The new Intel Core i7 11700K is being sold already in Germany and Denmark, list price of the 11900K leaked

[RejZoR]

2 hours ago, leadeater said:

You do when they run out, then you can't buy. You are literally burying your head in the sand by ignoring distributors, where stock comes from.

 

Really, can I now? Are you sure about that?

 

https://www.computerlounge.co.nz/shop/components/processors/amd#!categoryId=259&page=1&q=&scid=-1&isListMode=false&Filters[0].Key=Sort&Filters[0].Value=1

 

Tell me again how I'm able to buy these CPUs? That 5800X that is Direct ship was in stock 2 left yesterday, I'm willing to bet if I ring up and ask how many are left in total it'll be between 1 and 10, probably 1.

 

More retailers here:

https://www.ascent.co.nz/category/cpu?products_brand_asc[refinementList][Category][0]=CPU&products_brand_asc[refinementList][Socket][0]=Socket AM4

https://www.extremepc.co.nz/components/CPU-Processors?mfp=path[541]

https://www.pbtech.co.nz/category/components/cpus/amd-desktop-cpu

 

"It's fine for me stop complaining. My specific situation disproves that global supply is a problem". Counter to literally every single news article and industry source right now. You do you man, just don't come back to me when stock dry's up basically over night unless supply is actually improving and you get it before that happens.

 

And no I'm not going to buy a 5800X, it's the worst option of all of them. No not a bad CPU, but I'm not going to buy it.

 

Proportional product allocation is a thing you know.

And distributors can't have them if manufacturer doesn't make them. Are we gonna blame silicon mines now because they don't mine enough of that shit or something? The fact is, you can buy them across all Europe whether you like it or not. I don't get it why this offends you so hard for some reason. Even if each only has just 1, you can still grab it this very moment. Because they are there. Making up some dumb hypothetical scenarios where they end up being in stock are just so bizarre. It's like saying, I want a brand new capable CPU. And I see them in stock. But for some unknown reason I'm just gonna wait so they run out of stock and then I'm gonna complain how they are unobtainable? LOL much?

 

Also how is 5800X worst option? Given I already had 6 core, 12 thread CPU before, buying 5600X would be just silly. I didn't fancy paying 100€ extra for 5900X as I just don't need that many cores. So I bought 5800X. Clocks high, has single CCX unit and I gained major IPC uplift as well as extra cores. For someone who already had 9900K or 10980K maybe not so much.

[Stahlmann]

1 hour ago, Moonzy said:

at $500, which is stupid for a 8 core CPU

Seems like many people don't have a problem with this price. After all isn't that what the 9900K was priced back when it was king and everyone wanted one?

 

I agree, i wouldn't pay $500 for an 8-core CPU, but then again i wouldn't buy an 8-core CPU to begin with.

[AzzaNezz]

On 2/28/2021 at 12:06 PM, RejZoR said:

It's not a bad option I guess if you absolutely want Intel. Otherwise, 5800X is still a better option imo. Much more modern chip despite being released earlier than this. Intel still seems to hold on to moar clock over just making the things actually faster. And still 14nm. Come on Intel, at least release something at 10nm if you can't go any lower than that. It's weird given they already have 10nm CPU's but are only mobile iirc.

For noob like me who doesnt understand it,why cant intel go lower then 14nm,and amd can go to 7nm

[WhitetailAni]

2 minutes ago, AzzaNezz said:

For noob like me who doesnt understand it,why cant intel go lower then 14nm,and amd can go to 7nm

Intel is producing chips in their own fabs - where they do 14nm and 10nm (for mobile).

AMD has TSMC - a company not owned by AMD - to produce their chips. TSMC is able to do 7nm.

[AzzaNezz]

Just now, FakeKGB said:

Intel is producing chips in their own fabs - where they do 14nm and 10nm (for mobile).

AMD has TSMC - a company not owned by AMD - to produce their chips. TSMC is able to do 7nm.

ahaa thnx for explaining

[porina]

1 minute ago, AzzaNezz said:

For noob like me who doesnt understand it,why cant intel go lower then 14nm,and amd can go to 7nm

Firstly, AMD's "7nm" is not directly comparable to Intel's "14nm". At best they can be considered marketing numbers with little correlation to a physical aspect. 

