Xbox One vs. PS4 Resolution: Microsoft Challenges You To Spot The Differences on TV Smaller Than 60"

[mr moose]

They CAN do it, but they CAN'T do it while pushing the graphics of the most current games. They CAN do 1080p at 60fps of last gen games, even towards the end with games like tomb raider, which IMO looks better, even without AA. What I'm saying is these games are not made with the consoles in mind, they are too intensive for this generation. In fact, any console from this gen or last can do 1080p if the game is made specifically for it. look at the wii u. 

Look at Nuaghty dog. They are making last of us 180p and 60FPS. Now I know you are thinking "that was a last gen game" but even on the PS3 it looks as good if not better than games right now for the new consoles. That's because naughty dog games are extremely well optimized. Look at uncharted 2 or 3. Simply amazing what they can do when they build it ground up with target hardware in mind. Or my favorite: Jak 2 for the Ps2. it ran 60fps and manages to be open world with a lot of geometry, no loading screens, and even does so with higher res component connections. Naughty dog pulled every trick out of their asses to make those games run right. On the ps2, they even used the ps1 processor on the system for a bit of extra power. Not many companies do what they do. I know their ps3 games didn't run at 60fps, but Uncharted and Last of us pushed the limits of what the ps3 could do and got amazing results and performance. While they  did run at 30 fps and 720p, they never made excuses for it, and made it the most stable they could and used amazing post processing to make 720p actually look really good. I would aruge that those games almost look better than current gen games, though that' not a fair comparison since not much is available yet. And I would bet this time around like the last of us remake their new games wills tep it up to 1080p and 60fps, while looking as good if not better than competition. and it's because they do it right. 

There are more examples of studios like them, but unfortunately not way to many. 

You get what I'm saying? It's about setting your performance standard first, then optimizing the games to look the best while keeping that standard. Most game companies anymore don't even bother taking all textures off of non visible planes, or do other things that will only really help consoles. Instead they just slap the game on the crank down the settings until they work. 

 

Sounds like splitting hairs, yes they can do it but only if you turn off AA, shadows, particle effects etc etc.

 

What's the point in 1080 if all the graphics are dialed down so far it looks like 720? 

[BallGum]

Both the PS4 ans Xbone are perfectly capable of 1080p 60fps gaming, but game devs choose to focus on small effects with a large performance impact first before making it perform right then seeing what effects you can add. The ps3 and 360 were actually both capable of it somewhat. I have had experience game developing for both pc and the last gen consoles.  I know what I'm talking about. Small form factor has nothing to do with it by the way, nothing at all.

It's all in the marketing. They want the previews and the "graphics hype" to be the selling point, so they push for that instead of making it work right. Nintendo is seeming to make the opposite push recently. I get it, mario is not exactly a demanding game, but with ps4 and xbone you have more than enough power to make the games look better than last gen gradually while maintaining a good performance standard. 

I know that game devs will get better at squeezing every bit of power from these systems in the next few years, but instead of using that to make a game run at 1080p/60fps,I'm afraid they will continue to stay at 720p and 30fps just like last gen.  

It's lazy game dev. In fact last gen I think the only game I knew of that had a dynamic frame buffer was wipeoutHD. -.- So it's not like they laziness  started this gen. Tricks like that help you squeeze everything you can out of the hardware you have to work with. but instead they are trying to develop for them like they are PCs, and simply turn down the frame rate and resolutions caps instead of designing the game from ground up to run right.

 

I somewhat disagree with the statement that it's marketing.If anything, it would be better to market their game with the fact that it runs at 1080P, 60FPS, rather than making it look fancy with lighting, particle effects, and higher resolution textures. The consumer has never been so observant about things like resolution and framerate before.

[BallGum]

What if I told you that PC gamers are largely no different? 

 

Please, enjoy the average BF4 text chat (god help you if there is voice). People are hardly any better. 

