Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[Drazil100]

4 minutes ago, MindArlekin said:

So, after watching GN's reply, this is what I think:
1) Let's hope Ivonne will remind Linus that it's her company too, because without her LTT would not exist. Also, it will be good to see the new CEO giving Linus a good reality slap to the face and reminding him why he stepped down.

2) They NEED to lower amount of videos on LTT, especially ones that include testing of products by Labs or otherwise. It will give some air to breathe for employees (they actually want it, BTW) and will give some time for the proper QC while Labs are figuring out their tools, processes, and test methodology.

3) After this shitty (no offense, it just is) response Linus NEEDS to make a proper video with not just "I'm sorry", but with a list of what they are changing. It's not needed right this freaking second, but in a couple of days - absolutely.

Not yet it's not. She still needs to get him to sign shrodingers contract to transfer 2% of the company to her

[JoshuaScholar]

I'm disappointed in this forum.  Everyone is caught up in their stupid feelings about content creators that they don't know.

 

What I think is important here is that there's this media company up in Canada where we have pretty good evidence that management is pushing their employees to cut corners and do slipshod reporting, even if it hurts say some little company who is the victim of the day (Billet).  And if they don't own up and slow down, everyone at that company will suffer, not only from a crumby work environment, but also from working at a company that's losing its reputation, when its reputation is its biggest asset.

 

Linus complained that he "misread the room" - ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?

No.  

 

Also its all interesting that Linus is acting out of character and actually, you know, tried to cover up a bit instead of his usual mea culpa. 

Oh well, these parasocial relationships can be surprising!

 

Life is tough all over!

[eece_ret]

Just now, Abraxaz said:

You do fire the employee if they recognise a fuck up and don't report it.

 

Plus it gives the doom mongers the blood they want whilst protecting the brand.

 

 

Only if they recognize the fuck up.  Cant blame the blind for color selection.

 

Regarding your second statement, please refer to my first and reflect inwardly.

[LeeJC73]

6 minutes ago, SoulSunder said:

Sir, this is quite possibly the most childish way to look at this situation. When someone builds their entire brand on trying to do the right thing and then gets caught doing the opposite, you don’t just “get a grip”. That’s how you end up with people continuing poor behavior.

You mean like the mob culture that’s being displayed here?

 Cos that’s a pleasant social construct. 
 

The crux of my statement was that this nonsense of Linus must throw himself to the mercy of his follower and do as they demand ‘immediately’ like some martyr because ‘my trust is shaken’

 

What a complete crock. 
Society can’t get it’s leaders to be accountable, and repeatedly return them to positions of power.

 

 Here as there you’re ‘entitled’ to nothing, so get over yourselves. 

[orio76]

Well I believe something is wrong with alot of guys here... LMG have more then 100 employees this means that not all decision/subjects are discussed or reach linus hears... I can talk for the company I work, we are more the 1200 employees and if ever single decision wpuld have to be taken or get the approva of the CEO we would be gone a long time ago... mistakes happen, it's part of our life, what matters is what you do to fix the mistake and the measures you put in place to avoid that again...

[MarkPol88]

Is he already "on site"? Or still wrapping up previous job and working remotely?

[Uttamattamakin]

17 minutes ago, AamirA said:

The very start of the WAN show is gonna be so awkward. Like the, "hello everyone and welcome it the wan show, we've got a great show lined up for you today!" Frankly, the entire show is gonna be awkward. I really don't know how Linus will pull of his fun, energetic self.

He shouldn't.  I get it is unlike he reads or sees every @LinusTech .  Start apologetic,  start frank.  Maybe spend 30 minutes to an hour on it.  Then move on cold.  Settle it and never bring it up again. no. matter. what.  The story will then die off exponentially.  Don't address it and not addressing it can be a PR hit.  Just my $0.02 USD.  

[ben025]

9 minutes ago, Abraxaz said:

So many people that don't seem to understand how LMG works. It's not a small company it has 100 people working in it.

 

How many times do you guys email your ceo in your day to day emails. I bet Linus didn't even know about this until the GN video went live. The fact it's been resolved so quickly most likely means that Linus/CEO didn't know about this.

 

If Steve had contacted Linus directly this probably wouldn't have been such a issue and resolved very quietly. 

 

Linus needs to fire the member of staff as a example and let everyone know the person has been fired due to Steve's diligent investigation. 

If you have seriously messed up by selling a prototype that isn't yours, you should not send an email to the CEO. Instead, you should go to the CEO's office immediately and explain to him what happened. You need to tell him that you have made a serious mistake and that the company needs to take action to fix this as soon as possible.

[hassam222]

This is a fair point. The response yesterday seemed like an off the cuff response from Linus that seriously undermined Terren's legitimacy as CEO with the audience. Now if the response yesterday was what they came up with after going through committee, that's even worse. Like the whole thing would have blown over with a simple "Sorry we are working to be better and we will make things right with Billet Labs". 

