All TOR/VPN users a target for FBI

[RaiderZulu]

So soon (this December, to be exact), the FBI will be able to remotely search any machine anywhere in the world with a standard warrant.

 

Here is the wording of the addendum that allows this:

Quote

Authority to Issue a Warrant. At the request of a federal law enforcement officer or an attorney for the government: (6) a magistrate judge with authority in any district where activities related to a crime may have occurred has authority to issue a warrant to use remote access to search electronic storage media and to seize or copy electronically stored information located within or outside that district if: (A) the district where the media or information is located has been concealed through technological means; or (B) in an investigation of a violation of 18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(5), the media are protected computers that have been damaged without authorization and are located in five or more districts.

 

So, according to that, there is nothing keeping the FBI from snooping around in Linus' home rig (or mine or yours for that matter) if they are able to get a warrant for doing so.  And looking a the wording of condition A again, it looks like any form of encrypted communication, from HTTPS to Tunnel Bear, will satisfy it.  I think my justice department just 1-uped everyone on the war against encryption in the most subtle manner they could.

 

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/09/19/fbi_overseas_hacking_powers/

[ChrisCross]

yeah this is pretty much not new. i still doubt that they can break 256-bit openvpn or IPsec encryption though.

[Moonzy]

 

especially after what have been happening lately...

[Master Disaster]

Jesus can no one read anymore?

 

There important part of the quote is bit that says...

 

"a magistrate judge with authority in any district where activities related to a crime may have occurred has authority to issue a warrant to use remote access to search electronic storage media and to seize or copy electronically stored information located within or outside that district if:"

 

In other words they must first suspect a crime has taken place and then seek permission of a judge in the district where the suspected crime took place. No crime, no warrant. Crime outside of the USA, no warrant. Judge says no, no warrant.

 

Listen, I'm not in the business of defending any government on anything as a general rule but you could at least read the quote before you quote it.

[Lazmarr]

7 hours ago, RaiderZulu said:

So soon (this December, to be exact), the FBI will be able to remotely search any machine anywhere in the world with a standard warrant.

 

Here is the wording of the addendum that allows this:

 

So, according to that, there is nothing keeping the FBI from snooping around in Linus' home rig (or mine or yours for that matter) if they are able to get a warrant for doing so.  And looking a the wording of condition A again, it looks like any form of encrypted communication, from HTTPS to Tunnel Bear, will satisfy it.  I think my justice department just 1-uped everyone on the war against encryption in the most subtle manner they could.

 

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/09/19/fbi_overseas_hacking_powers/

They can't search users outside of the US.

[alicskysareblue]

7 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

Jesus can no one read anymore?

 

There important part of the quote is bit that says...

 

"a magistrate judge with authority in any district where activities related to a crime may have occurred has authority to issue a warrant to use remote access to search electronic storage media and to seize or copy electronically stored information located within or outside that district if:"

 

In other words they must first suspect a crime has taken place and then seek permission of a judge in the district where the suspected crime took place. No crime, no warrant. Crime outside of the USA, no warrant. Judge says no, no warrant.

 

Listen, I'm not in the business of defending any government on anything as a general rule but you could at least read the quote before you quote it.

Most of this is to target illegal activity m that is running rampent on tor, and I mean serious stuff like child pornography, drug cartel, stolen privste information ( there are entire sites on the dark net that are used just to host doxed informstion) stolen accounts etc, t

 

As much good as tor was neant for,There is a lot of bad stuff on the dark net and something needs to be done.

[EmeraldKiwi]

9 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

-snip-

Let me get my tinfoil hat real quick. *gets hat and puts it on*

I honestly (seriously) don't think that just because some book somewhere says the FBI has to have a warrant to look through someone's personal files means that they won't do it. The NSA doesn't give a single poop about your privacy and will violate it with or without just cause. I think the FBI will do the same thing claiming that it's for "national security" and saying "this will help stop attacks before they happen". The usual baloney we all love to hear from the NSA is probably what the FBI will say.

[Master Disaster]

19 minutes ago, EmeraldKiwi said:

Let me get my tinfoil hat real quick. *gets hat and puts it on*

I honestly (seriously) don't think that just because some book somewhere says the FBI has to have a warrant to look through someone's personal files means that they won't do it. The NSA doesn't give a single poop about your privacy and will violate it with or without just cause. I think the FBI will do the same thing claiming that it's for "national security" and saying "this will help stop attacks before they happen". The usual baloney we all love to hear from the NSA is probably what the FBI will say.

Yeah, agreed. Your forgetting one simple fact though, if they're going to do it regardless then they're going to do it regardless making this new legislation totally useless and this entire discussion moot.