 

PC gamers have the same level of asshattery, snobbery, and desire to tell me that they fucked my mother twice in the past 10 minutes as any console player. 

 

Depends on the game more than the platform. The only barrier I saw between PC and Console communities, is that you'd at least have to have some technical knowledge to buy a good gaming PC or build one. And that mean a more mature player.

[Syntaxvgm]

Sounds like splitting hairs, yes they can do it but only if you turn off AA, shadows, particle effects etc etc.

 

What's the point in 1080 if all the graphics are dialed down so far it looks like 720?

native resolution without AA looks better than 720p with aa by miles to me.

Also, read post below.

[Syntaxvgm]

I somewhat disagree with the statement that it's marketing.If anything, it would be better to market their game with the fact that it runs at 1080P, 60FPS, rather than making it look fancy with lighting, particle effects, and higher resolution textures. The consumer has never been so observant about things like resolution and framerate before.

It also has a lot to do with the way games are developed. They are pieced together at the last minute. This obviously results in broken games on release, but also worth noting when you have very large studios working on a game in the matter of a year or less in some cases they don't optimize the games well. It's not like what I'm saying about optimization they don't know, but it's a time consuming process, and hard to do with such large studios. It's easier to just make the games as if they were going to run on  a pc and then dial them back until they can be played on the consoles. Does that make sense? 

[Syntaxvgm]

oops double post

[Fetzie]

Pretty sure I'll notice the difference if I change my 1080p 24" monitor to some idiotic shitbird resolution like 792p, the pixels will be a strange shape and everything. What is the horizontal resolution? 1920*792 is going to be horribly stretched vertically.

 

Shut up and go home Microsoft, you're drunk (you'd better be).

 

 

 

60ppi at 100 inches. 

 

100 inches is 2.54 meters. 2.54m is 8.3 feet. 

 

I also don't know how to math, so I have no idea if thats valid. 

 

But there it is. 

 

 

 

 

The original source also a marketer. You guys are getting worked up over what a marketer is saying. since when do they EVER know what's going on? They market. They spew crap. And guess what? You're giving it all the free attention it doesn't deserve. 

 

You'll get eye-strain looking at a 100" screen from 2 metres away. I go by 1 metre for each ten inches of screen diagonal (1 metre for 1-19 inches, 2 metres for 20-29 inches, 3 metres for 30-39 inches and so on) when choosing a new TV and it works fairly well. It isn't just the width of the screen in arc minutes either, TVs are much brighter than computer monitors and often have higher colour saturation (so that you can still tell what is going on from 5 metres away).

[Syntaxvgm]

Pretty sure I'll notice the difference if I change my 1080p 24" monitor to some idiotic shitbird resolution like 792p, the pixels will be a strange shape and everything. What is the horizontal resolution? 1920*792 is going to be horribly stretched vertically.

 

Shut up and go home Microsoft, you're drunk (you'd better be).

It's actually 1408*792

A 10% higher res than 720p -.- Kinda pointless i know.

[Fetzie]

It's actually 1408*792

A 10% higher res than 720p -.- Kinda pointless i know.

 

Like I said, idiotic shitbird resolution.

[mr moose]

native resolution without AA looks better than 720p with aa by miles to me.

Also, read post below.

subjective, I have a native 720p projector with 100" screen and it looks shitloads better running of my pc with AA than my bro-inlaws 1080p 40" running from a ps4.

 

It also has a lot to do with the way games are developed. They are pieced together at the last minute. This obviously results in broken games on release, but also worth noting when you have very large studios working on a game in the matter of a year or less in some cases they don't optimize the games well. It's not like what I'm saying about optimization they don't know, but it's a time consuming process, and hard to do with such large studios. It's easier to just make the games as if they were going to run on  a pc and then dial them back until they can be played on the consoles. Does that make sense? 

 

So consoles have to be either graphically retarded or frame rate retarded in order to be playable.  Sounds like what I said earlier. 

