Samsung, Hynix & Micron facing DRAM Class Action suit

[Bananasplit_00]

6 hours ago, ARikozuM said:

Remember when 4GB DDR3 used to cost $50? Pepperidge Farm remembers. 

Remember when it was €50 for 8GB? That's what I paid in 2015 also pretty unrelated but PSUs also seem to have gone up in price, my EVGA G2 650W was €60, now you can't get a decent unit here for under €75

[Master Disaster]

Demand increased by upto 25%, they increased supply by upto 15%. Gee I wonder why there's a shortage.

 

The question the courts need to answer is did these fabs have the capability of increasing productivity more than they did?

[mrchow19910319]

im gonna be honest here, if it is for me, for all those money I can get, I will join the side of monopoly without blink of an eye. 

 

 

[Coaxialgamer]

3 hours ago, Sakkura said:

I got 8GB for that price 5 years ago.

I got ddr3 2400 for the that price back in 2015

[Coaxialgamer]

2 hours ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

Remember when it was €50 for 8GB? That's what I paid in 2015 also pretty unrelated but PSUs also seem to have gone up in price, my EVGA G2 650W was €60, now you can't get a decent unit here for under €75

There's actually a power supply shortage going on too atm

[Bananasplit_00]

1 minute ago, Coaxialgamer said:

There's actually a power supply shortage going on too atm

to me it has seemed more like people are more aware that shit ones blow up your system and will buy the good stuff no matter the cost so they pushed them up. havent heard anything about any shortage and its not like i have seen a single model ever sold out either

[AresKrieger]

So it would seem Samsung made 14.66 billion dollars profit in Q1, that is ~160 million dollars per day, the previous class action suit this law group won was for 300 million split between samsung and hynix (I don't know the ratio but I assume at least a third was Hynix's money), so they can make back the profit from a lawsuit in a day to a day and a half. Now as to what % of their profit is from dram/memory its hard to say, however their profits surged 58% so it's likely a large portion maybe even a majority portion.

 

 

In essence even if they get fined and have to pay out billions they are not inclined to stop due to the reward fir doing so negating any backlash. They'd have to lose about 8.5 billions dollars (assuming the surge is due almost primarily to memory fixing) for them to even care FOR THE QUARTER

[Coaxialgamer]

57 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

to me it has seemed more like people are more aware that shit ones blow up your system and will buy the good stuff no matter the cost so they pushed them up. havent heard anything about any shortage and its not like i have seen a single model ever sold out either

Linus mentioned it in a recent video if i recall correctly 

[Misanthrope]

9 hours ago, dizmo said:

One has to wonder if they'd bother. If supply is stretched like it is now, the companies could easily reduce their supply to Apple and increase it to other areas, while maintaining the same revenue. Apple doesn't want to lose potential profit. It's not like they feel the increase in their bottom line as much anyway with their high profit margins.

This blindly believes the version of events from people that have a vested interest in lying about their supplies and difficulties and could even be a proven fact in court at one point.

 

Sorry but until this is resolved, it is very difficult for me to accept that their supply is 'stretched like it is now' as a result or anything other than their desire to increase prices and not their actual capacity to meet demand.

[Doobeedoo]

Yeah um the prices need to cut in half though. While it's not as issue as graphics cards pricing it's still like twice than it used to be. 

[Okjoek]

13 hours ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

patents are making it much harder to start another dram company.

I feel like patents are  one of a monopolists best friends.

[Guest]

These amateur companies like 'Samsung' 'Hynix' will never learn. Just introduce your products at vastly inflated prices in the first place. 

[Zodiark1593]

17 hours ago, DrMacintosh said:

"Let the market sort itself out!"

 

Regulation is good, this legal pursuit is good. Unchecked corporations are a no-no. 

Might be a little late for stepping in here as these corporations have amassed a great deal of power already. If price fixing is so profitable that even fines are of little concern, what motive would there be to get these corporations to knock it off when they could just cut a check and continue on? The RAM chips are in constant demand, so any punishment that may threaten the supply (or have the corporation threaten an embargo) may cause more undue damage than good.

