Mobile GSync.....it's gonna be a thing

[mvitkun]

The news about Gamenab.net, what you probably recall as "Free Gsync on all eDP, DP 1.1 and DP 1.2 displays", drew PCPER.com to look into whether the claims that the driver enables GSync on laptops, mostly from this thread on OC.net, were true or not.

 

And as it happens PCPER.com tested this driver on their ASUS G751 laptop and sure enough it enabled GSync.

NO GSYNC MODULE

PCPER tore apart the laptop and the GSync module wasn't present.

 

 

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/Mobile-G-Sync-Confirmed-and-Tested-Leaked-Alpha-Driver

 

 

Looking further into the story PCPER found that the driver that can be found on the Gamenab page came about when a Nordic Asus rep leaked it in trying to fix an unrelated problem.

This driver is a work in progress to get GSync working on laptops, and it seems to have a good amount of the functionality seen on a regular GSync panel.

Though it is a leaked driver, meaning it was not yet ready because they haven't worked out all the kinks.

 -The first noted problem was a flicker at low fps.

 -The second noted problem was the display blacking out at even lower fps and at times when the game engine stalls.

As far as I know there is no ETA for M-GSync 

The low fps display black out

 

This would also lead one to believe that Gamenab's claims at modding mobile DSR (Dynamic Super Resolution) functionality into mobile GPUs may indicate that this is already something being worked on by Nvidia, and why not when there are 8GB GTX 980Ms.

 

I'm glad to see that the Dynamic Refresh Rate technology is becoming more and more common, it went from a single monitor to several to laptops.

[Aniallation]

Now all I need is G-Sync on my phone so I can have less screen tearing during UI navigation in Android.

[othertomperson]

It should have been a thing way before desktop g-sync (or equivalents) when you stop to think about it. In what other context from a manufacturer's point of view is there a mandatory proprietary connector to be chosen completely at your leisure between a monitor entirely of your own choosing and your GPU? Laptop, tablet and AIO and that's about it.

[The Benjamins]

It looks like it uses adaptive sync, or more or less a implantation like AMD.

[patrickjp93]

It looks like it uses adaptive sync, or more or less a implantation like AMD.

Nope, as laptops work on eDP which doesn't have the adaptive sync standard in them. In other words, DP 1.2a is pointless.

[Plasma]

phones use v sync they shouldn't have tearing this is more nvidia leading the dumb horse to water

[spartaman64]

doesnt many laptops have adaptive sync as a power saving feature. so its more free sync than g sync

[The Benjamins]

Nope, as laptops work on eDP which doesn't have the adaptive sync standard in them. In other words, DP 1.2a is pointless.

adaptive sync was taken from laptops eDP PSR standard and copied/upgraded to DP1.2a. Adaptive sync was first rolled out in 2009.

 

 

http://www.anandtech.com/show/8008/vesa-adds-adaptivesync-to-displayport-12a-standard-variable-refresh-monitors-move-forward "Adaptive-Sync (not to be confused with NVIDIA’s Adaptive V-Sync), the eDP feature that allows for variable refresh monitors, has been added to the DisplayPort 1.2a standard as an optional feature."

http://www.vesa.org/news/vesa-adds-adaptive-sync-to-popular-displayport-video-standard/ " Adaptive-Sync is a proven and widely adopted technology. The technology has been a standard component of VESA’s embedded DisplayPort (eDP™) specification since its initial rollout in 2009."

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Introducing-the-Panel-Self-Refresh-Technology/1384

[WelshDdraig]

This is actually very interesting. Damn PcPer ripped that laptop apart. Also someone at Asus just got fired.

[S w a t s o n]

This needs more attention for the specific fact that Nvidia confirmed to PCPer that infact G-Sync should work in general without the module it just happens that the driver was meant for laptops. So basically that guy on GameNab or whatever was right, Nvidia has been using the modules as a form of DRM. As a GTX 680 owner, I'm very close to never going Nvidia again after this shit combined with the 970 ,970m and 980m exhibiting vram issues..

 

Directly from: http://videocardz.com/54826/pcperspective-mobile-g-sync-confirmed-g-sync-module-unneeded

 

 

NVIDIA confirmed to PCPerspective that this technology is still in alpha-phase, but the G-Sync support was not meant to be added anytime soon. Most importantly NVIDIA confirmed G-Sync module is not required for G-Sync to work.

 

[ForsakenLive]

Who cares? Gaming on a notebook is not proper gaming in the first place.

[Shyxlol]

This needs more attention for the specific fact that Nvidia confirmed to PCPer that infact G-Sync should work in general without the module it just happens that the driver was meant for laptops. So basically that guy on GameNab or whatever was right, Nvidia has been using the modules as a form of DRM. As a GTX 680 owner, I'm very close to never going Nvidia again after this shit combined with the 970 ,970m and 980m exhibiting vram issues..