[Syntaxvgm]

subjective, I have a native 720p projector with 100" screen and it looks shitloads better running of my pc with AA than my bro-inlaws 1080p 40" running from a ps4.

 

 

So consoles have to be either graphically retarded or frame rate retarded in order to be playable.  Sounds like what I said earlier.

No, I'm saying they are rushed. If they were not, they would come out much better.

[Yoinkerman]

Sure, I guess?  It's hard to tell the difference between one pile of jaggy crap and another, I'll give them that,

[Syntaxvgm]

Sure, I guess?  It's hard to tell the difference between one pile of jaggy crap and another, I'll give them that,

Made me smile. And congrats on 1000 posts.

[ZacDaMan72]

God, Microsoft should really fuck off.

[RexinOridle]

Oh common guys,. Resolution is just a freaking number, like cockroach is just a bird.

[LAwLz]

What if I told you that PC gamers are largely no different? 

 

Please, enjoy the average BF4 text chat (god help you if there is voice). People are hardly any better. 

 

PC gamers have the same level of asshattery, snobbery, and desire to tell me that they fucked my mother twice in the past 10 minutes as any console player. 

Depends on the game but yeah, BF4 and COD are the same no matter what platform you play on.

[GeathX]

subjective, I have a native 720p projector with 100" screen and it looks shitloads better running of my pc with AA than my bro-inlaws 1080p 40" running from a ps4.

 

 

So consoles have to be either graphically retarded or frame rate retarded in order to be playable.  Sounds like what I said earlier. 

 

Have you actually watched the Uncharted 4 reveal?

http://www.naughtydog.com/site/post/uncharted_4_a_thiefs_end_2014_e3_trailer/

If you have a fast enough connection, there is a link to the 60fps version from Naughty Dog, the 30fps Youtube version at 1080 looks good too, but of course you don't get the fluidity of 60fps.

They are very clear and explicitly state it is captured in game, no doubt because of the WD media hellstorm they are making sure to get the point across.

 

Now not saying that the PS4 is super powerful, more so than a beast PC. More that what you see from PC today, is no where near what the hardware is actually capable, GPUs are being strangled by limitations in the software IE DirectX, which DX12 is meant to fix

[mr moose]

Have you actually watched the Uncharted 4 reveal?

http://www.naughtydog.com/site/post/uncharted_4_a_thiefs_end_2014_e3_trailer/

If you have a fast enough connection, there is a link to the 60fps version from Naughty Dog, the 30fps Youtube version at 1080 looks good too, but of course you don't get the fluidity of 60fps.

They are very clear and explicitly state it is captured in game, no doubt because of the WD media hellstorm they are making sure to get the point across.

 

Now not saying that the PS4 is super powerful, more so than a beast PC. More that what you see from PC today, is no where near what the hardware is actually capable, GPUs are being strangled by limitations in the software IE DirectX, which DX12 is meant to fix

 

Video streams and teasers are not always the same as game play, and to be honest I would rather not know what the FPS is so i can judge without confirmation bias how good it is. I understand pc can be a little better than what it is, and I believe consoles can be a little better than what they are too, but not enough to account for the difference in hardware performance.  If consoles could perform as well as pc's then there would be no need for devs to nerf the pc version or make silly marketing statements to try and convince people to stick with consoles.

[GeathX]

Video streams and teasers are not always the same as game play, and to be honest I would rather not know what the FPS is so i can judge without confirmation bias how good it is. I understand pc can be a little better than what it is, and I believe consoles can be a little better than what they are too, but not enough to account for the difference in hardware performance.  If consoles could perform as well as pc's then there would be no need for devs to nerf the pc version or make silly marketing statements to try and convince people to stick with consoles.

 

 

Would rather not know the FPS so you can judge? That reads to me that you could have evidence of consoles performing rather well, but that you would disregard it if you were told before hand it was evidence of consoles performing well....

