Intel to offer Haswell CPU in 2020

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

Source: Intel

Intel is to cancel the EOL (end of life) status for the Pentium G3420, a dual core, dual threads Haswell based LGA 1150 socketed CPU that was initially  launched in Q3 2013 (6 years ago). 
Interested customers can order the CPU from Intel from now to May 2020 when the last non-cancelable orders can be placed, with last shipments expected in December 2020.

 

OP opinions on this: Intel pretty much screwed the pooch here. First they have the 14nM shortage. They started to move some of their chipset production back to 22nM and now, re-releasing a 22nM cpu from 2013 to alleviate the shortage!? This is nuts! Anecdotally, as the OP is a sile owner-operator of a computer repair- trading shop, OP have heard of long RMA time and outright un-availability of replacement CPUs. People when their CPUs died got offered refunds instead of replacement CPUs. Yet, the price for new CPUs from both AMD and Intel keeps falling through the floor. Same with SSD and RAM prices in Vietnam.

[Drak3]

Long live Haswell.

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

Just now, yaboistar said:

>typing this on a 4790k

 

haswell was great, i missed it

It was a decent platform, everything just worked with all the latest features back then fully working.

Pcie 3.0, all Sata 3 ports, USB 3.0 ports on most motherboard. Decent platform, CPU is more of a side-grade from Ivy Bridge. Not as fun to OC like Sandy though. Most 2600K can do 5.0GHz with about 1.48V Vcore given you have decent cooling. Try that with a 4790K, I dare you.

[Mira Yurizaki]

Intel's 80186 and 80386 were available well into the mid 2000s because they were used in embedded systems. I think the 386 lasted longer.

 

But I think the sticking point is this: Intel will only make them if you want them.

[Levent]

1 minute ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

It was a decent platform, everything just worked with all the latest features back then fully working.

Pcie 3.0, all Sata 3 ports, USB 3.0 ports on most motherboard. Decent platform, CPU is more of a side-grade from Ivy Bridge. Not as fun to OC like Sandy though. Most 2600K can do 5.0GHz with about 1.48V Vcore given you have decent cooling. Try that with a 4790K, I dare you.

Lol try that with a ivy bridge CPU. My 3570K does 4.5Ghz with 1.42v.

[givingtnt]

Haswell is best architecture.

Sure, I'll upgrade from my 4790k next summer, but I:m not getting rid of it lol

 

As much as I find it hiiilaaarious that my cpu goes for the shape price it did NEW at launch (more or less lol)

 

These will be def cheaper and still very good.

 

So like, why not 

[pas008]

how is this bad?

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

3 minutes ago, Levent said:

Lol try that with a ivy bridge CPU. My 3570K does 4.5Ghz with 1.42v.

Well, sold my Z77 WS board with a delided 3770K. Not sure how golden that chip was, never had the time to mess with it too much. Tempted to do a direct die custom water cooling loop to see how far I can go. But then the gear are old and I have a shop to run lol

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

Just now, pas008 said:

how is this bad?

The G3420 used to be EOL, but now Intel have bring it back from the dead. That’s bad, since the chip aimed at substituting Pentium Gold at the bottom of the barrel of the product stack. The newer Pentium are  taking up precious 14nM capacity for much higher performance core series CPU.
This is the reasoning behind why Intel introduced the H310C chipset to replace the H310. The regular H310 is of a low end sku, yet taking up premium 14nM space. You know the shortage must be bad when they drag a 6 years old cpu out of retirement to fill out orders.

[pas008]

1 minute ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

The G3420 used to be EOL, but now Intel have bring it back from the dead. That’s bad, since the chip aimed at substituting Pentium Gold at the bottom of the barrel of the product stack. The newer Pentium are  taking up precious 14nM capacity for much higher performance core series CPU.
This is the reasoning behind why Intel introduced the H310C chipset to replace the H310. The regular H310 is of a low end sku, yet taking up premium 14nM space. You know the shortage must be bad when they drag a 6 years old cpu out of retirement to fill out orders.

how is this bad for consumers really

nothing you said is bad in my eyes

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

13 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Intel's 80186 and 80386 were available well into the mid 2000s because they were used in embedded systems. I think the 386 lasted longer.

 

But I think the sticking point is this: Intel will only make them if you want them.

I think Intel is doing this to ration 14nM capacity for higher end sku. Bottom of the barrel 8-9th gen Pentium or Celeron are not that much more capable than the older Pentium and I3 of yester years. And Intel did make the switch for H310 to H310C to shift chipset use from 14nM to 22nM last year. 
Low end sku get the axe from latest tech first it seemed

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

1 minute ago, pas008 said:

how is this bad for consumers really

nothing you said is bad in my eyes

It is not bad for consumers, it is showing Intel in a bad strategic position right now. Can’t keep up with demand, tough competition from AMD and delays in 10nM... 

