NVIDIA to launch next-gen Volta-based GeForce in Q3 2017

[laminutederire]

2 hours ago, tlink said:

this doesn't make sense, why release this before AMD releases their high end competing cards?

Because they're seriously afraid of AMD?

I saw someone pointing out that the CPU market is so much more lucrative, and therefore Ryzen success gives an edge to amd in terms of r&d budget on the long term, which hasn't happened for a while (explaining why nvidia could be consistently ahead for a few years). Therefore nvidia would be trying to milk customers as much as they can before amd comes back in a big way and takes the lead. That could explain the new release of the titan Xp, and could be a motivation to cash on a new architecture even it's unfinished or tweak able to be better. 

[Vode]

20 minutes ago, laminutederire said:

Because they're seriously afraid of AMD?

I saw someone pointing out that the CPU market is so much more lucrative, and therefore Ryzen success gives an edge to amd in terms of r&d budget on the long term, which hasn't happened for a while (explaining why nvidia could be consistently ahead for a few years). Therefore nvidia would be trying to milk customers as much as they can before amd comes back in a big way and takes the lead. That could explain the new release of the titan Xp, and could be a motivation to cash on a new architecture even it's unfinished or tweak able to be better. 

AMD will not come back in a big way anytime soon.

 

Even if AMD has the superior product Nvidia always outsells them regardless. HD4870, HD5870...

 

All AMD can do is hold on to their marketshare, take baby steps and make careful decisions. 

 

The lack of an RX490 as a GTX 1070 competitor is a testament to that, it would just be risky for them to spend R&D and resources on it with little return.

 

AMD is simply being "smart", only selling to mainstream below $300, focus on Semi-custom (Securing PS5 deal will be very important) and trying to market high end GPU to business, prosumers and also on Desktop+Server CPU, where margins are way higher.

[tlink]

21 minutes ago, laminutederire said:

Because they're seriously afraid of AMD?

I saw someone pointing out that the CPU market is so much more lucrative, and therefore Ryzen success gives an edge to amd in terms of r&d budget on the long term, which hasn't happened for a while (explaining why nvidia could be consistently ahead for a few years). Therefore nvidia would be trying to milk customers as much as they can before amd comes back in a big way and takes the lead. That could explain the new release of the titan Xp, and could be a motivation to cash on a new architecture even it's unfinished or tweak able to be better. 

but they won't gain any market share by doing this because any fanboy will buy nvidia regardless of how good amd is, and people who are really informed know that amd only has a foothold in the mid-tier market atm. so why immediately release their high end gpu when anything above the 1060 doesn't have any competition? they are planning to launch next gen high end cards within a year according to them. nvidia just has the stronger platform overall atm, so why release something new when you already have a pretty fucking big market share over the competition? they can milk this so much longer.

[MageTank]

29 minutes ago, laminutederire said:

Because they're seriously afraid of AMD?

I saw someone pointing out that the CPU market is so much more lucrative, and therefore Ryzen success gives an edge to amd in terms of r&d budget on the long term, which hasn't happened for a while (explaining why nvidia could be consistently ahead for a few years). Therefore nvidia would be trying to milk customers as much as they can before amd comes back in a big way and takes the lead. That could explain the new release of the titan Xp, and could be a motivation to cash on a new architecture even it's unfinished or tweak able to be better. 

It would take a very long time for AMD to release something that benefits from the R&D funds gained from Zen. Whatever Vega is, it's likely already been committed long before Zen made sales. The argument can go both ways, with Nvidia having plenty of R&D funds from their strong GPU marketshare after all these years. I personally don't think this is a response out of fear, as I don't really believe the source. However, if Nvidia does release yet another architecture before AMD releases their big GPU's, it would only be because they have some sort of proprietary tech to go along with it, to force their current lineup to be obsolete in comparison. Gameworks 2.0 if you will. 

 

Where I truly expect AMD to dominate, is APU's. Assuming they get their memory subsystem under control on Ryzen, their APU's are bound to cause an extreme stir in the low/mid segments of the market. With a lot of the markets switching to mobile, APU's are going to be a big deal. Nvidia likely knows this, but there is nothing they can do about it. Tegra will have to wait until ARM takes over, which might be an extremely long time from now. 

[laminutederire]

14 minutes ago, Vode said:

 

They played somewhat safe because they didn't knew how ryzen would sell. Now that they know it sells fairly well, they know they am have extra budget for both r&d dept and therefore can go the extra mile. The cpu market is ten times larger than the gpu market, that secured them financially. It isn't impossible for them to go back and dethrone nvidia. They can push extra money on the gpu dept and gradually come back. They won't inverse the tendance right away, but two generations of superior product in a row should suffice to make up their brand image.

 

14 minutes ago, tlink said:

 

Unless they expect Vega up to 1080 ti territory? 

And what platform are you referring to exactly ? 

9 minutes ago, MageTank said:

 

Where I truly expect AMD to dominate, is APU's. Assuming they get their memory subsystem under control on Ryzen, their APU's are bound to cause an extreme stir in the low/mid segments of the market. With a lot of the markets switching to mobile, APU's are going to be a big deal. Nvidia likely knows this, but there is nothing they can do about it. Tegra will have to wait until ARM takes over, which might be an extremely long time from now. 

