Linux Gaming FINALLY Doesn't SUCK!

[Varusal]

Just now, Drak3 said:

I've been trying to use Linux for the past six years, it's nothing but headache trying to keep things working software side. Now, Linux is only useful to me in a VM. I'm the last of one out of my group of friends to try to use Linux. Everyone I know that tried to use Linux went back to Windows after a year or two. None of them care about PC gaming, as they have consoles. They got sick of the constant maintenance Linux demands as well.

Than your friends use a very complicated Linux distribution. And even with that your friends stick with Linux for 1-2 years so, i can't be that bad if you consider that they worked with linux for over 1 year

[Drak3]

1 minute ago, SirMorokei said:

Than your friends use a very complicated Linux distribution

Ubuntu.

Mint.

OpenSUSE.

Kuki Linux.

Fedora.

Debian.

[Varusal]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

Ubuntu.

Mint.

OpenSUSE.

Kuki Linux.

Fedora.

Debian.

I use ubuntu and I don't need to maintenance anything. Auto-update for drivers and packages. Done.

[Drak3]

2 minutes ago, SirMorokei said:

I use ubuntu and I don't need to maintenance anything.

I'm calling outright bullshit. I was always dealing with something breaking in Ubuntu back when I was trying to use it. It constantly broke.

[Varusal]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

I'm calling outright bullshit. I was always dealing with something breaking in Ubuntu back when I was trying to use it. It constantly broke.

Than you can't use any OS. Windows is more broken than any other OS. My guess is that you just can't handle linux.

[Drak3]

Just now, SirMorokei said:

Windows is more broken than any other OS.

That statement is about 20 years out of date.

 

1 minute ago, SirMorokei said:

Than you can't use any OS.

Unix and Windows are lightyears ahead of Linux. If I have to fix OSX, Solaris, or Windows, it's AFTER I did something risky. If I'm fixing Linux, it's often after just using whatever browser if packaged with the distro I choose.

2 minutes ago, SirMorokei said:

My guess is that you just can't handle linux.

I can handle that shit show of an OS family. But I choose not to, I have better things to waste my time on.

[Varusal]

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

That statement is about 20 years out of date.

For sure you never used windows with all it's features. There are way more bugs than you think. Every update means more bugs.

[TechyBen]

12 hours ago, Enderman said:

The fact that you require like 3 different workarounds to get things to run with worse performance than windows still means it sucks.

Most native Linux games will run better. Less overhead. With exception of the proprietary tech/code.

 

[edit]

PS, also Wine.Is.Not.(an)Emulator. So it does not need to have any performance hit. It can theoretically match or improve on performance.

 

Out of the 12 or so Steam games I tested (most 2d, but a few 3d) 10 worked fine on Linux. One of the 3d ones I don't know if it was because I used integrated graphics, so I'd have to retry on a different system/OS. But most older games without DRM should now work in Proton/Steam.

 

Now most of my go to games either have dedicated Linux builds (Rocket League, etc) or will work on proton/Wine. If I can get the likes of Google Sketchup working, learn how to do true backups/images responsibly/routeinly, then I'm migrated in the next month or two... I literally am planning on putting my Windows 10 install in a bonfire!

[pipnina]

1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

I'm calling outright bullshit. I was always dealing with something breaking in Ubuntu back when I was trying to use it. It constantly broke.

I've been using Ubuntu on two machines for almost two years, only had one time where Ubuntu "broke" itself, and it was not a difficult fix.

The only times I've encountered breakage beyond that were my fault. It might depend on what you were trying to achieve? I'm using it as a general machine, maybe you were doing something more wild?

 

------------

On a more general note to do with the video, I think that it's obvious that Linus is not great at covering Linux topics (mostly because a fair % of his audience knows more about it than him). This doesn't mean he shouldn't make videos on it however, but I think the people who throw criticism at him over things he doesn't use day-to-day like the commenters are being a tad pedantic.

