Posted June 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, orbitalbuzzsaw said: Glad to see Ryzen giving Intel a push. Let's hope they can do the same for nVidia with RX Navi Rumours about Navi put it at 1080ti performance. So not a pusher for Nvidia at all really. 6 minutes ago, LukaH said: maybe more along the lines of more cores per ccx and if we are talking about dreams it has to be 5ghz base clock at least Thats next year with ryzen 3 and zen 2. Thats when 5ghz is expected aswell. At tyat point there is also speculation with 6-8 cores per ccx. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 Most people wont even use 8 cores anyways. And its going to be hella expensive. Unless they have crappy clockspeeds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 25 minutes ago, GoldenLag said: Rumours about Navi put it at 1080ti performance. So not a pusher for Nvidia at all really. Thats next year with ryzen 3 and zen 2. Thats when 5ghz is expected aswell. At tyat point there is also speculation with 6-8 cores per ccx. I would say there is potential for 5ghz. I mean to expect them to hit 5ghz is setting you up to be disappointed. I mean if they hit 4.6 to 4.7 relatively easily then I would be pretty happy. If they hit 5ghz then I would be ecstatic. People tend to overhype things and it causes people to get disappointed when things don't live up to the hype. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 32 minutes ago, GoldenLag said: Rumours about Navi put it at 1080ti performance. So not a pusher for Nvidia at all really. Thats next year with ryzen 3 and zen 2. Thats when 5ghz is expected aswell. At tyat point there is also speculation with 6-8 cores per ccx. Navi at 1080 Ti performance will still be a kick in the pants to nVidia at $399 since that's likely to be the price of the 1160 because GDDR6 is really fucking expensive and the 1160 will likely perform like a 1070 Ti if the rule of a given current gen SKU performs like the last-gen SKU two tiers up (e.g. 1070 > 980 Ti) holds true CPU: Core i9 12900K || CPU COOLER : Corsair H100i Pro XT || MOBO : ASUS Prime Z690 PLUS D4 || GPU: PowerColor RX 6800XT Red Dragon || RAM: 4x8GB Corsair Vengeance (3200) || SSDs: Samsung 970 Evo 250GB (Boot), Crucial P2 1TB, Crucial MX500 1TB (x2), Samsung 850 EVO 1TB || PSU: Corsair RM850 || CASE: Fractal Design Meshify C Mini || MONITOR: Acer Predator X34A (1440p 100hz), HP 27yh (1080p 60hz) || KEYBOARD: GameSir GK300 || MOUSE: Logitech G502 Hero || AUDIO: Bose QC35 II || CASE FANS : 2x Corsair ML140, 1x BeQuiet SilentWings 3 120 || LAPTOP: Dell XPS 15 7590 TABLET: iPad Pro PHONE: Galaxy S9 She/they Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 46 minutes ago, GoldenLag said: Thats next year with ryzen 3 and zen 2. Thats when 5ghz is expected aswell. At tyat point there is also speculation with 6-8 cores per ccx. Really? A 2700X needs dry ice/SS phase to validate and benchmark at 5GHz. I'd be amazed in AMD could get whatever is next to validate 5GHz on chilled let alone benchmark. Heck if the user didn't need to bathe there rads in an ice bucket that would be even more impressive. 5GHz probably isn't going happen unless you've got high end water/ice bucket ready to go. Our Grace. The Feathered One. He shows us the way. His bob is majestic and shows us the path. Follow unto his guidance and His example. He knows the one true path. Our Saviour. Our Grace. Our Father Birb has taught us with His humble heart and gentle wing the way of the bob. Let us show Him our reverence and follow in His example. The True Path of the Feathered One. ~ Dimboble-dubabob III Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, DildorTheDecent said: Really? A 2700X needs dry ice/SS phase to validate and benchmark at 5GHz. I'd be amazed in AMD could get whatever is next to validate 5GHz on chilled let alone benchmark. Heck if the user didn't need to bathe there rads in an ice bucket that would be even more impressive. 5GHz probably isn't going happen unless you've got high end water/ice bucket ready to go. But im talking Ryzen 3000 series with Zen 2 and 7nm. 5ghz is expected to be a valid clocknspeed, though unlikely for stock speeds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, GoldenLag said: But im talking Ryzen 3000 series with Zen 2 and 7nm. 5ghz is expected to be a valid clocknspeed, though unlikely for stock speeds I know TSMC stated that their 7nm process will allow for 5Ghz, but I am going to expect Zen 2 to be around 4.5-4.8 on the turbo boost, that gives it a 5-10% increase over Zen+. I am also expecting a core count bump on Zen 2 of 10-12c on mainstream, by this time next year. So even if intels 8c comes out late this year it will only be the top CPU in mainstream for 6 months, IMO. if you want to annoy me, then join my teamspeak server ts.benja.cc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 25 minutes ago, GoldenLag said: But im talking Ryzen 3000 series with Zen 2 and 7nm. 5ghz is expected to be a valid clocknspeed, I'm basing the estimation of what's already out there. We already know that Ryzen sucks for overclocking. A new and improved process won't make it drastically better. Ryzen 1000 needed LN2 for 5GHz, Ryzen 2000 needed dry ice/SS for 5GHz and Ryzen 3000 will most likely require either chilled or giant radiator in ice baths. They're not going to magically be able to let people do 5GHz on high end air/AIOs/low end water based on the previous results. 