TTL's R9 290X Review.

[ACatWithThumbs]

What I always wonder is where does AMD GPUs loos all the peformance??
Nvidia GPUs have less compute power on Paper and still are on par or even better in most cases.
GTX TITAN 4,5Tflops vs R9-290X 5,6Tflops.
GTX680 3Tflops vs HD7970 3,79 Flops.
GTX670 2,5Tlops vs HD6970 2,7 Tflops

Why is that?
 

[Opsilon]

GPU boost 2.0 on 780's is way different than it is on your 670.

i know, it has a 3rd factor, voltage, this is locked on 600 cards, but the throttling point is the same...

[DeViLzzz]

I am green team but basically I have to say if you don't care about physX, can buy waterblocks for these cards, can buy a 4K monitor and can buy multiple cards then do it.  AMD R9 290X performs well but you got to make sure you deal with those temps.

[Ineko]

I'm sorry, but OC3D are known "AMD haters", i watched few videos by them long time ago, did few dislikes, and moved on, not worth my time.

 

No not really, he was one of the first to say that the 7970 was just as good as a 680 and better for the price. At the time everyone was comparing to a 670 and saying buy a 680 if you wan't something high performance.

[Saladin]

No not really, he was one of the first to say that the 7970 was just as good as a 680 and better for the price. At the time everyone was comparing to a 670 and saying buy a 680 if you wan't something high performance.

Not to mention that if you watch his followup video posted today he mentions that he is currently sponsored by AMD not Nvidia and remember that in his personal rig (Orca) he has AMD cards.

[ltguy]

I thought the video was spot on. I am impressed with the R9 290x, its alot better than i thought and the price is a pleasant suprise. However, 95C is just not a temp that is okay for 24/7 operation regardless of whether the silicon can handle it or not. My case cant handle it, my room cant handle it, the paint on the wall behind my case cant handle it. I limit my titans to 70C and i'd do the same for the R9 290x. I think amd wanted to have a card to contend with the GTX 780 so bad that they gave it an unreasonable power and temperature envelope.

[Saladin]

I thought the video was spot on. I am impressed with the R9 290x, its alot better than i thought and the price is a pleasant suprise. However, 95C is just not a temp that is okay for 24/7 operation regardless of whether the silicon can handle it or not. My case cant handle it, my room cant handle it, the paint on the wall behind my case cant handle it. I limit my titans to 70C and i'd do the same for the R9 290x. I think amd wanted to have a card to contend with the GTX 780 so bad that they gave it an unreasonable power and temperature envelope.

95c makes me worry about a heat-pipe failure or some other run-away thermal event (read explosion).

[beebskadoo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OHKWMgBhvA

This is TTL's most recent video.

He clarifies his stance on the 290X. Everything he says is true.

[theABCshop]

Wow, it must perform so well on 4K resolution...Because EVERYBODY totally has a 4K monitor/setup.

[Tall Gora]

In my opinion Tiny Tom Logan gave a fair review and is taking a lot of flak for it (in the interest of openness I currently have a 660 ti and was planing on possibly upgrading to the 290x, though I will now be at least waiting until the 780 ti comes out to see if there are any price drops on either side). His review points out what other reviewers are pointing out:

1. The 290x is stupid hot (in my opinion 95c with 10+ min to cool down to idle temps is unacceptable)

2. The 290x is essentially overclocked out of the box

3. The 290x is on par with the reference non-overclocked 780 (slightly better in some games/benches, slightly worse in others)(an overclocked/non-reference 780 destroys the 290x)

4. The 4K numbers AMD has shown are essentially pointless given 1) the cost of 4K monitors pared with the low usage 2) the low frame rates at 4K resolutions

5. Mantle is fine but we have no games with it yet and no idea what the performance increases will be or what the adoption rates will be

I agree with TTL that this card performs well and is a decent price to performance, however TTL as with many (myself included) hoped/expected the 290x to smoke the 780, that isn't the case. Given that 1) the 290x is essentially on par with a year old piece of silicon (gk110 was originally planed as the 680) and 2) that there will be no non-reference cards at launch and 3) that Nvidia is coming out with the 780 ti (I'm hoping for a price drop of the 780 along with it) I view the 290x card as honestly underwhelming. Its good, but not great. We, the consumers, need the 290x to smoke the 780 and scare Nvidia into innovating, this did not happen. Just my two cents.

a perfectly accurate description and these are my thoughts. I am honestly underwhelmed and hoped for more. But kudos to AMD for their efforts, this will sway the tides slightly.