 

I think something that has been missing from these LTT Linux-related videos is something more explorative. I would personally quite like to see an LTT video where they install all the games from the biggest steam library they have access to (some employee there is bound to have some 300+ library right?) and do some simple "does it work" testing (i.e. a minute or two per game) and get an idea of what % of windows-only games work. Basically a slightly more scientific version of the last video.

Or maybe benchmarking of the "supported" proton games vs windows, which might be even more interesting.

[alextulu]

3 hours ago, SirMorokei said:

I use ubuntu and I don't need to maintenance anything.

In the video Ubuntu froze and Linus had to use the reset button. So much for Linux stability.

 

Also, from personal experience, last time I tried Ubuntu and Mint on my laptop, there was a very strange issue.

 

If I shut down the laptop from Ubuntu, and then booted it up again, the fans had this weird intermittent spinning, and it didn't POST.

I almost had a heart attack. I though I just bricked my laptop.

But then I discovered, that if I unplug the AC adapter and the battery, wait a while, then plug them back again, then it would POST.

 

I tried googling, but I got no useful results.

[ryao]

3 hours ago, Drak3 said:

I'm calling outright bullshit. I was always dealing with something breaking in Ubuntu back when I was trying to use it. It constantly broke.

Am I the only person who notices that this guy never provides concrete examples? He is your classic Internet troll.

[ryao]

29 minutes ago, alextulu said:

In the video Ubuntu froze and Linus had to use the reset button. So much for Linux stability.

The graphical output froze due to a bug, but he likely could have switched to a virtual console, killed the offending game and then had it keep going. Alternatively, restarting the display server should have worked (at the expense of requiring him to log in again).

 

That being said, bugs in how Wine supports a Windows application can do that. The solution is to file a bug report and move on until it is fixed.

[Ithanul]

3 hours ago, SirMorokei said:

For sure you never used windows with all it's features. There are way more bugs than you think. Every update means more bugs.

Understatement of the year.....

Freaking understatement of the year.  As a sys admin on both Windows and Linux.  Blasted Windows loves to break in the wackest of ways.  Got to love when two applications break each other because of a Windows Update is applied and makes it hang a thread full peg to 100%. Or, the lovely of lovely black screen with just the mouse cursor being the latest one on W10 or the breaking of multi monitor setups.  O what joy I had.....

While over on the Linux system, users complain about console being weird.....sees the system warning in application on reason.  Point to track range.....um, you do realize that you have that set to 70,000 to 7,000.  Negative range ain't going to work.     I actually get bored at work on the Linux system since it rarely breaks (I kid not, I have gone days of eight hour shifts of not troubleshooting because nothing breaks).  At most, I have to resolder comm cords because the students manage to mess them up.

[williamcll]

If only common linux distros could run android programs like chromeOS without emulation

[Sfekke]

I tried to fully switch to Linux, even with these recent developments it is hard.

[ryao]

57 minutes ago, valdyrgramr said:

I use both Linux and Windows too.  I prefer Windows for gaming as I have 5-600 games on Steam and more outside of it.  I use both for different workstation tasks, though.  

For me, Windows has more issues with apps not liking each other.  I can't use display fusion without chrome crashing every 5 seconds.

With Linux, my biggest issue is getting it to install right.  I follow the install perfectly, redownload it, and half the time the install doesn't work.  With Ubuntu, I can rarely get the newest version working, so I have to at least go back one version.  The only one that ever installs right for me is Fedora.  But, Ubuntu is a tad more ideal for me on the development side than Fedora.

I suggest sticking to the long term release on Ubuntu (e.g. 16.04 or 18.04) and use the PPA:

 

https://launchpad.net/~graphics-drivers/+archive/ubuntu/ppa

 

Note that I am a developer of a competing distribution (Gentoo), so you would want to listen to an actual Ubuntu developer over me except when I am part of upstream (which only applies to ZFS) for something that you want to work better.

