Tablet Wars: The Last Pixel Slate - Google Throws in The Towel on Pixel Slate

[Nowak]

21 hours ago, Drak3 said:

Pfft. No.

 

 

The Nexus 7 was a low end piece of shit and it showed. Google doesn't do hardware or operating systems well.

Depends on what model you mean. 2012 Nexus 7 or 2013 Nexus 7?

[DeScruff]

On 6/21/2019 at 12:43 AM, D13H4RD said:

The only tablet that Google did a decent job on was the Nexus 7.

 

Not surprising that the Slate failed. Was unimpressed from the beginning 

I'm *still* looking for a replacement to that tablet for my dad, cause his is feeling slugish, and the battery drains way to quickly.
He likes the thing to use while watching TV or whatever cause its bigger then a phone, But good luck finding a 7" or 8" tablet without one glaring issue. ( low res screen, only available in 16GB, Android 6.0 being the latest OS, locked to Amazon, stupidly expensive, or needing to switch to iOS (Which sucks when you need to rebuy all your apps) - Pick your poison )
 

[kaiju_wars]

On 6/21/2019 at 11:44 AM, RedRound2 said:

But Apple doesn't seem to be interested in controlling the tablet market the way Intel and Nvidia were controlling the CPU and GPU market by jacking up the prices and withholding cutting edge tech, before AMD at least.

 

Apple offers wide range of iPads varying in different sizes and prices that caters to almost all markets where a tablet would make sense, from iPad minis to be used in kiosks and restaurants to iPad Pro's to be used by artists and professional work. From the iPad 9.7" for kids to a more regular 10.5" iPads for families.

 

In short, they seem to just serve everyone with their market dominance and tbh with iPadOS, they seem to be pushing into a completely new UI and workflow, by taking the best of both worlds from phones and laptops.

 

Whether it'll be a success remains to be seen, but they're taking their time with it (unlike Microsoft) and they seem to be heading in a good direction, for now.

Speaking of which, even the baseline, cheapest iPad, the iPad 6th gen, has Apple Pencil support.  You can regularly find the iPad 6th gen for less than $300.  I picked mine up brand new on Amazon for $250.  That paired with an Apple Pencil is what I use as a drawing tablet.

 

Not the highest specs.  It doesn't have an A12 or A12X like the rest of the iPads currently.  But the A10 in it isn't a slouch either.

[Commodus]

2 hours ago, Sypran said:

I'm *still* looking for a replacement to that tablet for my dad, cause his is feeling slugish, and the battery drains way to quickly.
He likes the thing to use while watching TV or whatever cause its bigger then a phone, But good luck finding a 7" or 8" tablet without one glaring issue. ( low res screen, only available in 16GB, Android 6.0 being the latest OS, locked to Amazon, stupidly expensive, or needing to switch to iOS (Which sucks when you need to rebuy all your apps) - Pick your poison )
 

I'd honestly be tempted to say that a switch to the iPad mini is in order.  It's not cheap, but unless your dad has a huge investment in paid Android apps, it won't be that expensive.  And he absolutely won't complain about the performance, since it's demonstrably faster than all Android tablets you can currently buy (there aren't any major tablets with the Snapdragon 855 AFAIK, and that's still not as fast in key aspects).

[Results45]

On 6/21/2019 at 6:45 PM, WereCatf said:

Looking at all the replies here, it's almost as if I was the only one who actually wants an Android-tablet. I don't own any Apple-devices and I really have no interest in joining their shitty closed ecosystem and Surface-tablets are way too expensive, plus I don't have any experience on whether Windows is actually useable on a tablet in the first place.

 

I've once used 8" ZTE/AT&T-brand Android tablet on a daily basis for 2 months. It's alright -- pretty much like using an Android phone but with actual tabbed windows on some app and some other minor nice-to-have OS features.

 

At the end of the day I wouldn't say any of the minor differences in OS features was really a deal-breaker or would be reason for me to buy one in the future.

 

Yes, there was the larger screen but that's not a huge advantage unless you have OS functionality and apps to make good use of that larger screen (aka what Apple & Google are going for on larger iPads and folding phones).