 

Intel do their stuff mostly in house. AMD mainly uses TSMC currently. To be roughly comparable, Intel 10nm is comparable to TSMC 7nm. Intel have had troubles getting their 10nm working well, which has delayed everything they've done since about Skylake. Only recently seem to have done it with 10nm SuperFin used in their mobile Tiger Lake processors, and it is being rolled out to server now, and desktop towards end of year. So AMD still retain an advantage there.

 

Not sure what was rumour or fact now, Intel were reportedly looking at using TSMC in future also.

[RejZoR]

48 minutes ago, porina said:

Firstly, AMD's "7nm" is not directly comparable to Intel's "14nm". At best they can be considered marketing numbers with little correlation to a physical aspect. 

 

Intel do their stuff mostly in house. AMD mainly uses TSMC currently. To be roughly comparable, Intel 10nm is comparable to TSMC 7nm. Intel have had troubles getting their 10nm working well, which has delayed everything they've done since about Skylake. Only recently seem to have done it with 10nm SuperFin used in their mobile Tiger Lake processors, and it is being rolled out to server now, and desktop towards end of year. So AMD still retain an advantage there.

 

Not sure what was rumour or fact now, Intel were reportedly looking at using TSMC in future also.

Well, yes and no. Fact remains, 7nm TSMC chips that make up Ryzen 5000 series are much cooler and efficient than 14nm Intel CPU's.

[Loote]

44 minutes ago, porina said:

Not sure what was rumour or fact now, Intel were reportedly looking at using TSMC in future also.

I think GPUs are very likely, some CPUs are unlikely and top CPUs are highly unlikely.

The nm measure is, as mentioned before, mostly for marketing purposes, what's more it can be efficiency oriented, frequency oriented, or something else. TSMC has N7FF, N7P, N7FF+ and N6(probably called 6nm), the latter two using EUV and noticeably better.

[porina]

2 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Well, yes and no.

If you're going to say no, to what do you disagree?

 

2 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Fact remains, 7nm TSMC chips that make up Ryzen 5000 series are much cooler and efficient than 14nm Intel CPU's.

Under what conditions? Seriously, you can pick and choose scenarios where that may or may not be true. On average, I'd agree, but it is not an absolute.

[leadeater]

1 hour ago, porina said:

Under what conditions? Seriously, you can pick and choose scenarios where that may or may not be true. On average, I'd agree, but it is not an absolute.

Just lower the max boost targets of 14nm CPUs and use more sane PL2 settings and you'll have CPUs using that 14nm process performing roughly the same as AMD CPUs using TSMC 7nm using similar amounts of power. Intel 14nm is actually very good, like very good. That's literally the problem Intel has right now, trying to make 10nm better than the most refined silicon process node in history ever. Under normal cadence Intel's 10nm would already be better than their 14nm but their 14nm got like 3 refinements that wouldn't normally happen.

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

The fact is, you can buy them across all Europe whether you like it or not.

Ah yes but irrelevant to my original, very original comment. You've just been arguing a nonsense point for no reason literally only because you can buy them. A state which is only true right now, and not so not that long ago and has no guarantee of staying true past short term.

 

On 3/1/2021 at 2:05 AM, leadeater said:

Have you actually tried buying one outside your country and it's supply chain?

I did comment earlier that I thought you did understand supply chains but maybe this actually is not the case hence the chain of pointlessness 

 

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

I don't get it why this offends you so hard for some reason

It literally doesn't, it offended you when I said buying the 5800X or any other Ryzen 5000 CPU is a unicorn prospect and you wanted to argue that simply because you could buy them. What am I at now, the 4th time for this comment. Just be happy that you can. Literally could have ended there.

 

And like I said in my last comment, I will not buy a 5800X. There could be a million in stock and zero of everything else I'm still not going to buy it, I'll wait.

 

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

Also how is 5800X worst option? Given I already had 6 core, 12 thread CPU before, buying 5600X would be just silly.

A pointless unnecessary upgrade is also silly. If you are going to point to games and other lightly threaded workloads then the 5600X and 5800X perform the same so you want to spend more money for no reason why?