25 minutes ago, GoldenLag said: though unlikely for stock speeds Well obviously, lets not be silly here. Our Grace. The Feathered One. He shows us the way. His bob is majestic and shows us the path. Follow unto his guidance and His example. He knows the one true path. Our Saviour. Our Grace. Our Father Birb has taught us with His humble heart and gentle wing the way of the bob. Let us show Him our reverence and follow in His example. The True Path of the Feathered One. ~ Dimboble-dubabob III Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 I wouldn't feel sorry for AMD considering they are the ones with a newer, more efficient architecture and most likely far more competitive prices and production costs. By Q4 we'll probably be able to buy a 12 core threadripper for the same price as an 8 core covfefe lake... but hey, I'd love to be proven wrong. ...'member when Intel wanted 1k for their 8core? That was like... 2 years ago... Don't ask to ask, just ask... please sudo chmod -R 000 /* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 22 minutes ago, DildorTheDecent said: I'm basing the estimation of what's already out there. We already know that Ryzen sucks for overclocking. A new and improved process won't make it drastically better. Ryzen 1000 needed LN2 for 5GHz, Ryzen 2000 needed dry ice/SS for 5GHz and Ryzen 3000 will most likely require either chilled or giant radiator in ice baths. They're not going to magically be able to let people do 5GHz on high end air/AIOs/low end water based on the previous results. Well obviously, lets not be silly here. The 14nm “14LPP” process that Zen (and Zen+) is built on was rated for “>3GHz operation” however the new 7nm “7LP” process that Zen 2 is being built on is rated for “5GHz operation”. They are direct quotes from the Global Foundaries specification documents. Achieving 4GHz on a process that wasn’t designed for it is admirable. The Ryzen architecture could possibly be capable of much higher frequencies, we don’t know and won’t know till we get 7nm. If Zen 2 falls short of 5GHz we know that the architecture is to blame, if it hits or exceeds 5GHz then we will know the process node was to blame for the 4GHz~ wall of Zen/+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 On 6/13/2018 at 3:25 AM, NelizMastr said: Yep. Seeing how the 8086K is already 400+ with 6 cores, I'd expect the 8800K or whatever to cost $500+. yeaaah... you're gonna have to COUGH UP THE DOUGH for intel's 8 core. I hope they use the same motherboard chipsets and not try to pull an INTEL on their consumers... again... Bolivia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 39 minutes ago, DildorTheDecent said: We already know that Ryzen sucks for overclocking. It's not that it sucks for overclocking because its bad though. Rather once it hits the limits of its voltage curve the exponential heat generation is significantly quicker than Intel's, the chip design means much less variance in heat transfer quality than Intel's, and they've jammed the thing with so many sensors that it auto overclocks without significant input needed. So the real reason that it sucks for overclocking is that the software has gotten good enough that it can do so on its own and manual overclocking brings little to no benefit. Thus taking all the fun out of it. Luckily overclockers still have memory to play with because motherboard subtimings are still a complete shitshow. Not including design changes, if 7nm brings down memory latency a bit further and clock speeds up to even 4.8 that puts them at close enough to parity with Intel on everything but the ring bus. If they manage to increase IPC on top of that with Zen 2 then except for the topmost tiers of gaming and with AVX workloads AMD will be on top. Moreover, the cost to themselves will be much, much cheaper because of the chip design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 11 hours ago, Brooksie359 said: While I do see where you are coming from I would also argue that being able to use the same die that is potentially a server die where the margins are high makes the overall cost saving of having the Zen cpu modular much higher than what Intel has. I mean does Intel have may be similar yields? Probably similar but still worse yields. The you factor in that they can't take this die and potentially put it into one of their ultra high-end sever cpus that go for large margins. Well with Zen they can and this makes the overall profit per die therotically much