nVidia ends GeForce Partner Program

[Notional]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

I know Arez is real,  I was asking if Asus have claimed they are no longer making ROG AMD? have they actually said that or is it just insinuation form the 20+ tech publications reporting on it?

 

I "" evidence because what you claim is evidence to me is just correlation.   Evidence in indisputable,  personal conclusions based on correlation is not evidence.  Until Asus stop selling ROG AMD then I see nothing to support the claim Arez is specifically a GPP thing.

• I wonder why Asus made Arez
• I wonder why no Arez products use ROG
• I wonder why no AMD GPU's were suddenly not branded rog anymore
• I wonder why the official Asus Arez twitter liked and shared all articles about it, when the articles literal headlines stated it was because of the GPP
• I wonder why Arez was only going to be used on AMD GPU product categories, and not AMD motherboards
• I wonder .... don't you?

Like @leadeater stated, evidence isn't always conclusive, but requires extrapolation of several data points. There has been plenty in the GPP case. 

 

 

 

[Kamjam21xx]

Linus tech court, starring members of the LTT community. 

 

Music starts*

Dun dun duh duh dun dun dun... 

[mr moose]

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

I guess you're ignoring this definition then, "signs or indications of something." So don't period me. It doesn't even work that way in court either, "smoking guns" just don't exist in practicality. If that is your bar for something to be evidence then that is highly unrealistic.

I guess you got that from here:

 

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/evidence

 

In that context the "signs or indications" are not mere suggestions but lack of facts as defined in the example.

 

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

Say what you want evidence simply isn't what your implying. You can draw your own, different, conclusion from the evidence but I'd appreciate the end of "this is not evidence", it is and I will not budge on it. If you can't agree that there is evidence then we have nothing to discuss, there is no common ground so it's impossible.

 

Then we are not talking about evidence, we are talking about our own personal conclusion/appraisal of the effects of GPP.

 

 

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

And why would they? Another unrealistic expectation to have and one that could potentially have legal consequences if such a person went on record.

Regardless of why they would or wouldn't, the fact is they didn't and thus we don;t have much to go on.  

 

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

If Arez was unrelated to GPP then is it not odd that Asus will not comment further on why they brought it in? Don't read in to that, it plays no part in my assessment of GPP being the cause but Asus stating something counter to my assessment would instantly change my opinion. It's actually very easy to change my opinion on this, I believe very little about what is claimed about GPP but currently I have no doubts about the branding requirements.

I don't know. None of the AIB manufacturers seem to be forthcoming with information.  Gigabyte have been not talking about an Aorus Vega card since November last year.  Seeing as we haven't seen one yet and they still aren't talking, does that mean the rumours are true or false? 

 

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

Neither did I say it was fact, I've said based on the evidence I have seen my assessment is GPP is the reason for Arez, without it Arez would not exist.

 

There is reason in action, in this case Arez, so again all ears on one. Does Asus think there are too many products under ROG? That could be one, unlikely to warrant such a large branding change. AMD wanted the change, also unlikely given their response to GPP and press announcements in the last month.

 

Again I don't know,  this isn't the first time they have introduced a new brand or stopped using another branding. 

 

1 hour ago, Notional said:

• I wonder why Asus made Arez
• I wonder why no Arez products use ROG
• I wonder why no AMD GPU's were suddenly not branded rog anymore
• I wonder why the official Asus Arez twitter liked and shared all articles about it, when the articles literal headlines stated it was because of the GPP
• I wonder why Arez was only going to be used on AMD GPU product categories, and not AMD motherboards
• I wonder .... don't you?

Like @leadeater stated, evidence isn't always conclusive, but requires extrapolation of several data points. There has been plenty in the GPP case. 

 

 

 

That's an awful lot of wondering for a discussion full of "evidence".

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

Then we are not talking about evidence, we are talking about our own personal conclusion/appraisal of the effects of GPP.

No I'm talking about evidence. There is evidence, I have no movement on this but I don't know why I have to say it again for what the third or fourth time? You're not going to get a different result out of me. You want facts or proof, it's not there but we do have evidence. Call it circumstantial evidence if you like, I'll happily back that stance on it but it's still evidence.

 

What you want is direct evidence, you're not going to get it. Fingerprint and DNA evidence is not considered direct evidence before you start trying to hold direct evidence as some ultimate from of evidence and circumstantial is baseless and inconsequential.

