rant Why are server rack-mount cabinet enclosures so expensive?

[Chillstice]

To start off, I Imagine this will be quite a long post, it's somewhat of a rant, and I don't really need anything right now so it's going to immediately turn of lots of people. That's fine. I just wanted to hear some feedback regarding my experience trying to find server cabinets for a future project I have in mind. This is a place for discussion after all. So bear with me.

 

So I have this idea right. It's somewhat a dream of mine and I've spent a long time thinking of how to achieve this even if it will take a few years. I would like to somewhat follow in Linus' footsteps after he completed Personal Rig Update 2015(2016) and successfully utilized Optical Thunderbolt to move his personal rig out of the same room as his peripherals. I have a similar idea to that, but on an entirely different scale. My idea is this:

 

I would like to source a 24-42u server cabinet/ enclosure, a server rack-mounted 4u case(which I will get multiples of), and multiple runs of 100ft Optical thunderbolt cable. I don't know if I will be in the same house when I finally start working on this project, but the issue still remains. I would clear a space in the basement to place the server cabinet, build a new personal rig and a few other high-performance computers, and finally run the Optical Thunderbolt upstairs to a room where all the peripherals will connect to a breakout box. This system can apply to multiple rooms in the house running off different computers. Each desk basically acting as a sort of terminal to each respective computer. This will allow the computers 4u's worth of space for housing high-performance components while taking up that space somewhere else entirely(in the server cabinet in the basement). The cabinet will not just house computers; I plan to create a home lab with full networking and a NAS.

 

I probably spent more time than I should researching components and solutions for future reference. I managed to find a couple great options for 4u rackmount computer cases that are compatible with the parts I would like to use and might even have room for water cooling. The last piece of the puzzle in my mind is a cabinet to house everything. I thought this would be the easiest part because server cabinets are standardised and don't vary much from model to model... right? Also price wouldn't be an issue because it's just fabricated metal, they oftentimes don't even come with rails, sides, a door, or even casters........... right?

 

<rant>

So as I've spent a long time researching everything that will go in the cabinet, I've also spent a long time researching the cabinets themselves. I Immediately hit a wall because I started to see a pattern with the price. "Why is an 18u open-frame rack more than $500US? It doesn't even have rails, sides, a door, or even casters." You can see where I'm going with this. I was somewhat surprised to find that sites like Amazon and Newegg didn't have a large selection, but that's somewhat justified because those are more consumer-centric sites. So I started looking at sites like: rackmountsolutions .net, xcase .co.uk, servercase .co.uk, racksolutions .com (not to be confused with rackmountsolutions .net), superlogics .com, ebay and even my local craigslist. At this point I started getting frustrated. I just wanna find a 24-42u standard 19 inch 25-30 inch-deep cabinet to house my hobby. I can envision the bomb cost for most of these cabinets being under $100. So what gives? I've read about a dozen times about how building a cabinet can be a better solution than actually buying one by a company that specializes in building them. Like, actually what the fuck. Is the only reason why cabinets are so expensive because manufacturers artificially inflate the price because only large corporations and data centers purchase their products? This can't be the only reason can it? There's no monopoly/ oligopoly with server cabinet manufacturers. Where's the competition? The only way to find reasonably priced enclosures that I've heard of so far is to find ones that aren't being used anymore; Surplus, unused, no longer needed, being sold for less than half their original value. And it's still kind of overpriced. I should stop.

</rant>

 

I'm interested to hear what others think of the situation and I'm open to suggestions regarding a better server cabinet solution, or a better solution overall with this project-in-the-making.

 

Here's the cases I'm looking at:

ARK IPC-4570 Black Nice design, built well, reasonable price.

Rosewill RSV-L4000 Slightly longer, more fans, room for water cooling?

 

Here's a cabinet I kinda like, too bad it's expensive:

Tripp Lite 24U Blaaaaack, sweet-spot size, fully-enclosed, expensive :c

 

tl;dr Why are server rack-mount cabinets enclosures so expensive?

[GDRRiley]

B&H has some gear for cheap but most is shallow. I know the struggle was look for a rack for my server that is 30in long and everything is so expensive. really this cheap piece of metal costs 200$??

you can by ralls and screw them into 4x4 or 2x4 and make a diy frame

[brwainer]

all enterprise gear, even stuff that doesn't functionally do anything, has a high margin. That being said, the BOM cost of a good rack might only be 1/5 of its final cost (not saying that it is), but the labor and shipping costs of such a thing are pretty high.

