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TECHNOKID

iMore's reply to Linus on why macs are slower than PCs

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Posted · Original PosterOP

An article I found browsing the web:

 

About the fact that Isheeps blatantly ignore the truth. The fact that Linus is wrong that Macs are slower than pcs, when there is evidence on the contrary. The purpose of the article is to say that Apple devices thermal throttle like pcs, but not further. It is true laptops with i9s thermal throttle, albeit to a lesser extent. Is it right to put a CPU in a thin laptop, when not performing too at least near the full capacity? In Linus's video, he states that the i9 thermal throttles to below the base clock.

 

Quote

So, why is the Mac slow than the PC?

No, of course not. Despite what Linus says, what he shows, over and over again, is that it isn't. He's wrong about almost everything in the video and the one thing he's right about, that the thermals prevent maximum performance, applies to similarly designed PCs as well, which makes it decidedly not a Mac thing at all.

 

"which makes it decidedly not a Mac thing at all" isn't true as there are no pcs that I know of with an i9 of this form factor.

Original article by iMore: https://www.imore.com/linus-wrong-about-macs-being-slower-pcs-heres-why

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Looks like just another Apple fan using the subjectivity argument to try and disprove a statement that has nothing to do with subjectivity.

 

Doesnt seem like news to me


Awareness is key. Never enough, even in the face of futility. Speak the truth as if you may never get to say it again. This world is full of ugly. Change it they say. The only way is to reveal the ugly. To change the truth you must first acknowledge it. Never pretend it isn't there. Never bend the knee.

 

Please quote my post in your reply, so that I will be notified and can respond to it. Thanks.

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Just now, huilun02 said:

Looks like just another Apple fan using the subjectivity argument to try and disprove a statement that has nothing to do with subjectivity.

 

Doesnt seem like news to me

As an Apple hater, I can still say the fact Linus saying "Macs are slower than PC's" is actually dumb.... Depends on more than 3 fucking factors.... in PC's there are MILLIONS of possibilities on it being slower than Mac... or even faster.... Linus pissed me off by saying that because yeah the data from the Mac helps.... but I have seen worse data on Windows and sometimes (but rarely) on Linux too. I can make a video "Mac is slower than Linux, here is why" or "Linux is slower than Mac, here is why" and both are correct but also wrong at the same time. "Windows is slower than Mac here's why" is another thing I can do. The simple fact is there are defects, issues people have while others don't. Contrary to popular belief computers are not predictable. They can fuck up for no reason but that doesn't mean the hardware or device is bad, you might have gotten unlucky with a broken OS, a broken CPU, GPU, whatever, RAM too. There is no one situation and honestly... no one buys macs for the speed, they do it for looks and flexing.

Also no I do not own a mac, but I use several at school. How my school affords it? No clue.

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45 minutes ago, Saccaed said:

I love using dissenter to comment on articles.

too bad they removed it from the extension stores

 

that's pretty funny he's saying hardware is thermal-throttled on a well-cooled PC the same way it will always be thermal throttled on a mac

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Shocking, a guy who writes for a website called iMore and podcasts at applepodcasts.com has a problem with Linus saying something bad about Apple products.


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2 minutes ago, Lathlaer said:

Shocking, a guy who writes for a website called iMore and podcasts at applepodcasts.com has a problem with Linus saying something bad about Apple products.

You just don't understand, they are designed to throttle so it's fine*.

*Please ignore all MacBook Pro products before 2015 that didn't have this issue or was very minor.

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Everybody has to defend the revenue stream.   That's all this is.  Surely even this guy isn't that blind.


QuicK and DirtY. Read the CoC it's like a guide on how not to be moron.  Also I don't have an issue with the VS series.

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2 hours ago, Trik'Stari said:

Really? You mean like that time they made a system that ran so hot, the BGA melted itself and popped the GPU off the board? And their fix?

 

Put a piece of rubber between the outer case and the GPU, so that it wouldn't pop loose.

This only affected a small number of users.


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5 hours ago, TECHNOKID said:

"which makes it decidedly not a Mac thing at all" isn't true as there are no pcs that I know of with an i9 of this form factor.

i9 zenbook pro. 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

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2 hours ago, leadeater said:

You just don't understand, they are designed to throttle so it's fine*.

*Please ignore all MacBook Pro products before 2015 that didn't have this issue or was very minor.

wrong. my mid-2012 13" goes to 90+ degrees with the stock fan curve. ui put a custom fan curve on it and now it maxes out at 70 degrees with the stock thermal paste. 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

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3 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

wrong. my mid-2012 13" goes to 90+ degrees with the stock fan curve. ui put a custom fan curve on it and now it maxes out at 70 degrees with the stock thermal paste. 

Sure they got hot but they didn't drop performance like me rock climbing without a rope. Even on bootcamp they didn't and one of my clients at the time was a school of 70 staff MacBook Pros running bootcamp, yea don't ask.

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4 hours ago, SafyreLyons-5LT said:

and honestly... no one buys macs for the speed, they do it for looks and flexing.

that is a very bold statement.

 

I use a Mac because I like macOS. that's the only reason. I cannot live without it. and I certainly like a fast computer. 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

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1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Sure they got hot but they didn't drop performance like me rock climbing without a rope. Even on bootcamp they didn't

I've never seen an i9 MacBook tested with a custom fan curve so... 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

My Phone: LG G3 | 16GB | 64GB SD | Lineage OS

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1 minute ago, firelighter487 said:

that is a very bold statement.