[423redws3]

I feel like the tone of some in this situation is far too destructive; lets try to focus on being constructive! That being said... wow. I hope that all points made by Gamers Nexus get an appropriate response in a timely manner, it will be quite disappointing if the "response to the response" doesn't get... a response.

 

Best of luck to all involved - the tech community (us!), Billet Labs, Gamers Nexus and LMG. I hope all come out of this for the better... all in different ways of course. 

[aka473]

3 minutes ago, atxcyclist said:

It doesn't matter if they have a requirement from some organization or journalistic standards, Steve claims he does this, and he didn't in this instance. Steve changing his standards for this one incident is just being hypocritical on his part, whether you like it or not.

Again Jounalistic standards DO NOT require that you contact a target for publication. Especially in the event of a High-Profile target, who if asked for comment could try to kill the story by either removing the RAISON D'ÊTRE for said piece, or trying to flip or even get sources to no longer allow a publication to use their statements.

[BlackSmokeDMax]

1 minute ago, FluffyPuppyKasey said:

Honestly Linus is handing this situation like a (pardon the political comparison, but I feel it's apt) conservative would. Gaslighting, specific verbiage, dodging the actual topics at hand, and trying to defend himself even though everyone (who's not a superfan that thinks Linus can do no wrong) is calling him out on it, when the original GN video was posted OUT OF CONCERN.

 

@LinusTech, do better, please. You're investing in a lab, but the past has shown (for example, the 4090 review, in Cyberpunk, settings weren't double checked and the game wasn't restarted just to make sure they were applied) that the accuracy of the data (y'know, something that's very important for a public database of benchmarks and tests) isn't taken care of. Automation will only hurt this.

 

And the other half of the population would saying he is handling it like a liberal. What a terrible take to bring into the already heated discussion.

[daydreamfaze]

41 minutes ago, Adventnevda said:

This feels like the Artesian Builds moment for LMG

 

And HEEERRREESS THE RERRROOOOOLLLL

[VisibleXela]

Just now, Uttamattamakin said:

He shouldn't.  I get it is unlike he reads or sees every @LinusTech .  Start apologetic,  start frank.  Maybe spend 30 minutes to an hour on it.  Then move on cold.  Settle it and never bring it up again. no. matter. what.  The story will then die off exponentially.  Don't address it and not addressing it can be a PR hit.  Just my $0.02 USD.  

This is not the resolution I'd like to see, but it's probably the best one for LMG at this point and ultimately what's probably going to happen.

[harls]

8 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

It's called an Ambush Piece, though nearly all of GN's first video is actually observations and commentary on publicly posted material. You don't call a company for comment on their Financial Reports when you're just responding to them. The issue would be around Billet Labs. However, it took Billet getting a hold of GN to get anything done. Which really means it would have required GN Steve to contact Linus.  <--- This is the massive dysfunction.

 

While GN Steve has definitely had his own "bee in the bonnet" moments and gotten really worked up about minor things (because no one is perfect), resolving the Billet Labs situation changes very little about the video. While Linus may think that it's only happened once in 10 years, the reality is a malfunction that bad requires a massive analysis of their internal systems.  They should be pleased that Billet is just willing to take a check. LMG, the company, committed a crime (via negligence) under local law.

 

At the same time, Linus wants to bring in Labs to do far more testing of manufacturer claims. Which means significant errors in their work is a massive problem. It's pretty obvious GN Steve has been getting feed back from industry contacts about the issues around LMG.  This wasn't a hit piece. This was a combination of Intervention and Warning for future disasters if the ship isn't patched up.

It is disingenuous to say that it took Billet contacting GN to get anything done.  LMG contacted Billet to let them know that they fucked up and sold the block.  1 business day later GN put out his video and LMG responded after that.  To say that it taking 1 business day for a company to discuss what to do in this unprecedented situation means that they would not have done anything is a stretch.  

[jooroth18]

2 minutes ago, Drazil100 said:

If I recall, billet said that it was possible it would work (probably not understanding the filming process and that they would only try it on one card and not both). Linus took that and was like "viewers don't care about last gen lets try it on the 40 series card" (not an exact or actual quote)

I dont think its exactly how it happened. Here is what i think

 

The writer sets it up thinking he grabbed a 3090 but it was a 4090, as per shown in the beginning of the video

 

This implies that the 3090 billet sent was lost at logistics, which was pointed out by linus in an upcoming video exploring different lmg processes.

 

The writer asked Billet if it would work on a 4090. Billet says its possible. 

 

They make the video, and afterward when performance is revealed, the writer asks if they can use a 3090 because thats what billet said was compatible with.

 

Linus determines that the cost of sending someone out to the labs place to pick up a 3090, and the time to install would cost too much, and decides to move on.

[Gianluca Angeli]

1 minute ago, atxcyclist said:

 

I have stated numerous times in this thread that Steve's criticisms are not without merit, but it was from many hours before you even joined, and reading this thread would be difficult for you I imagine, with your goldfish-like memory abilities and all that.

Dude are you insane? Do you expect people to read 155 pages of replies? Bruh

 

[Skipple]

Just now, Uttamattamakin said:

Start apologetic

Therein lies the problem.