[ryao]

1 hour ago, Sfekke said:

I tried to fully switch to Linux, even with these recent developments it is hard.

What were the pain points?

[Varusal]

3 hours ago, Ithanul said:

Understatement of the year.....

Freaking understatement of the year.  As a sys admin on both Windows and Linux.  Blasted Windows loves to break in the wackest of ways.  Got to love when two applications break each other because of a Windows Update is applied and makes it hang a thread full peg to 100%. Or, the lovely of lovely black screen with just the mouse cursor being the latest one on W10 or the breaking of multi monitor setups.  O what joy I had.....

While over on the Linux system, users complain about console being weird.....sees the system warning in application on reason.  Point to track range.....um, you do realize that you have that set to 70,000 to 7,000.  Negative range ain't going to work.     I actually get bored at work on the Linux system since it rarely breaks (I kid not, I have gone days of eight hour shifts of not troubleshooting because nothing breaks).  At most, I have to resolder comm cords because the students manage to mess them up.

I feel your pain <3

[Varusal]

30 minutes ago, valdyrgramr said:

18.04 doesn't like to work for me for some reason.  I always get some errors when I go to install.  Tried 3 different flash drives, I use UUI, and follow the install steps correctly.  Redownloading and trying UUI again doesn't really work either.  I had the same issue with 16.04, I think it was, until 18.04 came out.

Try Rufus to make a bootable stick. I had problems with other tools but rufus works fine.

[Enderman]

7 hours ago, TechyBen said:

Most native Linux games will run better. Less overhead. With exception of the proprietary tech/code.

I was specifically talking about all the non-native games.

Obviously it's very good when a game runs natively and gets better performance than windows.

But that's like 1% of games.

[pipnina]

14 minutes ago, Enderman said:

I was specifically talking about all the non-native games.

Obviously it's very good when a game runs natively and gets better performance than windows.

But that's like 1% of games.

I think it is as Linus said himself. The train is probably coming, but we don't know when. One day any 10 or 20% performance decrease will not matter for today's games (modern hardware will be running them at 400, 600 or more fps and not 150 or 200) and if Valve's efforts are effective we might see vast improvement in native game development for Linux in coming years.

Today I can wholly see why some, or many, would not be interested in using Linux exclusively, even though I do so myself. Especially if EA, Ubisoft or Activision/Blizzard games are well liked by the specific gamer. But I do believe that, the way things are going, we will get there one day.

[Enderman]

31 minutes ago, pipnina said:

I think it is as Linus said himself. The train is probably coming, but we don't know when. One day any 10 or 20% performance decrease will not matter for today's games (modern hardware will be running them at 400, 600 or more fps and not 150 or 200)

As GPU performance increases the difficulty of driving games and displays also increases.

When 8k becomes mainstream everyone's fps will be cut down by half or three quarters.

So technically you will never catch up until there is a full pixel perfect hologram surrounding you.

[ryao]

1 hour ago, Enderman said:

As GPU performance increases the difficulty of driving games and displays also increases.

When 8k becomes mainstream everyone's fps will be cut down by half or three quarters.

So technically you will never catch up until there is a full pixel perfect hologram surrounding you.

Thankfully, DXVK performance is increasing. Graphics driver developers are improving their SPIR-V compilers to generate better binary code for GPUs. The state cache that is part of today’s 0.80 release also improves performance.

[ryao]

4 hours ago, valdyrgramr said:

18.04 doesn't like to work for me for some reason.  I always get some errors when I go to install.  Tried 3 different flash drives, I use UUI, and follow the install steps correctly.  Redownloading and trying UUI again doesn't really work either.  I had the same issue with 16.04, I think it was, until 18.04 came out.

What errors?

[ryao]

2 hours ago, Enderman said:

I was specifically talking about all the non-native games.

Obviously it's very good when a game runs natively and gets better performance than windows.

But that's like 1% of games.

There are ~15000 games and steam and ~3000 of them support Linux. 1% seems low.