higher than Intel's 6 core die. I mean an 8 core die is going to have a lower yeild and cost more to produce than two 4 core dies so it would make sense that it will be more expensive. The 8 core cpu from Intel will cost more than the 6 core i7 just like the 6 core i7 cost more than the 4 core i7. I would suspect it will go for around 500 dollars. Intel sold the 6 core i7 for a similar price as the 4 cores. Honestly based on Epyc sales rn I would not be surprised if the amount of 6 core dies intel sold in total out classes all of the 8 core dies amd sells. Intel just commands so much more market share at the moment. Make sure to quote me or tag me when responding to me, or I might not know you replied! Examples: Do this: Quote And make sure you do it by hitting the quote button at the bottom left of my post, and not the one inside the editor! Or this: @DocSwag Buy whatever product is best for you, not what product is "best" for the market. Interested in computer architecture? Still in middle or high school? P.M. me! I love computer hardware and feel free to ask me anything about that (or phones). I especially like SSDs. But please do not ask me anything about Networking, programming, command line stuff, or any relatively hard software stuff. I know next to nothing about that. Compooters: Spoiler Desktop: Spoiler CPU: i7 6700k, CPU Cooler: be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 3, Motherboard: MSI Z170a KRAIT GAMING, RAM: G.Skill Ripjaws 4 Series 4x4gb DDR4-2666 MHz, Storage: SanDisk SSD Plus 240gb + OCZ Vertex 180 480 GB + Western Digital Caviar Blue 1 TB 7200 RPM, Video Card: EVGA GTX 970 SSC, Case: Fractal Design Define S, Power Supply: Seasonic Focus+ Gold 650w Yay, Keyboard: Logitech G710+, Mouse: Logitech G502 Proteus Spectrum, Headphones: B&O H9i, Monitor: LG 29um67 (2560x1080 75hz freesync) Home Server: Spoiler CPU: Pentium G4400, CPU Cooler: Stock, Motherboard: MSI h110l Pro Mini AC, RAM: Hyper X Fury DDR4 1x8gb 2133 MHz, Storage: PNY CS1311 120gb SSD + two Segate 4tb HDDs in RAID 1, Video Card: Does Intel Integrated Graphics count?, Case: Fractal Design Node 304, Power Supply: Seasonic 360w 80+ Gold, Keyboard+Mouse+Monitor: Does it matter? Laptop (I use it for school): Spoiler Surface book 2 13" with an i7 8650u, 8gb RAM, 256 GB storage, and a GTX 1050 And if you're curious (or a stalker) I have a Just Black Pixel 2 XL 64gb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 14 hours ago, Armakar said: Little overreaction from everyone.. 14 hours ago, Armakar said: Intel isn't scared at all... Please sir, explain Intel's 28 core 5ghz processor... Bolivia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 8 minutes ago, SupremeGOAT said: Please sir, explain Intel's 28 core 5ghz processor... What does that have to do with fear? Last I knew Epyc isnt taking over the server world which is intels greatest profit. No every product released is a reaction to another one or fear of the other company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 16 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said: What does that have to do with fear? Last I knew Epyc isnt taking over the server world which is intels greatest profit. No every product released is a reaction to another one or fear of the other company. It was fake... the 28 core 5ghz processor was a fraud... do you know why? Bolivia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, SupremeGOAT said: It was fake... the 28 core 5ghz processor was a fraud... do you know why? How was it a fraud? Chilled cooling or not it was a 28 core running at 5ghz, like it was physically shown. That in itself is impressive. Could give two shits whether the product is released or not. Intel controls the server and mobile and AMD is just starting to make a dent. AMD might be shoving cores down peoples throats but single core performance is still more important for the next few years. Neither fear each other like you say. You are just fanboying stupid shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said: That in itself is impressive. No, that's numbers. Without knowing the number of chips that could do that out of say... 10,000, we have no clue how impressive it is. It could be very impressive, or it could be not impressive at all. Especially since they only ran Cinebench once. Now had they run P95 for 20 minutes... You could hit 5.0 on air* if you had a good Sandy Bridge chip so a Skylake server chip being able to do is no surprise and all comes down to numbers. *Not P95 stable, but mine was stable enough for TF2 and SWTOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 1 hour ago, DocSwag said: Intel sold the 6 core i7 for a similar price as the 4 cores. Honestly based on Epyc sales rn I would not be surprised if the amount of 6 core dies intel sold in total out classes all of the 8 core dies amd sells. Intel just commands so much more market share at the moment. Those 4 core dies aren't just used in 8 cores is my point. Those 