 

Out of all the Ryzen 5000 series the 5800X is the worst value option there is, I'm not the only person saying that. If you're happy to buy it, like you did then fine, it's not a bad CPU (it's only at this comment did I notice you actually brought one btw). The worst good CPU is still the worst out of good options, I'm sorry if it offends you that I'm indirectly criticizing your purchase, which is not my intention I'm purely commenting on the 5800X and how it makes little sense compared to the Ryzen 5000 series lineup as a whole and existing Ryzen 3000 options.

 

Not purchasing something is always an option.

[RejZoR]

You've moved your goal posts to moon of Jupiter anyways so I just give up. 5800X is shit and they are absolutely unobtainable. Happy? Oh, also buy Intel!

[CTR640]

What are the normal prices of the 5800X? Did AMD raise it by €50? Netherlands got them in stock but I ain't upgrading my 4770.

If I want/have to upgrade, I wanna make it big.

 

The 5800X prices so far:

https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/1618234/amd-ryzen-7-5800x-boxed.html

[Mateyyy]

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

7nm TSMC chips that make up Ryzen 5000 series are much cooler and efficient than 14nm Intel CPU's.

There's a reason you don't see people daily-ing overclocked 3950Xes pulling 250W+, but you do see people running 300W 10900Ks on air cooling. Or the 5800X being harder to cool than a 10700K.

 

More, smaller transistors will be harder to cool than fewer, larger transistors. Again, as mentioned previously, the difference between 7nm TSMC and 14nm Intel isn't as large as AMD's marketing hopes to make you believe (since "7nm" seems to be plastered over any of their recent CPU/GPUs), but this still holds true to an extent.

[Rym]

The prices are as I expected and said many times to my bro. They will either match or be higher than ryzen 5000 prices.

 

Looking at these pre-release prices they are exactly what I expected them to be. This may possibly go down with the official release although it's not likely.

 

The performance however is very lacking.

 

At the moment I'm conflicted between Intel and AMD. Gaming exclusive of course. I'm thinking between an i5 10600k with a Z590 TUF motherboard or a ryzen 5 5600x with a maybe B550 Aorus Pro V2? I'm not sure though, I know Buildozer recommended this one for overclocking in a GN video but the main difference is in price where the i5 + Z590 mobo equals 2109 Lei and 5600x + B550 Aorus Pro V2 equals 2429 Lei.

 

 

Although I did snipe a video on youtube where Ryzen was fighting with i5, both on stock, and was usually winning by 10 FPS. And I did hear about PBO 2.1 being able to OC all cores to 5GHz...

[Bombastinator]

6 minutes ago, Rym said:

The prices are as I expected and said many times to my bro. They will either match or be higher than ryzen 5000 prices.

 

Looking at these pre-release prices they are exactly what I expected them to be. This may possibly go down with the official release although it's not likely.

 

The performance however is very lacking.

 

At the moment I'm conflicted between Intel and AMD. Gaming exclusive of course. I'm thinking between an i5 10600k with a Z590 TUF motherboard or a ryzen 5 5600x with a maybe B550 Aorus Pro V2? I'm not sure though, I know Buildozer recommended this one for overclocking in a GN video but the main difference is in price where the i5 + Z590 mobo equals 2109 Lei and 5600x + B550 Aorus Pro V2 equals 2429 Lei.

 

 

Although I did snipe a video on youtube where Ryzen was fighting with i5, both on stock, and was usually winning by 10 FPS. And I did hear about PBO 2.1 being able to OC all cores to 5GHz...

I personally find the most important factor to be price/performance.  A sector AMD used to dominate in but the 5000 series didn’t go that route and retailers are marking ryzen stuff up so far the price/perfomance advantage actually can lean toward intel and away from AMD periodically. 

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, RejZoR said:

You've moved your goal posts to moon of Jupiter anyways so I just give up. 5800X is shit and they are absolutely unobtainable. Happy? Oh, also buy Intel!

Um did I actually say the 5800X was bad? Nope. You're still confusing something as the worst option with something that is actually bad. Neither did I change anything at all during this entire conversation mind you. I start with saying the 5800X isn't a good option in the 5000 series or compared to some 3000 series and said it's hard to come by, which is true depending on where you live. You got annoyed because I'm criticizing something you either brought or like (why?) even though there is a ton of evidence showing it's not a great option and that you and anyone else in your area can buy them yet still somehow not understand why you and every else around you has stock and where it comes from.