I don't know that I have ever seen Linus apologetic. Honestly. 

It's a massive issue. 

[RevengeofProfKatz]

1 minute ago, Amaninacity said:

Then you explain that in the story. Steve didn’t mention it until he was called out. And his reasoning was that he didn’t consider it relevant.

He actually did explain it at the start of the first video covering this entire mess. Steve literally said:
 

Quote

It is my job to ignore personal relationships. Yeah if LMG is going to make false accusations and wants to try and use "personal relationships" to gain favor so that we don't cover something we think is not ok, it's not going to work with us. We don't play that game.

Steve followed that up with:

 

Quote

We stand to lose a lot here. We risk pissing off people with direct and very valuable and useful to use connections to Youtube if we ever happen to need them. I don't have a connection at Youtube really who can help me in any way. Likewise, we risk pissing off people who are connected to LMG, that would include large streamers who operate in a class that we can't even begin to approach.
 

But most of all, we risk some our viewers getting upset. But we are approaching this as objectively as possible and we ask that you listen to the concerns we are raising, and the evidence that we are presenting, because ultimately if Linus Media Group wants to be consumer first, then it too should want this level of transparency and should want this knowledge of the issues we are present today.

 

[UncleFunkle]

16 minutes ago, Touch My Hamm said:

mods need to go through alot of this as alot of the conversation devolved into a yelling match with fanboys on both sides spitting at each other. nobody is changing minds here and I dont think the conversation is going to go anywhere.

 

hard to see as it started out as a company criticism and learning from it devolving into whatever half these conversations have become.

Oh god no. That's even more dangerous than doing nothing because people will say that LTT is silencing them and therefore must be trying to hide something nefarious.

[PandaSquawk]

6 minutes ago, K4shira said:

After LMG realized they've stolen a multi thousand dollar prototype you'd think they'd immediately call Linus and/or the CEO to get this issue fixed ASAP, and with ASAP I mean within the hour.

 

Why would you wait one business day to solve this? It would be the right thing to fix this immediately, also it would be good to not be known in the community for stealing prototypes/review samples, and you'd think they'd do everything they can to avert being charged for theft... They realized that they potentially commited a crime (theft), so why would they wait? That is something that warrants calling the boss even if he's on vacation to fix it immediately. The fact that they thought this can wait until next week just proves the questionable ethics of LMG.

Stolen? That's a poor choice of words. Stolen implies intent, and is a brain dead take.

[Retire]

1 minute ago, atxcyclist said:

 

I have stated numerous times in this thread that Steve's criticisms are not without merit, but it was from many hours before you even joined, and I'm sure reading this thread would be difficult for you, with your goldfish-like memory abilities and all that.

its weird how you resort to petty insults while i correctly called you out on your stupid responses and literal dickriding of Linus, he won't be your daddy, he's not gonna get in bed with you, he wont read out segways to their sponsors in the middle of the night, Santa Claus isn't real, The Earth is not Flat, Water is not Wet, and peoples online aren't your friends

[Abraxaz]

1 minute ago, ben025 said:

If you have seriously messed up by selling a prototype that isn't yours, you should not send an email to the CEO. Instead, you should go to the CEO's office immediately and explain to him what happened. You need to tell him that you have made a serious mistake and that the company needs to take action to fix this as soon as possible.

Exactly, my bet is this was hidden from Linus.

 

I bet if Steve had contacted Linus about it, Linus wouldn't have even known about it.

 

But since the nzxt fire issue that hasn't been Steve's style, outrage gets views see his monetisation of the latest video 

[atxcyclist]

Just now, aka473 said:

Again Jounalistic standards DO NOT require that you contact a target for publication. Especially in the event of a High-Profile target, who if asked for comment could try to kill the story by either removing the RAISON D'ÊTRE for said piece, or trying to flip or even get sources to no longer allow a publication to use their statements.

That's not the issue here, Steve made his own standards and pats himself on the back for them constantly, he's diverged from them to make this video. I am calling out that divergence, for standards he made for him/GN. I am not at all concerned about what some guidelines for journalists say, that's not the discussion here. I am discussing a person sticking to their own ethos consistently, which Steve isn't doing here.

[daydreamfaze]

1 minute ago, jooroth18 said:

I dont think its exactly how it happened. Here is what i think

 

The writer sets it up thinking he grabbed a 3090 but it was a 4090, as per shown in the beginning of the video

 

This implies that the 3090 billet sent was lost at logistics, which was pointed out by linus in an upcoming video exploring different lmg processes.

 

The writer asked Billet if it would work on a 4090. Billet says its possible. 

 

They make the video, and afterward when performance is revealed, the writer asks if they can use a 3090 because thats what billet said was compatible with.

 

Linus determines that the cost of sending someone out to the labs place to pick up a 3090, and the time to install would cost too much, and decides to move on.

Well to be frank, What you "think, is wrong. Theres what you think and what actually happened. Billet labs has two different products, one for the 3090 and one for the 40..