 

That doesn't change anything in my original statement either, as far as this legislation is concerned they require suspicion and a warrant before they can search anything. Them choosing to ignore the legislation doesn't change its meaning.

[BuckGup]

Does this apply to phones? Also almost everyone ever uses VPNs or VPNs based off the Tor network so good luck

[Notn4]

I'm not one to defend this but.

"a magistrate judge with authority in any district where activities related to a crime may have occurred has authority to issue a warrant"

Sounds like pretty standard stuff, first you need some indication that the crime or actions related to it have occurred in a certain district.

Basically anyone outside US is safe?

 

"to use remote access to search electronic storage media and to seize or copy electronically stored information located within or outside that district"

To use remote access sounds alot like exploiting a known vulnerability within the targets library of installed software, it's not going to give you a popup warning telling you that "The FBI have got an warrant for your PC, we will now conduct a search for your electronically stored information (Y/N)" so as long as you patch any known security flaws they won't be able to "remotely access" your PC with or without a warrant (yes I'm sure they got their own exploits that aren't publicly known but it can't be that many right?)

 

"the district where the media or information is located has been concealed through technological means"

This is about as vague as it gets, concealing information through technological means could even mean putting your dearest files within a folder and then marking it as hidden within Windows, I mean, for your average user that would be concealed and not very easily discoverable. 

 

This all is a bit of the same old same old stuff.

 

I might be waaaaay of on this since my knowledge with cybersecurity is very limited but just my 2 cents I guess.

 

[Agent181]

4 hours ago, Lazmarr said:

They can't search users outside of the US.

they do it anyways 

[NotSoAnonymoussChris]

13 hours ago, RaiderZulu said:

So soon (this December, to be exact), the FBI will be able to remotely search any machine anywhere in the world with a standard warrant.

 

Here is the wording of the addendum that allows this:

 

So, according to that, there is nothing keeping the FBI from snooping around in Linus' home rig (or mine or yours for that matter) if they are able to get a warrant for doing so.  And looking a the wording of condition A again, it looks like any form of encrypted communication, from HTTPS to Tunnel Bear, will satisfy it.  I think my justice department just 1-uped everyone on the war against encryption in the most subtle manner they could.

 

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/09/19/fbi_overseas_hacking_powers/

Linus is from Canada

[DarkBlade2117]

If the FBI tries to search my PC I'll purposely fill my history up with how to fuck over the FBI

[Beskamir]

49 minutes ago, DarkBlade2117 said:

If the FBI tries to search my PC I'll purposely fill my history up with how to fuck over the FBI

Well ahead of you. Gonna disguise a fork bomb as something they'd want to look at

[Humbug]

14 hours ago, Lazmarr said:

They can't search users outside of the US.

legally they can't.

 

but obviously they do if they are able to break the encryption. In many cases though they won't be able to get past the encryption, regardless of whether target is in US or outside.

 

when it comes to targetting users outside the US there is also the problem that much of that IP traffic never flows via US ISPs. So there may be an ipsec vpn tunnel running between two offices in asia. The FBI or NSA doesn't have any leverage over those foreign ISPs to get access to the dataflow. In that case they need malware installed either in the end user PCs or router firmware to discreetly report back to them. Not sure if this is happening, it could be, but in that case the spying would also be detectable by anybody who checks it out with packet sniffer etc.

 

for users outside the US who access websites and services hosted in the USA then that data (at least for those sessions) is still flowing via US ISPs so that's a good pace to tap it for them.

[Master Disaster]

1 hour ago, Humbug said:

legally they can't.

 

but obviously they do if they are able to break the encryption. In many cases though they won't be able to get past the encryption, regardless of whether target is in US or outside.

 

when it comes to targetting users outside the US there is also the problem that much of that IP traffic never flows via US ISPs. So there may be an ipsec vpn tunnel running between two offices in asia. The FBI or NSA doesn't have any leverage over those foreign ISPs to get access to the dataflow. In that case they need malware installed either in the end user PCs or router firmware to discreetly report back to them. Not sure if this is happening, it could be, but in that case the spying would also be detectable by anybody who checks it out with packet sniffer etc.

 

for users outside the US who access websites and services hosted in the USA then that data (at least for those sessions) is still flowing via US ISPs so that's a good pace to tap it for them.

That's the reason why they'd infect the firmware of the networking hardware in the data centers instead of trying to attack local machines or networks, it would allow them to pluck any data they choose from anywhere in the country with little effort and zero chance of them getting detected while doing it.

 

Its gives some credibility to some of what Snowdon says.

[7850OC]

so "many aggressive moves" from the government...

 

make me think that TOR is still SAFE to use 

 

(yay)