Republicans want to kill the FCC's plan to subsidize internet for the poor

[othertomperson]

No one has a right to a job

 

Of course they do. Not only that, but a capitalist society's existence depends on the ability of its citizens to work and be paid and to spend. You could make the argument that more than people having a right to a job, the state bets its own survival on its ability to provide this.

 

I would love to live in a world where we didn't need subsidies and benefits, and work and jobs are the way to do this.

[patrickjp93]

In the context of going from poor to not poor, not education, there is not enough opportunity everywhere.

 

Education itself, yeah that's available. Most libraries have free computers to use with internet access where you can find information on pretty much anything.

Information leads to opportunity. If you haven't the money to move to where it is, there's plenty of charities which can help with that.

[AlwaysFSX]

Information leads to opportunity. If you haven't the money to move to where it is, there's plenty of charities which can help with that.

You'd be amazed how much that doesn't open doors.

[patrickjp93]

Of course they do. Not only that, but a capitalist society's existence depends on the ability of its citizens to work and be paid and to spend. You could make the argument that more than people having a right to a job, the state bets its own survival on its ability to provide this.

 

I would love to live in a world where we didn't need subsidies and benefits, and work and jobs are the way to do this.

No, people have a right to pursue jobs. You do not have a right to simply getting one. If you don't provide sufficient value to a company or the state, you don't get one. We are a meritocracy as much as we are a capitalist republic.

[patrickjp93]

You'd be amazed how much that doesn't open doors.

I've seen it open doors for people from all walks of life. I call BS.

[AlwaysFSX]

I've seen it open doors for people from all walks of life. I call BS.

Life wouldn't be so problematic then.

[patrickjp93]

Maybe 25 years ago that would have gotten someone somewhere, countless hours of research into a career path used to mean something, but now employers want a college degree in many fields. You can't get a college education at a library. 

Actually you can. Coursera and other programs offer certification in the courses you take online. Furthermore, getting supplementary education during your high school years increases your value to colleges, often times resulting in significant merit scholarships. For the poor, there are needs scholarships both public and private, not to mention charities. The U.S. overflows with money and opportunity if you're willing to hunt for it.

[beebskadoo]

Of course they do. Not only that, but a capitalist society's existence depends on the ability of its citizens to work and be paid and to spend. You could make the argument that more than people having a right to a job, the state bets its own survival on its ability to provide this.

 

I would love to live in a world where we didn't need subsidies and benefits, and work and jobs are the way to do this.

People saying "no one has the right to____" is just a justification for their lack of interest in improving it. Politicians against education reform often stated that no one had the right to an education just to make it seem that their lax stance on improving the situation was somehow justified. One of the many issues. Yes people don't have a literal right to a job but the US govt needs to have a legal interest in making sure its citizens have an equal opportunity regardless of where they live or what class they are in. This has very obviously not worked in recent years, people born into impoverished families in impoverished areas do not have the same opportunities as people on the other side of the spectrum. The system creates these situations and perpetuates debt and poverty. 

[patrickjp93]

Life wouldn't be so problematic then.

Life is problematic for many reasons beyond a lack of equity. Disaster, disease, and many other factors beyond our absolute control can turn even a privileged life into Hell. Education gets you 95% of what you want and 99% of what you need. It's up to you to get it.

[AlwaysFSX]

Life is problematic for many reasons beyond a lack of equity. Disaster, disease, and many other factors beyond our absolute control can turn even a privileged life into Hell. Education gets you 95% of what you want and 99% of what you need. It's up to you to get it.

You're using a blanket statement for all walks of life when you're simply wrong in this regard. Education does not get you 95% of what you want. You can be highly educated and still have problems especially because of the education. Take it for what you will, but education does not solve everything.

[othertomperson]

No, people have a right to pursue jobs. You do not have a right to simply getting one. If you don't provide sufficient value to a company or the state, you don't get one. We are a meritocracy as much as we are a capitalist republic.

 

You're not a meritocracy. At all. The US has serious problems of nepotism and dynasties.

[patrickjp93]

You're using a blanket statement for all walks of life when you're simply wrong in this regard. Education does not get you 95% of what you want. You can be highly educated and still have problems especially because of the education. Take it for what you will, but education does not solve everything.

If you choose to be educated in liberal arts where society has little need for the skills you gain through that path, it's your own fault if you don't get a job. In high school, if your public institution isn't up to the standard you want/need, go online. Ace your SAT/ACT, ace your classes. If the standards are low, push beyond the standard. Seriously people, stop enabling the victim class. Education is the start, and with it you can go where you need to for jobs.

[patrickjp93]

You're not a meritocracy. At all. The US has serious problems of nepotism and dynasties.

In politics, that is true. In industry? No.

[AlwaysFSX]

If you choose to be educated in liberal arts where society has little need for the skills you gain through that path, it's your own fault if you don't get a job. In high school, if your public institution isn't up to the standard you want/need, go online. Ace your SAT/ACT, ace your classes. If the standards are low, push beyond the standard. Seriously people, stop enabling the victim class. Education is the start, and with it you can go where you need to for jobs.

I'm not enabling anything. I'm stating you facts from my life and others around me.

[patrickjp93]

I'm not enabling anything. I'm stating you facts from my life and others around me.