 

I think the only that would have kept Android tablets appealing against Apple was if Nvidia expanded their SHIELD Games support to other high-end lineups like Pixels and Galaxy Tabs. 

[mr moose]

39 minutes ago, Results45 said:

 

I've once used 8" ZTE/AT&T-brand Android tablet on a daily basis for 2 months. It's alright -- pretty much like using an Android phone but with actual tabbed windows on some app and some other minor nice-to-have OS features.

 

At the end of the day I wouldn't say any of the minor differences in OS features was really a deal-breaker or would be reason for me to buy one in the future.

 

Yes, there was the larger screen but that's not a huge advantage unless you have OS functionality and apps to make good use of that larger screen (aka what Apple & Google are going for on larger iPads and folding phones).

 

I think the only that would have kept Android tablets appealing against Apple was if Nvidia expanded their SHIELD Games support to other high-end lineups like Pixels and Galaxy Tabs. 

Given a really good chunk of people only want tablets for facebook, watching netflix and email, then anything mid range and up is suitable.  The OS is largely irrelevant unless you already have an iphone and are locked into the app store with previous purchases.   This explains ipads market share much more plausibly than assuming all android tablets are low quality shit.

 

 

[RoseLuck462]

They made a very poor attempt, I’m not surprised.

[D13H4RD]

On a side note, still rocking the 2015 iPad Pro. 

 

Been wanting a smaller one tbh

[LAwLz]

On 6/21/2019 at 5:18 AM, Arika S said:

I know more people with android tablets than Apple. I'm personally waiting to see want samsung's s5 Tab is going to be. i much prefer the Android ecosystem over iOS 

I'm also waiting for the Samsung S5 Tab.

Currently using a Sony Z4 tablet and it's starting to show its age. The Snapdragon 810 was not exactly a great SoC.

 

 

On 6/21/2019 at 6:32 AM, Drak3 said:

And Windows tablets/2in1s are growing. Fairly fast according to the article.

I don't get why though. Windows sucks as a tablet OS.

Try removing the keyboard from the people who use 2-in-1 Windows machines and they will most likely think it's clunky and a really bad user experience. Most of the programs they use aren't well suited for touch mode. And if you are only using your 2-in-1 in tablet mode, like I see most people doing, then why not just get a laptop?

 

I think that Android is far superior as a tablet OS to Windows. Windows is obviously more powerful and has a ton of great programs, but few of them are pleasant to use without a mouse/trackpad and keyboard. 2-in-1 devices usually tend to be far heavier, with shorter battery life and bulkier than Android tablets too. That will probably change with Windows on ARM, but I doubt most 2-in-1s sold are ARM powered today. They are Intel based.

Would Windows "tablets (2-in-1) sell as well as they do if none of them had keyboards and they were only sold as tablets? I don't think so. The reason why I don't think so is because I find the tablet experience to be terrible on Windows. Programs are clearly not made to be used with touch screens and on-screen keyboards.

 

 

On 6/21/2019 at 6:45 AM, Drak3 said:

The Nexus 7 was a low end piece of shit and it showed. Google doesn't do hardware or operating systems well.

Care to explain how the Nexus 7 was bad in objective terms?

The Nexus 7 tablets were widely successful and people really enjoyed them.

I don't even get how you can say it was low-end when it had top-of-the-line specs at a really low price, especially the 2013 model which had one of the best displays of any device on the market at the time, coupled with Qualcomm's flagship SoC.

[porina]

On 6/21/2019 at 4:20 AM, DrMacintosh said:

But marketshare wise, Apple holds a commanding lead, for good reason. The hardware and software is simply unmatched. 

You may recall from another thread I'm a partial convert from android tablets with the recent purchase of an ipad. I'd give it to Apple on the hardware, but it is not a win on the software side. I've been debating doing a writeup of it some time, but there are things Android does better IMO. iOS users probably don't miss it as they never had it. I think my dream device would be an Android tablet running on current ipad CPU/GPU.

 

On 6/21/2019 at 5:45 AM, Drak3 said:

The Nexus 7 was a low end piece of shit and it showed. Google doesn't do hardware or operating systems well.