 

You seem to be coming from the line that evidence can only lead to one common conclusion, so if there isn't the evidence you are looking for then there is no evidence. If only it were that easy. You can actually have conflicting conclusions, or none at all, from the same evidence, usually because there is still some lacking evidence but that does not mean there is no evidence.

 

This is the impasse we have, you say there is no evidence and I say there is. I'm happy for you to say there is a lack of evidence but not that there is no evidence.

 

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

Regardless of why they would or wouldn't, the fact is they didn't and thus we don;t have much to go on. 

But they did give information which is part of my evidence.

 

I've told you where I got my evidence and how to address it if you wish to but do not come at me with the no evidence line.

 

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

Again I don't know,  this isn't the first time they have introduced a new brand or stopped using another branding. 

It is the first time no explanation has been given for something such as this. Asus not being forthcoming with information is not a counter to my assessment of why Arez was created, it literally means nothing.

 

If Asus or any other AIB, or Nvidia, want to clarify the matters they can go right ahead but until they do their silence is irrelevant and I will use what information that does exist.

 

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

I don't know. None of the AIB manufacturers seem to be forthcoming with information.  Gigabyte have been not talking about an Aorus Vega card since November last year.  Seeing as we haven't seen one yet and they still aren't talking, does that mean the rumours are true or false? 

That is not the only Gigabyte product that had changes being made nor the only AIB. Do I need to state the there is no such thing as coincidences tag line again. If something is happening there is a reason. If these were all isolated events then they wouldn't account for much but they are not isolated.

 

GPP is the reason Arez exists unless you can show me something that would sway this opinion. Not a high bar to reach, it's not hard, all you have to do is put something forward that isn't evidence denial which I will immediately dismiss.

[JuztBe]

4 hours ago, Notional said:

• I wonder why Asus made Arez
• I wonder why no Arez products use ROG
• I wonder why no AMD GPU's were suddenly not branded rog anymore
• I wonder why the official Asus Arez twitter liked and shared all articles about it, when the articles literal headlines stated it was because of the GPP
• I wonder why Arez was only going to be used on AMD GPU product categories, and not AMD motherboards
• I wonder .... don't you?

Like @leadeater stated, evidence isn't always conclusive, but requires extrapolation of several data points. There has been plenty in the GPP case. 

 

 

 

Forget to add:

• I wonder why Asus ROG GPUS came back to be the same day GPP cancelation was announced.

https://www.asus.com/Graphics-Cards/ROG-Republic-of-Gamers-Products/ Must be coincidence really ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Carclis]

11 hours ago, mr moose said:

I know Arez is real,  I was asking if Asus have claimed they are no longer making ROG AMD? have they actually said that or is it just insinuation form the 20+ tech publications reporting on it?

From the Asus official announcement.

Quote

TAIPEI, Taiwan, April 17, 2018 - ASUS today announced AREZ, a new brand identity for ASUS Radeon™ RX graphics cards. Derived from Ares, the Greek god of war, AREZ-branded graphics cards are built using industry-leading automated manufacturing to provide AMD gamers and enthusiasts with superior cooling technology and a robust software ecosystem.

 

The new AREZ brand underlines the strong working partnership between ASUS and AMD that spans decades. Gamers and enthusiasts will enjoy a combination of exclusive ASUS innovations and technologies and AMD’s Radeon graphics processors and software.  

 

"Gamers around the world rally behind AMD Radeon because of what the Radeon name stands for: a dedication to open innovation such as our contributions to the DirectX and Vulkan APIs, a commitment to true transparency through industry standards like Radeon FreeSync™ technology, and a desire to expand the PC gaming ecosystem by enabling developers to take advantage of all graphics hardware, including AMD Radeon graphics. We invite gamers everywhere who believe in these values and the value of the exceptional gaming experience Radeon graphics delivers to join the Red team,” said Scott Herkelman, Vice President and General Manager, AMD Radeon Technologies Group.

Also, the ROG and AREZ versions of the Vega 64 card are identical with branding being the only difference.

There isn't really anything else that could be responsible for the brand name change. It is also completely illogical for Asus to invest in a completely new branding when their gaming brand is already performing well and GPU's are still suffering from worldwide shortages. I think Occam's razor very much applies here.

[Notional]

Ouch!

 

[Razor01]

6 minutes ago, Notional said:

Ouch!

 

Is someone pissed they have to shut their doors?

 

he didn't even watch that WAN show where they say they didn't do as much as others lol.

