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AMD Q4 Earnings Report & Zen 2 Will Have Spectre Fix

The Benjamins
By The Benjamins
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If you’ve been following the ongoing Spectre and Meltdown saga, you know that Intel has been the vendor most affected by the two chip vulnerabilities. Lisa Su, AMD’s chief executive, reiterated AMD’s prior position that the company’s chips aren’t vulnerable to Meltdown, nor to some of the iterations of potential Spectre exploits. 

Here’s how Su explained it:

“For Spectre variant 1, we continue actively working with our ecosystem partners on mitigations, including operating system packages that have begun to roll out,” Su said. “We continue to believe that variant 2 of Spectre is difficult to exploit on AMD processors. However, we are deploying CPU microcode packages that in combination with operating system patches, provide additional mitigation steps.

“Longer term, we have included changes in our future processsor cores, starting with our Zen 2 design, to further address potential Spectre-like exploits,” Su added. “We continue to collaborate closely with the industry on these vulnerabilities, and are committed to protecting AMD users on these and other security threats, as they arise.”

Put another way, it won’t be until 2019 that AMD solves its Spectre problem. Based on AMD’s extensive roadmap that the company recently revealed, the next-gen Zen 2 architecture won’t be released until next year.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3252237/components-processors/amd-will-spectre-proof-the-zen-2-architecture-and-4-other-nuggets-from-its-earnings-call.html

 

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The results exceeded AMD’s and analysts’ expectations. They were expecting in the $1.39B range, but their actual revenue came in at a relatively strong $1.48B. Not only was the quarter stronger than expected, but AMD was able to pull out another positive net income of $61M. It has been a while since AMD was able to post back to back profitable quarters. This allowed AMD to have a net positive year to the tune of $43M where in 2016 AMD had a loss of $497M. 2017 as a whole was $1.06B more in revenue over 2016. AMD has been historically lean in terms of expenses for the past few years, and a massive boost in revenue has allowed them to invest in R&D as well as more aggressively ramp up their money making products to compete more adequately with Intel, who is having their own set of issues right now with manufacturing and security.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Editorial/AMD-Reports-Stronger-Expected-Q4-Earnings

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12378/amd-announces-q4-fy-2017-results

 

It is awesome to see that AMD has been positive most of the year, and finally has some breathing room to grow. I hope 2018 is a even better year for them. it is nice to see new CPU designs coming that are not effected by Meltdown/Spectre in the next 1-2 years from both companies.

if you want to annoy me, then join my teamspeak server ts.benja.cc

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It's nice to see AMD stepping up to the plate and talking about how they are going about to fix spectre. (No word on meltdown yet)

 

But then take a look over at Intel as they kneel in a corner, counting their money and hoping everyone forgets about these issues if they keep their mouth shut.

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39 minutes ago, NinJake said:

It's nice to see AMD stepping up to the plate and talking about how they are going about to fix spectre. (No word on meltdown yet)

 

But then take a look over at Intel as they kneel in a corner, counting their money and hoping everyone forgets about these issues if they keep their mouth shut.

AMD is 100% not affected by meltdown, ONLY intel is effected by meltdown. Spectre effects most CPU's (even arm)

if you want to annoy me, then join my teamspeak server ts.benja.cc

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if i had to guess, Q2 2018 is going to be even better, because of the APUs mainly. its nice to see that AMD are back and earning, hope they can keep fighting so we have proper competition in the market :) 

I spent $2500 on building my PC and all i do with it is play no games atm & watch anime at 1080p(finally) watch YT and write essays...  nothing, it just sits there collecting dust...

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The original LAN PC build log! (Old, dead and replaced by The Toaster Project & 5.0)

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#1. Treat others as you would like to be treated.

#2. It's best to keep your mouth shut; and appear to be stupid, rather than open it and remove all doubt.

#3. There is nothing "wrong" with being wrong. Learning from a mistake can be more valuable than not making one in the first place.

 

Follow these simple rules in life, and I promise you, things magically get easier. " - MageTank 31-10-2016

 

 

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Annnnd it'll take intel an extra 4 months and call it a feature and sell it to you for double

▓ƆԀ▓ S▓₱▓Ɇ▓c▓s▓: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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Posted

But does it mean new socket just like Intel's 9th gen CPUs?

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6 minutes ago, hey_yo_ said:

But does it mean new socket just like Intel's 9th gen CPUs?

IIRC AMD has stated that zen 2 will be on AM4.

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2 minutes ago, The Benjamins said:

As far as I Know Zen 2 will be supported by AM4.

AM4 is (as stated by AMD) supposed to last up to 2019, and any AMD mainstream cpu releases will use that socket. Whether they stick to it or not is up to them, but thats what they promised with the release of Ryzen 1.0 in 2017 (I'm calling it Ryzen 1.0, no one else has called it that AFAIK)

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6 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

IIRC AMD has stated that zen 2 will be on AM4.

With that said, it makes me wonder why would Intel need to ditch the existing LGA 1151 just to fix the Spectre v2 in their 9th gen processors?

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2 minutes ago, hey_yo_ said:

With that said, it makes me wonder why would Intel need to ditch the existing LGA 1151 just to fix the Spectre v2 in their 9th gen processors?

Maybe their 9th gen processors have new features that can only be implemented with a bigger socket size.

 

Just a hunch, I don't want to immediately jump to the "to make more money" conclusion.

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19 minutes ago, hey_yo_ said:

But does it mean new socket just like Intel's 9th gen CPUs?

no, it will go in AM4 if they release them before 2020 which im pretty sure they will :P 

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I'm not quite sure if zen2 is really spectre immune... More like mitigations have been put in place.

