[Forbes] Why 'Watch Dogs' Is Bad News For AMD Users -- And Potentially The Entire PC Gaming Ecosystem

[Audacius]

"Open" is not strictly inherently "Open Source". You can have a programming API that has plenty of documentation and support, yet still have its source code undisclosed.

And yet still if Nvidia said Yes to Mantle, AMD would give them all the tools they needed. But they said No, and so AMD's API is proprietary? I guess i dont know how to think either, because i cant get the logic behind that either...

When will Nvidia make an offer to AMD about TXAA? Never?

[Misanthrope]

It's just ONE game!

 

I think you just found the perfect phrase to be engraved at the top of the slippery slope.

 

"It's just ONE game!"

 

             -Game publishers, prior to the videogame crash of 2015-16

[JcGross]

I don't understand why devs would hinder AMD in helping them, when the consoles themselves have AMD harware in them! This just goes to show that most devs don't know what the fuck they are doing and/or don't have the gamers' best interests in at heart.

[nokturrduk84]

so with that logic, you would like to see games like to see future games that AMD partners with to be crippled for NV gpus right?  you would be fine if 780ti were to struggle to keep up with a R9 280X for those types of games?

I don't care 280x & AMD gpus in general, I have Nvidia.

[Misanthrope]

By the way if AMD wants and escape plan they should concentrate their energies on the following: Make a damn impressive Linux driver and partner with Valve to make a similar, yet open source program, for SteamOS games and possibly the Source 2 engine. Just go with the indies and Valve, it will eventually pay off.

[sof006]

It's just ONE game!

Batman: Arkham Origins, Assassin’s Creed IV: Black Flag, and this week’s highly anticipated Watch Dogs.

 

 

Three games.

[Spongy141]

This just shows how immature Nvidia actually is.

[zeiferlance]

I think you just found the perfect phrase to be engraved at the top of the slippery slope.

 

"It's just ONE game!"

 

             -Game publishers, prior to the videogame crash of 2015-16

 

LOL!  :lol:

 

 

... Oh wait! NO please GOD NO! 

[Misanthrope]

LOL!  :lol:

 

 

... Oh wait! NO please GOD NO! 

 

This is terrible for big budget titles but for us gamers, it probably means that you'll see a permanent steam sale on ALL titles. Plus indies are pretty resilient against this type of stuff.

[Joe4evr]

And yet still if Nvidia said Yes to Mantle, AMD would give them all the tools they needed. But they said No, and so AMD's API is proprietary? I guess i dont know how to think either, because i cant get the logic behind that either...

When will Nvidia make an offer to AMD about TXAA? Never?

If NVidia had said "Yes" to Mantle, there would probably have been an agreement to keep the source code undisclosed to third parties. The API would still be proprietary, yes, but it would be owned/managed by two companies instead of one. And that's if they planned to keep it closed source forever, there's no reason they couldn't switch it to an Open Source model later as well, but I digress.

 

TXAA will likely never be offered to AMD, because this demonstrated that NVidia is being selfish and greedy (kinda ironic since "invidia" means "jealousy").

[LAwLz]

I guess I don't know how to read then:

"Open" is an extremely vague term and does not mean the same thing as "open source". Both the drivers required to run Mantle as well as the APIs themselves are strictly closed source, just like GameWorks for Nvidia.

We don't know how "open" Mantle was to Nvidia either. AMD might have demanded licensing fees, or cross licensing Nvidia wasn't willing to do, or maybe Nvidia would have needed to make big changes to the architecture that wouldn't have been worth it.

Bottom line, saying that Mantle is open source is like saying PhysX is open source, a very untrue statement. I wouldn't even call Mantle "open".

[catbutts]

This reminds me of:

 

Batman: Arkham Origins, Assassin’s Creed IV: Black Flag, and this week’s highly anticipated Watch Dogs.

 

Three games.

"It's just three games !"

[vitor_cut]

this is a big BS

 

i have a r9 290 card and i will pay for the game the same price that a nvidia card owner will pay and i am being f**** by nvidia.

 

in the case of MANTLE games, if you play MANTLE games in DX11 nvidia cards will provide the same gaming experience of an AMD card( ex BF4 and THIEF), so you guys that have a nvidia card and are trying to defend the nvidia move in this cut the BS. this is no good for all gaming world

[samuel]

My gosh what have I started? 

OK... I can't enable any of those effects on my low budget Nvidia or AMD card without HUGE penatlies! And what I think is that the average gamer is just like me!

[Switchblade Ninja]

No need to worry since the game itself is utter shit.

[d875j]

No need to worry since the game itself is utter shit.

You sir are shit the game is fantastic. But Nvidia is being a huge dick hogging the industry. I am very angry atm.

[DaRk0]

Tbh, someone needs to say AMD - deal with it.