 

Directly from: http://videocardz.com/54826/pcperspective-mobile-g-sync-confirmed-g-sync-module-unneeded

 

Interestingly, NVIDIA says that the answer hasn’t been 100% decided yet – the future could include this same module, a new module or perhaps even no module at all. There are features and technologies in the G-Sync module that haven’t been revealed, at least according to NVIDIA [...]

 

From the article. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that nvidia put the module in "for nothing" from that.

First of all, they released the g-sync module BEFORE we had the new standard aka freesync monitors. That alone made the module necessary for the time being.

The only reason it works for that laptop (and most likely some others) is the fact that freesync has been adapted from laptops in the first place.

[ACatWithThumbs]

This needs more attention for the specific fact that Nvidia confirmed to PCPer that infact G-Sync should work in general without the module it just happens that the driver was meant for laptops. So basically that guy on GameNab or whatever was right, Nvidia has been using the modules as a form of DRM. As a GTX 680 owner, I'm very close to never going Nvidia again after this shit combined with the 970 ,970m and 980m exhibiting vram issues..

 

Directly from: http://videocardz.com/54826/pcperspective-mobile-g-sync-confirmed-g-sync-module-unneeded

But you can clearly see that the monitor needs a module to not black out at low fps.

Third parties could fix this them selves but it's far from free.

And this only works on the laptop because it has an adaptive panel for power saving.

Even without Nvidia the guys that make the screen will need to add additional tech to the monitor which will cost at least $50-100 more than a monitor without it.

Adaptive refresh panels will always cost more money than a normal one with or without Nvidia.

[JAKEBAB]

Who cares? Gaming on a notebook is not proper gaming in the first place.

Id argue its a pretty viable option these days

[Misanthrope]

Nevermind I was thinking cellphones

[mvitkun]

This needs more attention for the specific fact that Nvidia confirmed to PCPer that infact G-Sync should work in general without the module it just happens that the driver was meant for laptops. So basically that guy on GameNab or whatever was right, Nvidia has been using the modules as a form of DRM. As a GTX 680 owner, I'm very close to never going Nvidia again after this shit combined with the 970 ,970m and 980m exhibiting vram issues..

 

Directly from: http://videocardz.com/54826/pcperspective-mobile-g-sync-confirmed-g-sync-module-unneeded

Technically that's not entirely true, the implementation of Gsync isn't perfect and they (Allyn and Ryan) noted that due to a lack of a logic board and proper frame buffer for storing frames in case the fps gets too low there was flickering at low frame rates and at times when the game engine stalled.

The GSync module does have some purpose other than DRM, though with the level of GSync functionality demonstrated on the laptop Nvidia may have led us to believe that the importance of the module was much greater than it actually is. 

Nope, as laptops work on eDP which doesn't have the adaptive sync standard in them. In other words, DP 1.2a is pointless.

eDP did have it, but DP 1.1, DP 1.2, and DP 1.3 do not.

Without DP 1.2a dynamic refresh rates would not have been introduced into the desktop DP standard.

So AMD would not have had any option to provide an open standard for Dynamic Refresh Rate on the desktop.

 

@LinusTech Nvidia supposedly admitted that they aren't sure whether the GSync module will be present in the same form that it currently is, or whether a GSync module will be required in the future at all.

[ForsakenLive]

Id argue its a pretty viable option these days

But this is a technology about increasing gaming quality, up to an image that is perfectly smooth, only to increase immersion. But then a portable computer... Small screen, poor ergonomics, your keyboard is close and strapped to the thing, not even properly angled. Why does it matter then? It's like discussing about the sauce when the pasta is not really that good and you are eating while you are standing, with the plate in your hand.

[Qwertious]

This needs more attention for the specific fact that Nvidia confirmed to PCPer that infact G-Sync should work in general without the module it just happens that the driver was meant for laptops. So basically that guy on GameNab or whatever was right, Nvidia has been using the modules as a form of DRM. As a GTX 680 owner, I'm very close to never going Nvidia again after this shit combined with the 970 ,970m and 980m exhibiting vram issues..

If I recall correctly. The gpu and monitor uses a much more direct connection that doesn't require the use of the module.

[S w a t s o n]

G-sync even with the module has issue at low fps too guys, Also I am aware that the laptop's use eDP but that guy got it working on normal monitors, so clearly it's not just eDP at work here. Maybe the module just forced adaptive sync on, as if you can recall adaptive sync was tabled long before it was put into DP 1.2a, In which case Nvidia was still being misleading.

[ComradeHX]

Technically that's not entirely true, the implementation of Gsync isn't perfect and they (Allyn and Ryan) noted that due to a lack of a logic board and proper frame buffer for storing frames in case the fps gets too low there was flickering at low frame rates and at times when the game engine stalled.

The GSync module does have some purpose other than DRM, though with the level of GSync functionality demonstrated on the laptop Nvidia may have led us to believe that the importance of the module was much greater than it actually is. 

You are not supposed to be playing games at 15fps> anyway; unless it's from Ubisoft.

