Microsoft Phones Still losing money despite new devices :(

[Sauron]

The problem is not with the phones, it's with windows. Solve app scarcety and open it up a bit and they'll sell better.

[AlTech]

The problem is not with the phones, it's with windows. Solve app scarcety and open it up a bit and they'll sell better.

I'll have to disagree and say 

 

1. It's the devs

2. More Ram and storage doesn't hurt anybody

[Bouzoo]

UM? Here are Google replacements (And what they replace):

Onedrive (Google Drive)

Metro Tube - Costs $1 or $2 but it's better than stock youtueb desktop (Youtube)

Spotify/Pandora/Beats Music (Google Music)

GMAPs+/Here Maps/Here Drive+ (Google Maps)

 

For a video player there's VLC

Browser - Opera Mini

 

TBH I never use a third of what you listed.

 There's probably an unofficial version of it but again it might be really low quality.

 

I use most apps that he uses so I'll feel free to comment. 

One drive is a big no for me when compared to Google Drive and Dropbox. I don't use it on pc and wouldn't on phone as well. 

Vlc on phones is not as good as MX, hell it's not even close. Actually I've to find a player that's even close MX. 

Haven't tried Opera so won't go there.

Here maps are good.

I've got problems when I connect my brother in law's 930 to my car (older LG stereo) and the android Music player is the only one that works as intended and I've bought  Poweramp and tried few other players. 

But the big ones are Wolfram Alpha that saves my life on a daily basis since I'm a math student, and Anki does the same for my gf who studies japanese among other things.

And I agree with him on many other maps. WP has so much potential, if only MS would do more for apps. 

[AlTech]

I use most apps that he uses so I'll feel free to comment. 

One drive is a big no for me when compared to Google Drive and Dropbox. I don't use it on pc and wouldn't on phone as well. 

Vlc on phones is not as good as MX, hell it's not even close. Actually I've to find a player that's even close MX. 

Haven't tried Opera so won't go there.

Here maps are good.

I've got problems when I connect my brother in law's 930 to my car (older LG stereo) and the android Music player is the only one that works as intended and I've bought  Poweramp and tried few other players. 

But the big ones are Wolfram Alpha that saves my life on a daily basis since I'm a math student, and Anki does the same for my gf who studies japanese among other things.

And I agree with him on many other maps. WP has so much potential, if only MS would do more for apps. 

They are. They basically made a clone of every API that app devs use on Android and IOS.That's how the compatibility works.

[Sauron]

I'll have to disagree and say 

 

1. It's the devs

2. More Ram and storage doesn't hurt anybody

 

it doesn't matter whose fault it is, if they don't fix the problems they'll never make a profit. I would not buy a microsoft phone at this stage, as much as I find them well built and functional.

[iHardware Shelden]

It's to bad not a single person wants to develop for Windows Phone. Really is a great operating system and I still think it's funny the camera on my phone is still better than most flagship Android & IOS devices... and it is almost 4 years old, ancient in terms of phones for most people

[AlexGoesHigh]

That's what happens when you only released 2 low end phones in march and nothing else, also that they haven't update the OS since early last year until they release 10 next month.

 

The only reason i want ths platform to grow is due to Google an Apple foothold of the market, so you either have to love Apple or not get annoyed by the retarded sluggishness of Android which i am pretty annoyed about and just having used Android for a bit longer that year, i swear if could afford a 6s+ i would buy it, despite me not liking iOS at all, but Android problems have me fed up.

 

MS has to get its shit together and stop rebooting the damn thing and instead improve on it, until its actually better that the competitors.

[GoodBytes]

Windows 10 Mobile isn't a reboot. All Windows Phone 8 apps works on it.

[AlTech]

That's what happens when you only released 2 low end phones in march and nothing else, also that they haven't update the OS since early last year until they release 10 next month.

 

The only reason i want ths platform to grow is due to Google an Apple foothold of the market, so you either have to love Apple or not get annoyed by the retarded sluggishness of Android which i am pretty annoyed about and just having used Android for a bit longer that year, i swear if could afford a 6s+ i would buy it, despite me not liking iOS at all, but Android problems have me fed up.