The success of zen is a promise of a smoother sail for shareholders and therefore looser budgets than previously when the situation was meh-ish.

While nvidia has cash, they haven't made so much innovation for quite a while now since pascal is almost only maxwell on a smaller node. That may show some frailty on their part.

I don't think either they release anything just yet, but mostly because they just can't since it's not finished.

Arm probably won't ever take over the laptop segment for instance, because of compatibility and overall maximum performance. But I agree for the apu part.

[tlink]

1 minute ago, laminutederire said:

Unless they expect Vega up to 1080 ti territory? 

And what platform are you referring to exactly ?

that would be wishfull thinking, amd has not focused on high end so chances are very likely that it will just be a budget alternative to nvidia's head pieces.

 

i mean their 10xx platform in general now. nvidia released it better from the start, has in general higher low's and runs much more power efficient. don't get me wrong i am waiting for vega because fuck nvidia but amd just isn't that smooth and still has that budget feel to it imo. but maybe thats just brand bullshit throwing off my judgement.

[Vode]

8 minutes ago, laminutederire said:

They played somewhat safe because they didn't knew how ryzen would sell. Now that they know it sells fairly well, they know they am have extra budget for both r&d dept and therefore can go the extra mile. The cpu market is ten times larger than the gpu market, that secured them financially. It isn't impossible for them to go back and dethrone nvidia. They can push extra money on the gpu dept and gradually come back. They won't inverse the tendance right away, but two generations of superior product in a row should suffice to make up their brand image.

The thing is they don't need to beat Nvidia right now, they need to make money. Which at this point in time isn't the same thing. As a pure business move it makes way more sense to invest more money back into CPU and APUs because they get more of a return and play it safe with GPUs.

 

I could be wrong but that's how I see it.

 

Obviously I wish there would be more competition in the Graphics market but it doesn't look like it at least right now. Two generations of superior product is a long way off. Nvidia is sitting on a huge pile of money right now from Maxwell and Pascal, they are not sleeping either and can invest way more in R&D than AMD can ever afford in their current position.

[samcool55]

53 minutes ago, Vode said:

The thing is they don't need to beat Nvidia right now, they need to make money. Which at this point in time isn't the same thing. As a pure business move it makes way more sense to invest more money back into CPU and APUs because they get more of a return and play it safe with GPUs.

 

I could be wrong but that's how I see it.

 

Obviously I wish there would be more competition in the Graphics market but it doesn't look like it at least right now. Two generations of superior product is a long way off. Nvidia is sitting on a huge pile of money right now from Maxwell and Pascal, they are not sleeping either and can invest way more in R&D than AMD can ever afford in their current position.

Nvidia also invests in self-driving cars and the Tegra which is now used in the switch. AMD doesn't.

And AMD has shown that they can do nice things with a much smaller R&D budget. If you don't R&D as much as your competition you don't need as much money. Makes sense?

[JamieOlive]

5 hours ago, Humbug said:

If AMD falls just short of their performance targets and Titan XP is still a bit faster then Nvidia will be comfortable. But if it matches or slightly beats Nvidia then they have motivation to launch Volta faster.

Not necesserilly. What if they match 90% of GTX1080Ti's performance with a price of let's say 400-500$ US. I know I know RADEON priocing is similar to Nvidia but they have always been slightly cheaper.

 

Also I can't find where I read it but the article said, " although AMD hired the same factory to manufacture the Vega Chips as Nvidia, sources said that their cost is between  5-15%  depending on the chip lower than Nvidia ". I don't know if that is true but if you can get 40-50 FPS @4K ULTRA with the high end Vega at 400+ $ then I am all in.

 

And lastly, let's talk realistically here, the majority of players are still at 1080p or below, so 4K gaming isn't for the masses. Now imagine the lower tier Vega going for 300$, (GTX1060 pricing), with 4Gb of HBM2 going for 4K  medium settings  at 60 fps, wouldn't that be godsend?

[Vode]

24 minutes ago, samcool55 said:

Nvidia also invests in self-driving cars and the Tegra which is now used in the switch. AMD doesn't.

And AMD has shown that they can do nice things with a much smaller R&D budget. If you don't R&D as much as your competition you don't need as much money. Makes sense?

Makes sense but it's overly optimistic thinking.

 

The odds are stacked against AMD in the GPU space moreso than ever before. I'm not saying they will go under or anything like that but for them to regain the perfomance crown something akin to a miracle ought to happen. Nvidia is a very smart company, they'll not get called of guard. They won't spend all on self driving cars and let their GPUs suffer...

 

Don't get me wrong I'm rooting for AMD as well, but this is just what it seems to be the reality. Manage your expectations.

 

 

[Princess Luna]

2 hours ago, MageTank said:

I see far more people in this thread not taking the bait. Very few actually believe the article. Are you even trying anymore?