 

Afaik, developers don't have to use Gameworks if they hate it (as stated in posts), so I don't know what's the big deal about it. AMD should start developing quality drivers that don't crash my Photoshop and Premiere just because they can (happy Nvidia user since then) instead of crying about what's NVIDIA doing. God forbid someone invest time and money into something and then they're not offering it for free.

 

I'd like to see market share data stating that AMD is holding 40% of GPU market share. If someone has it, I'd like to have a look at it.

 

So, I guess fanboys and haters should take over from here. 

[Misanthrope]

You sir are shit the game is fantastic. But Nvidia is being a huge dick hogging the industry. I am very angry atm.

 

I agree with your sentiment on the dick hogging (pun intended) however

 

1) Tone it down, no need to call anybody "shit"

 

2) The game does look like shit from all the footage I've seen on Twitch. All the pretty light effects only hide the hideous fucking textures and the oh-so-acclaimed-gameplay (#ResolutionISJustANumber) yeah, fucking boring as shit.

[d875j]

I agree with your sentiment on the dick hogging (pun intended) however

 

1) Tone it down, no need to call anybody "shit"

 

2) The game does look like shit from all the footage I've seen on Twitch. All the pretty light effects only hide the hideous fucking textures and the oh-so-acclaimed-gameplay (#ResolutionISJustANumber) yeah, fucking boring as shit.

Well i've been playing it on ultra with the highest textures i tell you that your wrong.You have to play game to see not judge by a stream or video.

[Misanthrope]

Well i've been playing it on ultra with the highest textures i tell you that your wrong.You have to play game to see not judge by a stream or video.

 

Look at the other thread the test results actually confirm this: the game is just an awful fucking broken mess that doesn't looks nearly as good as you would expect for the performance it devours:

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/watch_dogs_vga_graphics_performance_benchmark_review,9.html

[Notional]

And nothing's wrong with these news. If you want to play Nvidia optimized games with better performance, buy Nvidia card. If not, don't complain.

It is one thing to pay a dev to implement performance improvements of your architecture. It's an entirely different matter, when you make your improvements outright sabotage the competition. Nvidia pays devs to use gameworks, and in doing so, seems to sign an exclusivity clause with nvidia, meaning AMD cannot gain access to optimization of a new game until very close to the release. That is essentially anti consumer and anti trust.

 

I don't care 280x & AMD gpus in general, I have Nvidia.

Wow you missed the point so bad, you almost went into orbit. If a 300$ AMD card starts beating a 700$ Nvidia card, because AMD payed devs to implement code, that would not just improve performance on AMD, but also sabotage performance on Nvidia, you would not be very pleased would you?

 

----

Gameworks is very bad news. For the entire industry at the cost of us, the consumers. Even the devs getting payed hate it:

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/137965-developers-criticze-nvidias-gameworks-program-on-twitter-for-its-blackbox-nature/?hl=gameworks

[d875j]

Look at the other thread the test results actually confirm this: the game is just an awful fucking broken mess that doesn't looks nearly as good as you would expect for the performance it devours:

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/watch_dogs_vga_graphics_performance_benchmark_review,9.html

Well you know when a game gets played early without proper patch and drivers this happens right? I tell you this i make games and drivers play a big part in performance of the game.But as i said your judging it the wrong way i honestly telling you right now it is wonderful looking game.All those streams and video's aren't running ultra nor have good quality.

[ajoy39]

So Nvidia has a program where developers put some extra time into making the game look good and run well only on Nvidia hardware? Yeah, AMD would NEVER do anything like that. I mean, say, inventing a whole new API that's only compatible with AMD GPUs but boosts performance significantly for games that use it... totally not something AMD would do.

The difference is in the propriety closed nature of the technology. Mantle is Open, Nvidia is free to support it if they want to put in the time and effort to do so. They just don't want to, and with DX12 supposedly doing the same types of things I don't blame them> It just doesn't change the fact that Gameworks is an intentionally very closed and gaurded program, AMD couldn't work on it if they wanted to. 

[Pomfinator]

OMG AMD DON'T GET NO HBAO+, PhsyX, AND TXAA. WHY YOU DO DIS TO US NVIDIAR.

 

that's what this sounds like...Nvidia got their hands on this game, AMD gets their hands on games too.  The only difference is that it's easier to hate on Nvidia all the time and champion AMD.  I'm not saying that Nvidia is not a scumbag company, but that doesn't mean that AMD hasn't been a scumbag as well about other games.

 

 

Look at the other thread the test results actually confirm this: the game is just an awful fucking broken mess that doesn't looks nearly as good as you would expect for the performance it devours:

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/watch_dogs_vga_graphics_performance_benchmark_review,9.html

These benchmarks are eerily very different from the one shown in the article, here the 770 clearly loses to the 290x. Why? When clearly this is a Nvidia Gameworks and the article fervently uses it's GTX 770 is 5-6 fps above the 290x argument.

[Syntaxvgm]

I hope this isn't a repeat of AC4. That was bs.