But it's true...


le luci del giorno viventi

 

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The time Linus replied to me on one of my threads: 

 

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5 hours ago, huilun02 said:

Looks like just another Apple fan using the subjectivity argument to try and disprove a statement that has nothing to do with subjectivity.

it is correct though. a similarly designed pc does the same thing. (i9 zenbook pro)


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

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Just now, LinusTechTipsFanFromDarlo said:

But it's true...

no it isn't. I didn't buy my MacBook for looks. 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

My Phone: LG G3 | 16GB | 64GB SD | Lineage OS

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Just now, firelighter487 said:

no it isn't. I didn't buy my MacBook for looks.

As I've said to you before, you are NOT the only person in the world with an Apple device. 


le luci del giorno viventi

 

Intel Core i7 7800X 6C/12T (4.5GHz), Corsair H115i extreme performance liquid cooler (280mm radiator), Asus Prime X299-A, Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB (4X4GB 3000MHz DDR4), MSI GeForce GTX 1070 Gaming X 8G (2.113GHz core & 9.104GHz memory), 1 Samsung 960 Evo 250GB NVME M.2, 1 Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD, 1 Samsung 850 Evo 500GB SSD, 1 WD Red 1TB mechanical drive, Corsair RM750X 80+ Gold fully modular PSU, Corsair Obsidian 750D full tower case, Corsair Glaive RGB mouse, Corsair K70 RGB MK.2 (Cherry MX Red) keyboard, Asus VN247HA (1920x1080 60Hz 16:9), Windows 10 Home 64 bit. 

 

 

The time Linus replied to me on one of my threads: 

 

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Just now, LinusTechTipsFanFromDarlo said:

As I've said to you before, you are NOT the only person in the world with an Apple device. 

the person I replied to said nobody buys a Mac for speed. that is wrong. that's why I said it's a bold statement. 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

My Phone: LG G3 | 16GB | 64GB SD | Lineage OS

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2 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

I've never seen an i9 MacBook tested with a custom fan curve so... 

Why does that matter, the older MacBook Pros thermally were better. Then they got too thin, for no good reason, and suffer thermal design constraints because of it. Did Apple forget they have MacBook Airs? They have a specific product made to be thin, thin isn't better, thick isn't better either. MacBook Pro is supposed to be a performance balanced laptop and that is why I used to consider them the best laptops you could by, period. Now I don't.

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1 minute ago, firelighter487 said:

the person I replied to said nobody buys a Mac for speed. that is wrong. that's why I said it's a bold statement. 

But it's true, Apple devices are the Chelsea tractors of electronics. They just are. 


le luci del giorno viventi

 

Intel Core i7 7800X 6C/12T (4.5GHz), Corsair H115i extreme performance liquid cooler (280mm radiator), Asus Prime X299-A, Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB (4X4GB 3000MHz DDR4), MSI GeForce GTX 1070 Gaming X 8G (2.113GHz core & 9.104GHz memory), 1 Samsung 960 Evo 250GB NVME M.2, 1 Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD, 1 Samsung 850 Evo 500GB SSD, 1 WD Red 1TB mechanical drive, Corsair RM750X 80+ Gold fully modular PSU, Corsair Obsidian 750D full tower case, Corsair Glaive RGB mouse, Corsair K70 RGB MK.2 (Cherry MX Red) keyboard, Asus VN247HA (1920x1080 60Hz 16:9), Windows 10 Home 64 bit. 

 

 

The time Linus replied to me on one of my threads: 

 

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Just now, LinusTechTipsFanFromDarlo said:

But it's true, Apple devices are the Chelsea tractors of electronics. They just are. 

that still doesn't mean everyone who buys them buys them for looks. 

 

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Why does that matter, the older MacBook Pros thermally were better. Then they got too thin, for no good reason, and suffer thermal design constraints because of it. Did Apple forget they have MacBook Airs? They have a specific product made to be thin, thin isn't better, thick isn't better either. MacBook Pro is supposed to be a performance balanced laptop and that is why I used to consider them the best laptops you could by, period. Now I don't.

you are right. I was just saying maybe the thermals aren't too bad and you just need a custom fan curve. to be clear I would love if they went back to the 2012 design. the keyboards on those are SO much better than the new one's. 


DISCLAIMER: ANYTHING I SAY COULD BE WRONG. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! 

Have a look at my set up your linux gaming pc from start to finish topic if you want to get started with linux :) 

My Laptop: HP EliteBook 9470m | I5 3437U | HD4000 | 1TB SSD | 16GB RAM | Ubuntu Disco Dingo

My Phone: LG G3 | 16GB | 64GB SD | Lineage OS

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2 minutes ago, LinusTechTipsFanFromDarlo said:

But it's true, Apple devices are the Chelsea tractors of electronics. They just are. 

MacBook Pros used to be the only laptops that would be near in perfect condition after 3 years of use, had excellent battery life, high end performance, chassis you could trust not to bend or fracture, great screen and a damn good trackpad.

 

There's always been legitimate reason to buy a MacBook Pro but my opinion is the current generation of product has tipped the balance a bit too far towards thin and light. Going back to the same or near the same thickness of old would allow a bigger battery (something I would love to see) and much more room for cooling (bigger fans and heatsink).

 

Pointing out part of the problem that Intel CPUs produce more heat is completely valid however it's not helped by the reduction is chassis capability for cooling, compounding the issue is not exactly a smart idea. You can optimize the voltage profiles, frequency steps, fan curves as much as you like but those are not replacements for better cooling. That's a complimentary relationship, particularly important in laptops.

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