AMD Learns from NVIDIA and issues guidelines to retailers to prevent Radeon RX 6000-series scalping

[BiG StroOnZ]

AMD does not want Radeon RX 6000 series to be sold to scalpers. AMD issues preventive measure to retailers to circumvent the scalping of Radeon RX 6000-series (RDNA 2 GPUs). AMD learns from NVIDIA: Radeon RX 6000, Ryzen 5000 has launch guidelines.

 

Quote

 

In order to avoid making the same mistake NVIDIA did at the Ampere launch, AMD has sent out a document to its partners outlining the possible measures to prevent scalpers from obtaining the Radeon RX 6000 series cards. The news is coming directly from RedGamingTech on YouTube, which had a document that is reportedly from AMD and sent to their partners to curb scalpers from ripping the Ryzen 5000 and Radeon RX 6000 series launch to shreds. RedGamingTech received this document and it was shown in a video:

AMD has the following rules suggestions in place:

• Bot Detection and Management: Use real-time bot detection mechanisms and tools to scan and filter site traffic and identify/block known malicious bots.
• CAPTCHA Implementation: Use challenge-response tests to determine if the user is human during the checkout process. (e.g.. "I am not a robot" check box, simple math problem, picture/confident or alpha-numeric identification or honeypot)
• Purchase Limits: Limit purchases at launch to 1 per end-user_ Reject subsequent orders containing the same information, such as name, email address, or billing/shipping address.
• Reservations: Use a queue-based notification system that allows customers to reserve their place in line to purchase as stock becomes available in the future. If a product is shown 'out of stock', customers have the option to be notified by email once the product is available.
• Manual Order Processing: At launch, switch to manual order processing to properly validate orders with minimal delays.
• Limit Reseller Sales (B2B): During the 3 weeks after (AMD Ryzen 5000 / Radeon RX 6000) launch, limit the number of sales made to commercial resellers.
• Inventory-toe-Cart Allocation: Allocate inventory only when a customer submits an order or set a time limit on how long a customer can hold our product in their cart. Inform customers that purchases are not guaranteed until the order is submitted.

 

Source 1: https://www.dsogaming.com/news/amd-retailers-scalping-radeon-rx-6000-series-rdna-2/

Source 2: https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-issues-guidelines-to-retailers-to-prevent-radeon-rx-6000-scalping

Source 3: https://www.tweaktown.com/news/75798/amd-learns-from-nvidia-radeon-rx-6000-ryzen-5000-launch-guidelines

 

This year has been difficult for many not having the ability to purchase these new "next gen" gaming GPUs; as demand has been incredibly high. Let's all pray that the supply/demand isn’t an issue with AMD (unlike with the Ampere launch). Even worse is that Ampere GeForce RTX 3080 and 3090 shortages will continue until at least 2021 according to the NVIDIA CEO. This means gamers might have no choice but to turn to AMD if they can't wait until next year. Hence, all the pressure is on AMD, let's hope they don't buckle. 

[Letgomyleghoe.]

Even if this doesn't work its a lot better than nvidia who did nothing so hopefully getting these won't be such a pain in the ass.

Edit: Amd shot itself in the foot thinking since these are "guidelines" so we pray that partners will implament them or gg well played amd and good lucking getting a gpu

[The_russian]

How is giving a recommendation going to help? Asking your partners to implement bot detection is very different from the partners actually being successful in doing so. I didn't keep too close of an eye on the whole 3000 series launch since I wasn't planning to get one, but from what I understand Nvidia's site wasn't the only one having the problem, it was all the other retailer sites as well. How is this going to help the retailers prevent the same thing from happening with the AMD launch? 

 

As a side note, I can only hope that AMD will have the same kind of demand the 3000 series currently has, since that would mean the performance would actually be compelling but looking at the recent AMD graphics card launches and how they were teased/marketed vs how they actually turned out to perform, I am not holding my breath.

[dilpickle]

10 minutes ago, BiG StroOnZ said:

AMD has the following rules in place:

Completely inaccurate reporting. These aren't "rules" they are recommendations. If stores were going to implement these they would have done so already.

[FaxedForward]

2 minutes ago, dilpickle said:

Completely inaccurate reporting. These aren't "rules" they are recommendations. If stores were going to implement these they would have done so already.

Correct, AMDs own letter says they “strongly recommend” such measures, says nothing about a requirement.

 

Still, kudos to AMD for at least acknowledging the issues. Even without protections I think the AMD cards will be easier to get simply due to better yields, but more product in consumer hands = PR win for AMD, regardless of the reason.

[AldiPrayogi]

Does anybody know when Big Navi or even Zen 3 started getting manufactured? Because if I remembered correctly NVidia only started manufacturing 3000 series a month or two prior to launch which caused the shortage?

 

Really hope that they started manufacturing those two things earlier than Nvidia did

[Briggsy]

If AMD wanted to, they could implement a system in their supply chain to score retailers on their anti-scalping measures. Retailers who are putting more effort into combating scalpers would be first in line for resupply. Who knows, AMD may actually be planning this for all we know.