4 core dies are used in the entire product stack from their 32 core parts all the way down to their 4 core parts. This means the profit from a 4 core die can be anywhere from their 32 core epyc cpu to the r3 1200. That means the potential profit from the 4 core die is quite high when in the 32 core variant where as the same can not be said for the core part Intel makes. The 6 core part isn't being sold as part of their 28 core part or their 18 core part just their 6 core part and below. So when you take this into account it makes sense that the 8 core part Intel is going to make has its highest potential margin at the i7 part making them keen on selling it for more than what you would with a 2700x. Maybe they will use the 8 core part as a 8 core xeon but that would be the highest margin they could get. I would fully expect Intel to price the 8 core as they would any 8 core part and somewhere around 500 seems about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 16 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said: How was it a fraud? Chilled cooling or not it was a 28 core running at 5ghz, like it was physically shown. That in itself is impressive. Could give two shits whether the product is released or not. Intel controls the server and mobile and AMD is just starting to make a dent. AMD might be shoving cores down peoples throats but single core performance is still more important for the next few years. Neither fear each other like you say. You are just fanboying stupid shit. Intel CEO just admitted that AMD is going to take a good chuck of the server market so I would say you are wrong. Intel are clearly aware of the threat AMD poses and while they may not fear AMD they do respect the pressure they are putting on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 3 hours ago, LoganTNZ said: Most people You are right, most people do not need what they buy. A used pc like a 4th gen intel is sufficient for most people. Which costs a couple hundred bucks. They do the same thing with vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 5 minutes ago, ravenshrike said: No, that's numbers. Without knowing the number of chips that could do that out of say... 10,000, we have no clue how impressive it is. It could be very impressive, or it could be not impressive at all. Especially since they only ran Cinebench once. Now had they run P95 for 20 minutes... You could hit 5.0 on air* if you had a good Sandy Bridge chip so a Skylake server chip being able to do is no surprise and all comes down to numbers. *Not P95 stable, but mine was stable enough for TF2 and SWTOR. Im sorry but 1 run or 10,000 runs, still 28 cores at 5ghz. No different than OCers and NO2. Any why the fuck compare a 5ghz sandy bridge 4 core chip to a monster 28 core chip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 58 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said: You are just fanboying stupid shit. Ironic... The 28 core 5hz cpu was faked as an attempt to derail the announcement of TR2. Why would they do that though?... Seems we need to get Scooby and the gang for this one... Bolivia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 13 minutes ago, mynameisjuan said: Im sorry but 1 run or 10,000 runs, still 28 cores at 5ghz. No different than OCers and NO2. Any why the fuck compare a 5ghz sandy bridge 4 core chip to a monster 28 core chip? It's no more impressive than hitting 5Ghz in the first place under normal cooling, which they did back in 2011. After that the probability of finding enough contiguous cores with a stable enough voltage curve is nothing more than a numbers game. Now, if you're looking at 1 in 50 chips, that's pretty damn impressive. If you're looking at 1 in 10,000 it's interesting, but not that impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted June 14, 2018 Just now, SupremeGOAT said: Ironic... The 28 core 5hz cpu was faked as an attempt to derail the announcement of TR2. Why would they do that though?... Seems we need to get Scooby and they gang for this one... Again what proof do you have it was faked? Still have a cinebench score and clock speeds. Dont care what was faked about it. Just now, ravenshrike said: It's no more impressive than hitting 5Ghz in the first place under normal cooling, which they did back in 2011. After that the probability of finding enough contiguous cores with a stable enough voltage curve is nothing more than a numbers game. Now, if you're looking at 1 in 50 chips, that's pretty damn impressive. If you're looking at 1 in 10,000 it's interesting, but not that impressive. So somehow I think you are completely ignoring the 28 core part? Like do you realize how heat scales with cores or are you just lacking knowledge about it? Have you seen how hot intels 18 core gets at 5ghz? The fact that it wasnt done with NO2 is fucking impressive for intel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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