Intel with VEGA graphics?! Debunked

[Rune]

that's weird. I wonder when thats coming?

[Demonking]

I believe it these companies don't really hate each other if they both can make $ they'll do it and they sure as hell will rip us off. 

[JoeCoke]

I'm not gonna jump and yell fake because I obviously can't know for sure, but come on. In this day and age, why the hell is the image so blurry? My Nokia I had 10 years ago would take a better picture.

[WereCat]

8 minutes ago, 2Buck said:

I'm not gonna jump and yell fake because I obviously can't know for sure, but come on. In this day and age, why the hell is the image so blurry? My Nokia I had 10 years ago would take a better picture.

same as photos of UFO

[LAwLz]

1 hour ago, Sypran said:

I'm just curious, how much is Intel really investing in designing iGPUs?
The fact they have always been low end, makes me think 'Barely', and if given a good reason to outsource or use some other companies' GPU they might, even if that GPU comes from a competitor of another market. 
- Like if Intel was interested in being the CPU designer for the next generation of Consoles, the volume of Consoles would probably be worth it to them, even if they have to partner with AMD, to get the GPU in the same Chip.

Intel has made a few high end iGPUs, and they have all been competitive or superior to what AMD has offered at the time. 

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/intel-iris-pro-5200-graphics-review-core-i74950hq-tested

[SansVarnic]

Intel placing AMD product inside their core product... riiiiight.

I have zero confidence in this information.

Besides your source is http://wccftech.com/intel-mobile-processors-amd-vega-inside/

Need I say more?

[mr moose]

55 minutes ago, 2Buck said:

I'm not gonna jump and yell fake because I obviously can't know for sure, but come on. In this day and age, why the hell is the image so blurry? My Nokia I had 10 years ago would take a better picture.

The image puts me in mind of ghost hunters, yeti hunters and UFO spotters.  "Quick there's one, grab the lowest quality camera from the 50's you can find and start recording that evidence!"

 

Also wccftech seems to have about he same respect as Ghost hunters these days.

[leadeater]

Didn't both Intel and AMD come out and say this wasn't happening last time this rumor went around

[leadeater]

15 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

Intel has made a few high end iGPUs, and they have all been competitive or superior to what AMD has offered at the time. 

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/intel-iris-pro-5200-graphics-review-core-i74950hq-tested

Most laptops that weren't MacBook Pros in the past didn't get chips with Iris Pro iGPUs in them though, the HD 4600 performance is more representative of Intel based laptops that people ended up buying. Not checked recently but it would be nice if Intel just went with Iris Pro as standard.

[mr moose]

9 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Didn't both Intel and AMD come out and say this wasn't happening last time this rumor went around

wasn't that just the general conclusion on the forums.  From memory that was back when Intel started signing IP licenses with AMD instead of Nvidia.  

[leadeater]

2 hours ago, Swatson said:

Wasn't Intel rumored to be licensing AMD IP for their iGPU's a couple months ago and then Intel was like "lol no" and AMD was like "yea they are our compeititor what do you even mean?"

 

Edit: Yup. http://fortune.com/2017/05/23/amd-intel-chips/

 

10 minutes ago, mr moose said:

wasn't that just the general conclusion on the forums.  From memory that was back when Intel started signing IP licenses with AMD instead of Nvidia.  

Nah there was an official debunking of this, thanks @Swatson

 

Edit:

Intel also went on the record and said "LOL no"

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/249581-intel-puts-kibosh-reports-will-license-amd-gpu-technology

[Me1z]

Why do all "leaked" images always look like they were shot with the camera of the worst 2005 flip phone money could buy?

[lucidlts]

nope, it has been debunked again (as usual).

http://www.tech-critter.com/2017/10/alleged-image-of-intel-chip-with-vega.html

it's part of intel's employee appreciation campaign.

[leadeater]

15 minutes ago, lucidlts said:

nope, it has been debunked again (as usual).

http://www.tech-critter.com/2017/10/alleged-image-of-intel-chip-with-vega.html

it's part of intel's employee appreciation campaign.

But how does Denny fit inside a CPU? That is the real question.

[cj09beira]

4 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

Intel doesn't really care. 

 

As far as Intel is concerned using AMD graphics can prop up their CPUs and burry AMDs CPUs. It could be a better investment for Intel than you realise.  

That's why AMD would not do it

[Trixanity]

2 hours ago, LAwLz said:

Intel has made a few high end iGPUs, and they have all been competitive or superior to what AMD has offered at the time. 

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/intel-iris-pro-5200-graphics-review-core-i74950hq-tested

*Superior through L4 cache providing much higher memory bandwidth.

 

The core design isn't anything spectacular. 

 

It would be wise but expensive for AMD to do the same. The latter meaning it's not going to happen.

[leadeater]

15 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

It would be wise but expensive for AMD to do the same. The latter meaning it's not going to happen.

The move to the much faster DDR4 might help a lot though, aren't all the current ones all on DDR3?

[LAwLz]

3 hours ago, leadeater said:

Most laptops that weren't MacBook Pros in the past didn't get chips with Iris Pro iGPUs in them though, the HD 4600 performance is more representative of Intel based laptops that people ended up buying. Not checked recently but it would be nice if Intel just went with Iris Pro as standard.