1 hour ago, The Benjamins said:

Longer term, we have included changes in our future processsor cores, starting with our Zen 2 design, to further address potential Spectre-like exploits

As you can see, Lisa never straight out says zen2 is spectre immune, because it isn't. Rather, spectre has been "further addressed." Big difference here.

 

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18 minutes ago, The Benjamins said:

As far as I Know Zen 2 will be supported by AM4.

 

5 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

no, it will go in AM4 if they release them before 2020 which im pretty sure they will :P 

 

13 minutes ago, TVwazhere said:

AM4 is (as stated by AMD) supposed to last up to 2019, and any AMD mainstream cpu releases will use that socket. Whether they stick to it or not is up to them, but thats what they promised with the release of Ryzen 1.0 in 2017 (I'm calling it Ryzen 1.0, no one else has called it that AFAIK)

 And I believe X470 is backwards compatible to Ryzen 1.0, correct?

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Just now, Dissitesuxba11s said:

 

 

 And I believe X470 is backwards compatible to Ryzen 1.0, correct?

Yes but I think you're more likely to put a Pinnacle Ridge CPU into an X370 board than a Summit Ridge CPU into an X470 board. 

While there are no details, don't (necessarily) expect full functionality even though it'll work.

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20 minutes ago, hey_yo_ said:

With that said, it makes me wonder why would Intel need to ditch the existing LGA 1151 just to fix the Spectre v2 in their 9th gen processors?

I’m retry sure it’s more than that. IIRC Ice lake has always been on a new socket, even before specter/meltdown were known.

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HDDs: 4x HGST Dekstar NAS 4TB @ 7200RPM (3 data, 1 parity)

Case: Sillverstone GD08B

Other: Added 3x Noctua NF-F12 intake, 2x Noctua NF-A8 exhaust, Inatek 5 port USB 3.0 expansion card with usb 3.0 front panel header

Details: 12GB ram, GTX 1080, USB card passed through to windows 10 VM. VM's OS drive is the SATA SSD. Rest of resources are for Plex, Duplicati, Spaghettidetective, Nextcloud, and game servers.

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8 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

Yes but I think you're more likely to put a Pinnacle Ridge CPU into an X370 board than a Summit Ridge CPU into an X470 board. 

While there are no details, don't (necessarily) expect full functionality even though it'll work.

Why not expect full functionality? What has changed that could cause problems?

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My main PC (Hybrid Windows 10/Arch Linux):

OS: Arch Linux w/ XFCE DE (VFIO-Patched Kernel) as host OS, windows 10 as guest

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Cooler: Noctua NH-D15

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GPU: Guest: EVGA RTX 3070 FTW3 ULTRA Host: 2x Radeon HD 8470

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Other: White LED strip to illuminate the interior. Extra fractal intake fan for positive pressure.

 

unRAID server (Plex, Windows 10 VM, NAS, Duplicati, game servers):

OS: unRAID 6.11.2

CPU: Ryzen R7 2700x @ Stock

Cooler: Noctua NH-U9S

Mobo: Asus Prime X470-Pro

RAM: 16GB G-Skill Ripjaws V + 16GB Hyperx Fury Black @ stock

GPU: EVGA GTX 1080 FTW2

PSU: EVGA G3 850W

SSD: Samsung 970 evo NVME 250GB, Samsung 860 evo SATA 1TB 

HDDs: 4x HGST Dekstar NAS 4TB @ 7200RPM (3 data, 1 parity)

Case: Sillverstone GD08B

Other: Added 3x Noctua NF-F12 intake, 2x Noctua NF-A8 exhaust, Inatek 5 port USB 3.0 expansion card with usb 3.0 front panel header

Details: 12GB ram, GTX 1080, USB card passed through to windows 10 VM. VM's OS drive is the SATA SSD. Rest of resources are for Plex, Duplicati, Spaghettidetective, Nextcloud, and game servers.

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10 minutes ago, sazrocks said:

Why not expect full functionality? What has changed that could cause problems?

Not anything I can tell. Zen is SoC-like in nature and the chipset is much more decoupled than on Intel and should pretty much just rely on standard PCI-E lanes and otherwise not care what it's connected to. However, I'm pretty sure board vendors will want AMD to make some kind of artificial limitation to move more units.

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Spectre is an attack type against Out of Order execution in general. It'll always be theoretically possible to attack it, which is why they're implementing approaches to cut off any potential at the Software level as well. 

 

Meltdown is an Intel issue where they found higher IPC but cutting out steps that are attackable. Skylake cores have now functionally gone backwards in IPC from launch and their generational improvements.

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34 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

Yes but I think you're more likely to put a Pinnacle Ridge CPU into an X370 board than a Summit Ridge CPU into an X470 board. 

While there are no details, don't (necessarily) expect full functionality even though it'll work.

yes but we gotta have them hwbot points :P 

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3 hours ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Spectre is an attack type against Out of Order execution in general. It'll always be theoretically possible to attack it, which is why they're implementing approaches to cut off any potential at the Software level as well. 

 

Meltdown is an Intel issue where they found higher IPC but cutting out steps that are attackable. Skylake cores have now functionally gone backwards in IPC from launch and their generational improvements.

What? That's not correct at all. Meltdown is also an attack against Out of Order execution where it is theoretically possible due to how operating systems map memory. It has nothing to due with some cheating method Intel found to increase their IPC. Spectre goes about throwing crap into the cache that can then be tied to a victim process' data. Both go about how modern processors use branch prediction and out of order execution to speed up processing time. They are similar but Spectre is far harder to defeat due to how it's tied to the fundamentals of modern processing.

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