[Notional]

1 minute ago, Razor01 said:

Is someone pissed they have to shut their doors?

Someones pissed that one of the largest tech youtubers took credit for something they really had no right to.

[Razor01]

1 minute ago, Notional said:

Someones pissed that one of the largest tech youtubers took credit for something they really had no right to.

They didn't did you watch the WAN show?

 

Watch it, they stated they didn't do much lol

 

 

[Notional]

1 minute ago, Razor01 said:

They didn't did you watch the WAN show?

 

Watch it, they stated they didn't do much lol

 

 

I know. But that is not exactly what the head line states, is it?

[Razor01]

Just now, Notional said:

I know. But that is not exactly what the head line states, is it?

He was talking about PC enthusiasts in general!

 

Kyle is full of it.  He doesn't like the fact that he got screwed while others didn't go out of their way and make things up to support him.

[Dylanc1500]

My goodness, there is enough salt from this that I could preserve a whole hog. Seriously we need a fire hydrant to level out the sodium levels in here.

[Razor01]

1 minute ago, Dylanc1500 said:

My goodness, there is enough salt from this that I could preserve a whole hog. Seriously we need a fire hydrant to level out the sodium levels in here.

This isn't the first time for Kyle to do this, he talked bad about nV once before many years ago around 7 years back maybe a bit longer, where he got blacklisted lol, and everyone at B3D, didn't support what he did, pretty much stated he was out of line, and all those guys are professionals in the graphics card and CPU industries.  He was told he was barking up the wrong tree, then he went on a war path.

 

Just that back then we didn't have things like twitter so he went to B3D to plead his case. 

 

Then again he went a war path with the way he reviewed cards, and removing the apples to apples comparison. Where so many people at B3D stated he was wrong.

[Dylanc1500]

Just now, Razor01 said:

This isn't the first time for Kyle to do this, he talked bad about nV once before many years ago around 7 years back maybe a bit longer, where he got blacklisted lol, and everyone at B3D, didn't support what he did, pretty much stated he was out of line, and all those guys are professionals in the graphics card and CPU industries.  He was told he was barking up the wrong tree, then he went on a war path.

 

Just that back then we didn't have things like twitter so he went to B3D to plead his case. 

 

Then again he went a war path with the way he reviewed cards, and removing the apples to apples comparison. Where so many people at B3D stated he was wrong.

Honestly, I was referring to the lot of people that seemed to get so wound up about this on both sides of the trough.

 

My biggest concern isn't his viewpoint or his argument in regards to GPP. It's his lack of respect and unprofessionalism within his profession. Most of us would be reprimanded for speaking that way to someone, no matter the case. I don't care what is going on, you don't make presumptions about a statement someone used without first getting clarification in private first, especially when tone is nowhere near as discernible as when communicating vocally. He could have asked someone from LMG what they meant by their statement.

 

However, this is all the more I will say on the matter.

[Razor01]

6 minutes ago, Dylanc1500 said:

Honestly, I was referring to the lot of people that seemed to get so wound up about this on both sides of the trough.

 

My biggest concern isn't his viewpoint or his argument in regards to GPP. It's his lack of respect and unprofessionalism within his profession. Most of us would be reprimanded for speaking that way to someone, no matter the case. I don't care what is going on, you don't make presumptions about a statement someone used without first getting clarification in private first, especially when tone is nowhere near as discernible as when communicating vocally. He could have asked someone from LMG what they meant by their statement.

 

However, this is all the more I will say on the matter.

I agree, I just wanted to point out he has a habit of doing things like that lol.

 

Add he did make presumptions on the GPP too, his "opinions".  I had no issue with his GPP articles, outside of the "law suits pending" and the likes of this program akin to what Intel did.  The second article about the OEM's and why they were against signing for it, that was utterly fabricated too, again his "opinion" is now trying to support his first article, instead of taking a step back and focusing on what was the real cause for the OEM's.  I saw serious faults in that, it wasn't anything to do with what he definitively uncovered, it was what he thought they were equal to and what the outcome could be.

[Dylanc1500]

9 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

I agree, I just wanted to point out he has a habit of doing things like that lol.

Ah I gotcha. Well, it's unfortunate as burning bridges in life can make for a much harder, and longer, trek through said life. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

[Razor01]

6 minutes ago, Dylanc1500 said:

Ah I gotcha. Well, it's unfortunate as burning bridges in life can make for a much harder, and longer, trek through said life. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

 

 

Well, its funny that he probably knew it was coming, and then to tweet about it and say he has to close his doors if it comes about.