[pyromaniac]

AMD is grabbing at straws if they are banking on "BUT BUT ITS BETTER AT 4K GUIZ" Seriously... 99% of 4k owners will have the cash and will already have dual 780's or Titans in their rigs already. I Really wanted this card to blow the GK110 out of the water but the sad fact is that it doesn't. Theres no headroom for Overclocking, its on the limit. I am Disappoint AMD

[ASFfergie]

I (like everyone else it seems) expected and wanted the R9 290X to crush everything else, but the fact is AMD has no where near the amount of research and development money as Nvidia has and it struggling to keep up. We have seen it before, AMD cannot compete on an architecture level so they compensate by increasing the clock speed, making the cards cheaper and other "quick fixes" in order to compete with the big boys.

 

I think a lot of AMD fans saw this for themselves in TTL's review and didn't like it. I have always looked to TTL for good honest reviews because in the past he doesn't care about sponsorship he doesn't care what the manufacturer will think, he gives a fair and honest account. Do I think Nvidia has paid him off? Of course it possible but if have no reason to doubt him, just look at what happened with him and asus and you can see that he isnt afraid to see what he thinks

[eshbop]

Did people really expect this to destroy the 780? When was the last time Nvidia and AMD had same generation, equal tier products with more than 10% performance difference? You don't think that maybe they do this on purpose?

 

This GPU is 20% smaller than GK110, with equal performance. AMD didn't have the luxury of a contract that would of paid much of the expenses toward GK110 (for that Titan supercomputer) and therefore the ability to flog off all the GPUs that didn't make the cut. What would of they got out of a Titan sized die? Considering the time frame they've had to formulate an answer to this I think it's pretty impressive.

[Keystone Nyan Cat]

In my opinion Tiny Tom Logan gave a fair review and is taking a lot of flak for it (in the interest of openness I currently have a 660 ti and was planing on possibly upgrading to the 290x, though I will now be at least waiting until the 780 ti comes out to see if there are any price drops on either side). His review points out what other reviewers are pointing out:

1. The 290x is stupid hot (in my opinion 95c with 10+ min to cool down to idle temps is unacceptable)

2. The 290x is essentially overclocked out of the box

3. The 290x is on par with the reference non-overclocked 780 (slightly better in some games/benches, slightly worse in others)(an overclocked/non-reference 780 destroys the 290x)

4. The 4K numbers AMD has shown are essentially pointless given 1) the cost of 4K monitors pared with the low usage 2) the low frame rates at 4K resolutions

5. Mantle is fine but we have no games with it yet and no idea what the performance increases will be or what the adoption rates will be

I agree with TTL that this card performs well and is a decent price to performance, however TTL as with many (myself included) hoped/expected the 290x to smoke the 780, that isn't the case. Given that 1) the 290x is essentially on par with a year old piece of silicon (gk110 was originally planed as the 680) and 2) that there will be no non-reference cards at launch and 3) that Nvidia is coming out with the 780 ti (I'm hoping for a price drop of the 780 along with it) I view the 290x card as honestly underwhelming. Its good, but not great. We, the consumers, need the 290x to smoke the 780 and scare Nvidia into innovating, this did not happen. Just my two cents.

I hope TTL reads this! This would be perfect for Rushkit!

[CoffeeBlack]

i know, it has a 3rd factor, voltage, this is locked on 600 cards, but the throttling point is the same...

Voltage is not the only difference. And my MSI 670 card could actually change the voltages. GPU boost 2.0 is based more on a temperature target. The original GPU boost had no such functionality.

[Saladin]

I hope TTL reads this! This would be perfect for Rushkit!

Thanks, I hope he sees it too, that would make me smile. I really wanted the 290x to be everything its been hyped to be. I really don't like this team AMD vs team Nvidia stuff given that it really is team AMD/Nvidia vs team Consumer. If we, the consumer, want better graphics cards (and we do, oh yes we do) we need competition, we need a strong AMD and a strong Nvidia, we need them to push each other. I wish AMD had come out with a card that was mind bogglingly powerful that could run even the most demanding games at well above 60 FPS at greater than 1080p resolution with no stuttering or tearing, but it didn't happen. Its still a good card, however in my opinion it is not a good enough card to make Nvidia rush to develop something new so they can compete.

