AMD speaks on W10 scheduler and Ryzen

[AlwaysFSX]

1 hour ago, helping said:

This kind of trash is why I don't use this forum anymore and resent the nerd that sent me this link.

It's almost like people get dumber as time goes on.

[MageTank]

I like the part where @zMeul calls Anandtech an invalid source, but uses a random guy with a Ryzen logo as an avatar on their very forums as a source, simply because it agrees with his data. 

 

My personal stance is this: If a source cannot release their full testing methodology (list of all hardware, the speeds of their hardware, and the specific settings used in each test) then I cannot completely trust it as a valid source. In a lot of the CPU tests being used to test IPC, memory tends to play a very dramatic part in them. Who is to say the "14%" number you keep on quoting zMeul, doesn't come from the increased bandwidth/lower latency of DDR4? We won't know for certain, because we have no idea what memory was used.

 

Call Anandtech's numbers wrong all you like, but several sources match their Haswell to Broadwell IPC numbers (3-4%), and if you think Skylake/Kaby Lake yielded a 10% IPC boost over Broadwell, you are out of your mind. 

[Hunter259]

2 hours ago, Tomsen said:

Its quite simple. Because each CCX has its own L3 cache.

So the cores in CCX[0] can't see the cache in CCX[1]. [0] being the first and [1] being the second CCX cluster.

 

Except for the fact that core 2 quads were using MCM whereas ryzen is a single die.

It is not impossible for microsoft to optimize for zen architecture. For example, keep all the processes spawned from one program on a single CCX.

Ryzen is NOT a single die. 

 

[HalGameGuru]

12 minutes ago, Hunter259 said:

-snip-

I'm not sure you were paying attention to what he was saying in that video...

Spoiler

 

[Tenelia]

Isn't that guy basically another Patrick waiting for a ban? I was hoping intelligent discourse here, but whenever I see such a thing...

[Dabombinable]

Knew it. Ryzen performs as it should, isn't a repeat of Bulldozer, and Windows 10 is still ass.

[Techstorm970]

2 minutes ago, Tenelia said:

Isn't that guy basically another Patrick waiting for a ban? I was hoping intelligent discourse here, but whenever I see such a thing...

I've heard a lot of stuff about this "Patrick" guy being awful, but what exactly was he doing that got him kicked off LTT?  I've personally never encountered him, and I'm curious.

[Dabombinable]

5 hours ago, zMeul said:

except it's ~14% 

Ryzen on DDR4 does less than Haswell IPC .. or you did forgot that

Dat DDR3 1333 used with my 4790K......

[stconquest]

7 minutes ago, techstorm970 said:

I've heard a lot of stuff about this "Patrick" guy being awful, but what exactly was he doing that got him kicked off LTT?  I've personally never encountered him, and I'm curious.

Stubborn =/= awful... mostly.  Man was he stubborn, but I like to think the forums were more interesting with him around.  His ego would not let him be proven wrong.  He was not a bad guy, not with any interaction I had with him.

 

The first time I argued with him, I kept calling him "Mr. Masters of Computer Science"... he was formally trained as an engineer of sorts.

[Dabombinable]

36 minutes ago, Hunter259 said:

Ryzen is NOT a single die. 

 

Which means that the Core 2 uads could happen all over again-1 die being better binned than the other, and running 10^oC cooler.

[leadeater]

25 minutes ago, stconquest said:

Stubborn =/= awful... mostly.  Man was he stubborn, but I like to think the forums were more interesting with him around.  His ego would not let him be proven wrong.  He was not a bad guy, not with any interaction I had with him.

 

The first time I argued with him, I kept calling him "Mr. Masters of Computer Science"... he was formally trained as an engineer of sorts.

Pretty much this. Intelligent guy which is the type of person I like talking to, unfortunately lacking in the social interaction and courtesy area.

 

Also he was educated in Computer Science, specifically in software development field, he wasn't all that knowledgeable in the hardware aspects of things and that is where most of his arguments stemmed from. Mostly in the high-end enterprise and high performance computing hardware discussions which is a field I directly work in being a Systems Engineer in an IT department of a university.

[zMeul]

does anyone have a block diagram for Ryzen?

I'm searching for something rather detailed, like the one for Bulldozer:

Spoiler

 

[Guest Darth Revan]

4 minutes ago, zMeul said:

does anyone have a block diagram for Ryzen?

I'm searching for something rather detailed, like the one for Bulldozer:

  Hide contents

 

As far as I know they only showed this:

[zMeul]

5 minutes ago, Darth Revan said:

As far as I know they only showed this:

I know that one, it's shit 

[RagnarokDel]

8 minutes ago, Darth Revan said:

As far as I know they only showed this:

The lines on the cache are not aligned. *triggered*

[Phate.exe]

57 minutes ago, Tenelia said:

Isn't that guy basically another Patrick waiting for a ban? I was hoping intelligent discourse here, but whenever I see such a thing...