 

While I am all for free markets dictating prices, you can bet that AMD, Nvidia and retailers are not happy about scalpers. Imagine an AMD card retailing for $500, and AMD's net profit is $50 (for instance). A scalper turns around and sells that card for $1000 on eBay. In this scenario, AMD would have to sell 10 graphic cards at $500 each to make the same net profit that a scalper would make for flipping one card at $1000. Same goes for the retailers. While my numbers might not be exact, you can understand why AMD are pressuring retailers to use their brains.

 

While in a free market the extra $500 should rightfully go to Nvidia and AMD, they could then be accused of keeping supply low in order to scalp their customers. Ergo, AMD, Nvidia and retailers are all stuck in a catch 22, and it's ultimately up to retailers to get their act together. It's not scalpers who are at fault here, because I know if I got my hands on a 3080 or 3090 for MSRP right now, I'd probably flip it on eBay to some rube too.

[Master Disaster]

5 hours ago, The_russian said:

How is giving a recommendation going to help? Asking your partners to implement bot detection is very different from the partners actually being successful in doing so. I didn't keep too close of an eye on the whole 3000 series launch since I wasn't planning to get one, but from what I understand Nvidia's site wasn't the only one having the problem, it was all the other retailer sites as well. How is this going to help the retailers prevent the same thing from happening with the AMD launch? 

 

As a side note, I can only hope that AMD will have the same kind of demand the 3000 series currently has, since that would mean the performance would actually be compelling but looking at the recent AMD graphics card launches and how they were teased/marketed vs how they actually turned out to perform, I am not holding my breath.

It doesn't have to work. Now if/when it doesn't work AMD cab shift the blame onto retailers who failed to follow the recommendations.

[mwagen]

27 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

It's not scalpers who are at fault here, because I know if I got my hands on a 3080 or 3090 for MSRP right now, I'd probably flip it on eBay to some rube too.

Same. 

 

I'm crossing my fingers I'll be able to get my hands on all the shiny new AMD goodies as soon as they hit stores. I typically never buy stuff at launch and just wait for sales but I want to have my system ready for the games I want to play during these gloomy months in Michigan.

[Arika]

guidelines mean nothing if they are not enforced. retailers care about money, if they sell 200 GPUs they dont care if it's 1 person buying 200 or 200 buying 1.

 

No retailer that doesn't already have these "preventatives/suggestions" in place, are not going to suddenly put money and time into making them because another company told them to.

[Tristerin]

This also in - The CDC recommends a ton of stuff too

[CommanderAlex]

Just now, Tristerin said:

This also in - The CDC recommends a ton of stuff too

And yet people still don't follow....

[Tristerin]

1 minute ago, CommanderAlex said:

And yet people still don't follow....

The key word was "RECOMMENDS" just like how AMD is recommending some things....that the retailers:

1 minute ago, CommanderAlex said:

still won't follow....

*fixed to won't*

 

As a AMD distributor their only goal is to deplete inventory as FAST as possible to turn profit as FAST as possible

[CommanderAlex]

"We expect that some purchasers may initially try to buy large quantities of our new graphics and processing cards and re-sell them at higher prices in the secondary market including through the user of bots to make high-volume purchases and rapidly deplete inventory...To achieve this together, we strongly recommend that our partners that the following measures:"

 

This is not enough as we have seen the use of bots for the RTX 3080 launch and "we strongly recommend"  should be "To achieve this together, we are mandating that our partners carry out the following measures:".

[Arika]

3 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

"To achieve this together, we are mandating that our partners carry out the following measures:".

"hey we know you're our distribution partners and all, but you NEED to change your systems to how WE want them otherwise we're not going to give you our products to sell"

 

Sounds an awful lot like the GPP

[MageTank]

19 minutes ago, Arika S said:

guidelines mean nothing if they are not enforced. retailers care about money, if they sell 200 GPUs they dont care if it's 1 person buying 200 or 200 buying 1.

 

No retailer that doesn't already have these "preventatives/suggestions" in place, are not going to suddenly put money and time into making them because another company told them to.

No, but retailers do care about money from attachments. They'd rather sell to genuine customers that would also be willing to buy replacement plans and other components alongside a scarcely available product instead of selling an item in-bulk at MSRP that is just going to flip it in return for a higher price.

 

I do vividly recall the shortage of GTX 1000 series cards due to crypto mining and retailers that were offering cards at MSRP for people that were buying other system components alongside the cards.

 

I think it is in the best interest of these retailers to reach as many "real" customers as they can and I am confident they know that too, it's why many of them have been trying to put procedures in place to combat the bots and scalpers in the first place.

[dilpickle]

On 10/21/2020 at 9:10 AM, MageTank said:

No, but retailers do care about money from attachments. They'd rather sell to genuine customers that would also be willing to buy replacement plans and other components alongside a scarcely available product instead of selling an item in-bulk at MSRP that is just going to flip it in return for a higher price.