[PlatypusWithCheese]

i would guess the reason why mobile G-sync does not use a G-sync module is because the panel is connected directly to the GPU so it can control display itself directly therefore not needing the the extra circuitry to cram it out over an external connector.

[Glenwing]

G-sync even with the module has issue at low fps too guys, Also I am aware that the laptop's use eDP but that guy got it working on normal monitors, so clearly it's not just eDP at work here. Maybe the module just forced adaptive sync on, as if you can recall adaptive sync was tabled long before it was put into DP 1.2a, In which case Nvidia was still being misleading.

To be frank, the GameNab guy is full of shit, I wouldn't trust anything he says. If you remember he was trying to pass this driver off as something he modded himself to "unlock" G-SYNC when all he did was repackage the leaked driver from NVIDIA. It does not and will not work on any desktop monitor that I'm aware of, with the exception of possibly the selection of Adaptive-Sync monitors announced at CES (although I'm betting NVIDIA put in safeguards to prevent that from working out of the box). I tested this with several DP 1.2a monitors and it didn't work on any of them, and I have been monitoring three threads on this forum, one on OCN, and the three articles on the GameNab site and I have yet to see a single person who said they got it working on any desktop monitor. The only person who says it works on desktop monitors is the GameNab guy with one offhand comment about how his friend said it worked on his desktop monitor.

The G-SYNC module is also more than just DRM, as noted in the PCP video it repeats frames when the framerate drops too low in order to prevent flickering. It's also important to remember G-SYNC and the G-SYNC module came before DisplayPort 1.2a, and Adaptive-Sync was a forgotten feature in a handful of laptops. To enable variable refresh there has to be a standard of communication between the monitor and GPU, and since the Adaptive-Sync standard wasn't in place when G-SYNC came out NVIDIA used their own solution. Notice that FreeSync does not work on G-SYNC displays, as they do not support Adaptive-Sync. So the G-SYNC module is not just DRM on displays which are otherwise capable of it, the module does do something. It does what Adaptive-Sync does, except on displays that came out before Adaptive-Sync started being implemented on desktop displays.

One more thing that is worth noting is that just because it's called G-SYNC doesn't mean the software operates the exact same way. The initial G-SYNC implementation was built to work with the G-SYNC module, but I'm betting this "mobile G-SYNC" is a newer version of G-SYNC rebuilt around eDP Adaptive-Sync since that makes sense for implementation into laptops, and this would make it essentially the same thing as FreeSync. Of course they are still going to call it G-SYNC though. I mean, it does the same thing anyway.

[mvitkun]

You are not supposed to be playing games at 15fps> anyway; unless it's from Ubisoft.

The point (or one of the points) of Dynamic Refresh is making the gaming experience better without needing to throw all the horsepower in the world at a game.

[ComradeHX]

The point (or one of the points) of Dynamic Refresh is making the gaming experience better without needing to throw all the horsepower in the world at a game.

Below 24fps is worse than "cinematic."  It means you need to turn down settings; screentearing at that kind of fps is the least thing you should be worrying about.

[Guest Kloaked]

To be frank, the GameNab guy is full of shit, I wouldn't trust anything he says. If you remember he was trying to pass this driver off as something he modded himself to "unlock" G-SYNC when all he did was repackage the leaked driver from NVIDIA. It does not and will not work on any desktop monitor that I'm aware of, with the exception of possibly the selection of Adaptive-Sync monitors announced at CES (although I'm betting NVIDIA put in safeguards to prevent that from working out of the box). I tested this with several DP 1.2a monitors and it didn't work on any of them, and I have been monitoring three threads on this forum, one on OCN, and the three articles on the GameNab site and I have yet to see a single person who said they got it working on any desktop monitor. The only person who says it works on desktop monitors is the GameNab guy with one offhand comment about how his friend said it worked on his desktop monitor.

The G-SYNC module is also more than just DRM, as noted in the PCP video it repeats frames when the framerate drops too low in order to prevent flickering. It's also important to remember G-SYNC and the G-SYNC module came before DisplayPort 1.2a, and Adaptive-Sync was a forgotten feature in a handful of laptops. To enable variable refresh there has to be a standard of communication between the monitor and GPU, and since the Adaptive-Sync standard wasn't in place when G-SYNC came out NVIDIA used their own solution. Notice that FreeSync does not work on G-SYNC displays, as they do not support Adaptive-Sync. So the G-SYNC module is not just DRM on displays which are otherwise capable of it, the module does do something. It does what Adaptive-Sync does, except on displays that came out before Adaptive-Sync started being implemented on desktop displays.

One more thing that is worth noting is that just because it's called G-SYNC doesn't mean the software operates the exact same way. The initial G-SYNC implementation was built to work with the G-SYNC module, but I'm betting this "mobile G-SYNC" is G-SYNC rebuilt around eDP Adaptive-Sync since that makes sense for implementation into laptops, and this would make it essentially the same thing as FreeSync. Of course they are still going to call it G-SYNC though. I mean, it does the same thing anyway.

 

 

You just sound like an Nvidia fanboy.   /s