I don't believe the article but I wouldn't mind if Volta came this year already... I really wanna grab a GTX 2080 or if budget allows even the Titan XV to replace my Maxwell Titan X... The sooner the better as I wanna shift from 1080p ultrawide to 1440p ultrawide [:

[michaelocarroll007]

6 hours ago, deXxterlab97 said:

What comes after 7? 9

What comes after 9? 10

What comes after 10? 20

 

 to Be sort of fair 8 was not skipped they just only did Mobile Cards in the 800 series

10 does come after 9

I do think they should do 1180 ect but i dont think jumping to 2000s  is that bad but i feel like they will do something dumb after that like 2100s. But hey its not like its the  Titan X  Titan X (Pascal) and Titan Xp .....

 

 

Guess AMD was doing 1000s with there series when nividia was doing 100s and now that AMD is doing 100s Nvidia is swithcing to 1000s Haha  ( Not Exactly but to some degree just making a joke) 

 

Overall i would love if companies just give straight up product naming where its easy to compare last and current generations throughout. The Razer Blade and Titan Xs are very bad examples. but i suppose id settle for whichever weird product names give me the best Perf per Dollar even if its a random one off name like the Furry X or something. 

[laminutederire]

2 hours ago, tlink said:

 

Amd has overall a better image quality I found. Runs smoother but it feels less crisp (a bit cheap in a way). So I guess both have their strengths.

Well a budget 1080ti would be quite crushing for nvidia..

2 hours ago, Vode said:

 

Nvidia sure look like they're milking people with the same thing for... like 3 years now though.

[Dylanc1500]

52 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

I don't believe the article but I wouldn't mind if Volta came this year already... I really wanna grab a GTX 2080 or if budget allows even the Titan XV to replace my Maxwell Titan X... The sooner the better as I wanna shift from 1080p ultrawide to 1440p ultrawide [:

I don't know much about specifics in relation to specific chips, however I do know that Volta was slated for release this year regardless. They were going to launch it whether Vega came out or not.

I just hope on the consumer chips they decide to implement nvlink and drop the standard sli bridge.

[NumLock21]

In other news Jen Hsun says to be having a hard time, deciding which leather jacket he should wear on the day of Volta launch.

 

 

[Mr.Meerkat]

7 hours ago, deXxterlab97 said:

What comes after 7? 9

What comes after 9? 10

What comes after 10? 20

[Prysin]

@MageTank

Your bait is expired. 

[Prysin]

1 hour ago, laminutederire said:

 

Nvidia sure look like they're milking people with the same thing for... like 3 years now though.

Isn't there a X86 cpu maker who has been doing this for a while too? 

 

Not claiming there's a conspiracy but, there's a conspiracy. 

[DildorTheDecent]

>Inb4 doubles core count

[MadyTehWolfie]

7 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

They can't release a product to compete with AMD unless AMD releases theirs first. Nvidia would have to be lead by monkeys to release a potential dud just to get to market first. Nvidia has a lot to lose if they fuck up Volta. 

 

As everyone has said, its BS and won't be happening. No point in trying to defend or refute a potential Nvidia misplay. 

Yes and amd has a lot to lose if they fail with Vega assuming people having just gone out and bought a 1080ti by then. AMD needs to start releasing cards or theyll lose the GPU war based on that. There will always be fanboys and girls for either side. However the people that don't care will buy what's available first rather than wait for the most part.

[Vode]

1 hour ago, Prysin said:

Isn't there a X86 cpu maker who has been doing this for a while too? 

 

Not claiming there's a conspiracy but, there's a conspiracy. 

AMD milked Bulldozer pretty hard.   Squeezed it so hard the L3 Cache fell off.

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Thony said:

They had 8 for mobile market. So cant agree with u on that

 

2 hours ago, michaelocarroll007 said:

 to Be sort of fair 8 was not skipped they just only did Mobile Cards in the 800 series

10 does come after 9

I do think they should do 1180 ect but i dont think jumping to 2000s  is that bad but i feel like they will do something dumb after that like 2100s. But hey its not like its the  Titan X  Titan X (Pascal) and Titan Xp .....

 

 

Guess AMD was doing 1000s with there series when nividia was doing 100s and now that AMD is doing 100s Nvidia is swithcing to 1000s Haha  ( Not Exactly but to some degree just making a joke) 

 

Overall i would love if companies just give straight up product naming where its easy to compare last and current generations throughout. The Razer Blade and Titan Xs are very bad examples. but i suppose id settle for whichever weird product names give me the best Perf per Dollar even if its a random one off name like the Furry X or something. 

I was referring to desktop obviously

[Prysin]

3 minutes ago, Vode said:

AMD milked Bulldozer pretty hard.   Squeezed it so hard the L3 Cache fell off.

@MageTank. This is why you need fresh bait. 

[Humbug]

Well.... if it's any indication what we know for sure is that AMD is prepping Vega to fight against Volta, not just pascal... you can tell from their marketing.

 

[2FA]

1 hour ago, Prysin said:

Isn't there a X86 cpu maker who has been doing this for a while too? 

 

Not claiming there's a conspiracy but, there's a conspiracy.