 

Make sure you are looking at kit racks, not pre-assembled ones. pre-assembled racks cost 2-3 times more and the shipping is a lot more expensive too.

[KuJoe]

3 minutes ago, brwainer said:

all enterprise gear, even stuff that doesn't functionally do anything, has a high margin. That being said, the BOM cost of a good rack might only be 1/5 of its final cost (not saying that it is), but the labor and shipping costs of such a thing are pretty high.

 

Make sure you are looking at kit racks, not pre-assembled ones. pre-assembled racks cost 2-3 times more and the shipping is a lot more expensive too.

This. Do you know how much a cardboard box goes for at the store? A few bucks. Do you know how much a cardboard box for a server goes for on eBay? $100 (not exaggerating, I've paid $100 PLUS SHIPPING for server boxes before).

[KuJoe]

Also there's a reason why people build DIY server cabinets out of IKEA furniture.

[Chillstice]

Just now, KuJoe said:

Also there's a reason why people build DIY server cabinets out of IKEA furniture.

Yeah I saw that, I should have payed closer attention to the name of the IKEA item.

[Chillstice]

9 minutes ago, brwainer said:

Make sure you are looking at kit racks, not pre-assembled ones. pre-assembled racks cost 2-3 times more and the shipping is a lot more expensive too.

Does anyone have any good resources for kit racks?

[SCHISCHKA]

Ive always thought cabinets were a waste of money. Shipping cost might be a reason if it comes pre assembled. You know it's going to be much cheaper to stack ATX cases. Just keep them off the ground in case of flooding

[Chillstice]

Just now, SCHISCHKA said:

Ive always thought cabinets were a waste of money. Shipping cost might be a reason if it comes pre assembled. You know it's going to be much cheaper to stack ATX cases. Just keep them off the ground in case of flooding

It may be cheaper, but is it better?
Using rails will allow me to slide cases out from any position in the cabinet without knocking over a stack of 100lb computers.

[KuJoe]

Check Craigslist, I'm seeing a 42U for $80 in Englewood and another for $250 in Colorado Springs. I'll also keep an eye out for if any of my data centers in Denver have any extras to get rid of.

[Chillstice]

Just now, KuJoe said:

I'll also keep an eye out for if any of my data centers in Denver have any extras to get rid of.

<3

[Electronics Wizardy]

hunt of craigslist. I got a 12u rack filled with servers and switches and a pdu and kvm with monitor for 180. 

 

Also normally the 42u's are cheaper as there used datacenter suff, not many people are buying little ones. 

 

 

Also for remote pcs, id run thinclients and use ethernet instead of thunderbolt. Normally better support, cheaper, switches, and faster.

 

[SCHISCHKA]

1 minute ago, Chiller252 said:

It may be cheaper, but is it better?
Using rails will allow me to slide cases out from any position in the cabinet without knocking over a stack of 100lb computers.

It's meant for saving space in data centers. I wouldn't buy one for a house

[Chillstice]

Just now, SCHISCHKA said:

It's meant for saving space in data centers. I wouldn't buy one for a house

but... home lab?

[SCHISCHKA]

3 minutes ago, Chiller252 said:

but... home lab?

How many computers are you talking about?

[Chillstice]

like maybe 3 or more some day, a nas, router, switch, patch panel and a few extras. It's something I'm interested in getting into.

[leadeater]

36 minutes ago, SCHISCHKA said:

It's meant for saving space in data centers. I wouldn't buy one for a house

Depending on the equipment planned etc a rack can make sense at home, maybe not a 42U+ monster but it certainly is nicer to rackmount that type of equipment properly.

 

I plan on getting a rack for my equipment as I have quite a few servers (3 in parts atm) plus rackmount switches and firewall. I also have a lot of cabling through the house that needs to come back to a central point so a proper patch panel is going to be used. All up about 5-6 4U servers, AT-x900-24XS, FortiGate 60D, Aruba Controller (yet to buy), Cisco SG300, Eaton UPS's (yet to buy), 24 port patch panel, dual vertical PDU, cable management arms for the servers, patch cable management and likely other things I missed out but more than enough to fill a decent sized rack.

[SCHISCHKA]

2 hours ago, leadeater said:

Depending on the equipment planned etc a rack can make sense at home, maybe not a 42U+ monster but it certainly is nicer to rackmount that type of equipment properly.