 

MS has to get its shit together and stop rebooting the damn thing and instead improve on it, until its actually better that the competitors.

Excuse me but I didn't see Google or Apple putting Windows NT kernel (or equivalent) on a phone. That in itself is impressive! It runs a lot of stuff under the hood that Windows 8 and 8.1 does.

[LAwLz]

UM? Here are Google replacements (And what they replace):

Onedrive (Google Drive)

I have accounts on all three (Dropbox, OneDrive and Google Drive). The thing is that I collaborate with lots of people on different projects, and when I do that I have to use whichever service the group uses. I can't tell 5 other people "hey stop using Google Drive because my phone can't use that. Let's use OneDrive instead". So no, OneDrive is not an option to having OneDrive and Google Drive on my phone.

 

Metro Tube - Costs $1 or $2 but it's better than stock youtueb desktop (Youtube)

Seems nice but I would rather have an official one, that's free.

 

Spotify/Pandora/Beats Music (Google Music)

Not the same. I use the free version of Google Music and just upload all the songs I want. Pretty sure you can't do that for free with the services you recommended.

 

GMAPs+/Here Maps/Here Drive+ (Google Maps)

Seems like a good replacement.

 

For a video player there's VLC

Not sure if it has the features I want but it might be good.

 

Browser - Opera Mini

lol no...

 

And that leaves a huge amount of apps that I still would not have any alternative to.

[AlTech]

I have accounts on all three (Dropbox, OneDrive and Google Drive). The thing is that I collaborate with lots of people on different projects, and when I do that I have to use whichever service the group uses. I can't tell 5 other people "hey stop using Google Drive because my phone can't use that. Let's use OneDrive instead". So no, OneDrive is not an option to having OneDrive and Google Drive on my phone.

 

Seems nice but I would rather have an official one, that's free.

 

Not the same. I use the free version of Google Music and just upload all the songs I want. Pretty sure you can't do that for free with the services you recommended.

 

Seems like a good replacement.

 

Not sure if it has the features I want but it might be good.

 

lol no...

 

And that leaves a huge amount of apps that I still would not have any alternative to.

You can try Groove Music on android and decide if you like it. It can replace Google Music and is cross platform (Windows, Windows Mobile, Android and IOS)

 

Edit: there is an official ish app. It's just really terrible and made by MS because Google told them they weren't making one. It's basically a web wrapper.

 

As for Google Drive and Dropbox. TBH if i'm sharing stuff I use my laptop/desktop for that, i don't use my phone for it.

[AlexGoesHigh]

Excuse me but I didn't see Google or Apple putting Windows NT kernel (or equivalent) on a phone. That in itself is impressive! It runs a lot of stuff under the hood that Windows 8 and 8.1 does.

Apple uses their fork of Unix and Google uses Linux and i admit that is indeed impressive they put full NT since 8 but that doesn't solve the issues the platform currently has.

[Elapo]

Too bad, they're actually really good devices.

 

I can't switch easily though, I make too much use of android and google's services.

[atrash]

I think Microsoft is more into the long run game. They will continue to sell cheap low/mid end phones just fine in developing countries but as far as flagship goes, I think they are trying to do something like the Surface model where they showcase the usability of the OS and maybe great id (surface phone maybe?) and get the interest for other OEMs to start filling the various price ranges and at the same time try to include those core/unique windows features (something like Continuum,Windows Hello etc).

 

Get the core apps right and make the usability seamless across Windows products and I'm sure the interest will start to come in.

[ShadowCaptain]

Not him but here are some apps I use that are missing on Windows Phone

 

This really is my issue with Windows Phone too, I really really like the OS and layout, and the devices are good too

 

 

But all the apps (and importantly games for me) are just not available, therefore I just have no use for the device

[dmegatool]

Been using a Windows Phone for the past years and now I'm on a Zenfone 2. I really liked my experience with a WP phone. Reasons I switched was a price vs hardware (there's no equivalent of a 250$, 5,5" 4GB Ram with sd card slot) and the apps. 