[ARikozuM]

19 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

(or have the corporation threaten an embargo) 

Let them. Smaller players will undoubtedly pop up. 

[NoOverflow]

No matter if this is true or not,

a fine is not a good punishment against price fixing, a good one is to remove their involved pattent

This way they could be more competitor and they would be less likely to do such things

[Zodiark1593]

1 hour ago, ARikozuM said:

Let them. Smaller players will undoubtedly pop up. 

There's at least one potential player in China, I'm sure (if production is great enough, could singlehandedly bring down pricing). I've doubts that many smaller players will pop up without significant financial backing, and certainly won't resolve RAM pricing in the short or even intermediate term.

 

Apple, I suppose, would have enough financial firepower to jumpstart a memory vendor within a fairly short time (in exchange for preferential treatment) if things got especially dire. Perhaps even Intel could get in on the RAM game.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

Apple, I suppose, would have enough financial firepower to jumpstart a memory vendor within a fairly short time (in exchange for preferential treatment) if things got especially dire. 

Apple doesn't really care about this business. 

[Kamjam21xx]

Idk, i dont think it matters. Probably shouldnt do it... but beats aren't studio headphones and have a horrible frequency response, cost under 15$ to make and are sold for hundreds. 

 

People do it all the time.

[Fred Castellum]

This won't be helping their stock, that's for sure. 

 

[ARikozuM]

1 hour ago, Kamjam21xx said:

Idk, i dont think it matters. Probably shouldnt do it... but beats aren't studio headphones and have a horrible frequency response, cost under 15$ to make and are sold for hundreds. 

The difference here is that Beats isn't a manufacturer AND supplier AND seller for the industry. You HAVE the option to NOT BUY BEATS, you DON'T have the option to not buy Hynix, Crucial, or Samsung RAM as the market has normalized around these prices. 

[Razor512]

Hopefully they can actually get sued and fined a proper amount. with the last DRAM price fixing lawsuit and government fine, they still came out ahead in terms of net income for doing the price fixing than they had lost from the fines and settlement.

 

It does very little to discourage bad behavior from these companies if the fines don't at least take away all additional money they made from the crimes.

[ouroesa]

1.Fine them as shite load.

2.Use that money to start a public corporation to produce own DRAM chips at very low margins.

3. Current manufacturers forced to lower margins.

4. Almost everybody wins.

[LienusLateTips]

china china china china china china china 

 

 

where are you

 

we need help

 

 

 

 

nanya nanya nanya nanya nanya nanya

 

we still remember you

 

please start making consumer ram chips again

[mr moose]

23 hours ago, NoOverflow said:

No matter if this is true or not,

a fine is not a good punishment against price fixing, a good one is to remove their involved pattent

This way they could be more competitor and they would be less likely to do such things

I like this,  the whole idea that if a company can't play fair with in the system that is designed to protect it,  then they can go without the protections of the system.

[Sakkura]

22 hours ago, Zodiark1593 said:

There's at least one potential player in China, I'm sure (if production is great enough, could singlehandedly bring down pricing). I've doubts that many smaller players will pop up without significant financial backing, and certainly won't resolve RAM pricing in the short or even intermediate term.

 

Apple, I suppose, would have enough financial firepower to jumpstart a memory vendor within a fairly short time (in exchange for preferential treatment) if things got especially dire. Perhaps even Intel could get in on the RAM game.

There are at least 3 new players in China, with funding from the Chinese government.

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12681/chinese-dram-industry-spreading-its-wings-two-more-dram-fabs-ready

 

Problem is... they're far behind the major players. Even if their efforts go very smoothly, they're bringing an obsolete process to market. 22nm is a joke when we're talking 2019 mass production. Samsung started mass production at 20nm, a half-node ahead of 22nm, in 2014. Micron and Hynix followed in 2015.