I got a Nexus 7 2012 (the first one) and it was great when it came out, but it aged really badly. The last major official Android OS update for it practically killed it as it made performance so bad it was almost unusable. Keep it back a version and it is still usable for basic stuff even today.

 

On 6/21/2019 at 7:23 AM, abazigal said:

The issue isn’t that nobody wants android tablets. It’s that nobody wants high-end android tablets.

I'd twist it slightly differently, in that I think the hardware specs aren't good enough for the price in the upper-mid range ($300+ ball park). If there was an android tablet comparable to the ipad mini 2019 in hardware specs I would have bought it.

[Drak3]

28 minutes ago, porina said:

I got a Nexus 7 2012 (the first one) and it was great when it came out,

Nothing from the Nexus line was great at any point. The entire point of the nexus line was cheap devices that got major Android updates, which isn’t a plus. The quality of Android has gone down since Kitkat.

[porina]

31 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Nothing from the Nexus line was great at any point. The entire point of the nexus line was cheap devices that got major Android updates, which isn’t a plus. The quality of Android has gone down since Kitkat.

I'd have to disagree there, as owner of Nexus 7, 4, and 5X. Nexus devices were in a good sweet spot of price and performance. They weren't flagship level devices, but got most of the way to it for a lot less. They were never cheap in that there were much cheaper (and much worse) devices. I think Android has improved over the years, and would prefer it over current iOS given a choice. If it is not for you, fair enough. Not everyone is the same.

[LAwLz]

1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

Nothing from the Nexus line was great at any point. The entire point of the nexus line was cheap devices that got major Android updates, which isn’t a plus. The quality of Android has gone down since Kitkat. 

You keep saying those things but never back it up with anything objective.

I asked you earlier why you said the Nexus 7 was a "low end piece of shit" and is still waiting for an answer.

[Drak3]

55 minutes ago, porina said:

Nexus devices were in a good sweet spot of price and performance. They weren't flagship level devices, but got most of the way to it for a lot less. 

Nexus devices were mid end hardware in the era where mid end was not 'most of the way,' and Google's implementation of Android did not do well on said hardware. The real world experience of these devices were comparable to entry level alternatives with weaker hardware.

 

Google ended up killing the Nexus line because it couldn't compete, it was a fruitless task. Their devices had no merit to them other than somewhat better support.

 

58 minutes ago, porina said:

I think Android has improved over the years,

Stock Android has been playing catch up to Samsung's versions of Kitkat, and doing a bad job at it. Android has become more bloated.

[porina]

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Nexus devices were mid end hardware in the era where mid end was not 'most of the way,' and Google's implementation of Android did not do well on said hardware. The real world experience of these devices were comparable to entry level alternatives with weaker hardware.

Have you actually used them? As an owner of several of the devices, that doesn't fit in with my observations. As art of my previous day job I did have to test on multiple mobile devices over time too.

 

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Google ended up killing the Nexus line because it couldn't compete, it was a fruitless task. Their devices had no merit to them other than somewhat better support.

I don't know their reasons for stopping Nexus, but the Pixel 3A is a spiritual successor in that place without the name, so they are certainly not out of it yet.

 

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Stock Android has been playing catch up to Samsung's versions of Kitkat, and doing a bad job at it. Android has become more bloated.

All OSes become bloated as they add more features, wanted or not. On that note, I really can't stand Samsung Android when I had an S6 as my main work phone. It was so bad I got it replaced with an iPhone. Even as an Android main user, I'd rather get an iPhone than Samsung's interpretation.

[Drak3]

1 hour ago, porina said:

Have you actually used them?

Yes, they were consistantly slow and buggy.

[porina]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

Yes, they were consistantly slow and buggy.

I guess we had different experiences then, but that certainly wasn't mine. Well, the 7 cripplingly slow after the final OS update, but IMO they went too far with support on that one and it was beyond the hardware. It was fine on preceding OS.

[D13H4RD]

3 hours ago, Drak3 said:

Nothing from the Nexus line was great at any point. The entire point of the nexus line was cheap devices that got major Android updates, which isn’t a plus. The quality of Android has gone down since Kitkat.