 

I don't need a lot of apps but the fact that Google is boycotting WP is a real problem. I was using myTube and it's better than any version of Youtube I've used. But my mom ain't gotta understand what's going on and when she'll search for youtube on the app store, she'll expect an official youtube app. Can't believe Google took down the app developped by Microsoft, what a dick move. 

 

But it's not just Google. The facebook app is subpar if you compare to other OS. It's not even funny. 

 

All in all, people use app when they use the phone. They're on Facebook, twitter, they're playing games. People coming from other OS will be disapointed by the versions they get. They won't be blaming Facebook or Google or whatever dev... it's Microsoft fault. I hope that with Windows 10, their claim that it's easy to port Android app will get more quality on the store. Because it's not just about the number or availability, it's quality.  

[GoodBytes]

The problem with Windows Phone is that it is a chicken and egg issue.

-> Windows Phone is really easy to program for. Like REALLY EASY. Not only you can use programming languages like C# (or C/C++ for games for max performance), but you can even do HTML/CSS/JavaScript apps with impressive performance and looks nice where you would never know it is made in such language.

-> You have the phone and you have the hardware. Even specialty phones like dual Sim slot card. Microsoft has everything in terms of hardware. For example the Lumia 950/950XL, has: wireless charging USB Type-C, powerful specs, OELD screen, Gorilla glass, a touch screen that works with gloves, a really good camera, big battery, replaceable battery, micro-SD card slot, super fast charging, using it a desktop computer, it has everything.

-> The OS. It has the OS. It can run on hardware that makes Android crawl, yet it provides you with this iPhone like OS navigation experience in terms of responsiveness (until you actually start apps, those would obviously take time to load). Everything is smooth. It handles multi-threading very well as well in comparison to Android.

The problem:

-> No one gets the phone due to lack of apps. And there is no apps because there is lack of user base. And it doesn't help that the users don't want to give other apps a try, say Bing Map, or Here Map, and just want Google Maps, for example.

So basically, Windows Phone caters to people like me, people who don't give a damn about the apps and games on it. It sees a Smart phone as a phone first. They see it as a device to call, text, listen to music and take pictures. And it has Microsoft ecosystem surrounding it: Office, OneDrive, Grove Music, Maps, etc. And it doesn't help for the fact that you need to buy the phone in full as virtually no carrier wants it, as Microsoft wants to impose its own update system like Apple, and not have the mess that Windows Phone 7 and 8 and all Android users faces (and Blackberry). So Windows Phone is not going to be a phone that will get the masses any time soon. And when you get a Windows Phone you should expect that.

The new strategy from Microsoft is simple:

-> Offer the best phone (check), with the best experience of its OS (check), and offer Windows 10 for free for a great mass of people, push tablets running Windows 10.

Windows 10 for free boost market share, and important thing as Windows 10 as this new framework called Universal Apps. Apps that runs on Windows 10, Windows 10 Mobile, Windows 10 IoT, XBox One, and HoloLens. 1x app, runs everywhere with little to no code change 9basically to fine tune the GUI if you want, but not needed). Pushing Windows 10 tablets, means there is a need for universal apps. Having universal apps means more apps on Windows 10 Mobile.

So basically, a slow process, but coming process. But don't expect a miracle in 1-2 years.

[QwarkDreams]

Not him but here are some apps I use that are missing on Windows Phone:

• Alternative browsers (not just IE reskins)
• Anki (a proper app, not just an app that opens the browser version)
• A good file Explorer (the ones I have found are nowhere near for example ES File Explorer in terms of features and design)
• An app for my bank (Nordea)
• Swish (there is an app for it but it's plagued with issues)
• Atarashii (or any good MAL app. The ones in the WP store are terrible)
• Prisjakt (the one in the store has been abandoned and does not work anymore)
• AirDroid
• A good video player. To be fair, I haven't looked through all of them and since I no longer have a WP device I can't do it either. But please bear in mind that I am very picky when it comes to video players, and use fairly obscure formats like heavily styled soft-subs, 10bit HEVC and H.264. I use MX Player on Android and there is a Windows Phone version, but it seems far inferior to the Android version.
• TV.nu (Again there is an app for it but it got a terrible rating and as it turns out, it's just a wrapper for the website, not an actual native app)
• SwiftKey
• RCCDroid or any app that lets me plug my phone into my DSLR and control it.
• Vessel
• Fallout Shelter
• Hearthstone
• Wolfram Alpha
• WiFi Analyser