[Mira Yurizaki]

Just now, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

I think Intel is doing this to ration 14nM capacity for higher end sku. Bottom of the barrel 8-9th gen Pentium or Celeron are not that much more capable than the older Pentium and I3 of yester years. And Intel did make the switch for H310 to H310C to shift chipset use from 14nM to 22nM last year. 
Low end sku get the axe from latest tech first it seemed

If you're implying Intel is going to go back to Haswell for future Pentium or Celerons, I don't really think that's going to be the case.

[Zando_]

Me, still on 22nm anyways:

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

1 minute ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

If you're implying Intel is going to go back to Haswell for future Pentium or Celerons, I don't really think that's going to be the case.

I’m not, I think this is more of a fire fighting measures right now to alleviate the supply issue that have been going on for close to two years now. I don’t think Intel will want to do this going forward. 

[pas008]

5 minutes ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

It is not bad for consumers, it is showing Intel in a bad strategic position right now. Can’t keep up with demand, tough competition from AMD and delays in 10nM... 

how is it bad to use a 22nm fab facility for whats it intended for?

chipsets are there

and what does node really matter in this area of performance

[WereCat]

24 minutes ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

2600K can do 5.0GHz with about 1.48V Vcore given you have decent cooling. Try that with a 4790K, I dare you.

1.41V 4.6GHz on i7 4770k on air cooling (delided) around 83*C. Unfortunately I lost silicon lottery with that one (I don't have it anymore). Could go higher on voltage but 4.7GHz was never stable.

[Drak3]

4 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

If you're implying Intel is going to go back to Haswell for future Pentium or Celerons, I don't really think that's going to be the case.

I don't see why not, if they can't expand 14nm, or get 10/7nm running, but they can run 22nm. It's not like Broadwell and the various Skylake derivatives are that much better than Haswell, clock for clock and core for core.

 

And for the bulk of the market going for low end processors like Pentium or Celeron isn't going to really care (or know) about things like lithography.

[Mira Yurizaki]

5 minutes ago, Đỗ Đức Huy said:

I’m not, I think this is more of a fire fighting measures right now to alleviate the supply issue that have been going on for close to two years now. I don’t think Intel will want to do this going forward. 

Then I don't understand how your reasoning makes sense.

 

I'm pretty certain Intel is just offering system builders and other people who use Haswell for some reason or another a last chance to order batches for replacements or whatnot, then they'll just shelve it up and you can no longer buy Haswell. If anything, that'll mean their 22nm fabs can shift to something else. And it looks like two of their main fabs still produce 22nm parts (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_semiconductor_fabrication_plants)

[Mira Yurizaki]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

And for the bulk of the market going for low end processors like Pentium or Celeron isn't going to really care (or know) about things like lithography.

It's not a matter of what process size the nodes use, it's a matter of features. A future Pentium or Celeron with missing features, whatever those may be, isn't going to sit will with some people.

[RejZoR]

I also have Haswell. With 6 cores, 12 threads and clock of 4.5GHz. Old, but still very much relevant

[Drak3]

Just now, Mira Yurizaki said:

It's not a matter of what process size the nodes use, it's a matter of features. A future Pentium or Celeron with missing features, whatever those may be, isn't going to sit will with some people.

IIRC, Pentium and Celeron processors have been feature stripped processors for a long time. But again, I don't think the market that really goes for these knows or cares about that.

[Đỗ Đức Huy]

1 minute ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Then I don't understand how your reasoning makes sense.

 

I'm pretty certain Intel is just offering system builders and other people who use Haswell for some reason or another a last chance to order batches for replacements or whatnot, then they'll just shelve it up and you can no longer buy Haswell. If anything, that'll mean their 22nm fabs can shift to something else. And it looks like two of their main fabs still produce 22nm parts (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_semiconductor_fabrication_plants)

The main reason why the silicon industry moves to a new node is to capture the density (which mean more chip per fixed wafer size which mean less cost) and performance benefits baked into the new nodes. 
this ending of end of life status thing seemed like Intel is restarting production of 22nM cpu, which means the fabs were making something else before switching back to cpu again. It doesn’t look well when you are supposed to be on the bleeding edge of technology yet you have to drag a low end parts introduced 6 years ago out of retirement during a 2 years long product shortage. 

[Jurrunio]

Tbh that's fine, users that give a damn to a low power dual core like this probably won't mind if they get an older chip for cheaper. It does mean DDR3 memory and H81 boards will cost a bit more on the used market for a short period of time though

[Master Disaster]

38 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Intel's 80186 and 80386 were available well into the mid 2000s because they were used in embedded systems. I think the 386 lasted longer.

 

But I think the sticking point is this: Intel will only make them if you want them.

Lets be clear though, the 80386s Intel were producing in 2007 were not the same as the first batch in 1985. They were 100% instruction compatible but much faster, IIRC the fastest variant was clocked at 33Mhz.

 

Still technically you're correct and as we all know, technically is the best kind of correct

 

EDIT - Its actually kind of crazy, if you think about it, that Intel spent money on time & resources to improve a design based on a 20 year old process. I guess it shows how many of them Intel must have still been selling.