[Derangel]

95c makes me worry about a heat-pipe failure or some other run-away thermal event (read explosion).

 

The thermal limit of the cards is well above 95c according to AMD. They are not going to release a card that is set up to run at 95c the entire time you are gaming or benching without making sure everything on it won't die spontanously from the heat.

[Saladin]

The thermal limit of the cards is well above 95c according to AMD. They are not going to release a card that is set up to run at 95c the entire time you are gaming or benching without making sure everything on it won't die spontanously from the heat.

I'm sure thats true, doesn't mean that those temps are concerning 5c higher and water boils at normal pressure. I don't want that anywhere near my rig.

[beebskadoo]

The thermal limit of the cards is well above 95c according to AMD. They are not going to release a card that is set up to run at 95c the entire time you are gaming or benching without making sure everything on it won't die spontanously from the heat.

apparently that isn't the case or these cards would over clock better. 50mhz over stock clock is what you would expect to get with these cards. And any higher you run into major stability issues. These cards run too hot to do anything with the stock cooler. But 95 is the Max.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk

[beebskadoo]

Just because it can run at 95 doesn't mean it's good for the rest of your system. Think about 95C inside your case. That means your CPU will run hotter.

Think about these cards in crossfire... What a nightmare.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk

[mr moose]

Just because it can run at 95 doesn't mean it's good for the rest of your system. Think about 95C inside your case. That means your CPU will run hotter.

Think about these cards in crossfire... What a nightmare.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk

95^oC is almost hot enough to boil water.  Especially if you are above sea level.

[Derangel]

apparently that isn't the case or these cards would over clock better. 50mhz over stock clock is what you would expect to get with these cards. And any higher you run into major stability issues. These cards run too hot to do anything with the stock cooler. But 95 is the Max.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk

 

AMD set the throttling threshhold at 95c. Right now there is no way to change that. It would be increadibly stupid of AMD not to design the card to withstand higher temps than the driver set threshhold. If the card could only handle a max of 95c then it wouldn't live long considering it is set up to run at 95c all the time. Having the thermal limit of the cards be much higher takes care of that problem because then the cards can handle the high heat. Nvidia did the same with the 480, which was a card that on a stock cooler hit above 90c. The reason they don't overclock well is because the stock cooler is designed to do just that, run the card at stock settings. The stock cooler is clearly one of the areas AMD cut corners on to reach their desired price point.

[Saladin]

AMD set the throttling threshhold at 95c. Right now there is no way to change that. It would be increadibly stupid of AMD not to design the card to withstand higher temps than the driver set threshhold. If the card could only handle a max of 95c then it wouldn't live long considering it is set up to run at 95c all the time. Having the thermal limit of the cards be much higher takes care of that problem because then the cards can handle the high heat. Nvidia did the same with the 480, which was a card that on a stock cooler hit above 90c. The reason they don't overclock well is because the stock cooler is designed to do just that, run the card at stock settings. The stock cooler is clearly one of the areas AMD cut corners on to reach their desired price point.

The issue I have with the 95c temp isn't just that its the temperature of the card, but that the card is in my rig. The card would sit right over my chip set, it would effect temps in the case, possibly CPU core temps, drive temps, ram temps, ect. 95c may not kill the GPU but it isn't 'healthy' for the computer as a whole. Until we see some crazy efficient non-reference cards (that some how deal with exhausting that heat) or put that card underwater I have no interest in the 290x, the thermals are just unacceptable. Just because the card is stable at 95c doesn't mean that the back of the card isn't stupid hot or that all the heat is exhausted out the back, it doesn't work that way. A card that runs at 95c WILL effect the temps of your other components, the heat has to go somewhere, think about the case temps after 2-3 hours of hardcore gaming (personally terrifying).

[kuddlesworth9419]

The thermal limit of the cards is well above 95c according to AMD. They are not going to release a card that is set up to run at 95c the entire time you are gaming or benching without making sure everything on it won't die spontanously from the heat.

But what if you want to overclock that card. At the moment it would be a stupid idea to overclock the 290x unless you want temps in the range of 100C.

[DeViLzzz]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGZom6R4DiI

 

... and anxiously awaiting the video made for R9 290X