 

 

Then we got all the Google stuff like:

• Google Drive
• Google Maps
• Google Music
• YouTube
• Google Keep

 

 

On top of that I would still need to use Android on my tablet since Windows tablets are God awful for the things I use my tablet for.

And before you start linking me to apps that almost does what I want, please bear in mind that I will ignore apps you suggest that are inferior to the ones I am already using on Android. The apps I use as replacements needs to be as good or better than the ones I am already using. Otherwise there is no point in spending the time and money changing platform.

 

Don't forget to mention that you can't replace stock apps. I mean, you can, but not in the sense of "I prefer to open this stuff with this app" (setting default apps), that's not possible (unlike on Android).

[GoodBytes]

The facebook app is subpar if you compare to other OS. It's not even funny.

Facebook seams interested in Windows 10. They have been working hard on their universal apps.

It's reviews seams to be increasing lately if you check the Windows 10 app store.

[GoodBytes]

Don't forget to mention that you can't replace stock apps. I mean, you can, but not in the sense of "I prefer to open this stuff with this app" (setting default apps), that's not possible (unlike on Android).

I believe you can do this with Windows 10 Mobile now.

[dizmo]

The headline isn't quite accurate, considering the new devices haven't even been fully released yet. You can't blame their low sales on that.

 

 

Nah. We're talking 5 million less Lumias sold this year compared to 9.3 million last year.

People were likely waiting for the new phones that were coming out. The old ones were rather...lackluster compared to these new ones.
 

Yeah. I own one and it's awesome.

 

Go to a Microsoft store near you and try one it. Once you get the hang of them, They're quite awesome.

The phones are awesome, for sure. The OS...not so much. I prefer Android as it's more customizable.

Too bad they don't have a better app base. I love the hardware. The 950XL is a seriously sexy device, especially with the aftermarket leather backs you can get for it.

 

Don't worry dude! Google Spies on you more than Microsoft! And what apps are you missing?

 

Everything i need except a few apps are on WP.

Apps/things I'm missing: Snapchat, A transport app for my local area, Octopus and Octopus sim support (in my country we use a payment system called OCtopus it's essentially like an oyster card) and Youtube.

 

 

Eh, I wouldn't say that they have everything. I see other people have already pointed out the holes, but I'd like to add that the quality of the apps available on Windows Phone is also lacking.

Take for instance the eBay app. It's a million times better on Android. Just looks cleaner, moves faster, has more options. WP isn't the only one to have issues with this, as Blackberry has the same problems even though their apps are supposed ports.

 

Then there's banking. I use my banking app constantly, and they don't have a WP one. I imagine that's a huge pitfall for most.

 

The problem with Windows Phone is that it is a chicken and egg issue.
-> Windows Phone is really easy to program for. Like REALLY EASY. Not only you can use programming languages like C# (or C/C++ for games for max performance), but you can even do HTML/CSS/JavaScript apps with impressive performance and looks nice where you would never know it is made in such language.

-> You have the phone and you have the hardware. Even specialty phones like dual Sim slot card. Microsoft has everything in terms of hardware. For example the Lumia 950/950XL, has: wireless charging USB Type-C, powerful specs, OELD screen, Gorilla glass, a touch screen that works with gloves, a really good camera, big battery, replaceable battery, micro-SD card slot, super fast charging, using it a desktop computer, it has everything.

-> The OS. It has the OS. It can run on hardware that makes Android crawl, yet it provides you with this iPhone like OS navigation experience in terms of responsiveness (until you actually start apps, those would obviously take time to load). Everything is smooth. It handles multi-threading very well as well in comparison to Android.