 

Do you have a comprehension issue or something? Or you just like arguing and not reading what someone has written?

[RejZoR]

Yes, you win.

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, CTR640 said:

What are the normal prices of the 5800X? Did AMD raise it by €50? Netherlands got them in stock but I ain't upgrading my 4770.

If I want/have to upgrade, I wanna make it big.

 

The 5800X prices so far:

https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/1618234/amd-ryzen-7-5800x-boxed.html

The official MSRP is 449 euro, have a look around as there are places that actually do have it at MSRP but I don't know about Netherlands specifically. There's no change to the MSRP though, it'll just be market pricing factors.

[RoseLuck462]

Will a German i7 work with my USA Intel mobo?

[WhitetailAni]

4 minutes ago, RoseLuck462 said:

Will a German i7 work with my USA Intel mobo?

No.

Intel region-locks chips.

 

/s

Edited March 2, 2021 by FakeKGB
added modifier

[Mister Woof]

So if they already have them and have sold them all, and people are already benchmarking and using them, when will intel actually release these chips?

 

If they were slated for a later date, doesnt this kind of force their hand at a sooner release?

[D13H4RD]

On 3/1/2021 at 8:27 PM, RejZoR said:

Also how is 5800X worst option? Given I already had 6 core, 12 thread CPU before, buying 5600X would be just silly. I didn't fancy paying 100€ extra for 5900X as I just don't need that many cores. So I bought 5800X. Clocks high, has single CCX unit and I gained major IPC uplift as well as extra cores. For someone who already had 9900K or 10980K maybe not so much.

It is the weakest value option out of the initial Zen 3 AM4 lineup because it is in "No Man's Land". 

 

It's not really any better in gaming performance versus a 5600X and it's priced too close to a 5900X to the point where people who really need more cores are more likely to spring for that. I also would argue that it is not at all stupid to go with a 5600X rather than a 5800X especially if the money you saved can go to a GPU that's about a tier higher. 

 

Because some people have problems understanding that bad value does not necessarily mean a bad product, let me reiterate that the 5800X is a very good product but it is also positioned in a way that makes it a tough sell outside a very specific set of target users. No one should feel bad for buying a 5800X or the 10700K which was in the exact same position within its lineup because it is still ultimately a fundamentally excellent product. This is more on the product marketing and positioning side 

[RejZoR]

Priced close? 5800X is around 450€, 5900X is around 700€ (I know prices are weird currently, but that's what it is). I wanted more cores than I had before (8c/16t vs 6c/12t), but didn't feel like I need that many to justify almost 700€ for 5900X. Also single CCX has its perks. Smaller, but there are. I don't see how it's positioned weird when you're not buying these things for just 2 years.

[Kisai]

On 3/1/2021 at 5:32 AM, porina said:

Firstly, AMD's "7nm" is not directly comparable to Intel's "14nm". At best they can be considered marketing numbers with little correlation to a physical aspect. 

 

I really want people to stop using this as a defense against picking Intel.

 

You pick Intel because you need something the Intel CPU does. AVX-512? Video encoder and decoder? More availability? Less buggy chipsets? The chip nm and tdp doesn't matter if you need something like that.

 

However, it's a stretch that "nm" is marketing because there is no direct comparison between chips produced on different nodes. Intel can't produce a cooler chip, otherwise it would be able to produce a 16 core cpu and beat the AMD cpu's by a mile. So part for part, Intel's CPU's are 14nm and therefor take 4x the area that a 7nm cpu would. Intel should, if it was on the 7nm node, be able to put out 32-core (not thread, core) cpu's since their 14nm's are max out at 8. AMD is only getting 16 cores in their 7nm node because they've omitted the iGPU. AMD's iGPU CPU parts are all 8 core or less, and their iGPU's have always beat the snot out of Intel's iGPU's. 

 

So like-for-like, Intel should be able to have a 32-core/64-thread CPU with an iGPU that is 2x as performative as the existing 14nm Xe gpu in the 11th gen cpu, eg a 192 EU part, or perhaps they could squeeze in an AV1 encoder, as high end purchases of parts never use the iGPU, as the iGPU is always substantially underperforming. I'd rather have the video encoder/decoder in the CPU than the "GPU" for graphics in a desktop.