

there's no way to make sure or know if the funds were misused? just for the sake of knowing something worth the time/money spend.

[mr moose]

When it comes to money:

1. credit is for things you absolutely need but can't afford outright (exercise control)

2. never buy a promise (adopt as a matter of principal)

3. if it sounds to good to be true it probably is. (exercise caution)

[DildorTheDecent]

That's what you get for buying into the "3D sound" meme

 

[mark_cameron]

10 hours ago, Knifepro01playz said:

Original article: https://techcrunch.com/2018/05/20/after-tens-of-thousands-of-pre-orders-high-end-3d-headphones-startup-ossic-disappears/

 

After a successfull Kickstarter Raising $5.9 million and Tens of thousands of Pre-Orders for their much looked forward to "3D Sound" Headphones, Have announced on the weekend that they will be shutting down the company and all Kick Starter Backers Will NOT recieve a refund

 

Tech Crunch Reported "The company raised $2.7 million on Kickstarter and $3.2 million on Indiegogo for their Ossic X headphones which they pitched as a pair of high-end head-tracking headphones that would be perfect for listening to 3D audio, especially in a VR environment. While the company also raised a “substantial seed investment,” in a letter on the Ossic website the company blamed the slow adoption of virtual reality alongside their crowdfunding campaign stretch goals which bogged down their R&D team."

 

 

I really Hope they rethink what they are doing with the no refunds as it is complete BS that all thoose people who have put $1000 in each will loose it all even if they could do a 50% refund would be better then nothing.

 

 

They could be facing a fraud investigation if they can't prove where $5.9 million has gone.

 

 

[mark_cameron]

43 minutes ago, Tech_Dreamer said:

This is straight up fraud isn't it?  

If the money is not spent on adding value (profit. IP patents etc. shareholder value etc ) to the company raising the finance

 

Yes it is.

[Bcat00]

5 minutes ago, mark_cameron said:

 

They could be facing a fraud investigation if they can't prove where $5.9 million has gone.

 

 

Hmm, if i made a couple of millions in fraud, normally the first thing i would do is move to another country where X countries law can't get to me. 

Then i will buy a house, start another fraud scheme and keep rolling while living a life of luxury. 

[mark_cameron]

1 minute ago, Bcat00 said:

Hmm, if i made a couple of millions in fraud, normally the first thing i would do is move to another country where X countries law can't get to me. 

Then i will buy a house, start another fraud scheme and keep rolling while living a life of luxury. 

The internet and sharing of information makes such schemes harder.

 

Certainly no company should simply disappear when they were given $3.2 million in start up money.

 

That money should of generated a return or value. Intellectual property.

 

Value that should exceed the initial start up funding.

 

It sounds like it's not been properly managed.

 

If people were taking salary as well with no value generated. Well an argument can be made that is fraud.

[Misanthrope]

3 hours ago, bcredeur97 said:

this would be more of the "Exit scam" type. which is when a product or service is offered/promised, backed by investors, but then the company mysteriously backs out with all of the investors money. Perhaps not even having a product in the first place.

Which theoretically kickstarter is a really easy way to get away with if you write your legal policies correctly.

 

@Misanthrope

As long as we agree it's a fucking scam.

 

Honestly this discussion over what constitute what type of scam reminds me of Multi-Level scammers that sue if they're called Pyramids even though they just added another element to the older pyramid scheme.

[Bcat00]

25 minutes ago, mark_cameron said:

 

You are assuming too much about the internet. Such schemes can be easily carried out if you know the right person. 

[Teddy07]

There are so many failed projects. I guess people love throwing away their money.

[dalekphalm]

13 hours ago, Spotty said:

 

They have tens of thousands of unfulfilled pre-orders, but at the same time claiming that there isn't enough demand for the product due to slow adoption of virtual reality?
Sounds like bullshit to me.

Could be - or they lied about the feasibility of Kickstarter being the sole revenue source, and they actually were relying on third party investors and orders, and maybe that fell through?

 

But it being a scam, or simply completely and utterly mismanaged, is more likely.

 

Frankly, half the Kickstarters that fail, don't do so because they are scams. It's because of:

1. Unrealistic goals (not funding enough money for what they're offering), and

2. Terrible business/project management (wasting money unnecessarily, not knowing how to do things efficiently, etc).

9 hours ago, -BirdiE- said:

The problem with looking at it as an investment is that when people invest in risky start ups, it's for a percentage ownership in the company. You're assuming risk, but you also have the potential for reward beyond your initial investment. Also, if the company later on realizes their business model is not feasible, all remaining assets are split by the investors. In this case it looks like they took the unspent money, took the assets, and ran. Pre-purchasing with only the potential for loss is not the same thing as investing.

 

With that being said, I agree that people paying for things like this on Kickstarter are silly if they get upset. It's a broken platform. There are little to no controls to hold the start up accountable, so you should very much consider it lost money if you buy in.

Kickstarter is an investment. It's a bad investment, but it's still an investment. You're not pre-ordering a product, because in most cases, there is no product yet. You're pre-ordering the idea of a product.

[-BirdiE-]

38 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Kickstarter is an investment. It's a bad investment, but it's still an investment. You're not pre-ordering a product, because in most cases, there is no product yet. You're pre-ordering the idea of a product.

I mean, if we want to play it that way technically everything you spend money or time on is an investment. Buying a banana is an investment. Going to the gym is an investment.

 

But in normal financial terms, an investment is something that you purchase in hopes that it appreciates in monetary value. If you invest in a start-up company you take the risk that you lose money in hopes that the company, and thus your share in the company, appreciates in value and you net a return on your money. Purchasing a product, or even pre-ordering a product, would not be considered an investment in financial terms.