The problem:
-> No one gets the phone due to lack of apps. And there is no apps because there is lack of user base. And it doesn't help that the users don't want to give other apps a try, say Bing Map, or Here Map, and just want Google Maps, for example.

So basically, Windows Phone caters to people like me, people who don't give a damn about the apps and games on it. It sees a Smart phone as a phone first. They see it as a device to call, text, listen to music and take pictures. And it has Microsoft ecosystem surrounding it: Office, OneDrive, Grove Music, Maps, etc. And it doesn't help for the fact that you need to buy the phone in full as virtually no carrier wants it, as Microsoft wants to impose its own update system like Apple, and not have the mess that Windows Phone 7 and 8 and all Android users faces (and Blackberry). So Windows Phone is not going to be a phone that will get the masses any time soon. And when you get a Windows Phone you should expect that.

The new strategy from Microsoft is simple:
-> Offer the best phone (check), with the best experience of its OS (check), and offer Windows 10 for free for a great mass of people, push tablets running Windows 10.

Windows 10 for free boost market share, and important thing as Windows 10 as this new framework called Universal Apps. Apps that runs on Windows 10, Windows 10 Mobile, Windows 10 IoT, XBox One, and HoloLens. 1x app, runs everywhere with little to no code change 9basically to fine tune the GUI if you want, but not needed). Pushing Windows 10 tablets, means there is a need for universal apps. Having universal apps means more apps on Windows 10 Mobile.

So basically, a slow process, but coming process. But don't expect a miracle in 1-2 years.

Interesting take on it.

 

I'm really hoping Windows 10 helps boost it, but I don't see a lot of apps being made because of the universal framework.

Banking, eBay, etc likely won't make an app for Windows, because people can just use the browser like they've always been doing.

Games and such will obviously be better for it, but personally that doesn't help me at all. I need the productivity apps.

 

I also see my phone as a phone first for the features you described, however I also realize that it can be so much more; and that's what Windows needs to realize as well.

I know they've tried to light a fire under devs, but there must be a way to increase the heat. Banking and large companies (eBay, do they have a good Paypal app?) at the very least.

Sadly I don't see it happening. I also find WP to be a bit...unrefined. I bought a 520 (I know, cheap phone) to test out WP. I wasn't impressed.

 

Hopefully I'm wrong. I really want me a 970XL.

[LAwLz]

-> The OS. It has the OS. It can run on hardware that makes Android crawl, yet it provides you with this iPhone like OS navigation experience in terms of responsiveness (until you actually start apps, those would obviously take time to load). Everything is smooth. It handles multi-threading very well as well in comparison to Android.

[Citation Needed] on it handling multi-threading better than Android.

 

Personally I think the OS is by far the biggest issue with for example the Nokia 950. I am not just saying that because of a lack of apps either. I think the entire OS is subpar. From the lackluster multitasking (which freezes the app so you can't even download things in the background) to the fact that you can't charge your device while it is turned off and really bad support outside of the US (here in Sweden a lot of features just flat out does not work because they are geo-blocked by Microsoft, such as Cortana).

 

The 950 and 950LX would be far more interesting to me if they ran Android.

[GoodBytes]

[Citation Needed] on it handling multi-threading better than Android.

Go try it.

[MrTiC]

How much you got? The 930 is still available for $300 USD.

 

IF not then there's the Lumia 1520, 640XL, 640.

 

I agree the Lumia 950 is damn expensive for a windows phone. But remember, It's microsoft, you don't have to pay much to have a good experience. I wrote a review on the 640XL if you want to check that out. A lot cheaper

ATM 0 (euro) but i can save up for it if i wanted

I currently have a LG optimus G PRO

But i like win 10 so hard i want to switch windows phone

[QwarkDreams]

I believe you can do this with Windows 10 Mobile now.

 

The question is when will we get it (aside from the Preview version)? And in consideration of Win10 for PCs: what crazy stuff will MS implement on the mobile version? (mandatory, automated updates? even more spying?)