And those facts are? Your schools stunk. What did you do about it to help yourself? What did you sacrifice to get something you needed/wanted? What effort did you give beyond the minimum? I have sympathy for real sob stories, but the majority of the poor are not made of family tragedies and endless medical expenses.

[othertomperson]

In politics, that is true. In industry? No.

 

I'm only talking about industry. So few of the wealthiest business owners in the US made their own fortune, as opposed to inheriting it. The US has become what Europe used to be.

[AlwaysFSX]

And those facts are? Your schools stunk. What did you do about it to help yourself? What did you sacrifice to get something you needed/wanted? What effort did you give beyond the minimum? I have sympathy for real sob stories, but the majority of the poor are not made of family tragedies and endless medical expenses.

The fact of the matter is that education doesn't lead you everywhere. You can have all the education in the world and still not get to where you want to go.

[patrickjp93]

I'm only talking about industry. So few of the wealthiest business owners in the US made their own fortune, as opposed to inheriting it. The US has become what Europe used to be.

Inheriting a fortune has little to do with gaining the respect and skill necessary to take over a C-suite position at any company. It isn't about dynasty, no matter how much you want to claim otherwise. If you want it, you earn it.

[patrickjp93]

The fact of the matter is that education doesn't lead you everywhere. You can have all the education in the world and still not get to where you want to go.

It is the first step, and after that it's totally up to you. Go get a menial job until you have the money to get where a better job is, or have a homeless shelter take you in near your job until your first few paychecks come in. Invest in internships, co-ops, and other career training if that's necessary. Education gets you to all this. If you can't find the way forward from that, it's your own fault. There's plenty of jobs waiting to be filled with huge deficits in qualified workers. Research the job/labor demand, get the skills, and go.

[othertomperson]

Inheriting a fortune has little to do with gaining the respect and skill necessary to take over a C-suite position at any company. It isn't about dynasty, no matter how much you want to claim otherwise. If you want it, you earn it.

 

So goes the rhetoric. Are you a billionaire? If not, why the fuck not? Go out and earn it. Right this second, it's really that simple... apparently.

[wpirobotbuilder]

I think the Obama phone was a stupid plan. There is no reason people should get a free phone. A phone is a luxury not a right.

You mean the Reagan and/or Clinton phone? The Universal Service Fund was put in place with the 1996 telecommunications act, almost two decades ago. A law which passed a primarily Republican congress, and which fits with your ideology, since its primary intent was to deregulate broadcasting.

 

Since access to emergency services requires a telephone nowadays, everyone must have one. Unless you can tell me how else to access said services, especially if you live alone.

 

You can apply for jobs without the internet, but more and more applications are online only, because it's just plain easier from a business perspective. Eventually we will probably need the fund to be extended to basic internet service, why not get it out of the way now? That way we can be proud of ourselves for our foresight, and we won't hear news stories about how people can't get jobs because they can't afford internet service.

[patrickjp93]

So goes the rhetoric. Are you a billionaire? If not, why the fuck not? Go out and earn it. Right this second, it's really that simple... apparently.

That's where meritocracy comes in. It takes time, drive, brilliance, and the respect of your peers on a very high level. I'm also in school still myself, and my current desire is to keep learning about computer science as long as it's financially viable. After my Master's is done, I'll go find a job. I'll test my own mettle and push hard. Where I end up from that point is solely a result of my decisions, any disasters aside.

[mr moose]

The fact of the matter is that education doesn't lead you everywhere. You can have all the education in the world and still not get to where you want to go.

This is true, I don't know how widespread it is in the US, however I have several qualifications yet life has taken me elsewhere.  I have had had three professional careers in the last 20 years and have had to leave each one for reasons beyond my control and start again in a new career.  Funnily enough my most recent career is in education.

 

 

 

Also on topic, it appears the republicans are just as crazy, biased, paid off and as stupid as the democrats,  and true to form,  people are taking sides and totally ignoring the good things the other party does.

[AlwaysFSX]

Also on topic, it appears the republicans are just as crazy, biased, paid off and as stupid as the democrats,  and true to form,  people are taking sides and totally ignoring the good things the other party does.

Here's a fair rule of thumb in American politics:

 

They're lying.

 

Doesn't matter who, what party they associate with, or what they say, they're lying and equally as bad as the next guy in one way or another.

[Jaybird]

You mean the Reagan and/or Clinton phone? The Universal Service Fund was put in place with the 1996 telecommunications act, almost two decades ago. A law which passed a primarily Republican congress, and which fits with your ideology, since its primary intent was to deregulate broadcasting.

 

Since access to emergency services requires a telephone nowadays, everyone must have one. Unless you can tell me how else to access said services, especially if you live alone.

 

You can apply for jobs without the internet, but more and more applications are online only, because it's just plain easier from a business perspective. Eventually we will probably need the fund to be extended to basic internet service, why not get it out of the way now? That way we can be proud of ourselves for our foresight, and we won't hear news stories about how people can't get jobs because they can't afford internet service.

I do not affiliate with any party only choose a party member based on his reputation and what they believe. no matter what excuse is used, if you cant afford a phone, it is likely you live under a rock. currently. a basic lanline phone is $20/month. a basic cell phone plan is $40/month. if a person cannot afford this then I really am oblivious to something. I would love to see a financial report of someone who cannot afford either plan. 

 

the public library has free internet.