 

I plan on getting a rack for my equipment as I have quite a few servers (3 in parts atm) plus rackmount switches and firewall. I also have a lot of cabling through the house that needs to come back to a central point so a proper patch panel is going to be used. All up about 5-6 4U servers, AT-x900-24XS, FortiGate 60D, Aruba Controller (yet to buy), Cisco SG300, Eaton UPS's (yet to buy), 24 port patch panel, dual vertical PDU, cable management arms for the servers, patch cable management and likely other things I missed out but more than enough to fill a decent sized rack.

are you running a file server for the whole neighbourhood? I just have one computer with lots of nics that runs as a file server and it was more cost effective buying extra nics than buying a switch. Then I have a cheap laptop that is a firewall, I just use this cos it only needs to be as fast as the internet and it has screen, battery, and monitor built in. How many devices does a house have to justify the expense of enterprise equipment? I did use a second hand server in the past but it died and when it came to finding a replacement a cheap amd based computer does the job

[scottyseng]

5 hours ago, leadeater said:

Depending on the equipment planned etc a rack can make sense at home, maybe not a 42U+ monster but it certainly is nicer to rackmount that type of equipment properly.

I actually bought a 45U used server rack (There was a good Dell server cabinet used as well, but it was too large for my room), and it's quite the fun conversation piece when my non tech savvy friends come over and just see this really tall server rack in my room.

 

6 hours ago, Chiller252 said:

like maybe 3 or more some day, a nas, router, switch, patch panel and a few extras. It's something I'm interested in getting into.

It's definitely fun to get into. I would also recommend getting a bag of cage nuts / screws in case you get rails that need them. I had some shelves that came with my rack and well, no mounting hardware so I had to go buy cage nuts and screws from ebay.

[Sir Asvald]

My dad bought a rack from work. It's the one where you need to assemble it yourself. I checked the price.. it was around £1250. 

 

I forgot the brand. But it's too big to fit the the house.

42u rack. 

[Chillstice]

3 hours ago, scottyseng said:

It's definitely fun to get into. I would also recommend getting a bag of cage nuts / screws in case you get rails that need them. I had some shelves that came with my rack and well, no mounting hardware so I had to go buy cage nuts and screws from ebay.

Cage nuts seem like a pain. Are there any alternative mounting methods?

[scottyseng]

6 minutes ago, Chiller252 said:

Cage nuts seem like a pain. Are there any alternative mounting methods?

Clip nuts, but those are equally as painful.

 

You have to pay attention to the equipment though, like my SuperMicro server rails don't require screws, they just click in place.

 

My Eaton UPS though, the Rails needed cage nuts (It came with them at least). You'd only need cage nuts if your equipment didn't come with any or if you're buying shelves (I don't think you are...I have my printer / scanner on a shelf on my rack).

[Mikensan]

$250 4 post 25u rack, I'm using it myself. Love it.

https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-Adjustable-Levelers-Management-4POSTRACK25U/dp/B00O6GNLQE/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1488214136&sr=8-2&keywords=24u+rack

 

 

[brwainer]

3 hours ago, Chiller252 said:

Cage nuts seem like a pain. Are there any alternative mounting methods?

http://rackstuds.com/

https://www.amazon.com/Rackstuds-Smart-Mounting-System-100-pack/dp/B00I348OD0

I have that exact bag. Rack Studs are amazing. I'm trying to convince my work to buy them for our new installs. They are appropriate for everything except UPSs, very heavy servers or JBODs (like a 4U filled with hard drives with high platter counts), and some rails, depending on how the rails mount and the server covers the front.

[leadeater]

13 hours ago, SCHISCHKA said:

are you running a file server for the whole neighbourhood? I just have one computer with lots of nics that runs as a file server and it was more cost effective buying extra nics than buying a switch. Then I have a cheap laptop that is a firewall, I just use this cos it only needs to be as fast as the internet and it has screen, battery, and monitor built in. How many devices does a house have to justify the expense of enterprise equipment? I did use a second hand server in the past but it died and when it came to finding a replacement a cheap amd based computer does the job

A lot of it has to do with some of the technologies I want to test requires multiple servers, some up to 4 minimum. However the cost of them isn't actually that high as the Intel S5520HC + 2x L5630 combo I buy from ebay is around $200 USD + shipping, more costly part is actually the case/PSU etc.