Also, just because Ubisoft are being dicks doesn't mean all game developers are going to do the same thing.

 

There is at least one area where PC has a lot of ground to catch up on consoles, and its what Mantle and DX12 are aiming to do. Draw calls, the function of the CPU telling the GPU to draw the game.

 

http://www.redgamingtech.com/amd-mantle-works-on-nvidia-gpus-100000-draw-calls-similar-to-ps4-api-library/

"He mentioned that PC developers can currently get between 3 to 5 thousand draw calls per frame if we’re talking at a 60HZ game. As we discussed in the previous article this is an issue with DirectX, basically eating up a lot of processor power."

 

 

http://www.redgamingtech.com/introducing-amd-mantle-low-level-api-from-amd/

 

"Right now, a high end GPU can process more draw calls than what the CPU can issue – in other words, the CPU is holding the GPU back."

"To clarify, a Draw Call is one of the most important aspects of creating a 3d scene. The CPU issues a command to the GPU of what to draw, and must do so for each unique item on screen. Think of it this way, in the current generation of Xbox 360 and Playstation 3 titles, there can be between 10,000 to 20,000 pieces of geometry in a single frame of animation."

 

3-5k compared to 10-20k on PS3/360 and 30k hinted on PS4...

http://www.redgamingtech.com/infamous-second-son-engine-postmortem-analysis-breakdown/    in the PS4 CPU is Decent slide.

 

Mantle is aiming to push the draw calls available to the 100k region, but if realistically they fall short of that, even half means they are out performing the PS4 on that front.

[flibberdipper]

I'm beginning to wish that I could live under a rock so I wouldn't have to deal with idiots like this.

[skullbringer]

Well, I cant see the difference between this and a football unless Im using a 60" screen and Im less than 50 meters away!

 

 

[steffen_anywhere]

I think this statement may cost them more than the R&D (which is none) to make an XBox Two (whatever man)... Just bad. I mean it's OK that the consoles are the way they are. They are mediocre, but for most people they're just fine. However, this crap talk geared at techies (cuz who else is gonna care really) annoys me.

[deathjester]

Have you actually watched the Uncharted 4 reveal?

http://www.naughtydog.com/site/post/uncharted_4_a_thiefs_end_2014_e3_trailer/

If you have a fast enough connection, there is a link to the 60fps version from Naughty Dog, the 30fps Youtube version at 1080 looks good too, but of course you don't get the fluidity of 60fps.

They are very clear and explicitly state it is captured in game, no doubt because of the WD media hellstorm they are making sure to get the point across.

 

Now not saying that the PS4 is super powerful, more so than a beast PC. More that what you see from PC today, is no where near what the hardware is actually capable, GPUs are being strangled by limitations in the software IE DirectX, which DX12 is meant to fix

 

Naughty Dog has lied before. "Dev kit" and a PS4 aren't the same. Looks like a cutscene which means nothing. Until I see a person with a controller with a PS4 next to them and actual gameplay? I could care less. Add to that we may have emulation before Uncharted 4 even comes out.

 

http://www.lazygamer.net/general-news/ps4-and-xbox-one-emulators-could-arrive-as-early-as-next-year/

http://news.dice.com/2013/12/09/the-quest-to-build-xbox-one-and-ps4-emulators/

 

Am I saying it won't look good or be fun? Not at all. It is the ONLY console exclusive I have any interest in whatsoever. That said? If I can emulate it on a better x86 console (my computer) I will buy the game and play it on the PC. I could care less about the multiplayer in Uncharted. 

[steffen_anywhere]

Well, I cant see the difference between this and a football unless Im using a 60" screen and Im less than 50 meters away!

 

-the computato (i don't even know)-

 

Potato Salad... Let that sink in for a minute

[LimpCurve]

"Experience watch dogs in a way only the PS4 can deliver, at 1080p 60FPS"

That's not entirely stupid considering it's half true.