Debunking the "Eyes see at 24 fps" Myth

[Compl3xity_]

I have been waiting to get this off of my chest. After seeing Luke trolling and the butthurt console players not being able to see that he is trolling here it is:

 

This myth kills me more than any other out there, due to having such a vested interest in PC gaming. This is such a common myth that it honestly makes my head hurt.

 

I'd like to correct this and if only 4 people walk away after seeing this thread and know better, I'll feel great. I'm going to keep this simple.

 

Myelinated nerves can fire between 300 to 1000 times per second in the human body and transmit information at 200 miles per hour. What matters here is how frequently these nerves can fire (or "send messages").

 

The nerves in your eye are not exempt from this limit. Your eyes can physiologically transmit data that quickly and your eyes/brain working together can interpret up to 1000 frames per second.

 

However, we know from experimenting (as well as simple anecdotal experience) that there is a diminishing return in what frames per second people are able to identify. Although the human eye and brain can interpret up to 1000 frames per second, someone sitting in a chair and actively guessing at how high a framerate is can, on average, interpet up to about 150 frames per second.

 

The point: 60 fps is not a 'waste'. 120 fps is not a 'waste' (provided you have a 120hz monitor capable of such display). There IS a very noticable difference between 15 fps and 60 fps. Many will say there IS a noticeable difference between 40 and 60 fps. Lastly, the limit of the human eye is NOT as low as 30-60 fps. It's just not.

 

The origin of the myth: The origin of the myth probably has to do with limitations of television and movies. Movies, when they were recorded on film reel, limited themselves to 24 frames per second for practical purposes. If there is a diminishing return in how many frames people can claim to actually notice, then the visual difference between 24 fps and 60 fps could not justify DOUBLING the amount of film reel required to film a movie.

 

With the advent of easy digital storage, these limitations are mostly arbitrary anymore.

 

The numbers often cited as the mythological "maximum" the eye can see are 30 fps, 40 fps, and 60 fps. 

 

I would guess the 60 fps "eye-seeing" limit comes from the fact that most PC monitors (and indeed many televisions now) have a maximum refresh rate of 60hz (or 60 frames per second). If a monitor has that 60 fps limit, the monitor is physically incapable of displaying more than 60 fps. This is one of the purposes of frame limiting, Vsync and adjusting refresh rate in video games.

 

tl;dr: The human eye can physiologically detect up to 1000 frames per second. The average human, tasked with detecting what framerate he/she is looking at, can accurately guess up to around 150 fps. That is, they can see the difference in framerates all the way to 150 fps.

[SeriouslyMikey]

But the human hand cant see over 24fps. 

Debunk that, captain obvious. 

[Ostwind]

Why are you posting about this here, where 99% of the people know that the human eye can see more than 24hz.

[Albatross]

What kind of eyes do they have, the Sharingan? jk jk

 

I think you may be right about the monitors being the reason behind people believing we can "only" see up to 60.

[FloRolf]

The last dude in the video was trolling too...

[Red Dragon]

I appreciate the time you put into this   but was it not kinda obvious ubisoft was just being a derp 

[Hans Christian | Teri]

It's been debunked a million times, hell Linus has even done a video on it. Wrong forum to post this on mate.

[Sauron]

Bare in mind old CRT monitors were quite comfortable dishing out up to 85 hz. Other than that it's a nice post, but I think anyone interested would already know this.

[IP man]

Why are we arguing over this hahah

[ShadowCaptain]

But the human hand cant see over 24fps. 

Debunk that, captain obvious. 

 

thanks, spilt my tea on my keyboard at work

[MblaZe7run]

From what I've been told by optometrist that worked on my dads eye after a tragic incident, the human eye can see higher frame rates the closer you get to the screen. The further away you are, the worse the frame rate. But hey, I was told this almost 6 years ago now. Not sure if I remember everything correctly, I was fairly shaken up..

[SeriouslyMikey]

 

thanks, spilt my tea on my keyboard at work

 

 

Was your tea moving at over 24fps? 

[lutewan]

For the all the people saying that this is unless I'm going g to link my friend to this because he doesn't know and it's a nice post that he would understand

[Compl3xity_]

Oh my god, the amount of people who care, is TOO DAMN HIGH.  It's obvious that everybody knows this, I just thought it would be fun to rant about it again. Apparently people only just seem to just have the need to bash people for bringing up old topics.  I spent time on this, and really idgaf if people are saying "who the hell cares", I am just having a major laugh seeing how people respond. lmfao.

[Mush Brain]

43Hz

[The_Strict_Nein]

Above 24 FPS the average human eye can't distinguish rapid still images from a moving image.

 

Above that, smoothness increases. The theoretical maximum would be the rate at which changes in light levels can be communicated from the retina to the brain.

[Briggsy]

one thing to note about your eyes, and perceived frame rates, is that your peripheral vision may see framerates differently than your focal point. Its a little strange when you really think about it, but your brain fills in a lot of pieces with your vision (what causes people to see ghosts and stuff out of the corner of their eye). I personally find when I look at a low framerate GIF image, it looks smoother when I am looking directly at it, but choppy when I am looking somewhere else. 

 

I personally think that if you are sitting further away from a display, more of whats on screen is in your focus, while sitting close up to a monitor while playing a pc game puts more of the screen in your peripheral vision, affecting how smooth framerates look. I have no proof of this affecting smoothness, just how my own eyes and vision works.

[-TesseracT-]

I just saw The Hills Have Eyes (2006) again. It was too damn choppy, I want a higher framerate

[Prastupok]

Please try and hide your age, no one is threatened by you. 

 

Why has this devolved so much?

 

To note, 29.97 fps is a fair step up from 24, without much more data to use. It's more... pleasing.

[flibberdipper]

I just think it's entertaining how immature you guys are about real discussions. I never knew having 20,000 posts on a forum made you have the right to deliberately talk down to people. Saying it's your sense of "humor" doesn't make it any better.

Dude, you're responding the same freaking way. It's like the pot calling the kettle black.

 

And surprise. It is my sense of humor. You may have your own opinion on it or whatever, but I'm pretty sure I know what it is since I'm the one that actually made the post.

[GoldSrc]

Yeah but the human eye can only see up to 480p.

[Compl3xity_]

can't you only see what apple calls RENTA? 

 

Maybe, (maybe i am a cyborg that can see MORE)

[aselwyn1]

Maybe, (maybe i am a cyborg that can see MORE)

LOL just noticed i spelled RETINA wrong LOL

[Kamina]

The eyes don't see in frames but they interpret motion. More the frames, the better the motion will be. I'm sure there is a threshold as it will be so fast to notice, but it would make a cool slow motion clip. 

[airdeano]

ok, the thread has been cleaned/cleared of off-topic chatter. although this topic

is in off-topic, still has the reasonably same guidelines as the forums:

 

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/234698-posting-guidelines-please-read/

 

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please stay on topic, as the admins are not too happy about all this chest-beating

banter. if you cannot add to the topic, do not reply. easily said.