 

He is trying the classic attention seeking behavior to save his site.

 

He could have gotten the same attention, the same results without his opinions being plastered all over.  His readership is fairly well versed in tech, they can draw their own conclusions without a guiding hand. 

 

I don't think anyone would have a problem with his article if he left out the drama parts out.

 

What is nV going to say?  You talked bad about us.  Well if those parts were left out,  then Kyle, [H], wouldn't be responsible for the what the people that read the article though it about it right?

[laminutederire]

10 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

 

To be fair, Nvidia is known to be pretty vindictive and very self righteous. Case in point, LTT, GamersNexus and many other have publicly said that collaborating with them has been very hard for years, that it got better but became increasingly harder during that time where gpp was out in the wild.

Another example is their stubbornness with Apple over the MacBook issues.

I think him calling them out on being blacklisted is related to that track record with Nvidia from everyones point of view in that industry.

[XenosTech]

1 hour ago, Dylanc1500 said:

My goodness, there is enough salt from this that I could preserve a whole hog. Seriously we need a fire hydrant to level out the sodium levels in here.

Smells like a legit ocean breeze doesn't it ?

 

Wait hold on I can hear the rust forming on my captcitors

[Dylanc1500]

3 minutes ago, XenosTech said:

Smells like a legit ocean breeze doesn't it ?

 

Wait hold on I can hear the rust forming on my captcitors

Enough to solve the saline shortage.

[Razor01]

23 minutes ago, laminutederire said:

To be fair, Nvidia is known to be pretty vindictive and very self righteous. Case in point, LTT, GamersNexus and many other have publicly said that collaborating with them has been very hard for years, that it got better but became increasingly harder during that time where gpp was out in the wild.

Another example is their stubbornness with Apple over the MacBook issues.

I think him calling them out on being blacklisted is related to that track record with Nvidia from everyones point of view in that industry.

 

AMD has done the same , he also called out AMD prior to being blacklisted for the Polaris, and AMD shit show article.  He also called out being blacklist in the past before as "its no big deal" we can buy our own products for reviews.  This time that has changed.  Also H didn't have patreon's till just a few months back.  It shows they are probably in trouble financially.

 

Its the world these journalists live in.  I've seen many articles that weren't as ripe with opinions that never get their sites blacklisted.

 

All ya have to do is keep the crap out of the article, let the content speak for itself.

 

Do you see Computerbase.de, Hexus, Linus of course, Hardware Unboxed, and others, getting blacklisted?  They don't go out of their way to piss companies off, they still give out fair reviews, and tell it as it is.

 

Do you know why the major publications didn't go on record and support Kyle?

 

It wasn't the fear of being blacklisted, it was because they didn't have corroborating evidence.  And the one that did go on record which was GN saw both sides to the story.  Kyle's and nV's.  Which they gathered both sides were up to no good.

 

Kyle is going to paint his side as correct, nV is going to paint their side as correct.  This is human nature.  Usually its always something in the middle that is true.

[laminutederire]

20 minutes ago, Razor01 said:

 

It's also because reviewers seem to be living scared of being blacklisted. It doesn't seem that much people have decent working relationship with Nvidia. There's always something Nvidia does to make them feel uncomfortable.

 

By the way LTT does make clickbaity titles, so there no harm pointing it out to them.

[Razor01]

16 minutes ago, laminutederire said:

It's also because reviewers seem to be living scared of being blacklisted. It doesn't seem that much people have decent working relationship with Nvidia. There's always something Nvidia does to make them feel uncomfortable.

 

By the way LTT does make clickbaity titles, so there no harm pointing it out to them.

 

Well same can be said about Qualcomm, MS, AMD, Intel, and many other companies.

 

This is not a singular thing. we have seen it in many other companies and a select few writers.

 

Click bait is the same as yellow journalism which is pretty much a taboo in journalistic circles.

 

Either you are a journalist and have the ethics to stand by what you find or you use what you find in such a way to be a click bait whore. 

 

The content that makes a click bait whore is the same as the content that makes a proper article, just the way its worded to arise emotions.

 

Did you see what I did there, that is bringing emotions into what I wrote,  I didn't need to do that to get the point across.  And it was just one word placed in two spots.

[Kamjam21xx]

We can just argue about anything cant we?

 

Black was a horrible font to pick for harocp qoutes.