I didn't say they were common. I was just saying that if Intel wanted to make high end iGPUs they could. Doesn't seem like it's worth it for them though. 

 

 

20 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

*Superior through L4 cache providing much higher memory bandwidth.

 

The core design isn't anything spectacular. 

 

It would be wise but expensive for AMD to do the same. The latter meaning it's not going to happen.

Fair point. All I was saying is that Intel has not always targeted low and midrange with their iGPUs. They have done high end ones and they have performed very well. I wasn't trying to compare AMD vs Intel architectures. 

[NvidiaIntelAMDLoveTriangle]

So not only that Intel processors come with a build in oven, but now they will also include a bloody volcano.

 

[lucidlts]

1 hour ago, VegetableStu said:

oh fark his name is Vega isn't it ( /)_(\

yes, Vega he is.
and there's Guo and Denny. 

[raphidy]

6 hours ago, Ekst4zy said:

"AMD Forms Radeon Technologies Group To Enhance Focus on Graphics And Immersive Computing Under The Leadership of Raja Koduri"

 

http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/radeon-technologies-group-2015sept09.aspx

 

Sure, it's a separate company with no ties to AMD.

Strange that it's a separate company but when Raja went in vacation/temporary leave? Lisa Su is taking charge of RTG.

I really think it's still the same company, it's just they want something to separate the graphics division which isn't that necessary.

 

The image is blurry and looks photoshopped.

[Dylanc1500]

12 minutes ago, raphidy said:

Strange that it's a separate company but when Raja went in vacation/temporary leave? Lisa Su is taking charge of RTG.

I really think it's still the same company, it's just they want something to separate the graphics division which isn't that necessary.

 

The image is blurry and looks photoshopped.

It's the same company but is operating more independently of the CPU division. RTG is the name they applied to that specific division of the company, it is not a subsidiary.

[Exotath]

8 hours ago, iamdarkyoshi said:

 

I want vega in an i9...

-image-

What is this an image of? Is there a related article or build log?

[MageTank]

5 hours ago, mr moose said:

The image puts me in mind of ghost hunters, yeti hunters and UFO spotters.  "Quick there's one, grab the lowest quality camera from the 50's you can find and start recording that evidence!"

 

Also wccftech seems to have about he same respect as Ghost hunters these days.

That's because they used the exact same camera used in every Bigfoot sighting  

 

Seriously though, there is little reason for Intel to want to do this. Not only would they be at the mercy of AMD when it comes to yields (if the GPU and CPU die are separate and share the same MCM), they are also at the mercy of AMD when it comes to drivers. They certainly would not want to be in that position, when you rely on a competitor to make your product look good. 

 

Now, if AMD would sell RTG off to Intel, and let Intel fight Nvidia in the GPU world, AMD would have a nice influx of cash to focus entirely on CPU's. That would be pretty neat, but I also doubt that will happen anytime soon. 

[Trixanity]

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

The move to the much faster DDR4 might help a lot though, aren't all the current ones all on DDR3?

It helps but it also helps Intel. Depending on how you calculate, the first Haswell chips with L4 cache had 120 GB/s effective memory bandwith (L4 cache + DDR3 system memory) whereas a AMD chip would have been stuck with something along the lines of 25 GB/s on a good day. Remember that the L4 cache is still of limited size (128 MB I believe) so there will still be system memory used. That's why DDR4 will be a large benefit even for an L4 equipped chip. Bristol Ridge does have DDR4 memory so you can look at benchmarks of those but honestly Bristol Ridge is so crippled by a poor CPU and a poor memory subsystem that I'd consider the DDR4 memory itself crippled to the point of being of limited help.

1 hour ago, LAwLz said:

I didn't say they were common. I was just saying that if Intel wanted to make high end iGPUs they could. Doesn't seem like it's worth it for them though. 

 

 

Fair point. All I was saying is that Intel has not always targeted low and midrange with their iGPUs. They have done high end ones and they have performed very well. I wasn't trying to compare AMD vs Intel architectures. 

Of course. Intel's Iris Pro initiative is aimed at achieving great graphics performance and I wouldn't call Intel's efforts fruitless. Their core design is just still behind what AMD and Nvidia can do in my opinion. They have a far superior memory subsystem to AMD though and adding an L4 cache provides a massive boost to an already commanding lead. So in simplified terms you're looking at mediocre GPU cores with a excellent memory subsystem vs excellent GPU cores with a mediocre memory subsystem. Memory bandwidth is very important for graphics though so that's why you'll find the AMD side being suffocated by the lack of bandwidth and many cases falling behind Intel's offerings.

 

Iris Pro is a much wider design than Intel's other chips but I don't know enough to compare them to what AMD has achieved. With that being said I'm unsure how much wider Intel can make it without making the die size needlessly big. There comes a point where the integrated graphics will be bottlenecked by other factors than core design (or execution units). It could be TDP and frequency, it could be memory bandwidth or even driver support. It might be pointless to make it bigger all things considered. Not unlike AMD's desktop Vega implementation where it's so big and wide that it's bottlenecked in multiple areas (memory bandwidth, ROPs etc - to name a few).