Nahh, zMeul seems to be pretty okay on topics that aren't AMD-related.  He gets into it with people, argues points hard, and tends to select the "AMD are morons" conclusion in any way he can with the data given, but typically keeps the arguments on-topic.  zMeul provides links to support his arguments.  I might disagree with his conclusions, but he's a sane person with an odd grudge.

 

Patrick made genuinely absurd claims, and would argue them to death, often making additional equally absurd claims in an attempt to either support his point or deflect entirely.  Also liked to whip his education out and attempt to belittle people.  I think the best example was the Bristol Ridge delid thread, where he was adament that the CPU in the image was actually an old xeon model that didn't actually exist.  He'd also cite unverifiable sources like "my contacts that work in ______ chip fab" say Ryzen will never clock above X.Y GHz (somewhere in the low 3's I think).

[Dabombinable]

13 minutes ago, Phate.exe said:

Nahh, zMeul seems to be pretty okay on topics that aren't AMD-related.  He gets into it with people, argues points hard, and tends to select the "AMD are morons" conclusion in any way he can with the data given, but typically keeps the arguments on-topic.  zMeul provides links to support his arguments.  I might disagree with his conclusions, but he's a sane person with an odd grudge.

 

Patrick made genuinely absurd claims, and would argue them to death, often making additional equally absurd claims in an attempt to either support his point or deflect entirely.  Also liked to whip his education out and attempt to belittle people.  I think the best example was the Bristol Ridge delid thread, where he was adament that the CPU in the image was actually an old xeon model that didn't actually exist.  He'd also cite unverifiable sources like "my contacts that work in ______ chip fab" say Ryzen will never clock above X.Y GHz (somewhere in the low 3's I think).

Then there was "pirate this expensive textbook if you can't buy it".

[Fetzie]

4 hours ago, zMeul said:

if you have that kind of workload, it should be no problem to use a Intel Xtreme CPU ...

If you have that kind of workload then you will do better to buy two ten core Xeons, a motherboard and ram for the price of the 6950x.

[Dabombinable]

Just now, Fetzie said:

If you have that kind of workload then you will do better to buy two ten core Xeons, a motherboard and ram for the price of the 6950x.

Even older, second hand Xeons.

[zMeul]

Just now, Fetzie said:

If you have that kind of workload then you will do better to buy two ten core Xeons, a motherboard and ram for the price of the 6950x.

not if the workload is CPU core speed dependent

haven't you watched the Linus video already? he put a Xeon and saw crap performance, put the Xtreme chip and saw very good perf

[Fetzie]

Just now, Dabombinable said:

Even older, second hand Xeons.

And you would be getting ECC memory support (like on Ryzen, incidentally - z270 and X99 don't get that)

[Hunter259]

2 hours ago, HalGameGuru said:

I'm not sure you were paying attention to what he was saying in that video...

  Hide contents

 

My apologies. No they are a single die but the way that looks to me is when data is transferred between CCX's there is going to be an increase in latency just due to design.

[Nergale]

I got an i5 4670k.

 

Cause I'm poor.

[Bouzoo]

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

Pretty much this. Intelligent guy which is the type of person I like talking to, unfortunately lacking in the social interaction and courtesy area.

 

Also he was educated in Computer Science, specifically in software development field, he wasn't all that knowledgeable in the hardware aspects of things and that is where most of his arguments stemmed from. Mostly in the high-end enterprise and high performance computing hardware discussions which is a field I directly work in being a Systems Engineer in an IT department of a university.

Don't get ahead of yourself, patrick was only proven wrong twice here and that says enough, be would bring that up everytime you dared to tell him you've proven him wrong. Statistics matter. And he was the type that would never ignore your posts. Especially when you ask him for the 3rd time in 6 months to reply to your post, you were probably not worthy of his time. 

[leadeater]

12 minutes ago, Bouzoo said:

Don't get ahead of yourself, patrick was only proven wrong twice here and that says enough, be would bring that up everytime you dared to tell him you've proven him wrong. Statistics matter. And he was the type that would never ignore your posts. Especially when you ask him for the 3rd time in 6 months to reply to your post, you were probably not worthy of his time. 

Well I don't exactly keep count of anyone been proven wrong ever, what would be the point of that? Anyway I know of more than two times he's been completely wrong, but so what no body is correct all the time. I'm not even sure why that even matters?

 

Intelligence or self belief in ones point of view does not excuse anyone from following the Community Standards, particularly in his case being civil to all members of the forum and not constantly trying to belittle everyone.

 

And just so you know I actually advocated for him to not be permanently banned.

 

Edit:

Take it to PM if you want to discuss it further, not exactly on topic to the thread.