Nexus devices were originally meant to be developer-oriented devices. They only got "cheap" when the Nexus 4 and 7 came along. Prior Nexus devices, especially the GNex were at a price point that was up there with typical high-end phones of the time.

[LAwLz]

2 hours ago, Drak3 said:

Nexus devices were mid end hardware in the era where mid end was not 'most of the way,' and Google's implementation of Android did not do well on said hardware. The real world experience of these devices were comparable to entry level alternatives with weaker hardware.

I find it quite atoning just how much you get wrong.

 

Nexus devices were not "mid end" hardware. Let's look at the Nexus devices, shall we?

 

Nexus One - Very high end. It was slightly less powerful and feature-rich than the Galaxy S but that was released almost half a year later, and by that time we had gotten slightly better stuff.

It was by no means low or mid range. It was high end.

 

Nexus S - Very high end. It was more or less a rebranded Galaxy S, which was arguably the best Android phone you could get at the time.

In Brian Klug's review at Anandtech he said "Right now, there's no doubt about it that the Nexus S is the best Android phone on the market".

Not exactly something you would say about a "mid range" phone.

 

Galaxy Nexus - High end. Again, Brian Klug said in his review that "I'd go so far to say that the Galaxy Nexus is without question the current best Android device". It was released between the Galaxy S2 and S3 and it kind of shows by the specs. The SoC is closer to the S2 in terms of performance, but the screen is more like the s3.

 

Nexus 4 - Was at the time competing against the Galaxy S3 and had very competitive specs.

Again, let's listen to what Brian Klug said about it. "You can go back and read what I've written about the Nexus 4 hardware - in a word it's superb" and "for $299 you can get the latest and greatest hardware", and he ends with "the Nexus 4 pretty much blows the door off of any other unlocked or out of contract smartphone, which usually end up being priced at around $600 or more".

 

Nexus 5 - Again, high end. Citation from Brian Klug: "At $349 you not only get the absolute latest hardware, but the most accurate 1080p display availible on an Android device". Notice how he said "absolute latest hardware"? That's because it was as high end as you could get at launch.

 

Nexus 6 - Used the same high end hardware as other phones at the time. The SD 805 among other things. Let's listen to what Brian Klug says: "On the hardware side it sports great build quality, a camera which is greatly improved from the Nexus 5, a sharp display, and performance which is essentially the best that you'll find in an Android phone. "

Let's repeat that, the best performance you'll find in an Android phone.

 

Nexus 5X - This was the first time a Nexus device did not have a top-of-the-line chip. Remember why? Because it used the Snapdragon 808 rather than the 810 which had huge thermal issues. This was the first time a Nexus device wasn't up there competing with the highest end offerings from the likes of Samsung and Motorola.

 

Nexus 6P - High end. Used the latest SoC (SD 810), same amount of RAM (3GB), one of the best displays available, etc... You could not find many phones with higher end specs. Maybe from Apple, and Samsung was maybe ahead in some regards but that was about it.

 

 

 

Nexus 7 - Had high end specs for the time. Asus had some higher end tablets but that was double the price, for 0.3GHz faster CPU (same SoC, just slightly overclocked, Tegra 3 T30L vs Tegra 3 T33). The display was not class-leading, but it was not at all bad either. I guess it would be fair to say the display was mid range.

 

Nexus 7 (2013) - Fantastic. Possibly the best screen of any Android device at the time. The highest end SoC at the time, and a bunch of stuff which was not common place at the time of release, such as wireless charging.

Here is Brian Klug's summary of it: "The build quality is great, the display is amazing and the hardware is fast. The new Nexus 7 also happens to be the most color accurate Android device we've ever tested - easily competitive with the iPad's Retina Display, and delivers the longest battery life we've ever seen from an Android tablet."

 

Nexus 10 - It was the fastest Android tablet on the market at the time of release. Might even have been the fastest Android device on the market, period. It also had the highest resolution display of any Android device. How anyone can say the Nexus 10 was not high end is beyond me.

 

Nexus 9 - I hated the Nexus 9 and would rather not talk about it. It was really high end though. It had the Nvidia K1 SoC.

[kelvinhall05]

o hecc

 

 

i sad