 

I do vividly recall the shortage of GTX 1000 series cards due to crypto mining and retailers that were offering cards at MSRP for people that were buying other system components alongside the cards.

 

I think it is in the best interest of these retailers to reach as many "real" customers as they can and I am confident they know that too, it's why many of them have been trying to put procedures in place to combat the bots and scalpers in the first place.

You would think so but many retailers just see a sale as a sale and don't care who is buying.

 

Just look at the panic buying when the lockdown started. We saw pics of people walking out with 4 shopping carts full of toiler paper and leaving nothing for everyone else. You would think the store would put a limit on purchases. They might piss off a few people but they would make hundreds more happy. But they didn't care because they make the same money no matter who is buying.

[Briggsy]

2 hours ago, dilpickle said:

You would think so but many retailers just see a sale as a sale and don't care who is buying.

 

Just look at the panic buying when the lockdown started. We saw pics of people walking out with 4 shopping carts full of toiler paper and leaving nothing for everyone else. You would think the store would put a limit on purchases. They might piss off a few people but they would make hundreds more happy. But they didn't care because they make the same money no matter who is buying.

and even then limits don't really stop people who are determined. Earlier this year during the lockdown we saw people who were driving around from town to town pulling a trailer with one or more deep-freezers. They'd stop in each grocery store and buy their limit of all the meat products, then drive to the next grocery store and rinse and repeat. The same will happen with scalpers of graphic cards if retailers impose limits. Instead of buying 20 cards from one place, they'll buy 1 or 2 from multiple locations. For online stores they'll have bots ready to go across every site. 

 

It always comes back to the real problem, which is that there are people out there willing to pay double or triple to get something before everyone else. Just like with Ampere, they'll have to contend with crappy launch drivers and hardware bugs, but that doesn't seem to stop them. And like you've alluded to, its as much about perception management. People will be happier if there's restrictions to prevent scalping, even if the cards sell out in 10 minutes at launch.

[illegalwater]

As if any retailers will follow these recommendations, lol.

[Paranoid Kami]

The reason why this whole scalping situation happened is because Nvidia had low stock. If supply is low and demand is high you can increase prices but they're selling them at normal prices. Scalpers see this and buy them knowing they can profit. If GPU makers want to stop scalping they need to increase supply. It's not the fault of scalpers or retailers.

[Bombastinator]

17 minutes ago, Paranoid Kami said:

The reason why this whole scalping situation happened is because Nvidia had low stock. If supply is low and demand is high you can increase prices but they're selling them at normal prices. Scalpers see this and buy them knowing they can profit. If GPU makers want to stop scalping they need to increase supply. It's not the fault of scalpers or retailers.

Not the retailers anyway.  This is an obfuscated “don’t hate the player hate the game” argument.  I’m not letting scalpers off the hook, though I do readily admit there will always be a sufficient supply of them.  Dirtbags are everywhere.  It doesn’t make them not dirt bags though. 

[TetraSky]

Scalpers will buy the entire stock easily through various addresses and different credit card if they need to (easy enough in the US with Privacy). Bot or no bot.

Then there's still the coin miners who can't switch to ASIC, that will be buying a ton of them...

 

If the stocks can't handle the demand from both of these type of people, it's gonna be a while before regular Joe can buy his card at retail price.

 

Overall... I doubt any retailers will actually adopt any of these guidelines.

I just wish a store would implement a "reservation" system, the same way "pre-orders" work. You order it when it's not in stock yet and when it is, they just ship it to you without further input on your part... But nope, "out of stock, email to notify" instead...

[Briggsy]

1 hour ago, TetraSky said:

I just wish a store would implement a "reservation" system, the same way "pre-orders" work. You order it when it's not in stock yet and when it is, they just ship it to you without further input on your part... But nope, "out of stock, email to notify" instead...

It's ironic, isn't it?  Digital sales of games almost always have the option to pre-order months in advance, when there is literally a limitless supply of digital copies.  Meanwhile, physical sales of a highly sought after component that can only be produced in limited quantities is first come, first serve. 

 

There's always going to be those that argue "It's always been this way with graphic cards and CPUs", and I've been around long enough to know that's true, but it doesn't mean pre-orders are impossible. I mean, scalpers are still going to get in on the pre-orders, but its far easier to control who get's what with pre-orders, and especially with reservations.

[Bombastinator]

6 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

It's ironic, isn't it?  Digital sales of games almost always have the option to pre-order months in advance, when there is literally a limitless supply of digital copies.  Meanwhile, physical sales of a highly sought after component that can only be produced in limited quantities is first come, first serve. 

 

There's always going to be those that argue "It's always been this way with graphic cards and CPUs", and I've been around long enough to know that's true, but it doesn't mean pre-orders are impossible. I mean, scalpers are still going to get in on the pre-orders, but its far easier to control who get's what with pre-orders.

When I look at scalping in general there is a long history of scalping show tickets.  Might look to the entertainment industry on how to control them.  Not that they’ve had a lot of luck.

[PocketNerd]

Should only provide cards/chips to retailers that have captcha implemented